UVA's Historic slight by the NCAA Committee
- Thread starter pittman71
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My 1's were UK, Duke, Wisky, Arizona. The Big East was too weak for Nova (dont care they got 5 other scrub teams in) to get a 1 and the loss to Duke plus the unbalanced ACC schedule cost UVa I think. Regular season championships mean very little in terms of seeding. Who'd you play and who'd you beat? Duke had the better resume.
Kind of a typical apples to orangutans argument that people make nowadays.....Nothing can be considered "historical" if the metrics (ie. Unbalanced conference schedules etc.) are not the same over the period in question. Not exactly sure how having only one more conference win (aka reg season conference champ) where you did not play identical schedules holds more sway over all other factors (rpi, sos, win on the road against team in question). I hate Duke as much as the next guy but they sure seem to have to bear the brunt of a lot of absurd second guessings....
you did read the article, right?
"Since 1979, when the NCAA started using seeds, there have been 148 possible #1 seeds. This is only the eighth time a team has earned a #1 seed despite not winning the regular season or tournament title."
"In six of those instances the conference winner also got a #1 seed so there was no slight. The only other time a team got hosed like UVA was in 1989, when the Illinois Fighting Illini got a #1 seed instead. So it is only the second this has happened in 148 instances".
This post was edited on 3/17 2:51 PM by pittman71
And in how many of those seasons were there at least 4 other "Power 6" teams with 3 losses or less? UK, Wisky, Arizona, and Nova all had 3 losses or less. Arizona was 31-3, started the season ranked #2 (and I know rankings mean nothing but still) and got a 2 seed. When was the last time a Power 6 team with 30 wins and/or 3 losses or less got a 2? Arizona deserved a 1.
Arizona was unfairly punished because of the laughable conference they play in. Or maybe not unfairly, the weak conference could have inflated their record.
I don't think there would have been an outcry if Arizona had been given the #1 seed instead of Duke. The issue is Duke, a team that lost BOTH the regular season and tournament titles, being given the 1 seed over the regular season champion. And yes it is very rare, and will be even more embarrassing when Duke loses on the first weekend of the tourney
This post was edited on 3/17 3:03 PM by pittman71
I don't think there would have been an outcry if Arizona had been given the #1 seed instead of Duke. The issue is Duke, a team that lost BOTH the regular season and tournament titles, being given the 1 seed over the regular season champion. And yes it is very rare, and will be even more embarrassing when Duke loses on the first weekend of the tourney
This post was edited on 3/17 3:03 PM by pittman71
Villanova won the regular season and tournament championship of the #2 conference in the country. A conference that put 60% of their teams in the tournament. Half of the conference is a 6 seed or better. They are easily the #2 overall seed this year, not even a question.
But they are in Pitt's former conference, so SMF and most others here have to try to put the conference down.
But they are in Pitt's former conference, so SMF and most others here have to try to put the conference down.
I didn't watch one Villanova or Big East game all season so I can't express an opinion on how good the conference is.
BUT, the SEC got 5 teams and the PAC 12 got 4 teams, and both conferences in my opinion don't pass the laugh test. So the 6 teams the Big East got don't mean that much in that regard.
BUT, the SEC got 5 teams and the PAC 12 got 4 teams, and both conferences in my opinion don't pass the laugh test. So the 6 teams the Big East got don't mean that much in that regard.
There are 10 Big East teams.
There are 14 SEC teams.
There are 12 Pac 12 teams.
60% of the BE teams made it, with half of tbe entire conference a six seed or better.
35% of the SEC made it, only 2 of the their teams better than a 9 seed.
33% of Pac 12 made it, only 2 better than 8 seed.
You don't know hoops if you are comparing the Big East to those two.
There are 14 SEC teams.
There are 12 Pac 12 teams.
60% of the BE teams made it, with half of tbe entire conference a six seed or better.
35% of the SEC made it, only 2 of the their teams better than a 9 seed.
33% of Pac 12 made it, only 2 better than 8 seed.
You don't know hoops if you are comparing the Big East to those two.
I would posit....
that anyone who thinks that the Big East had five of the top 24 teams in the country this season is the one who really doesn't know hoops. And that would be the tournament committee. But then again that's the same people that think that Texas and UCLA belong in the tournament, so what do you expect?
I would add to the list of people who don't really know hoops anyone who actually believes that the Big East was the second best conference this year. The Big East is good, and so is Villanova, but neither is that good. Villanova would be an underdog if they were playing two of the number two seeds on a neutral court tomorrow. That's what tells you that them getting the number two overall seed in the tournament was a mistake, not withstanding the silly RPI.
that anyone who thinks that the Big East had five of the top 24 teams in the country this season is the one who really doesn't know hoops. And that would be the tournament committee. But then again that's the same people that think that Texas and UCLA belong in the tournament, so what do you expect?
I would add to the list of people who don't really know hoops anyone who actually believes that the Big East was the second best conference this year. The Big East is good, and so is Villanova, but neither is that good. Villanova would be an underdog if they were playing two of the number two seeds on a neutral court tomorrow. That's what tells you that them getting the number two overall seed in the tournament was a mistake, not withstanding the silly RPI.
Re: I would posit....
I do know that Providence went head-to-head with Notre Dame this year on a neutral court, and won.
I do know that Butler went head-to-head with North Carolina this year on a neutral court, and won.
I do know that Georgetown went down to the wire against #1 seed Wisconsin and #2 seed Kansas, but narrowly lost both. They did beat #1 seed Villanova though.
I do know that the average RPI of Xavier's wins (103) is better than anyone in the nation except for Kentucky (102), Villanova (102), Kansas (74), Wisconsin (97), and Iowa State (102).
These teams are seeded correctly based on their merit. They all played tough schedules - Villanova SOS 21, Providence SOS 5, Georgetown SOS 11, Xavier SOS 9, Butler SOS 31 - and they were all successful against those schedules.
At some point, you guys have to get over the breakup. Doom was predicted in recruiting... these schools have thrived in recruiting... doom was predicted in NCAA appearances... these schools have had as many appearances as anyone, when it comes to percentage of teams in the tournament. This isn't some A-10/MWC/MVC level conference... this is a real deal basketball conference that is going to continue to thrive.
Big East vs other conferences 2014/2015
vs ACC - 7-2
vs AAC - 4-1
vs A10 - 7-1
vs B12 - 1-2
vs B1G - 7-5
vs MWC - 1-0
vs P12 - 2-2
vs SEC - 4-5
That's 33-18. ACC was 45-31 against those same conferences. So basically each conference's teams played an average of 5.1 games against those other conferences. Big East (.647), ACC (.592).
I do know that Providence went head-to-head with Notre Dame this year on a neutral court, and won.
I do know that Butler went head-to-head with North Carolina this year on a neutral court, and won.
I do know that Georgetown went down to the wire against #1 seed Wisconsin and #2 seed Kansas, but narrowly lost both. They did beat #1 seed Villanova though.
I do know that the average RPI of Xavier's wins (103) is better than anyone in the nation except for Kentucky (102), Villanova (102), Kansas (74), Wisconsin (97), and Iowa State (102).
These teams are seeded correctly based on their merit. They all played tough schedules - Villanova SOS 21, Providence SOS 5, Georgetown SOS 11, Xavier SOS 9, Butler SOS 31 - and they were all successful against those schedules.
At some point, you guys have to get over the breakup. Doom was predicted in recruiting... these schools have thrived in recruiting... doom was predicted in NCAA appearances... these schools have had as many appearances as anyone, when it comes to percentage of teams in the tournament. This isn't some A-10/MWC/MVC level conference... this is a real deal basketball conference that is going to continue to thrive.
Big East vs other conferences 2014/2015
vs ACC - 7-2
vs AAC - 4-1
vs A10 - 7-1
vs B12 - 1-2
vs B1G - 7-5
vs MWC - 1-0
vs P12 - 2-2
vs SEC - 4-5
That's 33-18. ACC was 45-31 against those same conferences. So basically each conference's teams played an average of 5.1 games against those other conferences. Big East (.647), ACC (.592).
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