Realistic Expectations

[CCHS82]

Reading a post below about how we have no post presence and scoring inside stinks. Fans forget just how bad post players like Taylor, McGee, Zanna, even Adams were as freshman. These guys were high star players too, not like the ones we currently have, and yet we want to beat these kids up. (Maybe not McGee) . We were ready to boot the 4 and 5 Star players out the door back in the day. Fortunately, those guys had “experienced “ players above them so Jamie could bring them along slowly and develop them. The current kids have been thrown into the ocean and we wonder why they are drowning!

Realistic expectations please.

Amazing that almost everyone on this board predicted 0-2 acc wins this year WITH Luther on the roster and now, without him, we are wondering why we have not won a game yet. Duh!

Realistic expectations please.

 

[DiehardPanther]

Reading a post below about how we have no post presence and scoring inside stinks. Fans forget just how bad post players like Taylor, McGee, Zanna, even Adams were as freshman. These guys were high star players too, not like the ones we currently have, and yet we want to beat these kids up. (Maybe not McGee) . We were ready to boot the 4 and 5 Star players out the door back in the day. Fortunately, those guys had “experienced “ players above them so Jamie could bring them along slowly and develop them. The current kids have been thrown into the ocean and we wonder why they are drowning!

Realistic expectations please.

Amazing that almost everyone on this board predicted 0-2 acc wins this year WITH Luther on the roster and now, without him, we are wondering why we have not won a game yet. Duh!

Realistic expectations please.

We had a good thing going with Dixon, but it got completely f’ed up because it wasn’t good enough for some people. Do you realize how stupid Pitt looks for opening the door for him to leave? This is almost on par with what we did with Sherrill in regards to stupidity.

 

[Slick Manager of Champs]

We had a good thing going with Dixon, but it got completely f’ed up because it wasn’t good enough for some people. Do you realize how stupid Pitt looks for opening the door for him to leave? This is almost on par with what we did with Sherrill in regards to stupidity.

I liked Dixon but ACC Dixon wasn't the same as first 7 years of Big East Dixon. And the Big East version of Dixon wasn't coming back. A change was needed for both sides.

But in typical Pitt fashion, good intentions but lousy execution. Similar to football, want to upgrade from Wannstedt but go about it poorly. Same with basketball. Upgrades were warranted but half-assed effort to really make the desired improvement.

 

[DiehardPanther]

I liked Dixon but ACC Dixon wasn't the same as first 7 years of Big East Dixon. And the Big East version of Dixon wasn't coming back. A change was needed for both sides.

But in typical Pitt fashion, good intentions but lousy execution. Similar to football, want to upgrade from Wannstedt but go about it poorly. Same with basketball. Upgrades were warranted but half-assed effort to really make the desired improvement.

Hall of Fame Coaches have dry spells. It happens to almost every coach. The guy is 52, not 62. He would have bounced back.

 

[Slick Manager of Champs]

Hall of Fame Coaches have dry spells. It happens to almost every coach. The guy is 52, not 62. He would have bounced back.

possibly, but most dry spells aren't 5 years. Was Dixon's heart in the ACC? Did he have the desire to bounce back? Recruiting didn't seem like it.

 

[CCHS82]

I did not intend this to be ANOTHER Dixon thread. He is gone. Time to move on. Focus on what we DO have.

 

[mbrannagan]

Reading a post below about how we have no post presence and scoring inside stinks. Fans forget just how bad post players like Taylor, McGee, Zanna, even Adams were as freshman. These guys were high star players too, not like the ones we currently have, and yet we want to beat these kids up. (Maybe not McGee) . We were ready to boot the 4 and 5 Star players out the door back in the day. Fortunately, those guys had “experienced “ players above them so Jamie could bring them along slowly and develop them. The current kids have been thrown into the ocean and we wonder why they are drowning!

Realistic expectations please.

Amazing that almost everyone on this board predicted 0-2 acc wins this year WITH Luther on the roster and now, without him, we are wondering why we have not won a game yet. Duh!

Realistic expectations please.

I do wonder how those players you mention may have looked if they got more minutes (aside from Adams) would they have contributed more if they got the kind of minutes we have given Brown or Chukwuka. As for Adams, he wasn't dominant, but if you really look at his stats he had a pretty excellent freshman year. If he had been on 13-14 team there would be entirely different conversations about Dixon's success in the ACC

 

[DiehardPanther]

possibly, but most dry spells aren't 5 years. Was Dixon's heart in the ACC? Did he have the desire to bounce back? Recruiting didn't seem like it.

You act like he fell off a cliff. 3 NCAA’s and an NIT is still pretty good. And that was his low point. People would throw a party if Stallings did that right now.

 

[steeltown24]

Reading a post below about how we have no post presence and scoring inside stinks. Fans forget just how bad post players like Taylor, McGee, Zanna, even Adams were as freshman. These guys were high star players too, not like the ones we currently have, and yet we want to beat these kids up. (Maybe not McGee) . We were ready to boot the 4 and 5 Star players out the door back in the day. Fortunately, those guys had “experienced “ players above them so Jamie could bring them along slowly and develop them. The current kids have been thrown into the ocean and we wonder why they are drowning!

Realistic expectations please.

Amazing that almost everyone on this board predicted 0-2 acc wins this year WITH Luther on the roster and now, without him, we are wondering why we have not won a game yet. Duh!

Realistic expectations please.

To be fair, I don't think people are wondering why they have not won an ACC game yet. I think watching it play out is just a frustrating experience and this is the place Pitt fans come to discuss those issues. Most expected the rough season. The difference we as fans have is in the reason for believing this season would be rough and the best path to correct it. Some blame Dixon. Some blame Stallings. I assume most (just not as vocal) spread the blame around.

 

[DiehardPanther]

I did not intend this to be ANOTHER Dixon thread. He is gone. Time to move on. Focus on what we DO have.

We have a guy who was a mediocre coach in his prime, and he is no longer in his prime. He has recruited 11 players and none of them are Top 100. He underachieved last year. A lot of players on the current roster are not developing. And he has a droopy the dog, woah is me attitude. Constantly making excuses. He needs to go ASAP and hire Musselman.

 

[316 S Bouquet]

Reading a post below about how we have no post presence and scoring inside stinks. Fans forget just how bad post players like Taylor, McGee, Zanna, even Adams were as freshman. These guys were high star players too, not like the ones we currently have, and yet we want to beat these kids up. (Maybe not McGee) . We were ready to boot the 4 and 5 Star players out the door back in the day. Fortunately, those guys had “experienced “ players above them so Jamie could bring them along slowly and develop them. The current kids have been thrown into the ocean and we wonder why they are drowning!

Realistic expectations please.

Amazing that almost everyone on this board predicted 0-2 acc wins this year WITH Luther on the roster and now, without him, we are wondering why we have not won a game yet. Duh!

Realistic expectations please.

From a rankings standpoint, McGee would be the 2nd highest rated recruit on this roster or next year's roster (behind Carr only). Which is part of the problem.

Can't say I agree with stressing realistic expectations. Just because people expected this team to be bad and they are fulfilling that expectation does not make it okay.

The team being bad would be more tolerable if we were bringing in even a decent recruit class, or if the team were showing some signs of improvement, or even Stallings was representing the University well in the public eye. None of those things are happening, and people are justifiable upset with the direction of the program.

 

[gary2]

Reading a post below about how we have no post presence and scoring inside stinks. Fans forget just how bad post players like Taylor, McGee, Zanna, even Adams were as freshman. These guys were high star players too, not like the ones we currently have, and yet we want to beat these kids up. (Maybe not McGee) . We were ready to boot the 4 and 5 Star players out the door back in the day. Fortunately, those guys had “experienced “ players above them so Jamie could bring them along slowly and develop them. The current kids have been thrown into the ocean and we wonder why they are drowning!

Realistic expectations please.

Amazing that almost everyone on this board predicted 0-2 acc wins this year WITH Luther on the roster and now, without him, we are wondering why we have not won a game yet. Duh!

Realistic expectations please.

You got it

 

[Fsgolfdr]

We had a good thing going with Dixon, but it got completely f’ed up because it wasn’t good enough for some people. Do you realize how stupid Pitt looks for opening the door for him to leave? This is almost on par with what we did with Sherrill in regards to stupidity.

The similarity ends with Jackie would’ve won a national championship !
Both horrible decisions !

 

[Slick Manager of Champs]

We have a guy who was a mediocre coach in his prime, and he is no longer in his prime. He has recruited 11 players and none of them are Top 100. He underachieved last year. A lot of players on the current roster are not developing. And he has a droopy the dog, woah is me attitude. Constantly making excuses. He needs to go ASAP and hire Musselman.

Agree with everything.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

We have a guy who was a mediocre coach in his prime, and he is no longer in his prime. He has recruited 11 players and none of them are Top 100. He underachieved last year. A lot of players on the current roster are not developing. And he has a droopy the dog, woah is me attitude. Constantly making excuses. He needs to go ASAP and hire Musselman.

Why do you assume Musselman would want the job ?

 

[mbrannagan]

To be fair, I don't think people are wondering why they have not won an ACC game yet. I think watching it play out is just a frustrating experience and this is the place Pitt fans come to discuss those issues. Most expected the rough season. The difference we as fans have is in the reason for believing this season would be rough and the best path to correct it. Some blame Dixon. Some blame Stallings. I assume most (just not as vocal) spread the blame around.

Agreed, I'd add that part of the frustration is also looking at next year and seeing another mediocre recruiting class, as well as the concern that tanking in the NCAA doesn't get you a better draftpick, it gets you more bad press, weak crowds, embarassing national TV games, and more reasons for a recruit to look elsewhere.

 

[DiehardPanther]

Why do you assume Musselman would want the job ?

Make him a good offer. He is only making 1 million now. Provide the proper support for him and his staff. Be prepared with a list of 5 additional candidates just in case he is not interested.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

Make him a good offer. He is only making 1 million now. Provide the proper support for him and his staff. Be prepared with a list of 5 additional candidates just in case he is not interested.

If a coach has higher aspirations Pitt is only a stepping stone and there’s no quick turn around happening here . Just don’t see a guy only making a million dollars risking his future at a school not fully committed to winning playing in the best conference in the country .

 

[ERICCARTMAN]

Anyone who thinks we had a good thing going with Jamie didn't attend the games the last three years he coached at PITT.

The talent level degenerated each year and there was no indication there was light at the end of the tunnel.

PITT's board of trustees and Nordenberg must have been blind or disinterested not to see that.

 

[Delpanther]

We had a good thing going with Dixon, but it got completely f’ed up because it wasn’t good enough for some people. Do you realize how stupid Pitt looks for opening the door for him to leave? This is almost on par with what we did with Sherrill in regards to stupidity.

Correction- the "good thing with Dixon" was run off the rails by Dixon and then people got fed up. Opening up the door for him to leave,.... Just a stupid, completely naive statement in view of contractual realities of the situation. Pitt's decision to lower the buyout would gave been irrelevant had Dixon wanted to stay. He knew the mess he created and sneaked out of town like a rat and then had a couple of his media buddies paint him the martyr figure in the whole scenario.

There are no parallels to the Sherrill departure. Sherrill left Pitt when Pitt was at the top of college FB and he left for one reason....Bozik was jealous of him and wanted to micromanage Sherrill to the point that he made life unbearable for Sherrill. Dixon on the other hand needed and deserved some criticism and constructive feedback on his staff, his scheduling and the trajectory of the program.....instead of taking the needed feedback on board and adjusting like a reasonable guy, he got defensive and acted like a brat refusing to make any changes of his own volition.. Not surprising for a coach who flirted with a new suitor almost every year.

 

[IamHeisenberg]

Make him a good offer. He is only making 1 million now. Provide the proper support for him and his staff. Be prepared with a list of 5 additional candidates just in case he is not interested.

$1 million now, but Dixon was listed as $2.3 million the year he left. Not sure what Stallings is getting but Musselman is not that sure a thing to have Pitt paying him $1.5 as a bump or higher.

 

[DiehardPanther]

Correction- the "good thing with Dixon" was run off the rails by Dixon and then people got fed up. Opening up the door for him to leave,.... Just a stupid, completely naive statement in view of contractual realities of the situation. Pitt's decision to lower the buyout would gave been irrelevant had Dixon wanted to stay. He knew the mess he created and sneaked out of town like a rat and then had a couple of his media buddies paint him the martyr figure in the whole scenario.

There are no parallels to the Sherrill departure. Sherrill left Pitt when Pitt was at the top of college FB and he left for one reason....Bozik was jealous of him and wanted to micromanage Sherrill to the point that he made life unbearable for Sherrill. Dixon on the other hand needed and deserved some criticism and constructive feedback on his staff, his scheduling and the trajectory of the program.....instead of taking the needed feedback on board and adjusting like a reasonable guy, he got defensive and acted like a brat refusing to make any changes of his own volition.. Not surprising for a coach who flirted with a new suitor almost every year.

Let me be clear - anybody that understands college basketball realizes we were complete fools for opening the door and allowing him to leave. The administration should have sat down and found out what needed to be done to improve the program. Dixon spoke in length at Narduzzi’s Introductory Coaching Caravan in Wexford. Dixon sure seemed committed to me at that time. The jackals ruined a good thing.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Correction- the "good thing with Dixon" was run off the rails by Dixon and then people got fed up. Opening up the door for him to leave,.... Just a stupid, completely naive statement in view of contractual realities of the situation. Pitt's decision to lower the buyout would gave been irrelevant had Dixon wanted to stay. He knew the mess he created and sneaked out of town like a rat and then had a couple of his media buddies paint him the martyr figure in the whole scenario.

There are no parallels to the Sherrill departure. Sherrill left Pitt when Pitt was at the top of college FB and he left for one reason....Bozik was jealous of him and wanted to micromanage Sherrill to the point that he made life unbearable for Sherrill. Dixon on the other hand needed and deserved some criticism and constructive feedback on his staff, his scheduling and the trajectory of the program.....instead of taking the needed feedback on board and adjusting like a reasonable guy, he got defensive and acted like a brat refusing to make any changes of his own volition.. Not surprising for a coach who flirted with a new suitor almost every year.

Let me be clear - anybody that understands college basketball realizes we were complete fools for opening the door and allowing him to leave. The administration should have sat down and found out what needed to be done to improve the program. Dixon spoke in length at Narduzzi’s Introductory Coaching Caravan in Wexford. Dixon sure seemed committed to me at that time. The jackals ruined a good thing.

You tell him the full buyout must be paid. His choices were to leave and go to court when Pitt sues him. Or suck it up and coach us

 

[IamHeisenberg]

Let me be clear - anybody that understands college basketball realizes we were complete fools for opening the door and allowing him to leave. The administration should have sat down and found out what needed to be done to improve the program. Dixon spoke in length at Narduzzi’s Introductory Coaching Caravan in Wexford. Dixon sure seemed committed to me at that time. The jackals ruined a good thing.

But was the dastardly thing that Barnes told Dixon that made Dixon say, "That's it!!", and he chose to leave. Did he ask for millions of salary dollars back? Did he say you can have no assistants? Did he dare challenge him to improve on performance and then we will talk about your desires?

I get it. Yes, Barnes and his cronies were idiots for thinking that if Jamie walked they could do better, but anybody that understands college basketball knows that the worse that happened here was that Barnes said no we won't do what you ask in terms of increasing salaries for assistants. If Barnes said, no the status quo of what you currently earn and what your ACs earn is all I will do. Is that really an "I'm going to walk" moment?

So Jamie was not being humiliated with what his next year was going to bring. It probably was pretty much what he agreed to in his contract. So, making Dixon seem like someone who was humiliated and spurned and had no choice but to leave is just ridiculous.

Two truths. Jamie left of his own volition. Barnes did not care.

 

[Delpanther]

You tell him the full buyout must be paid. His choices were to leave and go to court when Pitt sues him. Or suck it up and coach us

What a naive suggestion. No one enforces the full terms of a buyout of the contract of an employee making $3m a year when he unequivocally tells you he wants to take a new job....No one!!! This is particularly the case of an employee whose performances has gone down hill. To do so is to court disaster and I recognize we have a disaster at hand but that was created by a half ass coaching search and nothing else. Employees don't put forth full effort when they have a gun to their head...simple as that. Add to that had Pitt blown up the TCU deal by enforcing the full buyout then they would have looked pretty stupid having to ax Dixon a couple years later( which wasn't out of the question in view of where the program was headed). The lifetime contract Dixon had was a lodestone around Pitt's neck (thank you Nordy) because of the downturn in Dixon's performance which influenced what occurred here.

 

[Delpanther]

Let me be clear - anybody that understands college basketball realizes we were complete fools for opening the door and allowing him to leave. The administration should have sat down and found out what needed to be done to improve the program. Dixon spoke in length at Narduzzi’s Introductory Coaching Caravan in Wexford. Dixon sure seemed committed to me at that time. The jackals ruined a good thing.

Open the door... Please.... that statement completely ignores legal and contractual realities. TCU opened the door with an offer which Dixon didn't have to accept whether or not Pitt agreed to reduce the buyout. The control here was always in a Dixon's hands. No doubt Dixon and Barnes didn't get along but there is NO evidence suggesting Dixon would change his ways or his staff... and what evidence does exist on the subject indicates Dixon refused to change his floundering staff... see the Slice affair.

 

[pitt-girl]

Reading a post below about how we have no post presence and scoring inside stinks. Fans forget just how bad post players like Taylor, McGee, Zanna, even Adams were as freshman. These guys were high star players too, not like the ones we currently have, and yet we want to beat these kids up. (Maybe not McGee) . We were ready to boot the 4 and 5 Star players out the door back in the day. Fortunately, those guys had “experienced “ players above them so Jamie could bring them along slowly and develop them. The current kids have been thrown into the ocean and we wonder why they are drowning!

Realistic expectations please.

Amazing that almost everyone on this board predicted 0-2 acc wins this year WITH Luther on the roster and now, without him, we are wondering why we have not won a game yet. Duh!

Realistic expectations please.

Just playing devils advocate but your post is exactly why some of us could not understand why Stallings forced out almost his entire inherited bench. Admittedly I am no recruiting expert, but our HC himself exercised no patience with the development of those players.

As fans we are supposed to embrace the notion that none of them (with the exception of Milligan and Luther) had any upside. That's fine. But you can't have it both ways that some fans are now somehow at fault for not giving these current new players enough space or time to develop.

I am 100% behind these student athletes, including those that were on the bench last year. But lecturing others about having realistic expectations is a bit disingenuous when Stallings demonstrated an inability to do just that. JMO.

 

[FireballZ]

Just playing devils advocate but your post is exactly why some of us could not understand why Stallings forced out almost his entire inherited bench. Admittedly I am no recruiting expert, but our HC himself exercised no patience with the development of those players.

As fans we are supposed to embrace the notion that none of them (with the exception of Milligan and Luther) had any upside. That's fine. But you can't have it both ways that some fans are now somehow at fault for not giving these current new players enough space or time to develop.

Sure you can have it both ways because it's not apples to apples. Kithcart was kicked off the team for behavior. Manigault has already been suspended for behavior at his new location. Clark blew out his knee, again. Damon Wilson got worse his second year. Cam Johnson couldn't handle the pressure of being a leader. If there is an apparent lack of ability, coupled with behavior issues, it's easy to let people go. Do you think being around guys like Artis and Young for two years was good for Damon Wilson's attitude?

None of these guys were Stalling's recruits, so it's completely reasonable that if you're going to be forced into a rebuild, that you would want to start fresh with your own guys, who you believe will buy-in.

Attitudes AND poor showings on the court is why most of those underclassmen were shown the door.

 

[pitt-girl]

Sure you can have it both ways because it's not apples to apples. Kithcart was kicked off the team for behavior. Manigault has already been suspended for behavior at his new location. Clark blew out his knee, again. Damon Wilson got worse his second year. Cam Johnson couldn't handle the pressure of being a leader. If there is an apparent lack of ability, coupled with behavior issues, it's easy to let people go. Do you think being around guys like Artis and Young for two years was good for Damon Wilson's attitude?

None of these guys were Stalling's recruits, so it's completely reasonable that if you're going to be forced into a rebuild, that you would want to start fresh with your own guys, who you believe will buy-in.

Attitudes AND poor showings on the court is why most of those underclassmen were shown the door.

All very reasonable points. And I get that new HC's want their own recruits. My problem is calling out fans for a lack of patience over any progress currently when the HC himself exhibited none, albeit for the reasons you posted above. I just don't think it's fair to have it both ways, that's all.

And could we please stop the narrative about Cam Johnson folding under some kind of perceived pressure? Unless you had access to the family (which maybe you did?), none of us know exactly what precipitated his decision to leave the program. By all accounts he was an intelligent, modest kid with tremendous upside. No reason to pile one except it strengthens your position.

 

[pitt-girl]

Sure you can have it both ways because it's not apples to apples. Kithcart was kicked off the team for behavior. Manigault has already been suspended for behavior at his new location. Clark blew out his knee, again. Damon Wilson got worse his second year. Cam Johnson couldn't handle the pressure of being a leader. If there is an apparent lack of ability, coupled with behavior issues, it's easy to let people go. Do you think being around guys like Artis and Young for two years was good for Damon Wilson's attitude?

None of these guys were Stalling's recruits, so it's completely reasonable that if you're going to be forced into a rebuild, that you would want to start fresh with your own guys, who you believe will buy-in.

Attitudes AND poor showings on the court is why most of those underclassmen were shown the door.

Also, given what you've seen so far this year, is it reasonable to assume that Stallings will be making mass substitutions again on his bench? Or is somehow a "lack of ability" going to be tolerated now when it wasn't before, just because they're "his" guys?

I obviously would hope they are given the time to develop, but color me suspicious given Stallings past actions here at Pitt that some/many will be back next year.

 

[DiehardPanther]

But was the dastardly thing that Barnes told Dixon that made Dixon say, "That's it!!", and he chose to leave. Did he ask for millions of salary dollars back? Did he say you can have no assistants? Did he dare challenge him to improve on performance and then we will talk about your desires?

I get it. Yes, Barnes and his cronies were idiots for thinking that if Jamie walked they could do better, but anybody that understands college basketball knows that the worse that happened here was that Barnes said no we won't do what you ask in terms of increasing salaries for assistants. If Barnes said, no the status quo of what you currently earn and what your ACs earn is all I will do. Is that really an "I'm going to walk" moment?

So Jamie was not being humiliated with what his next year was going to bring. It probably was pretty much what he agreed to in his contract. So, making Dixon seem like someone who was humiliated and spurned and had no choice but to leave is just ridiculous.

Two truths. Jamie left of his own volition. Barnes did not care.

Correction - Barnes and his consulting firm wanted Dixon to leave, so they could both make $. Barnes was already looking to leave, so what did he care.

 

[Delpanther]

All very reasonable points. And I get that new HC's want their own recruits. My problem is calling out fans for a lack of patience over any progress currently when the HC himself exhibited none, albeit for the reasons you posted above. I just don't think it's fair to have it both ways, that's all.

And could we please stop the narrative about Cam Johnson folding under some kind of perceived pressure? Unless you had access to the family (which maybe you did?), none of us know exactly what precipitated his decision to leave the program. By all accounts he was an intelligent, modest kid with tremendous upside. No reason to pile one except it strengthens your position.

I would suggest that the fans being called out for "lack of patience" with the current young players are being called out because in most instances they are actually also taking Stallings to task for purportedly encouraging or forcing several players to leave even though they were at least as good as the players he recruited. As Firebalz points out, the guys forced out were either upper classmen who showed no development under Dixon and Stallings or who had some behavioral issues on top of their performance problems. Hey there are lots of things about which one may reasonably shoot arrows at Stallings but getting rid of Dixon's riff raff isn't one of them. Stallings had a year's worth of data to evaluate the players who departed.... Not the case with the class he recruited.

 

[pitt-girl]

I would suggest that the fans being called out for "lack of patience" with the current young players are being called out because in most instances they are actually also taking Stallings to task for purportedly encouraging or forcing several players to leave even though they were at least as good as the players he recruited. As Firebalz points out, the guys forced out were either upper classmen who showed no development under Dixon and Stallings or who had some behavioral issues on top of their performance problems. Hey there are lots of things about which one may reasonably shoot arrows at Stallings but getting rid of Dixon's riff raff isn't one of them. Stallings had a year's worth of data to evaluate the players who departed.... Not the case with the class he recruited.

So, I'll ask you: given where we are today, do you expect that same kind of wholesale changes going into next year?

 

[Delpanther]

So, I'll ask you: given where we are today, do you expect that same kind of wholesale changes going into next year?

I think we're in uncharted territory, I'm not sure what to expect other than to say that until Pitt establishes some kind of foundation on its roster there may be more attrition than anything we've ever seen in the past. Pitt's in a situation almost akin to those sad situations where universities have lost all or nearly all of their players because of some kind of tragic accident. Pitt's essentially starting from scratch- that rarely happens anywhere. I think Pitt will likely be opportunistic where they can be going forward( regardless of who the HC is)and if that means more players leaving to create openings for better players, that's likely to be the case. Not a pretty situation....

 

[pitt-girl]

I think we're in uncharted territory, I'm not sure what to expect other than to say that until Pitt establishes some kind of foundation on its roster there may be more attrition than anything we've ever seen in the past. Pitt's in a situation almost akin to those sad situations where universities have lost all or nearly all of their players because of some kind of tragic accident. Pitt's essentially starting from scratch- that rarely happens anywhere. I think Pitt will likely be opportunistic where they can be going forward( regardless of who the HC is)and if that means more players leaving to create openings for better players, that's likely to be the case. Not a pretty situation....

Agree 100%. New HC's take over teams all the time. Somehow THIS one warranted a wholesale change. Perplexing.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

So, I'll ask you: given where we are today, do you expect that same kind of wholesale changes going into next year?

IMO, only if Stallings is replaced. Otherwise, some turnover but not "wholesale."

 

[Delpanther]

Agree 100%. New HC's take over teams all the time. Somehow THIS one warranted a wholesale change. Perplexing.

Well would we be any better off if the starting 5 we're Manigault, Kithcart, Damon Wilson, Nix and Wilson-Frame? I think not.... we'd be in at least as bad a situation with an equally uncertain future.

 

[pitt-girl]

IMO, only if Stallings is replaced. Otherwise, some turnover but not "wholesale."

No idea if Stallings will be returning, but I hope you're right. It wouldn't make much sense given what happened last year and the perceived lack of development or progress, but I think these kids deserve a chance to receive a bit more coaching before being thrown out.

 

[pitt-girl]

Well would we be any better off if the starting 5 we're Manigault, Kithcart, Damon Wilson, Nix and Wilson-Frame? I think not.... we'd be in at least as bad a situation with an equally uncertain future.

Totally agree again.

But in the spirit of this particular thread, that is why I feel it is disingenuous to point at the fanbase as not being reasonable when the HC appeared to demonstrate the same exact mindset. And my fear is that if it was necessary to do it last year, why wouldn't it happen again? The team appreciably is as bad (or worse given the current record) as last years, so logically wouldn't Stallings be thinking of replacing many of them?

 

[PANTHERAN]

Hall of Fame Coaches have dry spells. It happens to almost every coach. The guy is 52, not 62. He would have bounced back.