He was my favorite player growing up - loved his swagger!! When the leaves turn brown, I will be wearing the batting crown!! I know people probably have mixed emotions about DP but what he is your favorite memory of the Cobra? Mine is when he crushed Johnny Oates on a play at the plate against the Phillies in 79. I think he should be in HOF, but that is a totally biased opinion. Although, if Harold Baines is in, Parker should be in!!
OT: 70 years ago the Cobra was born
- Thread starter BucosRule
- Start date
Yeah.....on no planet was Harold Baines ever a better baseball player than Dave Parker.
pittdan77
Athletic Director
Imagine if Parker played today with batters swinging for the fences and not being asked to do much more?
Imagine Stargell?? And imagine Willie's numbers if the didn't play most of his prime in Forbes Field? He probably would have hit over 600 HR's in his career.
Barry Bonds was the best thing that happened for Parker’s likability in the city since 1980.
Parker is a very debatable HOF worthy, but no doubt Parker > Baines
His on field legacy will be forever tainted. Parker testified in open court that he let his "primary drug dealer" have access to the Pirates clubhouse along with flying him to away games on the same plane the Bucs traveled to deliver drugs to him and other players.
This wasn't some boozing superstar that managed to perform despite late night escapades at the bars. His actions were illegal and he openly arranged delivery of illegal drugs to others.
Think about it. He brought his addiction to work with him and facilitated the dispensing and transaction of illegal drugs.
If he were anybody other than a borderline Hall of Fame candidate of a hometown team would Pittsburgh fans be so forgiving of his actions.
This wasn't some boozing superstar that managed to perform despite late night escapades at the bars. His actions were illegal and he openly arranged delivery of illegal drugs to others.
Think about it. He brought his addiction to work with him and facilitated the dispensing and transaction of illegal drugs.
If he were anybody other than a borderline Hall of Fame candidate of a hometown team would Pittsburgh fans be so forgiving of his actions.
He reached for a low and away pitch, pulled it anyways, the second baseman actually jumped thinking he could snag it and it was a home run. A total rocket.
He also smoked a grounder up the middle and the cover came off the ball.
Also think about that at the time he was doing that amphetamines were available in every clubhouse in baseball and were handed out like they were candy to anyone who wanted them. Imagine the uproar if amphetamines were illegal and addicting like cocaine.
Wait a second....
Parker put up some decent numbers in his prime, and was a terrific defensive outfielder. I don't dislike the guy, but I grew up idolizing Clemente. The guy who lost his life on a humanitarian mission to a country not his own. He also happened to be the greatest right fielder of any generation.
Parker basically became a go between illegal drug user/ dealer for teammates and opponents. As you mentioned, athletes looked for ways to gain competitive advantage, even sometimes through pharmaceuticals. Not sure if Parker benefited athletically with coke, but his involvement with it was a stain on the franchise, his teammates, and the sport itself.
Maz is an interesting case. Probably one of the best defensive second baseman ever. Weak hitter who delivered one of the biggest home runs in World Series history.
Parker was truly a legit 5 tool player, even at his size. His 1977- 1978 seasons ~ he was arguably the most dominant player in all of MLB. No doubt his dealings with ‘cocaine’ the next few seasons (yes it started to show late in the 1979 WS season) curtailed his career in what should have been his best seasons, but to his credit he turned it around in Cincinnati and put up some terrific seasons. It likely cost him his HOF induction though, based on him coming up somewhat short in HR’s, RBI’s, career hits, etc...
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Yeah, I mostly agree with that. Except I don't think that the guys that were doing coke were getting any actual "athletic" benefit from it, like all the guys from the 50s, 60s, 70s and into the 80s were getting from amphetamines.
And of course as great as Clemente was, the greatest right fielder of any generation was Babe Ruth, and the second greatest was Hank Aaron. But there is certainly an argument that Clemente is third.
I am too young to judge Babe Ruth. Aaron certainly put up more power numbers than Clemente and is worthy of his accomplishments. Aaron was a 3 time Gold Glove Winner in right field. Roberto won 12 consecutive Gold Gloves from '61 through '72. He also batted over .300 for 13 seasons. He was a four time batting champion.
As a kid I sat in the right field bleachers of Forbes Field in awe of Clemente. Maybe Aaron was better.... I wouldn't know it.
Clemente was the better fielder. Aaron the better hitter when you factor in power of course, although playing in the bandbox that was Atlanta vs Forbes Field for most of their respective careers was a huge advantage for Aaron, relative to HR’s/power numbers. Not saying Clemente would have had as many, but it significantly hindered his HR production playing in the largest ballpark in the NL most of his career. Clemente developed an onside out, line drive swing to compensate playing in Forbes Field and could hit a ball as far as anyone when he got all of it, save maybe Stargell and McCovey in the NL.
So what's the record for hardest hit ball ever measured? 124mph? SS O'Niel Cruz shows us why his ceiling is Parker/Stargell/Clemente-high with a 120mph bomb in AA - which he has been dominating for weeks now as basically the tallest shortstop ever....
The potential/ceilings of the Bucs minor league talent is truly phenomenal right now, would not be surprised to see them rated near the top of MLB by fall. Honestly it's hard to imagine Pittsburgh contender for #1 farm system with L.A. & Tampa, but it's certainly headed in that direction IMO. Cherington is dope.
Stargell, Clemente, and Parker - oh my
The potential/ceilings of the Bucs minor league talent is truly phenomenal right now, would not be surprised to see them rated near the top of MLB by fall. Honestly it's hard to imagine Pittsburgh contender for #1 farm system with L.A. & Tampa, but it's certainly headed in that direction IMO. Cherington is dope.
Stargell, Clemente, and Parker - oh my
Best defensive 2B is like being the prettiest girl at fat camp. 2B is where you hide an average IF who has a decent bat.
Max is best ever. No question. No second baseman should be in HOF if he isn’t
MAZ could turn the double play like no one before, or after. Slick fielder all the way around. Obviously his bat was fairly pedestrian, although solid and dependable. Reminds me somewhat of Brooks Robinson at 3B, clearly the best fielder at his position ever, with a good bat, but nothing spectacular for a 3B. Clutch player who had a few huge years and certainly more pop than MAZ, but expected from 3B vs 2B.
‘Stan the Man’ from Donora, PA. ~ just south of the ‘Burgh on the Mon River. Also the birthplace of Ken Griffey of the Cincinnati Reds, (father of KG JR. fame), but still outstanding ball player in his own right and key member of the 70’s Big Red Machine
He was least favorite player. Lazy, had that dumb flick after a catch which allowed the ball to come out several times, was a named drug user and got out of shape.
This is a clear example of someone who doesn’t know baseball mouthing off.
true, 1b, 2b, C and even 3b are positions you can kinda hide someone with poor athleticism (see Moran). But to even allude that Maz is akin to a far camp is like saying Ozzie Smith is barely a better fielder than dale berra.
Catcher is the most important defensive position, followed closely by Shortstop, then Center Field. 2nd baseman are widely considered the 4th most critical spot on defense.
I came to Pittsburgh in 1977 to go to Pitt. Growing up I went to mostly Baltimore games when they were a juggernaut. Dave Parker is the best baseball player I ever had the pleasure of watching in person. For a 5 year span he was the best player in MLB. At his size he ran a 9.6 100yd dash....before the advent of metric races in the USA. He won an All-Star game MVP for making 2 unbelievable throws from the warning track, gunning both guy out at the plate.....with both throws on a line right into the catchers glove on the fly. He was a line drive hitter who could also hit for power.
I know he was part of the cocaine things along with Rod Scurry but as a ball player he was fantastic.
I know he was part of the cocaine things along with Rod Scurry but as a ball player he was fantastic.
I'm guessing you never tried to turn a double play with a runner aiming for your ankles.
I agree with this, I couldn’t stand the guy. I wasn’t old enough to see his hay days but I remember my dad complaining about how lazy he was. If he gave just a bit more he would be in the hall too
The double play is way worse for shortstops than 2nd baseman. The second baseman's movement to the bag gets him away from trouble most of the time. Shortstop movement is toward and sometimes through the bag with an awkward open body throw. There is a reason shortstops get the cleats way more often than second baseman. That being said, I go shortstop, catcher, 2b, centerfielder, and then the rest in terms of difficulty. 1B and left field are almost comically easy in comparison. Right field at least should require a strong arm.
As an edit, 3rd baseman have to be man enough to take rocket shots off the chest on smoked ground balls. And sometimes the situation dictates they have to be standing in front of the dirt on the grass when it happens. You have to have some balls to play third base and some kind of arm. They deserve more credit. Many of them were not quick enough to play middle infield and too slow to play center field. 3rd base > corner outfield spots unless you play in a cavernous right field park.
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The only thing tougher to defend/react than a 3B at the hot corner is a pitcher on a line drive right at him, especially on a windup/follow through motion and the ball coming right at his head like a bullet. Best thing to do is to remember to keep your glove up near your face during the follow through. Amazing that there hasn’t been more significant injuries over the years, but certainly there have been some ugly incidents.
Raise you hand if you ever had your pitcher taken with Dave Parker when you were a 13 year old on the field at Three Rivers???
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