OK, I'm not talking about 48-46 games but most Dixon games were 64-58 type games. Was last night's 3 point shootout more entertaining to you? I am glad we won and will take a win any way we can get it but watching those teams refuse to play any defense at all and watching warm-up 3 after warm-up 3, I cant say that was more entertaining to me than a hard fought 58-55 game from the old days. I mean I'll take a 42-40 win over a 95-93 loss but these limited defense games arent entertaining to me. Its why I cant watch the NBA regular season.
Pitt/Wake Game vs Dixon Ball
- Thread starter Sean Miller Fan
- Start date
I found last night’s game to be very aesthetically pleasing. Lots of ball movement, good pace, good shooting, no weird fouls or a ref show. And it was close. Really good, high-level basketball - the Clemson game was the same way.
So many open looks though. I kept thinking, eventually Wake is going to guard someone but it was open 3 after open 3. It just felt weird watching it. Like a pickup game where you arent playing 100% on D
I could agree except for the second half stretch against the 1-3-1 when Burton was out of the game. That was kinda brutal actually.
Unfortunately, any stretch of the game without Burton in is currently brutal. The health of that knee and his wind are the two main factors going down the stretch. See you tomorrow!
Mostly a win is a win to me. But over time the offensive limitations of Jamie ball (due to simply just not recruiting enough shooters / scorers) made it tough to watch as his team's became less competitive.
This team has its limitations, but is nice to watch how they defer yo each others and work for each other offensively.
This team has its limitations, but is nice to watch how they defer yo each others and work for each other offensively.
Yes. It all culminated in that tourney game against Wisconsin. I don’t think I’ve ever been more frustrated watching a sporting event.
Kind of funny, When I watched our last possession where Burton dribbled into the half court and every other of our players were in a stationary position, it so reminded me of Jamie ball. In particular the last possession against Butler in Verizon. I get it, most coaches are winding clock until they run the play in the last seven seconds. But I have always felt more movement could open up so many opportunities and not result In a shot clock violation.
Nothing new here DT.
Some of us have been
criticizing Capel's approach
against zones for years. It
wasn't all Burton. IMO we
should have known what to
do agaist a 1-3-1, especially
one that extended the
double team so far out in
front. He's lucky he had
Burton to come in and save
us. If not we lose.
Jamie's teams were too offensively limited for March but they got there. I was happy to beat Wake but watching an NBA 3 point shootout wasn't as entertaining to me.
This is so true. There
have been stretchers
where Cummings did a
decent job out front. The
problem is he is not a
pure pg. This was so very
obvious last night with
Burton on the bench.
When Burton is on the
floor Cummings has some
help out front and Burton
is usually the lead guard.
Good as our other guards
are they are not pg's and
they don't make up for
Burton's absence.
Yeah, that was our penance for shooting 75% from three and building a 15 point lead in the first half lol
I think it's hard to micromanage a team to an NCAAT title. Jamie will finish close to 800 wins when he's done so it's hard to say his style doesn't work, but I don't think it's a coincidence that his teams never made it very far in the tournament.
We obviously have to defend better, but I'm in favor of offensive freedom vs. pulling a guy for taking a "bad" shot.
I said this yesterday, the Hinson heat check triple in the 1st half would've warranted a benching from JD. Capel rode it out. You live and die with that kid .. when he's on, just let him go.. he made 8 of them and who knows how many more he would've made if he got yanked and yelled at for taking a 28 footer early in the clock.
You need to trust your guys to let them play this way.. I fully trust this style with Burton out there. I also trust it because nobody really forces it unless it's Nike and 80% of the time I'm ok with the shots he takes.
I have no doubt we can score with anyone in the country. Whether or not we can give up less than others is TBD.. if we tighten up on D, I think we have a pretty high ceiling. If you took JD's 6-7th best team, I'd like them over a full season v. this team... but I'd take this team's ceiling over almost all of JD's other teams... besides a few. I just think this team has major upside if they get to March. When we're hot, we're very difficult to outscore.
We obviously have to defend better, but I'm in favor of offensive freedom vs. pulling a guy for taking a "bad" shot.
I said this yesterday, the Hinson heat check triple in the 1st half would've warranted a benching from JD. Capel rode it out. You live and die with that kid .. when he's on, just let him go.. he made 8 of them and who knows how many more he would've made if he got yanked and yelled at for taking a 28 footer early in the clock.
You need to trust your guys to let them play this way.. I fully trust this style with Burton out there. I also trust it because nobody really forces it unless it's Nike and 80% of the time I'm ok with the shots he takes.
I have no doubt we can score with anyone in the country. Whether or not we can give up less than others is TBD.. if we tighten up on D, I think we have a pretty high ceiling. If you took JD's 6-7th best team, I'd like them over a full season v. this team... but I'd take this team's ceiling over almost all of JD's other teams... besides a few. I just think this team has major upside if they get to March. When we're hot, we're very difficult to outscore.
Yeah, the amount of people who disrespect when Jamie’s teams became “less competitive” aka going to the tournament every year is very odd. Get there, hope for a miracle run. That’s really PITT’s ceiling and for Jamie to have gotten 2 #1 seeds in 3 years and be a half second away from a final four once and probably a long run the second time with teams we’re extremely efficient offensively isn’t really PITT’s ceiling and never was. A one off 3 year run we shouldn’t expecf
I’m so tired of rehashing Dixon’s tenure at this point. And I’m sure his approach has impacted tourney performance. But there’s so much luck involved in making a final four. Does Loyola’s improbable run mean Porter Moser is a better coach than Dixon? Considering how Moser is going to flame out at OU that’s an easy no from me.
He’s already planning an exit!!! And Shaka Smart was destined to win 10 national titles after his VCU run with Havoc! He doesn’t even run Havoc anymore!!! There’s a million examples of this
I’m in the extreme minority here and am probably making a wild hot take (I already know @Sean Miller Fan disagrees with me).
But… Moser never should have left Loyola and Loyola should have stayed in the MVC. They could have built themselves into a mini-Gonzaga.
wasn't a slight at Dixon by any means.. I'm just not in favor of the style. You can point to UVA in 2018 as the model for this style, but they still had Guy, Jerome and Hunter.. they still had a pile of talent and shot makers... Just looking through the NCAAT winners, nobody really wins by throwing haymakers at eachother like we did in the Big East. You need to have guys that can make shots and Pitt through those years had shot makers on every single team, but I just think they were restricted a bit too much.
I'm not here to trash Jamie. I said yesterday I want PItt to schedule some games with TCU and roll out the red carpet for Jamie to come back and get his due in front of the fans.. I love Jamie Dixon and would take him back right now.. no questions asked. I don't mean to sound like a spoiled fan, but the march results were absolutely a let down.
Well they were a high major team playing in a mid major conference there, but now they’re a low major team in a mid major league and they’re in the bottom of the conference within the conference in a mid major instead of being a high major in a low major where they could’ve been the top dogs in the conference within a conference.
I don’t know. I think his recruiting was a bigger impediment than coaching tight. You need either extreme luck or some dudes. It’s no surprise Pitt’s deepest run came when it had some dudes. Just had bad luck against a Nova team that matched up well with Pitt.
Got it......Wait what???
The A10 needs to get better. Why cant Loyola be VCU or Dayton, getting to the NCAAT almost every year? They just need to listen to my "2 state solution" for the A10 (ie 2 conferences of 8).
If you would’ve given Jamie all of the Petersen updates to the locker room, moving the zoo, redoing the practice gym, etc… the cool Pitt colors and uniforms… the increased budget… the increase assistant pool when he was striking out as PITT’s assistant budget became stagnant after initially attracting top assistants… I think he’d have something similar to what he has at TCU last 2 years when he was given the right support.
The sad truth is, “Dixon 2” coincided with us just not updating facilities or money to keep up with the rest of the leagues that were spending. It wasn’t some sort of philosophical change. It was money, facilities, shifting landscapes.
When Pitt is giving up open 3s, I sometimes say "what the hell are they doing ?' But the Wake Forest game is the first time I ever said that about the opponent. It was in the 2nd half when Elliot made one without a defender being within 15 feet of him.
I imagine there was someone named Skip Prosser Fan or something going nuts on the Deacon messageboard.
I agree, but let's not pretend like Dixon didn't have talent on every team here. I think the biggest fallacy is that he built winning teams on 3 star guys... which isn't entirely true. He didn't get a bunch of the 5 star guys, but he had his fair share of 4 star players.
definitely tailed off when we went to the ACC, but he had a lot of talent here and credit to him and his staff for getting that talent here...but these teams weren't built off guys who couldn't play.. he had some serious dudes that IMO were held back just a tad.
2004 - 50th
-Benjamin (4star)
-Ramon (3star)
-Degroat (3star)
2005 - 10th
-Young (4 star) - one of the best recruits in the country
-Fields (4 star)
-Biggs (4 star)
2006 - 56th
-Gilbert (4 star)
2007 - 11th
-Blair (5 star)
-Brad (4 star)
- Gary (3 star)
2008 - 36th
-Nasir (4 star)
-Gibbs (3 star)
-Woodall (3star)
-Jermaine (2 star transfer)
2009 - 18th
-Dante (5 star)
-Lamar (4 star)
-Zanna (4 star)
2010 - 33rd
-JJ (4 star)
-Cam Wright (3star)
2011 - 13th
-Malcom Gilbert (4 star)
-Durand (4 star)
-John Johnson (3 star)
2012 - 25th
-Steve (5 star)
-J Rob (4 star)
- C Jones (3 star)
2013 - 31st
-Mike Young (4 star)
-Artis (3 star)
-Newkirk (3 star)
2014 - 87th
-Cam (3 star)
-Luther (3 star)
2015 - 80th
-Damon (4 star)
-Nix (3 star)
TCU
2016 - 48th
2017 - 36th
2018 - 35th
2019 - 30th
2020 - 58th
2021 - 99th
2022 - 94th
2023 - 51st
no question he recruited much better at Pitt in big east v TCU... not really a question at all.
Like I posted this team has its limitations.
That said, its context, too.
I will gladly watch this team playing loose and fun on offense vs the abyss of the last half decade plus.
Since the mid 80s I had at least watched every possible Pitt basketball game on TV, until Stallings' second year. I pretty much bailed on his second season completely.
I tuned back in for HCJCs first two seasons, but pretty much tuned out the last two prior to this year. I mean, last year's team has no chance of doing anything.
Who knows what next and future years will be, but just happy to see this team being truly competitive.
New athletic dorms, too. Where the guys live now is 10x better than wherever they used to live. Sutherland?
Pitt scored 43 points in Dixon's last tournament game with Pitt.
Pitt scored 49 points in the first half of the Wake game the other day.
I prefer the latter. Dixon-ball won't get you far in today's game. The original M.O. for Howland/Dixon was "recruit to shoot". That was correct. That's the way you can make long runs in post-season tourneys. Strong defense night after night can win you a lot of regular season games. But to advance in the NCAA tourney, you need shooters.
Better to enter the tourney as a 6- or 7- seed with a bunch of shooters... than a 2- or 3- seed that excels at defense. The former will usually have longer tourney runs.
Pitt scored 49 points in the first half of the Wake game the other day.
I prefer the latter. Dixon-ball won't get you far in today's game. The original M.O. for Howland/Dixon was "recruit to shoot". That was correct. That's the way you can make long runs in post-season tourneys. Strong defense night after night can win you a lot of regular season games. But to advance in the NCAA tourney, you need shooters.
Better to enter the tourney as a 6- or 7- seed with a bunch of shooters... than a 2- or 3- seed that excels at defense. The former will usually have longer tourney runs.
I remember that 3. Elliot was standing in the corner for like 5 seconds, no one near him. I think I said "pass it to Elliot" out loud. I couldn't believe how open he was. All game I kept thinking that eventually we wouldn't get such open looks but we did. We either got an open 3 or turned it over.
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