At this point, I don't care where the stadium is located. Putting it in Oakland doesn't seem feasible, especially considering they put a basketball court on the only reasonable space in town. I only cared that Pitt had a place of its own, but like I mentioned, that dream is dead.
The MONEY for the New Pitt Stadium
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At this point, I don't care where the stadium is located. Putting it in Oakland doesn't seem feasible, especially considering they put a basketball court on the only reasonable space in town. I only cared that Pitt had a place of its own, but like I mentioned, that dream is dead.
If Pitt wanted to build a stadium in Oakland, they could have spent the better part of the last 20 years acquiring the right parcels of land (some of which they would already own) at a reasonable price per square foot (based on properties sold over the last decade) and had the space for a new stadium. Of course now, "we don't have the space" is a direct result of the foot dragging of the past. At some point, an excuse becomes true, but only because they allowed it to happen. Fools.
Pitt bought the land they needed in Oakland in a very reasonable and intelligent way over the past decades. It was used for their primary mission: educating students and for academic and research buildings. The site where The Pete stands was not an option as it is now being used in a much better, more effective way than if a football stadium were there. It's about priorities.
What are they doing with the 2 million they were just given for football. I know that isn't enough for a stadium but it has to help somewhere. Maybe taking a plane to Florida Texas to recruit a little
I'd argue that they didn't buy the land needed for their primary academic mission, but that's another discussion. I do agree, however, that Pitt decided that football isn't a top priority, which is why there is no on campus stadium.
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They choose hoops over football, nordy's first love! A HUGE MISTAKE , one of many he made concerning athletics
It might actually have made sense to do so considering the state of football in the late 90s ... on the verge of insolvency and in a very dubious conference. Spinning us off into a shared stadium we don't own or operate was very appealing in case we'd end up taking the nuclear option with football.
The galling thing is that they threw in behind basketball but then let the program go to hell in the past few years.
If it were about priorities, the Pete should be torn down for a football stadium since college football is much more popular and profitable than basketball. They can build a smaller 8000-10,000 seat bball arena somewhere else on campus. 12,500 for basketball is too big.
Actually, if it were about academic priorities, the Pete wouldn't be there either.
But... Pitt needed a convocation center, so the $100M investment makes it ok, I guess.
CP in 3....2....1....
I remember the idea he had.It would have been similar to what BC has now.With Conte Forum connected to Alumni Stadium.Any idea why the idea went down the tubes?
They found a cheaper, easier way to give football and basketball new facilities.
https://www.fourfourtwo.com/us/feat...s-moving-pitches-public-parks-virtual-reality
This is a really good article about the MLS "urban stadium of the future" concept by Populous. Hey, in 20 years maybe something like this would be doable in Oakland for college football. Or a joint Pittsburgh MLS/Pitt football stadium downtown, maybe on the site of the old Civic Arena.
This is a really good article about the MLS "urban stadium of the future" concept by Populous. Hey, in 20 years maybe something like this would be doable in Oakland for college football. Or a joint Pittsburgh MLS/Pitt football stadium downtown, maybe on the site of the old Civic Arena.
It wouldn't fit. Stupid idea. No possible way could you get it properly balanced without it eventually falling.
And to allow a quick and easy cut and run from football if the situation ever got totally dire. Which it was close to in the late 90s. Seems on more solid footing now but that was far from assured back then.
For basketball, remember that the Pete can also be used for many other things. Even with basketball at a low point now and the foreseeable future, the building is still viable for concerts, ceremonies, other sports, general athletic facilities and offices.
You can deplore it from a traditionalist and sentimental view but from aspects of finances (and traffic and parking and egress) it was the (very very very rare) smart decision. The fact that it became necessary because of decades of DUMB decisions regarding athletics (such as caving to pressure to self sanction in football, and no maintenance to the stadium seemingly through its entire existence) is moot. As is the idiocy of allowing basketball to fall apart in recent years. In that isolated span of time of the late 90s, the Pitt administration made a wise decision.
There you go again. You aren't an engineer, architect or city planner and you claim The New Pitt Stadium won't fit. Unfortunately, you are wrong again. Please formulate a better response. I've measure the site. Fits like a glove. See www.newpittstadium.com
The best and wisest leaders do not make decisions that are solely the best at that moment, but are the best for the long term future.
It IS taking the long term future into consideration. Football still isn't out of the woods yet. Especially if the conference situations remain fluid and the big programs freeze out the ones that can't (or in Pitt's case refuses) to keep competitive. If (when) the truly "power" programs of college football split off and if Pitt is left out of that, and football becomes totally untenable to continue with, they can just call the stadium authority and say "nice knowing ya".
Nordy inherited a rundown, neglected stadium that could have been updated, but at what cost? I was all for keeping the Stadium, but the Trustees caved to political pressure and inked the quid pro quo deal with Rooney. You may recall that the 6-county referendum on replacing 3RS with the new joints was defeated by a 2-1 margin....and ignored. Smurphy, a Rooney waterboy, greased the skids in Hbg, and we ended up with a great facility for hoops. That's as close to an all-out commitment to sports as we'll ever see.
I praise them in my post above for the decision. It was the only thing they really could have done at the time short of just dropping football all together. Maybe that's what they SHOULD have done since they seem to have such contempt for success in it. But that's fodder for a different thread.
Can't believe this is still being debated in 2017. Think of how bad the program was in 1996. How bad things got for football in the big East around the same time or shortly thereafter (consider where Cincy and UConn are now in football). And how bad the stadium was. Don't recall it a happy little student just excitedly attending college games ... rolling out of your SOD with that hangover from Zeldas and stumbling up to the student section, where you likely passed out anyway and then left early. That romanticizes the place (not sure how, but different strokes). No, seriously try to remember how decrepit it was later, when you were paying higher prices and going (or not) from your comfy home in the suburbs. Remember how bad the benches. The steps crumbling. Of course, the awful restrooms. Concessions worse than a little league field. Having to pay an old Hill District guy so you could park your car on the side of his hovel and crossing fingers the car would be there (on all four wheels) when you returned. And remember that the school really could not pay enough to fix all those awful things even if it had the money or will, which it didn't. Really seriously think about it.
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As I said....the admin under Posvar/Bozik....Killer "B's", had totally bailed on keeping the old girl in shape.....it WAS crumbling. But it was OURS. Given the situation, we have paid the price extracted by Nordy's predecessors. Now, it's a case closed, there is NO justification for building a new place....none. I said then that we'd never return to campus. Do you recall the Pharm school webcam that chronicled the tear-down?? The last section...36, was where I had my 4 tix. I recall the reaction from my oldest when I told her on the phone....she just went silent for a couple minutes.
Ideal world they would have been continuously upgrading it for decades and it would have not take much to improve by late 1990s. Likewise would have kept up the winning through the 80s and 90s and you'd have eager alumni happy and willing to contribute to it instead of an embarrassed and disgusted group that was witnessing losses like 60-6 and 72-0. But we didn't have that so they did the best thing they could at the time.
Just because it was "ours" wouldn't have kept the place from continuing to rot away. They can't or won't pay for the basics of football now ... our decent coaches like Canada automatically leave and it's not even a consideration to keep them... we pay nothing for recruiting while our enemies around us have private jets and helicopters ... And that's with NO stadium albatross around our necks. Imagine trying to field a program with annual 7 and 8 figure budgets for stadium upkeep.
Did you think Matt House sucked as a Defensive coordinator? (Of course you did, you're not retarded). Well he'd probably be our HEAD coach in the above scenario. Hell, I dunno we could even afford THAT.
There are no Republicans in Pgh. and, yes, I think Ridge was governor at the time?? Idiots & crooks, all of them.....but NO ONE drains the taxpayers like the Rooneys.
I think they quoted $100 milion to renovate it.....silly. They were already that much behind on upkeep. Claimed cost of maintenance was $800K/year. No way Pitt was going to put $500 million into that fancy stadium/gym hookup connected by escalators. It would have been a showplace.
County Republicans. Rooney convinced them to green-light the North shore T extension and nix the proposed T line into Oakland so that his stadium would have more going for it. The extension is so popular that it has to be free to convince people to use it (sarcasm). Meanwhile, Oakland is getting a fancy bus while traffic gets worse and worse there.
the north shore T extension is used, not sure what you are watching. work in north shore and that thing is filled daily. took it on thur to bucco game and unfortunately I took it, felt like I was in India trying to get to work, mad dash for the door, dudes hanging on the sides, couple poor kids sitting indian style on top..
Simple as this. Pitt missed their opportunity to invest in the stadium in the 70s and 80s, when football was great. Accounts from those here make it seem like Pitt was more embarrassed than proud to have a great football team, as if Pitt were equivalent to Harvard. Opportunity doesn't often come knocking.
It's still free right? They don't want to suffer the embarrassment of it going unused most of the day, that's one reason why it is free. The other is because they've figured out how to get a tax payer funded and mostly tax payer subsidized line to help fill up the parking lots on the North shore (wink wink more revenue for those in the right spot) with proceeds going to the parking company (actually a contract deal I believe) while the public funds the T with some token contributions from the Steelers.
It's all one brilliant, interconnect plan to add more revenue to the coffers.
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all stops within the city are free, once you cross the river, they are free. that was always the case.. not sure that effects the volume going to the north shore for the daily commute though, no one lives in downtown Pittsburgh, no one lives near wood street or gateway plaza and needs to commute to north shore. If they did, they'd just walk across the bridge, it's easier.
I wont argue with you on your last few points, politicians playing politics, rooneys play it well. All I can tell you is that those last two stops, north shore and the one by Heinz, does not go unused.
If all things were equal, and it was between the T stop to Heinz or a line to Oakland, I'd choose the latter, no arguments there..
Unfortunately many, particularly posters here, think the same today. And tellingly these include posters that others consider our 'sages'. Umpteen guys (possibly women too to be fair) who have hundreds or thousands of posts on a PITT SPORTS MESSAGE BOARD (never understand that) whose bulk of their posts consist of screeds like "Pitt's purpose is to be an academic university" and "sure glad WE'RE not UNC (or Ohio State or whomever is successful at that time).
What? You wouldn't want Pitt to be considered a better university (which those definitely are)? Universally admired, enhancing the value of the degrees of their alumni, giving fun memorable experiences to their student body, being given political favors (including free land and subsidized facilities) and making money hand over fist? Yeah sure glad WE aren't THEM.
It takes big $$$ to compete at that level....and Pitt has screwed the pooch repeatedly in the time I've been here. Did well to convince (Conomikes) John Majors to come here. Did well to bring in Howland (Vaccaro gift). Both were succeeded by their top assistants, who carried on really well. Other than that??? There's no reason/excuse for Pitt to be so weak in sports....but there's no commitment.
Any sane person without a vested financial interest would have chosen the line to Oakland over the North shore T extension.
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what has gone on. One parking company gets more business as people from the suburbs park on the North Shore and take the half billion dollar tax payer funded T extension half a mile to work. Or they drive to downtown to park for a game, and either take the T or walk over. Likely, they will be parking in a garage owned by the same company as the North Shore garages. Then, with more garages going up, there is less tailgating space, which increases the value of stadium club seats, bars and restaurants in that area, and additional revenue generators like paying for a tailgating tent.
The tax payers subsidize all of this and end up with what? Fewer options to tailgate and more chances to direct their money from their own wallets and into the coffers of the folks who orchestrated this brilliant plan.
To top it all off, the T extension was supposed to extend into the Northside neighborhood, so that people who live there could use it to get to work. But that generates $0 for certain entities, so it never happened.
Sounds like a conspiracy theory, doesn't it? It isn't. When the Rooney's can convince County Republicans to make it happen, you know the right people are making big bucks.
Dude, how many times does it need to be said. No one cares about tailgating. You and I drinking beer from our cars on a Saturday under the sunshine with a grill, that doesn't equate into the development of the city.. This isn't a priority for city and county officials. They aren't all getting together and talking about plans and say, well HTP and Swerve are pounding beers on Saturdays in October and well this new garage could impact that. Not sure we should do this, Swervin and Hailtopitt really like their beer and hot dogs..
That doesn't happen. No one of consequence cares about tailgating. The rest of it is politics my man and I will not argue that with you. Deals were done to line pockets and they were probably not done for the best interest of us shlubs. No arguments from me on this.. All I said was the T is filled daily, that in no way is me trying to argue with you on any of this..
a T line to Oakland would be very beneficial to the city. TOns of employees work daily in there. Students, the 25 hospitals, retail stores, CMU students, all of it. I agree 100% that this should be a priority. If I had 2.5 billion to spare, I'd fund the thing myself but I just got back from Virginia beach with the kiddos and im tapped out..
