The myth of the greatness of wanny

[H2P 2003]

There are far too many people on here that seem to misrember his tenure here.

Yes, he had the best three year stretch a pitt coach has had in the last 30 years. Yes, he recruited a good amount of talent. Yes, he won 10 games.

However, that three year stretch was only one win better than walt’s Lasr three years. Walt played in a much stronger conference until his last year.

Despite everyone assuming 09 was our best year in the last thirty years, that title belongs to the 08 team. A win against top 5 VT, and close losses to a powerhouse Miami, and a good ND team. The A&M loss sucked, but was no worse than the Nc state loss.

Finally, Walt took over a horrendous situation and saved the program from the dead. Dave inherited a team with a fairly large amount of talent, and frankly stunk up the joint.

He squandered palko. He completely misused LaRod Stephens howling. He had decent defensive talent. Even with all that, pitt missed three straight bowls.

Yes, wanny turned it around, but the main complaint about Walt is he couldn’t take the next step. Dave did not, and in fact pissed away gift wrapped big east titles.

Don’t be confused by facts, both coaches had flaws, but wanny’s teams choked more than any coach I’ve ever seen.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Yes but Wanny's recruiting was still on the upward trend, at least on paper. Walt's recruiting started getting bad

 

[H2P 2003]

Yes but Wanny's recruiting was still on the upward trend, at least on paper. Walt's recruiting started getting bad

Maybe on paper, but what he had signed in that class ended up pretty underwhelming.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Yes but Wanny's recruiting was still on the upward trend, at least on paper. Walt's recruiting started getting bad

Maybe on paper, but what he had signed in that class ended up pretty underwhelming.

Yes but he beat big programs for those guys which is a sign he could have continued to do that.

 

[Pittx9]

Despite everyone assuming 09 was our best year in the last thirty years, that title belongs to the 08 team. A win against top 5 VT, and close losses to a powerhouse Miami, and a good ND team. The A&M loss sucked, but was no worse than the Nc state loss.

Considering none of that ever happened in 2008, I’m assuming you meant the 2002 team? If that’s the case I may have to agree. I’ve always said that may be the best 4 loss team in college football history. Every loss was by 1 possession, just a few plays away from beating some really, really good teams.

 

[H2P 2003]

Considering none of that ever happened in 2008, I’m assuming you meant the 2002 team? If that’s the case I may have to agree. I’ve always said that may be the best 4 loss team in college football history. Every loss was by 1 possession, just a few plays away from beating some really, really good teams.

Yeah, my bad. 02.

 

[Toddy_Too_Hotty]

The way I see it, I have my preference between the two, and I like them both more than most of the recent hires, but they both had a fair shot (meaning plenty of years) to get us to the next level. They didn't.

Walt peaked in performance. Wanny was always flatlined and likely a little downward. Either of them just needed one stellar year to secure a longer term, but that didn't happen.

 

[LeftCoastPanther]

If you're going to be cheap with your football program then you might as well keep a figurehead guy like Wannstedt.

He had a good staff in place despite the piss-poor leadership not willing to spend. When you have your recruiting budget sliced, you cannot expect huge results recruiting slow kids within a 90-mile radius of Pittsburgh.

Dave had some kids committed who had solid college careers: Quentin Alston, Deonte Gibson, Bill Belton, Terrell Chestnut, Kyshon Jarrett off the top of my head.

The schedules in 2011 and 2012 weren't daunting, so the chance to win 8-9 games or more and showing stability would have been huge. Then with PSU's issues coming, Wannstedt had the chance to poach some kids from PSU's roster to fill holes. Not many, but two or three kids would have been helpful. Pitt showed it was even more unstable than PSU at this time, which is pretty amazing in itself.

There was an upswing in talent in Pennsylvania in 2012, especially with offensive linemen and defensive backs. Wannstedt was already building a nice secondary with K'wuan Williams and Jason Hendricks then adding Jarrett and soon Pitts. There were some kids coming down the pike who ended up going to Michigan State then with the kid still at WVU from Aliquippa. Linebacker recruiting was always a weakness for Dave and his staff.

The 2011 team would have had Lewis, Hyno and Graham toting the rock, Street and Shanahan catching passes and a good line with Gibbs, Jacobson, Nix, Rotherman and Turley starting. Sunseri would have benefitted playing in the same offense instead of Graham's spread. The defensive line with Donald, Caragein, Chas and Lindsey would have been pretty good.

It is time to move on from it. This decade is winding down and Dave has been gone since December of 2010. The school screwed up firing him, but that is what Pitt's leaders are best at: screwing up its football program. Just like in 1982 going cheap with Foge instead of opening it up to a head coach from elsewhere who wanted to inherit the No. 1 team in the country and coach Dan Marino!

 

[rmf05]

Yes but Wanny's recruiting was still on the upward trend, at least on paper. Walt's recruiting started getting bad

Yet anothet myth. His recruiting was falling apart. His class wasn't ranked when he was fired. It was top 10 for awhile that year which kept him from getting canned during the season as the team totally imploded around him and we were supposedly in the running for a couple Top 100 kids from NJ and Harrisburg. Then he totally lost the team and they quit against WVU, the coordinators got into a fistfight at half time. Several players were suspended-expelled for gang activity including one player who had acouple of his armed buddies show up at the southside facility to murder another player on the team because he broke his I-Pad. 3 of the top players in our class de-committed after the season (including Hank Poteats nephew) and the 2 Top 100 kids eliminated us from contention including Keith Hamilton's son. The class was becoming a disaster which meant there was no longer a reason to fear firing him. The ax fell. Wannstedt left the program a shambles. Every aspect of it both on and off the field were bottom half of the Big East level.

 

[303vND]

Wannstedt couldn’t coach he had to go!

 

[McKee Place]

It's not who you get rid of, it's who you replace him with.

 

[H2P 2003]

It's not who you get rid of, it's who you replace him with.

Hayward was a reach, but the reality is he might have come here and killed it. We don’t know.

Todd graham was a really good hire....he was just a doosh.

 

[oldpanther]

The way I see it, I have my preference between the two, and I like them both more than most of the recent hires, but they both had a fair shot (meaning plenty of years) to get us to the next level. They didn't.

Walt peaked in performance. Wanny was always flatlined and likely a little downward. Either of them just needed one stellar year to secure a longer term, but that didn't happen.

I agree, Walt arrived and the program was a disaster, being offensive minded he did a very good job in the rebuilding that phase of the team but I believe he neglected the defensive side which cost the team more success. Wanny had to spend several early years of his stay rebuilding the defense which limited his success. He failed to take advantage of his wins over opponents ND, WVU etc. when the team would collapse against inferior competition, Bowling Green, UConn etc.. The Big East title game against Cincinnati was the dagger that destroyed what minor success that both Walt and Wanny achieved.

 

[Pittx9]

If you're going to be cheap with your football program then you might as well keep a figurehead guy like Wannstedt.

He had a good staff in place despite the piss-poor leadership not willing to spend. When you have your recruiting budget sliced, you cannot expect huge results recruiting slow kids within a 90-mile radius of Pittsburgh.

Dave had some kids committed who had solid college careers: Quentin Alston, Deonte Gibson, Bill Belton, Terrell Chestnut, Kyshon Jarrett off the top of my head.

The schedules in 2011 and 2012 weren't daunting, so the chance to win 8-9 games or more and showing stability would have been huge. Then with PSU's issues coming, Wannstedt had the chance to poach some kids from PSU's roster to fill holes. Not many, but two or three kids would have been helpful. Pitt showed it was even more unstable than PSU at this time, which is pretty amazing in itself.

There was an upswing in talent in Pennsylvania in 2012, especially with offensive linemen and defensive backs. Wannstedt was already building a nice secondary with K'wuan Williams and Jason Hendricks then adding Jarrett and soon Pitts. There were some kids coming down the pike who ended up going to Michigan State then with the kid still at WVU from Aliquippa. Linebacker recruiting was always a weakness for Dave and his staff.

The 2011 team would have had Lewis, Hyno and Graham toting the rock, Street and Shanahan catching passes and a good line with Gibbs, Jacobson, Nix, Rotherman and Turley starting. Sunseri would have benefitted playing in the same offense instead of Graham's spread. The defensive line with Donald, Caragein, Chas and Lindsey would have been pretty good.

It is time to move on from it. This decade is winding down and Dave has been gone since December of 2010. The school screwed up firing him, but that is what Pitt's leaders are best at: screwing up its football program. Just like in 1982 going cheap with Foge instead of opening it up to a head coach from elsewhere who wanted to inherit the No. 1 team in the country and coach Dan Marino!

Some spot on points. One minor detail though, do you really think wanny staying keeps dion Lewis from going pro following the 2010 season? I doubt it, but who knows.

 

[H2P 2003]

Some spot on points. One minor detail though, do you really think wanny staying keeps dion Lewis from going pro following the 2010 season? I doubt it, but who knows.

Lewis wasn’t coming back to allow wanny to run him 35 times a game and break him down.

Also ray graham had come close to surpassing him.

 

[Jakey_John]

Yeah, my bad. 02.

That’s what compounded the awfulness of 2003. 2002 was by far and away the best season since the wheels fell of and it’s certainly the best after. 2003 should have been spectacular. Then Toledo happened.

 

[Pittx9]

Lewis wasn’t coming back to allow wanny to run him 35 times a game and break him down.

Also ray graham had come close to surpassing him.

I was actually always a little more of a graham fan. And that’s not a knock on Lewis, he was a fantastic running back. If graham didn’t get hurt though, I really think he would be widely considered the 2nd best back ever out of pitt.

 

[BuffetParrothead]

There are far too many people on here that seem to misrember his tenure here.

Yes, he had the best three year stretch a pitt coach has had in the last 30 years. Yes, he recruited a good amount of talent. Yes, he won 10 games.

However, that three year stretch was only one win better than walt’s Lasr three years. Walt played in a much stronger conference until his last year.

Despite everyone assuming 09 was our best year in the last thirty years, that title belongs to the 08 team. A win against top 5 VT, and close losses to a powerhouse Miami, and a good ND team. The A&M loss sucked, but was no worse than the Nc state loss.

Finally, Walt took over a horrendous situation and saved the program from the dead. Dave inherited a team with a fairly large amount of talent, and frankly stunk up the joint.

He squandered palko. He completely misused LaRod Stephens howling. He had decent defensive talent. Even with all that, pitt missed three straight bowls.

Yes, wanny turned it around, but the main complaint about Walt is he couldn’t take the next step. Dave did not, and in fact pissed away gift wrapped big east titles.

Don’t be confused by facts, both coaches had flaws, but wanny’s teams choked more than any coach I’ve ever seen.

I'll take any of that compared to what we have now and what we can expect.
Do you realize we could be heading for a 3-9 season. Maybe a 2-10 season?
If that happens I bet you'll mis-remember that fact!

 

[H2P 2003]

I was actually always a little more of a graham fan. And that’s not a knock on Lewis, he was a fantastic running back. If graham didn’t get hurt though, I really think he would be widely considered the 2nd best back ever out of pitt.

Before he got hurt, and in graham’s Offense, he was a Heisman contender. He had the vision, and ability to cut back like Le’Veon bell.

 

[H2P 2003]

I'll take any of that compared to what we have now and what we can expect.
Do you realize we could be heading for a 3-9 season. Maybe a 2-10 season?
If that happens I bet you'll mis-remember that fact!

Narduzzi wasn’t the answer. I was concerned by year two, really worried after last year, and now it is obvious he isn’t the guy.

It doesn’t change the fact that wanny was a disaster. If wanny did 9-3 and 8-4 records in the ACC I’d be fine staying with him forever. Doing it on a weak big east and not winning the conference was unacceptable.

 

[LeftCoastPanther]

Some spot on points. One minor detail though, do you really think wanny staying keeps dion Lewis from going pro following the 2010 season? I doubt it, but who knows.

My buddy from Youngstown was the video coordinator for Pitt then and said Lewis likely stays if Wanny stays, just as Hyno left with year remaining to play.

 

[paulbl99]

The trifecta of whacking Wanny with replacements by baby mommy beater by the Texas Turd is the most f’d up college sports fiasco in the history of f’d college sports fiasco.
Smiley pulled off the near epic impossibility.......PITT has not recovered, may not for a very long time.

I know it’s the hipster thing to heep praise all over Lyke,
but she may have sunk PITT FB even further by giving a coach, coming off a yr three S* record, a huge bump and extension....

 

[Pittx9]

My buddy from Youngstown was the video coordinator for Pitt then and said Lewis likely stays if Wanny stays, just as Hyno left with year remaining to play.

Wow, I know even though some don’t like to admit it, all the kids I’ve heard from in interviews and that I’ve talked to in person loved wanny. But I’m still a bit surprised by that as it does not seem going pro was a bad choice at all for dion.

 

[PittMiamiRivalry]

There are far too many people on here that seem to misrember his tenure here.

Yes, he had the best three year stretch a pitt coach has had in the last 30 years. Yes, he recruited a good amount of talent. Yes, he won 10 games.

However, that three year stretch was only one win better than walt’s Lasr three years. Walt played in a much stronger conference until his last year.

Despite everyone assuming 09 was our best year in the last thirty years, that title belongs to the 08 team. A win against top 5 VT, and close losses to a powerhouse Miami, and a good ND team. The A&M loss sucked, but was no worse than the Nc state loss.

Finally, Walt took over a horrendous situation and saved the program from the dead. Dave inherited a team with a fairly large amount of talent, and frankly stunk up the joint.

He squandered palko. He completely misused LaRod Stephens howling. He had decent defensive talent. Even with all that, pitt missed three straight bowls.

Yes, wanny turned it around, but the main complaint about Walt is he couldn’t take the next step. Dave did not, and in fact pissed away gift wrapped big east titles.

Don’t be confused by facts, both coaches had flaws, but wanny’s teams choked more than any coach I’ve ever seen.

 

[PittMiamiRivalry]

I think you meant to say the 2002 season not 2008.

 

[wbrpanther]

There are far too many people on here that seem to misrember his tenure here.

Yes, he had the best three year stretch a pitt coach has had in the last 30 years. Yes, he recruited a good amount of talent. Yes, he won 10 games.

However, that three year stretch was only one win better than walt’s Lasr three years. Walt played in a much stronger conference until his last year.

Despite everyone assuming 09 was our best year in the last thirty years, that title belongs to the 08 team. A win against top 5 VT, and close losses to a powerhouse Miami, and a good ND team. The A&M loss sucked, but was no worse than the Nc state loss.

Finally, Walt took over a horrendous situation and saved the program from the dead. Dave inherited a team with a fairly large amount of talent, and frankly stunk up the joint.

He squandered palko. He completely misused LaRod Stephens howling. He had decent defensive talent. Even with all that, pitt missed three straight bowls.

Yes, wanny turned it around, but the main complaint about Walt is he couldn’t take the next step. Dave did not, and in fact pissed away gift wrapped big east titles.

Don’t be confused by facts, both coaches had flaws, but wanny’s teams choked more than any coach I’ve ever seen.

Wanny had us winning 9 and 10 games a year and the program was stabilized. Maybe we wouldn’t have improved a lot on that going forward but it doesn’t look bad about now.

 

[#99HUGHgreen]

I was actually always a little more of a graham fan. And that’s not a knock on Lewis, he was a fantastic running back.

I know what you mean about Graham and Lewis. We were spoiled as fans to have those two truly elite talent backs on one team. I remember being ecstatic after only seeing a few carries by Ray his freshman year. You just knew he was going to be special.

If graham didn’t get hurt though, I really think he would be widely considered the 2nd best back ever out of pitt.

He was special to the point where one could argue his potential ceiling at Pitt was greater than Lewis, Martin, Hayward or Richards... even Conner. I just don’t ever see him (even at his absolute best), surpassing TD or McCoy. Those guys are literally as good as it gets. Ray was so, so gifted, just a hair less so than those two.

There are elite backs who have a great shot of playing on Sunday (unless an injury stops them), and then there are “top shelf” elite backs who are just so ridiculously good that they are all but guaranteed to be elite backs on Sunday too.

 

[MyNameisJoe]

Useless post and typical of every single Pittsburgh fan, living in the past.

 

[H2P 2003]

Wanny had us winning 9 and 10 games a year and the program was stabilized. Maybe we wouldn’t have improved a lot on that going forward but it doesn’t look bad about now.

His last year he won 7 games, got blasted by Miami and WVU, and let a mediocre UConn team beat him...a UConn team that lost to temple, Rutgers, and a mediocre Louisville team.

It was possibly the easiest path pitt ever had to a BCS bowl, and dave’s team blew it.

 

[Wildman4Pitt]

Well right now and since Wanny it's been CRAP, so give me Wanny over this circus act any day.

 

[MyNameisJoe]

His last year he won 7 games, got blasted by Miami and WVU, and let a mediocre UConn team beat him...a UConn team that lost to temple, Rutgers, and a mediocre Louisville team.

It was possibly the easiest path pitt ever had to a BCS bowl, and dave’s team blew it.

Wanny is a gazzilion times the coach that Walt is. There's a reason you never heard of Walt before and after his stint at Pitt.

 

[H2P 2003]

Wanny is a gazzilion times the coach that Walt is. There's a reason you never heard of Walt before and after his stint at Pitt.

LOL.

 

[SoufOaklin4Life]

Wanny had us winning 9 and 10 games a year and the program was stabilized. Maybe we wouldn’t have improved a lot on that going forward but it doesn’t look bad about now.

Until the next season when he won 7.

 

[Pittx9]

I know what you mean about Graham and Lewis. We were spoiled as fans to have those two truly elite talent backs on one team. I remember being ecstatic after only seeing a few carries by Ray his freshman year. You just knew he was going to be special.




He was special to the point where one could argue his potential ceiling at Pitt was greater than Lewis, Martin, Hayward or Richards... even Conner. I just don’t ever see him (even at his absolute best), surpassing TD or McCoy. Those guys are literally as good as it gets. Ray was so, so gifted, just a hair less so than those two.

There are elite backs who have a great shot of playing on Sunday (unless an injury stops them), and then there are “top shelf” elite backs who are just so ridiculously good that they are all but guaranteed to be elite backs on Sunday too.

Yeah I remember his run against Notre Dame his freshman year, I was standing in the student section just in awe how anyone could ever tackle that kid lol.

Obviously nothing could’ve made him surpass td though, that’s why I said second best. I know what you mean about McCoy and I agree, but hypothetically I don’t think it’s that far fetched he could’ve been regarded higher by pitt and college football fans.

Pitt was still alive for the BE title heading to Morgantown, lost by 1 as they got knocked out of FG range late. Also lost to Cincy when we missed a long last second FG earlier in the year. With graham’s talent, I think we probably win those games, and if we did... would’ve went to the BCS. And if he kept up his torrid pace, could’ve at least been a Heisman candidate (winning it may have been too tall of a task but who knows). That was his junior year, that injury seriously, seriously derailed his career.

 

[Wildman4Pitt]

Wanny is a gazzilion times the coach that Walt is. There's a reason you never heard of Walt before and after his stint at Pitt.

He took Thanford to new heights!

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

Wanny is a gazzilion times the coach that Walt is. There's a reason you never heard of Walt before and after his stint at Pitt.

You get that to the rest of the football world other than the yinzer part of it Dave Wannstedt is pretty universally considered a joke of a coach who failed every time he got the chance to be a head coach, right?

Including here.

 

[KennyTheKangaroo]

Why the f are we talking about a coach that hasn’t been here for almost an entire decade

 

[Pittx9]

Wanny is a gazzilion times the coach that Walt is. There's a reason you never heard of Walt before and after his stint at Pitt.

I think most people knew Walt was o-coordinator for a handful of years under majors at Tennessee, qb coach of the jets for a few years, and qb coach at Ohio state for a couple years. That was all before pitt, if you hadn’t heard of him at that point I don’t know what to tell you.

 

[Jakey_John]

Why the f are we talking about a coach that hasn’t been here for almost an entire decade

Are you new here?

 

[CJsE]

You get that to the rest of the football world other than the yinzer part of it Dave Wannstedt is pretty universally considered a joke of a coach who failed every time he got the chance to be a head coach, right?

Including here.

He certainly is not in the upper echelon of the coaching ranks, but calling him a joke just shows your ignorance. The vast majority of coaches eventually fail as a head coach, there aren't many that have 10 years of success followed by a celebrated retirement. There are literally hundreds of NFL coaches with less years as a coach, less wins as a coach, a lower winning percentage, and less playoff appearances. There is an even higher percentage of college coaches that fared far worse during their tenure than Wannstedt.

The Dolphins won 41 games over 4 seasons (4 more wins than during the 4 precious years under Jimmy Johnson) before the 2004 disaster. Before that season, Rick Williams retired (after having nearly 4,000 yards of offense over the previous 2 seasons), Marino was hired then quit as VP of Football Operations, and their new VP traded away high draft picks for AJ Feeley, and traded away the team's reigning MVP in Ogunleye.

He was an average head coach at worst.