Toney

[Sean Miller Fan]

I turned on Arkansas/Central Arkansas for 2-3 minutes and the Ark announcers were basically beating off to Audiese Toney. They said how Musselman told him he was going to develop him for the next level and referenced the Martin twins. During this time, he was beating Central Arkansas basically 1 on 5 and I had to turn it off.

That team last year with Johnson, Toney, and Champagnie should have been an NCAA Tournament team. We didn't have an ACC Big but whose fault is that?

 

[JD1976]

I turned on Arkansas/Central Arkansas for 2-3 minutes and the Ark announcers were basically beating off to Audiese Toney. They said how Musselman told him he was going to develop him for the next level and referenced the Martin twins. During this time, he was beating Central Arkansas basically 1 on 5 and I had to turn it off.

That team last year with Johnson, Toney, and Champagnie should have been an NCAA Tournament team. We didn't have an ACC Big but whose fault is that?

Well as it turns out we did have a serviceable big man, but he was on the sidelines for knocking off a vehicle. Last year’s team clearly had the talent to make the NCAAs, but had very little chemistry—not to mention this staff’s shortcomings related to gameday coaching.

 

[Wanstash21]

That team last year with Johnson, Toney, and Champagnie should have been an NCAA Tournament team.

not even a question.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Well as it turns out we did have a serviceable big man, but he was on the sidelines for knocking off a vehicle. Last year’s team clearly had the talent to make the NCAAs, but had very little chemistry—not to mention this staff’s shortcomings related to gameday coaching.

True about Hugley last year. The fact that we've had 2 seasons derailed by legal problems is a red flag.

I know you cant control what these players do but when Horton got that ticket, he should have called Capel. Capel specifically said he chose to live in the city so he can be close to the players and build relationships. Capel could have been there in 5 minutes to defuse. As for Hugley, those kids shouldn't have been partying, which lead to the theft. I know you can't stop college kids from partying but during the early stages of the pandemic, Capel should have been adamant about that.

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

True about Hugley last year. The fact that we've had 2 seasons derailed by legal problems is a red flag.

I know you cant control what these players do but when Horton got that ticket, he should have called Capel. Capel specifically said he chose to live in the city so he can be close to the players and build relationships. Capel could have been there in 5 minutes to defuse. As for Hugley, those kids shouldn't have been partying, which lead to the theft. I know you can't stop college kids from partying but during the early stages of the pandemic, Capel should have been adamant about that.

Call Capel for a ticket? Haha. Ok. Maybe he should have just taken the ticket and went on his way instead of acting up then punching a cop in the face.

As far as the partying. No matter how adamant anyone is kids are gonna do kid things.

Capel is failing. I’m not defending him. But how about some personal responsibility/accountability for Horton and Hugley? People always looking to blame others and/or lessen accountability.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Call Capel for a ticket? Haha. Ok. Maybe he should have just taken the ticket and went on his way instead of acting up then punching a cop in the face.

As far as the partying. No matter how adamant anyone is kids are gonna do kid things.

Capel is failing. I’m not defending him. But how about some personal responsibility/accountability for Horton and Hugley? People always looking to blame others and/or lessen accountability.

Of course they should be responsible but given Capel's stance on cops, I would think he should tell the players, do what the cop says and call me. He should be like a father figure....and honestly, if a player is being questioned for something minor and Capel pulls up, the cops would probably end up just saying "ok coach, make sure he doesn't do this again, have a nice night."

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

Of course they should be responsible but given Capel's stance on cops, I would think he should tell the players, do what the cop says and call me. He should be like a father figure....and honestly, if a player is being questioned for something minor and Capel pulls up, the cops would probably end up just saying "ok coach, make sure he doesn't do this again, have a nice night."

I applaud any coach who’s willing to be a father figure. 100% at any level.

But if you get a ticket and/or your car’s being towed, there is zero need for anyone else to even be involved. It’s an extremely minor and daily occurrence. Calling Capel for something so stupid would reek of a “do you even know who I am” entitled vibe.

 

[Wanstash21]

I applaud any coach who’s willing to be a father figure. 100% at any level.

But if you get a ticket and/or your car’s being towed, there is zero need for anyone else to even be involved. It’s an extremely minor and daily occurrence. Calling Capel for something so stupid would reek of a “do you even know who I am” entitled vibe.

dude come on.. if this happens to any college kid they're calling their parents. Capel is the closest thing they have to a parent in the area. Or in general.

I don't think the point is that Capel would come in and save the day, but he'd be a voice of reason and handle it for Horton who was drunk at the time.

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

dude come on.. if this happens to any college kid they're calling their parents. Capel is the closest thing they have to a parent in the area. Or in general.

I don't think the point is that Capel would come in and save the day, but he'd be a voice of reason and handle it for Horton who was drunk at the time.

For a ticket? For a parking ticket? If I’d have called my dad at 21 for a parking ticket he’d have said why are you calling me? And I’d have never called him or my mother. Take the L and move on.

If you’re talking about the escalation list ticket ok. But he’s responsible for that too. Should never even gotten to that point.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

For a ticket? For a parking ticket? If I’d have called my dad at 21 for a parking ticket he’d have said why are you calling me? And I’d have never called him or my mother. Take the L and move on.

If you’re talking about the escalation list ticket ok. But he’s responsible for that too. Should never even gotten to that point.

Given the whole "cop thing," and Capel's beliefs, yes, I do believe the policy should be he is called any time police are involved.

 

[Wanstash21]

For a ticket? For a parking ticket? If I’d have called my dad at 21 for a parking ticket he’d have said why are you calling me? And I’d have never called him or my mother. Take the L and move on.

If you’re talking about the escalation list ticket ok. But he’s responsible for that too. Should never even gotten to that point.

his vehicle was being towed. cops were then called to the scene.

I'm not saying he's not responsible for his actions. I do know that people do dumb shit when they're drunk. Having someone there, especially when the cops were called, would've benefited everyone.

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

his vehicle was being towed. cops were then called to the scene.

I'm not saying he's not responsible for his actions. I do know that people do dumb shit when they're drunk. Having someone there, especially when the cops were called, would've benefited everyone.

Fair enough. And that might be the policy. But someone who escalated something simple and extremely minor to being arrested may say eff that policy in the heat of battle. Or maybe even in general.

 

[Franb]

Given the whole "cop thing," and Capel's beliefs, yes, I do believe the policy should be he is called any time police are involved.

How do you know that this was not the policy? The player was obviously not using good judgment throughout the incident, so maybe he didn’t follow the policy. There are plenty of reasons to be critical of Jeff Capel, why do folks feel the need to find any more knocks on him?

 

[bobfree]

Of course they should be responsible but given Capel's stance on cops, I would think he should tell the players, do what the cop says and call me. He should be like a father figure....and honestly, if a player is being questioned for something minor and Capel pulls up, the cops would probably end up just saying "ok coach, make sure he doesn't do this again, have a nice night."

you don’t live in reality.

your ideas aren’t bad but Jesus.

Im sure Capel gives good advice and I’m sure Hortons has heard many times to just say comply. This is not Capels fault!!

if the program was better and had more leaders maybe this doesn’t happen. But it’s not Capels fault it’s Hortons.

 

[PittPoker]

For a ticket? For a parking ticket? If I’d have called my dad at 21 for a parking ticket he’d have said why are you calling me? And I’d have never called him or my mother. Take the L and move on.

If you’re talking about the escalation list ticket ok. But he’s responsible for that too. Should never even gotten to that point.

Your take is ridiculous. Horton should have immediately reached out to Capel.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

you don’t live in reality.

your ideas aren’t bad but Jesus.

Im sure Capel gives good advice and I’m sure Hortons has heard many times to just say comply. This is not Capels fault!!

if the program was better and had more leaders maybe this doesn’t happen. But it’s not Capels fault it’s Hortons.

It certainly is Capel's fault that he recruited 2 players who had to have major suspensions due to legal trouble. This isnt football with 85 players. Of his roster last year or 12 players, 2 faced legal trouble, and 2 had to transfer out because they couldn't stop doing each other's girlfriends. When you have 4 critically important players who cant play due to off-court stuff, that's a reflection of the coach

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

Your take is ridiculous. Horton should have immediately reached out to Capel.

Yea ok. A 21 year old can’t handle a parking ticket or getting his car towed. Boo hoo. If that’s the case no wonder we have an entire generation littered with big helpless babies. But I’m not shocked that’s your position.

And it’s one thing to give a tow truck driver some guff. But when the cops show up get your ass in an Uber, go home, and figure it out in the morning. That might be a good time to call for some help or advice. Or call the folks to see if they can float you a few bucks to get the ride back if needed.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

Yea ok. A 21 year old can’t handle a parking ticket or getting his car towed. Boo hoo. If that’s the case no wonder we have an entire generation littered with big helpless babies. But I’m not shocked that’s your position.

And it’s one thing to give a tow truck driver some guff. But when the cops show up get your ass in an Uber, go home, and figure it out in the morning. That might be a good time to call for some help or advice. Or call the folks to see if they can float you a few bucks to get the ride back if needed.

So at 1pm after class your car is being towed is a far different situation than when it’s 1am and your intoxicated.

 

[KennyTheKangaroo]

Capel specifically said he chose to live in the city so he can be close to the players and build relationships. Capel could have been there in 5 minutes to defuse

5 minutes? To the south side? At 1 am? Where does capel live, Page Dairy Mart?

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

5 minutes? To the south side? At 1 am? Where does capel live, Page Dairy Mart?

He puts a sleeping bag right between the chocolate and the vanilla.

 

[JS School]

Horton was drunk enough to punch a cop, and he's supposed to think clearly enough to call Capel?

And Capel is going to arrive within 5 minutes and do what?

 

[JS School]

Maybe Toney should have called Capel. "Coach, I'm in bed with Champ's girl. come and get me out of this mess!"

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Maybe Toney should have called Capel. "Coach, I'm in bed with Champ's girl. come and get me out of this mess!"

Wasn't it DT that reported that is what did happen but it was the other Capel and he provided an alternative type of assistance in that matter?

 

[JS School]

Wasn't it DT that reported that is what did happen but it was the other Capel and he provided an alternative type of assistance in that matter?

I don't know, but that sounds like it could be an amusing anecdote.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

He's 12th in the SEC in RPG, 17th in PPG, 1st in FG%. May end up being 1st Team All-SEC. Cant believe this team couldn't win with Champagnie, Toney, and BballinsiderfromPitt from Pitt's hero. Plus Horton is a pretty good 4th/5th starter.

 

[BballinsiderfromPitt]

He's 12th in the SEC in RPG, 17th in PPG, 1st in FG%. May end up being 1st Team All-SEC. Cant believe this team couldn't win with Champagnie, Toney, and BballinsiderfromPitt from Pitt's hero. Plus Horton is a pretty good 4th/5th starter.

They were 8-2 or whatever, beat Duke and were in great shape against Wake. It was coaching.

You keep fighting it, but everything I’ve said has been correct.

 

[TWPitt]

They were 8-2 or whatever, beat Duke and were in great shape against Wake. It was coaching.

You keep fighting it, but everything I’ve said has been correct.

So was it coaching that helped them beat Duke? Or only lose games ?

 

[BballinsiderfromPitt]

So was it coaching that helped them beat Duke? Or only lose games ?

They did a great job of acquiring talent, they did a poor job of retaining and managing that talent. 90 percent of college coaching is being a psychologist. The capel era is over.

I’m confused why anyone is still defending this staff. Femi isn’t coming back. They have zero recruits. Bryce Lindsay is going to DePaul. What are you defending at this point?

 

[TWPitt]

They did a great job of acquiring talent, they did a poor job of retaining and managing that talent. 90 percent of college coaching is being a psychologist. The capel era is over.

I’m confused why anyone is still defending this staff. Femi isn’t coming back. They have zero recruits. Bryce Lindsay is going to DePaul. What are you defending at this point?

Not defending anything. Just never understand guys like you who want to blame coaches for everything but not give them credit for the good too.

It wasn’t the players who beat Duke but the coaches who lost to St Francis.

 

[BballinsiderfromPitt]

Not defending anything. Just never understand guys like you who want to blame coaches for everything but not give them credit for the good too.

It wasn’t the players who beat Duke but the coaches who lost to St Francis.

So you didn’t actually read my post.

I’ll repeat. They did a great job of acquiring talent. That is a positive.

they did a poor job of retaining and managing talent. That is a negative.

did I slow it down enough?

they had the money lined up to buy him out in October. There’s no going back at this point now that we’re THIS bad. It’s over.

 

[pittjas]

So you didn’t actually read my post.

I’ll repeat. They did a great job of acquiring talent. That is a positive.

they did a poor job of retaining and managing talent. That is a negative.

did I slow it down enough?

they had the money lined up to buy him out in October. There’s no going back at this point now that we’re THIS bad. It’s over.

Is your last sentence just a cliche or actual info?

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

90 percent of college coaching is being a psychologist.

In this day and age, I agree with this. If the HC cant be the "psychologist," you need a "player retention" person on staff to baby these kids.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

They did a great job of acquiring talent, they did a poor job of retaining and managing that talent. 90 percent of college coaching is being a psychologist. The capel era is over.

I’m confused why anyone is still defending this staff. Femi isn’t coming back. They have zero recruits. Bryce Lindsay is going to DePaul. What are you defending at this point?

Why is Lindsey 88th in 247 but not in Rivals 250?

If he did land Lindsay plus 2 other 120ish players and Hugley stayed, I'd say maybe you give him another year to save the buyout money. I know none of this is going to happen. Just saying.

 

[NCanton Panther]

They were 8-2 or whatever, beat Duke and were in great shape against Wake. It was coaching.

You keep fighting it, but everything I’ve said has been correct.

Yeah, 1st thing I thought of with these claims we should have been a tourney team.

We were playing like and had results of a tourney team up through the Duke game.

But we imploded down the stretch like prior years because teammates couldn’t get along with each other and Capel obviously couldn’t rectify it or otherwise keep them in line.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Yeah, 1st thing I thought of with these claims we should have been a tourney team.

We were playing like and had results of a tourney team up through the Duke game.

But we imploded down the stretch like prior years because teammates couldn’t get along with each other and Capel obviously couldn’t rectify it or otherwise keep them in line.

I think people forget that there was a locker room altercation the year before between McGowens and Toney (I think it was Toney). There were rumors about sleeping with each other's girlfriends that year also.

 

[pittchagg]

They did a great job of acquiring talent, they did a poor job of retaining and managing that talent. 90 percent of college coaching is being a psychologist. The capel era is over.

I’m confused why anyone is still defending this staff. Femi isn’t coming back. They have zero recruits. Bryce Lindsay is going to DePaul. What are you defending at this point?

The “90 percent is being a psychologist” is something that more people need to understand. A computer program can draw up schemes to run on game day. The most important thing a coach (especially a head coach) does is people management. Recruiting is part of that (you can’t manage people if you don’t get them in the door) but as we’ve seen with Capel, it’s only half the battle.

I really don’t think Capel is as bad as people say in the technical aspects of coaching. He just can’t manage people, and that inability to manage people has been the cause of every problem he’s experienced here, plus some bad luck.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

So you didn’t actually read my post.

I’ll repeat. They did a great job of acquiring talent. That is a positive.

they did a poor job of retaining and managing talent. That is a negative.

did I slow it down enough?

they had the money lined up to buy him out in October. There’s no going back at this point now that we’re THIS bad. It’s over.

It’s also very convenient not to mention that they lost Hugley which left a huge void .

Also that your man X started taking T’s and becoming a distraction .

Or that Toney felt like it was a good idea to cross a line with a teammates girl .

But your right all that’s just bad coaching !

 

[TWPitt]

Its the players!

Look at Trey Mcgowens. He was a flop last year at Nebraska just like I said he would be. They lost on opening night too and he wasn't some star player in his 4th year at college. He's still a bust.

Look at X. 3 turnovers in the first 5 minutes at Indiana and put on the bench for most of the first half because of it and you could see him sulking on the bench. Indiana barely won last night with all that talent. X didn't make them better. He did the same dumb mistakes at Indiana with far more talent than us as he did here in game 1.

Who is going to win with Terrell Brown? Nobody. Not Coach K or anybody. He isnt close to being a D1 Power 6 caliber player.


The 2 guys that stood out last night were AKC and Toney. And low and behold, those two were 2 of the highest offensive efficiency ranked players at Pitt last year. AKC is going to make Capel look bad with the way Capel under used him. Toney wasn't a team player at Pitt.

No Coach is going to win with 1 guard on the team in our current situation. Nobody.

They were 8-2 or whatever, beat Duke and were in great shape against Wake. It was coaching.

You keep fighting it, but everything I’ve said has been correct.

So you didn’t actually read my post.

I’ll repeat. They did a great job of acquiring talent. That is a positive.

they did a poor job of retaining and managing talent. That is a negative.

did I slow it down enough?

they had the money lined up to buy him out in October. There’s no going back at this point now that we’re THIS bad. It’s over.

Read your own BS above -- you blame coaching for them losing to Wake. They had the same players as when they beat Duke but you never credit the coaches for the wins.

Coaching is what happens in games and in practice - I thought you should know that....but I guess you need it slowed down and explained more

Recruiting is player acquisition and roster management

did i slow it down for you enough?

 

[BballinsiderfromPitt]

Read your own BS above -- you blame coaching for them losing to Wake. They had the same players as when they beat Duke but you never credit the coaches for the wins.

Coaching is what happens in games and in practice - I thought you should know that....but I guess you need it slowed down and explained more

Recruiting is player acquisition and roster management

did i slow it down for you enough?

Lol. You’re way off here. Either way capel is fired at season’s end. It’s a moot point.

 

[BballinsiderfromPitt]

It’s also very convenient not to mention that they lost Hugley which left a huge void .

Also that your man X started taking T’s and becoming a distraction .

Or that Toney felt like it was a good idea to cross a line with a teammates girl .

But your right all that’s just bad coaching !

So controlling your players on the court who you recruited and have had under you for 3 years is the not on coaching?

you realize kids are for the most part idiots and have to have boundaries set by adults (in this case the coaches) to be successful or they will do whatever they want. It’s like parenting… lol