Tim Benz article Narduzzi is overrated

[steel_curtain]

-Anyone read this? Here is the big glaring omission. No one talks about playing 5 ranked teams every single year. No one talks about a suicide non conference schedule every single year. Because its either lazy journalism or no one remembers.


-But people sure remember win loss records. Every Wisconsin fan loves being ranked Top 5 for beating no one, playing no one, then losing 59-0 to Ohio state. But they dont care. They are in the Top 5 polls

-Again, why does Pitt continue to play suicide schedules? How many frigging articles paint the picture that only win / loss records count.

-The day football adopts the RPI is the day polls have meaning



https://triblive.com/sports/columni...h-pat-narduzzi-overrated-depends-how-much-you

 

[jtownknowitall]

You know who is not overrated? Nick Saban.

 

[Pittstudent313]

You know who is not overrated? Nick Saban.

He is a complete jagoff, but he is not overrated! You nailed that, boom .....

 

[Pittstudent313]

I do see a lot of merit in this article though, he really needs a breakout year and soon.

 

[ratking17]

I do see a lot of merit in this article though, he really needs a breakout year and soon.

Of course you do.

And he was just given an extension in the off season so I am not sure he needs a breakout year and soon. 21 wins in his first 3 years is best in 30 years at pitt.

 

[JD1976]

Strange column. Sounds like a local media guy who liked Harris and Wanny because they were more Media friendly.

 

[Burgh15]

I really don't know what Benz was trying to achieve with this column. No one is saying Narduzzi is a top coach right now, not even in his own division.

 

[PhPanther2]

What’s Narduzzi rated at now in order for anybody to say he is overrated/underrated?

Do we go by salary? If so, he’s about middle of the pack right? So based on his performance, he’s rated about right.

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

Tim Benz is a tool. He tried hard to write a negative article and couldn't even do a good job at that. He created a strawman and left it standing.

 

[pittdan77]

Given what happened to Miami last night, the Costal is bad. Narduzzi needs to jump all over the division.

 

[Pittx9]

21 wins in his first 3 years is best in 30 years at pitt.

Amazing really that nobody seems to comprehend this. Yes, chryst inherited an absolute disaster and left narduzzi with a solid foundation. But Wanny (the only coach since ‘81 with a 10 win season) inherited a preseason top 25 team with talent and couldn’t win right away. Walt (only coach to take pitt to the bcs) had an amazing turn around but had early struggles after his inaugural bowl season.

Aside from Chryst who despite building a solid foundation remained stagnant at .500 each regular season he was here, the other coaches who stayed more than 1 year recently got better with time. I don’t think you should overlook that narduzzi came in and won 8 games right off the bat.... and then again in year 2. And despite the defense going way downhill in year 2, he has some great signature wins already.

Certainly it hasn’t all been good under narduzzi. Comparatively speaking though, he’s definitely off to a better start than we’ve seen in a very long time. These next two years will tell a lot though.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

Amazing really that nobody seems to comprehend this. Yes, chryst inherited an absolute disaster and left narduzzi with a solid foundation. But Wanny (the only coach since ‘81 with a 10 win season) inherited a preseason top 25 team with talent and couldn’t win right away. Walt (only coach to take pitt to the bcs) had an amazing turn around but had early struggles after his inaugural bowl season.

Aside from Chryst who despite building a solid foundation remained stagnant at .500 each regular season he was here, the other coaches who stayed more than 1 year recently got better with time. I don’t think you should overlook that narduzzi came in and won 8 games right off the bat.... and then again in year 2. And despite the defense going way downhill in year 2, he has some great signature wins already.

Certainly it hasn’t all been good under narduzzi. Comparatively speaking though, he’s definitely off to a better start than we’ve seen in a very long time. These next two years will tell a lot though.

"But Wanny (the only coach since ‘81 with a 10 win season) inherited a preseason top 25 team with talent and couldn’t win right away."

Wow, this complete myth still persists! Amazing!

 

[jtownknowitall]

Myth? It took him five years to make Pitt as good as it was when he took over.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

It took him five years to make Pitt as good as it was when he took over.

It also took the quality of the league he was playing in to go downhill.

But he did like him some chip-chop and fish sammiches, so he was Gdo!

 

[McKee Place]

The best coaches are often called overrated by enemies of the program... which he certainly qualifies, as do most local media.

It's why i cringe at our fans saying that of Franklin. He has flaws as a coach. But as a recruiter, the most important part of the job, he exploits his blue blood advantages to the hilt. He's not overrated.

As far as our guy then ... this Syracuse puke saying it kind of helps legitimize Narduzzi.

And the best coaches regularly are shown to be "jagoffs". So whoever said that, that's a compliment to Narduzzi too. I might not wanna be his neighbor (unless he'd score me club seats!). But if he's a prick, frankly that often goes with success.

You know these local weasels peruse these boards craving attention for their insults ... so we're giving it to him ... but as mentioned it's actually a compliment.

 

[pittdan77]

Amazing really that nobody seems to comprehend this. Yes, chryst inherited an absolute disaster and left narduzzi with a solid foundation. But Wanny (the only coach since ‘81 with a 10 win season) inherited a preseason top 25 team with talent and couldn’t win right away. Walt (only coach to take pitt to the bcs) had an amazing turn around but had early struggles after his inaugural bowl season.

Aside from Chryst who despite building a solid foundation remained stagnant at .500 each regular season he was here, the other coaches who stayed more than 1 year recently got better with time. I don’t think you should overlook that narduzzi came in and won 8 games right off the bat.... and then again in year 2. And despite the defense going way downhill in year 2, he has some great signature wins already.

Certainly it hasn’t all been good under narduzzi. Comparatively speaking though, he’s definitely off to a better start than we’ve seen in a very long time. These next two years will tell a lot though.

There’s no reason to believe Chryst wouldn’t have been as successful as Narduzzi the next three years.

 

[Pittx9]

"But Wanny (the only coach since ‘81 with a 10 win season) inherited a preseason top 25 team with talent and couldn’t win right away."

Wow, this complete myth still persists! Amazing!

They weren’t coming off a fiesta bowl appearance and ranked #23 to start the season? And did he not miss a bowl game his first 3 years?

 

[Pittx9]

There’s no reason to believe Chryst wouldn’t have been as successful as Narduzzi the next three years.

I agree. But to have that success your first three years as a head coach, not insane to expect ‘18, ‘19, and ‘20 to be even better than that when the coach is experienced and has had time to build a program.

 

[Pittstudent313]

There’s no reason to believe Chryst wouldn’t have been as successful as Narduzzi the next three years.

PC is a better coach than Duzz, just my opinion

 

[pittguy81]

I do see a lot of merit in this article though, he really needs a breakout year and soon.

The fact that you think your trolling as a "Pitt fan" is working...well funny as hell.

Oh. Joe knew.

 

[pittguy81]

Given what happened to Miami last night, the Costal is bad. Narduzzi needs to jump all over the division.

It must be nice for you to have a job that requires no analytical skills or logic. So Miami is the entire Coastal? Yeah OK. Great insight after one team plays one game against a Top 25 SEC team.

Hey you did set up a ridiculous strawman to bury Pitt and Narduzzi if they don't rout every other team in the Division, so you have that going for you.

 

[LeftCoastPanther]

I do see a lot of merit in this article though, he really needs a breakout year and soon.

What the program needs is stability and see what can happen with Narduzzi as the coach for four more years. This year could have been a breakout year but playing the toughest non-conference schedule in the country is not the year to gauge him in the W-L record.

 

[oldpanther]

-Anyone read this? Here is the big glaring omission. No one talks about playing 5 ranked teams every single year. No one talks about a suicide non conference schedule every single year. Because its either lazy journalism or no one remembers.


-But people sure remember win loss records. Every Wisconsin fan loves being ranked Top 5 for beating no one, playing no one, then losing 59-0 to Ohio state. But they dont care. They are in the Top 5 polls

-Again, why does Pitt continue to play suicide schedules? How many frigging articles paint the picture that only win / loss records count.

-The day football adopts the RPI is the day polls have meaning



https://triblive.com/sports/columni...h-pat-narduzzi-overrated-depends-how-much-you

Benz is just a little boy, hell he needs a grown up to hold his hand to cross the street. If one would see this kid out after dark, call 911 he may be lost.

 

[McKee Place]

What the program needs is stability and see what can happen with Narduzzi as the coach for four more years. This year could have been a breakout year but playing the toughest non-conference schedule in the country is not the year to gauge him in the W-L record.

Yes. I don't have big expectations this year due to the still-weak defense, mediocre backs, young raw QB and the tough schedule ... but even if a worst case 4-8 disaster, by all means he needs to be retained a and given multiple more years opp. Only because odds of getting even an equal replacement to him are slim given our current state.

 

[pittdan77]

It must be nice for you to have a job that requires no analytical skills or logic. So Miami is the entire Coastal? Yeah OK. Great insight after one team plays one game against a Top 25 SEC team.

Hey you did set up a ridiculous strawman to bury Pitt and Narduzzi if they don't rout every other team in the Division, so you have that going for you.

Oh, please. Miami hasn’t been closer than two scores to a win against a good team (well, any team) since Pitt ruined them last year. And Pitt is supposed to be at least as good as everyone else in the division, right?

But hey, way to ramp up the exaggerations.

 

[Jpripper88]

I really don't know what Benz was trying to achieve with this column. No one is saying Narduzzi is a top coach right now, not even in his own division.

The article is pretty shitty, but a lot of people here state it as fact HCPN is a top coach and we have a decided coaching advantage against all of our competition. The same contingent says that is why there should be no worry about the mediocre to poor recruiting.

 

[Panther Parrothead]

With very few exceptions, the Pittsburgh media knows very little about Pitt athletics, yet somehow they get paid to comment about it.

 

[FKA VITAL]

The article is pretty shitty, but a lot of people here state it as fact HCPN is a top coach and we have a decided coaching advantage against all of our competition. The same contingent says that is why there should be no worry about the mediocre to poor recruiting.

That's just not true-a lot of people really like coach Naduzzi-including me-but I read this board all the time and can't recall anyone saying he walks on water against his competitors. You are one of the self proclaimed "truth tellers" on his board but your twisting things here. Go back to your negative recruiting narrative-you got that down.

 

[pittdan77]

That's just not true-a lot of people really like coach Naduzzi-including me-but I read this board all the time and can't recall anyone saying he walks on water against his competitors. You are one of the self proclaimed "truth tellers" on his board but your twisting things here. Go back to your negative recruiting narrative-you got that dow

The “Albany Thoughts” thread just went there with Narduzzi’s coaching. It happens about once a week during the season.

 

[BFo8]

Yes. I don't have big expectations this year due to the still-weak defense, mediocre backs, young raw QB and the tough schedule ... but even if a worst case 4-8 disaster, by all means he needs to be retained a and given multiple more years opp. Only because odds of getting even an equal replacement to him are slim given our current state.

Agree with this to a point, even if Pitt went 4-8 this year Narduzzi ain’t going anywhere.

However if that does happen they had better show marked improvement in 2019 or he almost certainly would be coaching for his job in 2020. I’m sure to some that would even be showing too much patience.

Hopefully it’s a discussion that never needs to happen.

 

[Jpripper88]

That's just not true-a lot of people really like coach Naduzzi-including me-but I read this board all the time and can't recall anyone saying he walks on water against his competitors. You are one of the self proclaimed "truth tellers" on his board but your twisting things here. Go back to your negative recruiting narrative-you got that down.

It is most definitely true. Again. And again. And again that is the reason why there is no need to worry about the subpar recruiting. HCPN and Co is going to coach these players up and be able to consistently beat more talented teams like Miami, VT, and PSU. That is the argument. Of course no one else, in the country, thinks the same, but that argument is made here over and over. You, Stache, meister, Fireballz, etc. have consistently made that argument, but no, I am sure no one has ever said he "walks on water" so your straw man argument is true, but purposely made ridiculous, so you can claim you are right.

 

[passedout]

Given what happened to Miami last night, the Costal is bad. Narduzzi needs to jump all over the division.

One game doesnt make a season. LSU is a tough matchup for anyone. By the 4th game you can get a pretty good idea about what a team is all about. Miami will be looking for revenge for last year as well, so we will get their best.

 

[FKA VITAL]

It is most definitely true. Again. And again. And again that is the reason why there is no need to worry about the subpar recruiting. HCPN and Co is going to coach these players up and be able to consistently beat more talented teams like Miami, VT, and PSU. That is the argument. Of course no one else, in the country, thinks the same, but that argument is made here over and over. You, Stache, meister, Fireballz, etc. have consistently made that argument, but no, I am sure no one has ever said he "walks on water" so your straw man argument is true, but purposely made ridiculous, so you can claim you are right.

This is a huge week for you. If Pitt somehow wins this game your narrative takes a big hit. If Pitt loses then you got a great "I told you so" moment. I wonder who you are rooting for. My guess is yourself (psu).

I wasn't trying to create a straw man. "A decided coaching advantage" was what Charlie Weiss said when he got to Notre Dame (a lot of folks thought he could walk on water after he arrived). No one has made a similar claim here. The fact some here don't believe recruiting rankings preordain results doesn't mean we necessarily think we have the best coach in the country- but I do think he is pretty darn good so far. BTW he has won against each of those teams you reference over the last 3 years and I fully suspect he will be competitive with them going forward.

 

[#99HUGHgreen]

Narduzzi is currenrly underperforming but not yet officially overrated.

I was very excited about the hiring of Narduzzi and would love to see him succeed as much as just about anyone, but that does not mean I can not in good conscience allow any more excuses to be used as reasons why he deserve another 4 years (or at least be given a raise) should this year’s team fail to get at least 8 wins.

He came in looking like a straight shooter. During his introduction speech, Narduzzi voiced with confidence that he expected to win more right away - even win an ACC championship with the players he inherited. He had Conner, Boyd, Peterman, Q Henderson, a very good O line, Orndoff and Holtz at TE, Price, Soto, Grigsby, Whitehead and other solid contributors. Unfortunately, while has proven to get a few very impressive wins, he still has not lived up to my expectations or his promise thus far.

No more excuses for Pitt coaches who produce mediocre results:

PN, like many coaches before him who have not quite lived up to expectations, has given various excuses as to why his teams have not done as well as expected... players arent “buying in” or there is a new coordinator and new system, players just making just little mistakes. Like those other coaches before him, it all is starting to get a little old.

The Pitt Administration and AD need to decide to either place specific,higher expectations on their head coach (e.g. 9/10 wins a season, a top 30 recruiting class) and expect him to live up to those expectations (and fire the coach if he doesn’t achieve those expectations within say 4 years) or decide they are okay with a coach who consistently produces a mediocre record as long as the players seem to like him (which is where we have been for the past 30 years) and then just pay him what other coaches who consistently produce similar mediocre records get paid.

Recruiting needs to improve:

While I buy the argument (to some extent) that recuiring isn’t always about the stars and that there will be some “under the radar” players discovered by he and his staff, it doesn’t mean he shouldn’t be able to get at least a handful of 4 Star players every year who have multiple offers from good power5 teams.

Pitt’s recruiting classes should consistently be in the top 25 or 30. Having much of your incoming class made up of players who only have offers from schools like Toledo and Akron and IUP is not getting it done on the recruiting trail.


PN suggested his team could win every game this year.

It is a statement that we fans need to embrace and hope this is the year his team really turns the corner. Obviously, he won’t be considered a failure if his team falls short of being undefeated.

If Pitt wins 9+ games this season, Narduzzi will be considered a coach finally moving the ship in the right direction. Less than 8 wins though may officially cement him into the “mediocre head coach” catatory.

 

[pittbb80]

It must be nice for you to have a job that requires no analytical skills or logic. So Miami is the entire Coastal? Yeah OK. Great insight after one team plays one game against a Top 25 SEC team.

Hey you did set up a ridiculous strawman to bury Pitt and Narduzzi if they don't rout every other team in the Division, so you have that going for you.

You noticed that too? There’s a segment of the Pitt “fan” base that takes more joy out of the program losing and spinning everything in a negative light than winning. Very strange Kind of the opposite of the definition of a fan

 

[PittPoker]

PC is a better coach than Duzz, just my opinion

After seeing what he's done at Wisconsin, I've totally changed my impression of him. This is an important season imo for Narduzzi. Year 4, has a solid QB and all his recruits. If this ends up another mediocre 6-6, 7-5 season or 5-7 type season, then Narduzzi should start feeling the hot seat. I get the extension and I totally disagreed with it, but it doesn't mean he is immune from criticism and accountability.

Plus his recruiting has not been great and seriously needs to improve.

 

[Jpripper88]

This is a huge week for you. If Pitt somehow wins this game your narrative takes a big hit. If Pitt loses then you got a great "I told you so" moment. I wonder who you are rooting for. My guess is yourself (psu).

I wasn't trying to create a straw man. "A decided coaching advantage" was what Charlie Weiss said when he got to Notre Dame (a lot of folks thought he could walk on water after he arrived). No one has made a similar claim here. The fact some here don't believe recruiting rankings preordain results doesn't mean we necessarily think we have the best coach in the country- but I do think he is pretty darn good so far. BTW he has won against each of those teams you reference over the last 3 years and I fully suspect he will be competitive with them going forward.

It is a huge week because we play our rival and we induct the best Pitt athletes into the Pitt Hall of Fame and that should be a good time for all. I'll see you at the dinner, at the tailgate, on the sideline, and in the box right?

I don't have a "narrative". I want Pitt to win every game and do it with ease. However, I am not going to lie to make the situation seem better. We are not recruiting well enough to consistently compete at an acceptable level and the gameday/strategy coaching has been suspect at times. That isn't acceptable to me and if HCPN wants to remain the Pitt HC he better find a way to improve things. 5-7 was not acceptable last year. I cheer for Pitt. I do not cheer for or have allegiance to a coach. If he can't get the job done, I don't care how his feelings are hurt on the way out.

 

[pittdan77]

You noticed that too? There’s a segment of the Pitt “fan” base that takes more joy out of the program losing and spinning everything in a negative light than winning. Very strange Kind of the opposite of the definition of a fan

Why is it strange to expect Pitt to be better?

It’s like some of you prefer making excuses for mediocrity and want to keep the real debate limited to what sections should be tarped off and what color yellow is the right color for the helmets.

 

[Jpripper88]

You noticed that too? There’s a segment of the Pitt “fan” base that takes more joy out of the program losing and spinning everything in a negative light than winning. Very strange Kind of the opposite of the definition of a fan

There is a segment of the "fan" base that cares more about defending the individual coach than the program's ability to win. They believe the program is destined to mediocrity and anyone who passionately believes Pitt is capabale of more is not a fan and a "Nitter" in disguise. Generally those same characters then turn on the coach as soon as they are gone. Very strange. Kind of the opposite of the definition of a fan.

 

[FKA VITAL]

It is a huge week because we play our rival and we induct the best Pitt athletes into the Pitt Hall of Fame and that should be a good time for all. I'll see you at the dinner, at the tailgate, on the sideline, and in the box right?

I don't have a "narrative". I want Pitt to win every game and do it with ease. However, I am not going to lie to make the situation seem better. We are not recruiting well enough to consistently compete at an acceptable level and the gameday/strategy coaching has been suspect at times. That isn't acceptable to me and if HCPN wants to remain the Pitt HC he better find a way to improve things. 5-7 was not acceptable last year. I cheer for Pitt. I do not cheer for or have allegiance to a coach. If he can't get the job done, I don't care how his feelings are hurt on the way out.

Wow-very cool that you are headed to those things-congrats and have fun but does not make you a better fan. I guess I now feel obligated to tell you I'll be in the club on the Pitt side where I've been for ten years (before that down in 136 since Heinz opened and before that section 1 at Pitt Stadium.

Let's just just be honest here-you do have a narrative-it's anti Narduzzi.

I don't expect Pitt to win every game with ease-that is a recipe for disaster for every fan of pretty much every team in every sport and completely unrealistic. Particularly for one that has essentially sanctioned itself for years resulting in instability. Sometimes you need to take some lumps instead of, at the first sign of adversity, sowing the seeds of discontent that ultimately undermine the program's foundation and result in a Groundhog Day situation. We need to get out of that rut and a coach who goes 8-5 his first two years with some very impressive wins is not one you should be ripping to the degree you and a few others have.

H2P!