Vader: Capel has Recruiting Momentum heading into September

[King Of All Message Boards]

You missed to 2 words before that said "as if "we contribute substance so look again and you'll see it was a putting down of us three

I didn’t miss anything. Looks like you missed the period after as if.

 

[SoufOaklin4Life]

You missed to 2 words before that said "as if "we contribute substance so look again and you'll see it was a putting down of us three

Bad phrasing
But there is a period prior to recognizing you three as being substantive

 

[Tonyt66]

I didn’t miss anything. Looks like you missed the period after as if.

Bad phrasing
But there is a period prior to recognizing you three as being substantive

Your right that was a miss on me! I apologize for my mistake and clapping back.

The guys who keep knocking Vader add nothing to the discussion. They don't challenge his points but rather complain about his literary style -- as if. Bballinsider and Tonyt and DT actually contribute substance, but all these complaints from several otherwise insightful posters are surprising because of their negativity.

Vader is talking about targets with what I would imagine is the same positive approach that Capel and the coaches have. They are making exhaustive efforts to keep in contact with these superb potential Pitt players, and it's certain that their attitude is closer to Vader's in his posts than to the people who keep complaining about Vader. They are telling the recruits what a great place Pitt would be for them and what great things they will do at Pitt. The coaches are telling each recruit about his game and his skills, proving that they are watching him and thinking about him personally. None of that is much different from the kinds of things Vader says about the recruits in his breakdowns. Whatever the case, the coaches are not thinking about the recruiting battles they are going to lose.

Vader's posts are more detailed and more measured than those of his critics, who just basically are announcing that they don't know something of value to share. There are a lot of people who have expressed how pleased they are that Vader is posting. I know that I check to see if he has something new. The critics are tiresome. They just need to chill or else start a thread about something they know that might be of interest to the Board.

 

[thebadby2]

i dont think it matters who he is or what he does in his spare time, his post are more interesting than just about anyone else who posts on this board

To each his own. I read them. To me, the only useful info I see in them is a summary of the names and recruiting rankings of the guys we are recruiting, and the list of competing offers. That's fine. The purported editorial analysis, with no personal knowledge or source attribution, about who is overrated, underrated, who had a big game in a prospect tournament, who is "blowing up", whose mom likes what school, and the incessant self-congratulatory I-told-you-so nonsense like "I said in a post weeks ago that (insert factoid) look I was right" is why this guy gets the grief that he gets. The back-slapping responses only feed the flames.

 

[Pitt1992]

That is really no different than any recruiting analyst or someone who posts on rivals, no one knows anything unless they are tipped off, verify few have insider info that's factual.

 

[CougarClaws]

I used to pride myself on creating Pitt hoops conversation on this board, particularly during the off season. But that's become something I've found to be much more difficult for me to do in the last several years. Therefore, anyone who helps with that cause surely works for me.

What a long strange trip it's been DT.

 

[DT_PITT]

Too be honest, still don't really think this is Steel. While I do see some similarities, I don't think Steel ever really demonstrated the depth of knowledge about overall recruiting that Vader most certainly has.

I disagree. The styles and pseudo-authoritative, self-congratulatory tone are too similar. Even the handles--Steel Curtain and Vader Storm--are cut from the same dorky cloth. Evokes an immature nerd who spends a lot of time at card shows and Comic-Cons. The information appears to be regurgitation of internet fodder compiled from Google deep diving on these recruits. I don't see anything in any of these posts that appears to be personal knowledge--in your post, you said you spoke to the player's family members and had insight based on that. That's personal knowledge. Vader/Steel doesn't offer anything of the sort. Steel made it clear he was some kind of day trader who doesn't work for a living and spends most of his average day online. Anyone with enough time and a high speed internet connection can come up with the same information.

On top of that, as far as I know, this guy has never responded one way or the other as to all the many, many posts suggesting that he and Steel are the same poster.

You certainly could be right. But either way, I can’t think that it makes much difference.

 

[DT_PITT]

What a long strange trip it's been DT.

Indeed.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

Too be honest, still don't really think this is Steel. While I do see some similarities, I don't think Steel ever really demonstrated the depth of knowledge about overall recruiting that Vader most certainly has.

And that's the credit that we really should give Vader here. Whether he has some true inside connections or instead, he's just someone who follows recruiting very closely, he certainly has a better overall knowledge than I do.

I take guesses as to what is going on with recruits (leaning this way or that way) or what our staff wants with a much bigger grain of salt though.

And while I'm not a big fan or hype for hype's sake (where Vader and Steel are similar), I must say I am grateful for any Pitt hoops conversation.

I used to pride myself on creating Pitt hoops conversation on this board, particularly during the off season. But that's become something I've found to be much more difficult for me to do in the last several years. Therefore, anyone who helps with that cause surely works for me.

No summer league certainly hurts the number of topics to be discussed.

 

[lunzhegu]

OK, Tonyt. Let me elaborate on Souf and clarify the offending post. There is a PERIOD after "as if." The phrase "as if" follows the dash in the previous sentence, to which the phrase refers. The ellipted meaning is that the posters who are inferring self-aggrandizement and pretense and hidden identities within Vader's posts are doing so with textual analysis, "as if" anybody ever cared to raise or follow that standard on this Board. Your name, Tonyt, is in the FOLLOWING sentence, linked to such estimable posters as Bballinsider and DT for contributing substance. DT and Ski and Souf pointed this out to you without the explanation, and now it appears that you have reread the post until you understand it. I will have to assume your apology was meant for me. It is because you have made some insightful comments that I am trying to cool you out. Putting your name in there was a compliment, but it was an incidental element of my post, and this back and forth is a distraction.

The more important point was that attacking Vader for discussing the attractions Pitt has to potential recruits seems to be a way of expressing a lack of trust in Capel and the staff. The most important quality Capel has brought to Pitt certainly does not accrue to his achievements here but rather to his respectability. He is a respectable person who gives people respect, and he has made Pitt respectable again. His current players are involved to the extent that they can validate Capel's qualities as a coach and a person. Vader's posts discuss the recruiting on that level, that is, what are the connections and reasons why Pitt is on someone's list. Vader has just now stressed the importance of building a personal relationship with the recruits. The credibility of Vader's posts is not derived from the provenance of his information on the shifting field of recruits but rather on his highlighting the possible motivations and networks in play,

I don't get the antipathy that some of us are directing toward Vader. A few month's back I compared the criticism to 20-20 Hindsight's old notion (which I think I mistakenly attributed to whirlybird) of the "loser's hedge," the idea that predicting failure or loss mitigates disappointment, like those annual preseason threads counting in advance which games Pitt will lose. However, the attacks in this thread have no substance. Vader writes positive commentary on Pitt's chances with recruits. Why are some people so upset about that? Even in our recent banner years, there were many posters who argued that Dixon was unable to get many of his recruiting targets. That notion that Dixon could not "close" became a Board meme of questionable truth. Now we have a guy who appears to have the right stuff to persuade high-level recruits to come to Pitt. Vader is giving the rationale of success that the coaches themselves have to believe and promote to their targets. Many of the posters who complained about Dixon are now jumping on Vader for his confidence in the coaches' potential to sign these recruits. It seems absurd to me. DT was able to engage a comment on Puff Johnson without attacking Vader personally. That is how the Board should function. The critics need to put what they know on the same table where Vader puts his stuff, and then we will look at it and compare it. These ad hominem attacks just show they have nothing to say.

 

[SoufOaklin4Life]

OK, Tonyt. Let me elaborate on Souf and clarify the offending post. There is a PERIOD after "as if." The phrase "as if" follows the dash in the previous sentence, to which the phrase refers. The ellipted meaning is that the posters who are inferring self-aggrandizement and pretense and hidden identities within Vader's posts are doing so with textual analysis, "as if" anybody ever cared to raise or follow that standard on this Board. Your name, Tonyt, is in the FOLLOWING sentence, linked to such estimable posters as Bballinsider and DT for contributing substance. DT and Ski and Souf pointed this out to you without the explanation, and now it appears that you have reread the post until you understand it. I will have to assume your apology was meant for me. It is because you have made some insightful comments that I am trying to cool you out. Putting your name in there was a compliment, but it was an incidental element of my post, and this back and forth is a distraction.

The more important point was that attacking Vader for discussing the attractions Pitt has to potential recruits seems to be a way of expressing a lack of trust in Capel and the staff. The most important quality Capel has brought to Pitt certainly does not accrue to his achievements here but rather to his respectability. He is a respectable person who gives people respect, and he has made Pitt respectable again. His current players are involved to the extent that they can validate Capel's qualities as a coach and a person. Vader's posts discuss the recruiting on that level, that is, what are the connections and reasons why Pitt is on someone's list. Vader has just now stressed the importance of building a personal relationship with the recruits. The credibility of Vader's posts is not derived from the provenance of his information on the shifting field of recruits but rather on his highlighting the possible motivations and networks in play,

I don't get the antipathy that some of us are directing toward Vader. A few month's back I compared the criticism to 20-20 Hindsight's old notion (which I think I mistakenly attributed to whirlybird) of the "loser's hedge," the idea that predicting failure or loss mitigates disappointment, like those annual preseason threads counting in advance which games Pitt will lose. However, the attacks in this thread have no substance. Vader writes positive commentary on Pitt's chances with recruits. Why are some people so upset about that? Even in our recent banner years, there were many posters who argued that Dixon was unable to get many of his recruiting targets. That notion that Dixon could not "close" became a Board meme of questionable truth. Now we have a guy who appears to have the right stuff to persuade high-level recruits to come to Pitt. Vader is giving the rationale of success that the coaches themselves have to believe and promote to their targets. Many of the posters who complained about Dixon are now jumping on Vader for his confidence in the coaches' potential to sign these recruits. It seems absurd to me. DT was able to engage a comment on Puff Johnson without attacking Vader personally. That is how the Board should function. The critics need to put what they know on the same table where Vader puts his stuff, and then we will look at it and compare it. These ad hominem attacks just show they have nothing to say.

I’ll be brief in recap-
Who cares if Vader’s predictions are wrong?
What’s he going to lose, credibility of an alias on a message board full of people using aliases to shield their identity?!?
The horror

 

[sherepower]

Recruiting information can sometimes change fast, especially with players that are newer targets or with a new offer.

5 Star Daishon Nix is the perfect example (Pitt did not recruit him). He cut his school list to 5, set up multiple school visits, then the very next day he commits to UCLA after just scheduling a visit to Alabama. It happened faster than the blink of an eye. That's the way it goes sometimes. You cant fault the reporters or the analysts that get the information wrong when something like this happens. It is what it is. The player made the choice in the end.

All players are different. Some will jump fast at the best offer. Some stick with the same schools recruiting them the hardest and longest over the long haul. Earl Timberlake is the perfect example. His school list, outside North Carolina, is almost identical to 1 year ago with the same coaches recruiting him. It's literally the same exact final schools and coaches. He shut down new schools entering the picture with him. So did players like Karim Coulibaly. So did Levance Fields over 10 years ago. So did Ja Morant. Some players feel that if you are not there and do not make them a priority from the start and build a relationship with them, these players say Im not going to your school regardless of who offers. Long relationships matter to some players and some players want to be a priority recruit over the better offer from another school.

Roy Williams obviously got that message with RJ Davis with making him a priority player.

It is a very good thing Shakeel Moore is visiting Pitt. I like his "potential" a lot as he can rise fast with his raw ability as a CG developing PG ( I talked about him weeks ago). He had a strong EYBL and a strong CP3 camp where offers came roaring in. He has off the charts athletic ability and raw potential much like Xavier Johnson did when Johnson started putting it all together. He was the steals leader in the entire EYBL this spring and summer and is an absolute pest on defense.

Moore's mother is a very large voice in his recruitment, she visited NC State with him previously. He is tied previously with Toney (previous teammate) and RJ Davis and now is taking an official visit to Pitt. He has camped at NC State before. I mentioned the NCAA and sanctions is a possible black cloud for some programs. Moore likes NC State a lot. He also is aware of the level 1 violations of that program which could impact his recruiting. Moore is not the only player watching what is going on with multiple schools receiving Level 1 violations. Moore will also be playing his senior year with Josh Hall, another Pitt target that is also high on NC State.

The updated recruit rankings are out today. Im not going to toot my horn here about which players I said were underrated, it is there unedited in black and white for everyone to read. I don't edit or delete my posts and Ive been clear who I said was rising or should be falling in the rankings and who we should be going after. Here are some players on the updated ESPN rankings.

Timberlake-34th Nationally in the country, still underrated
RJ Davis-39th Nationally in the country, and still underrated imo
Omoruyi-46th in the country
Puff Johnson-61st in the country
Bridges-72nd in the country
John Hugley-4 Star
Collier-4 Star
Posh-4 Star
Elijah Taylor- 1 point away from being a 4 star, still very underrated imo


RJ Davis is becoming the fastest rising player in the class. He was ranked an embarrassingly bad 204th 3 star back in May by 247 sports.


Everyone gets some things wrong however. There is nothing wrong with saying that. Im going to downgrade what I said about Jalen Bridges. We are no longer in a strong position for him.


At the end of the day any true Pitt fan just wants Pitt to get good players and to win. Jeff Capel has put in 110% effort to try to make this happen. And that's all that you can ask for and what you expect and want from your head coach.

He needs to land them. Coming in 2nd means nothing. Capel makes over 2 million a year to get the best players to come to Pitt. Effort is expected when you pay someone that type of money. Fans want wins and getting there is signing the best players.

 

[BballinsiderfromPitt]

Recruiting information can sometimes change fast, especially with players that are newer targets or with a new offer.

5 Star Daishon Nix is the perfect example (Pitt did not recruit him). He cut his school list to 5, set up multiple school visits, then the very next day he commits to UCLA after just scheduling a visit to Alabama. It happened faster than the blink of an eye. That's the way it goes sometimes. You cant fault the reporters or the analysts that get the information wrong when something like this happens. It is what it is. The player made the choice in the end.

All players are different. Some will jump fast at the best offer. Some stick with the same schools recruiting them the hardest and longest over the long haul. Earl Timberlake is the perfect example. His school list, outside North Carolina, is almost identical to 1 year ago with the same coaches recruiting him. It's literally the same exact final schools and coaches. He shut down new schools entering the picture with him. So did players like Karim Coulibaly. So did Levance Fields over 10 years ago. So did Ja Morant. Some players feel that if you are not there and do not make them a priority from the start and build a relationship with them, these players say Im not going to your school regardless of who offers. Long relationships matter to some players and some players want to be a priority recruit over the better offer from another school.

Roy Williams obviously got that message with RJ Davis with making him a priority player.

It is a very good thing Shakeel Moore is visiting Pitt. I like his "potential" a lot as he can rise fast with his raw ability as a CG developing PG ( I talked about him weeks ago). He had a strong EYBL and a strong CP3 camp where offers came roaring in. He has off the charts athletic ability and raw potential much like Xavier Johnson did when Johnson started putting it all together. He was the steals leader in the entire EYBL this spring and summer and is an absolute pest on defense.

Moore's mother is a very large voice in his recruitment, she visited NC State with him previously. He is tied previously with Toney (previous teammate) and RJ Davis and now is taking an official visit to Pitt. He has camped at NC State before. I mentioned the NCAA and sanctions is a possible black cloud for some programs. Moore likes NC State a lot. He also is aware of the level 1 violations of that program which could impact his recruiting. Moore is not the only player watching what is going on with multiple schools receiving Level 1 violations. Moore will also be playing his senior year with Josh Hall, another Pitt target that is also high on NC State.

The updated recruit rankings are out today. Im not going to toot my horn here about which players I said were underrated, it is there unedited in black and white for everyone to read. I don't edit or delete my posts and Ive been clear who I said was rising or should be falling in the rankings and who we should be going after. Here are some players on the updated ESPN rankings.

Timberlake-34th Nationally in the country, still underrated
RJ Davis-39th Nationally in the country, and still underrated imo
Omoruyi-46th in the country
Puff Johnson-61st in the country
Bridges-72nd in the country
John Hugley-4 Star
Collier-4 Star
Posh-4 Star
Elijah Taylor- 1 point away from being a 4 star, still very underrated imo


RJ Davis is becoming the fastest rising player in the class. He was ranked an embarrassingly bad 204th 3 star back in May by 247 sports.


Everyone gets some things wrong however. There is nothing wrong with saying that. Im going to downgrade what I said about Jalen Bridges. We are no longer in a strong position for him.


At the end of the day any true Pitt fan just wants Pitt to get good players and to win. Jeff Capel has put in 110% effort to try to make this happen. And that's all that you can ask for and what you expect and want from your head coach.

I don’t post recruiting info unless I know it’s 100 percent dead on accurate. I posted we aren’t a played for Bridges WEEKS ago. Give me my due sir!

 

[Tonyt66]

What happen with Bridges so where we're not on his radar no more? What did I miss?

 

[BballinsiderfromPitt]

What happen with Bridges so where we're not on his radar no more? What did I miss?

The AAU team that claims to represent Pittsburgh is not a friend of Pitt

 

[DiehardPanther]

The AAU team that claims to represent Pittsburgh is not a friend of Pitt

What is their issue with Pitt?

 

[BballinsiderfromPitt]

What is their issue with Pitt?

They’re a$$holes

 

[CScott14]

What is their issue with Pitt?

Still mad about Konate or something probably

 

[BballinsiderfromPitt]

Still mad about Konate or something probably

Nah they didn’t control Konate. That was Jamie’s flub.

Basically these guys think they’re the prototypical shady aau guys who can get money or jobs for players but they’re in way over their head

 

[superstein61a]

Im not going to toot my horn here about which players I said were underrated, it is there unedited in black and white for everyone to read.
.

As you proceed to toot your own horn . Sheesh

 

[PittMan 72]

The AAU team that claims to represent Pittsburgh is not a friend of Pitt

Do any of them have connections with the people that ran the former J.O.T.S. AAU program?

 

[Ronnyp91]

 

[bummer01]

View embedded media

Are we SERIOUSLY going to miss out on Puff AND Bridges???

 

[Bethlehemjohn]

Are we SERIOUSLY going to miss out on Puff AND Bridges???

Probably.......but we're going to get RJ and Hugley.

 

[gary2]

Probably.......but we're going to get RJ and Hugley.

Hope you are right!

 

[BballinsiderfromPitt]

Do any of them have connections with the people that ran the former J.O.T.S. AAU program?

Nope. And u can go back and look at any thread about bridges and I said we aren’t involved.

Not friends of Pitt.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Probably.......but we're going to get RJ and Hugley.

Yeah, I mean if we miss on Puff and Bridges, but get RJ Davis, Hugley and say Elijah Taylor.....well I'll take that in a heartbeat.

 

[Drew1208]

Nope. And u can go back and look at any thread about bridges and I said we aren’t involved.

Not friends of Pitt.

Hey I trust your word now.
I didn't know before, but you were definitely right and knew what's up.
Thanks for sharing the info to the board.

 

[docpanther26]

I desperately want Hugley at Pitt, desperately. However getting Timberlake to commit is an all around talent changer and really sets the new standard.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

When a kid can write his own ticket to just about any major D1 program no one should be surprised when local kids decide to go elsewhere . Going away from home , if affordable is what most college kids want to do and athletes are no exception. It’s all part of the growing up experience.
Until such time as local kids grow up desperately wanting to be Pitt Panthers Pitt has no great advantage on local kids . Once JC establishes himself as a winning coach and hopefully a great winning coach one cannot just assume that WPa kids want to go to Pitt .

 

[Tonyt66]

Here's why Bridges didn't put us in this top five this is what he told Pittsburgh now.

Pittsburgh Sports Now contacted Bridges and asked why Pitt was unable to make the final cut and he gave the following answer, “they wanted me to cancel my official visit to Miami and come there instead and when I said no they stopped recruiting me.”

 

[Pitt1992]

He was never going to Pitt,he wouldn’t give them an OV

 

[Tonyt66]

I'm not going to say he was never going to Pitt because I'm that one of his friends or family members or anything like that to know that but he may think he's seen all he needed to see at Pitt he was there a couple times and the last time he was there when they made the changes so he's seen everything and Pitt wanted him to come at the same time RJ is here but that's the weekend he's visiting Miami and JC didn't like that. He probably wanted some of those other schools to pay for his trips because that can become a little expensive paying out of your own pocket. Imo

 

[Drew1208]

Here's why Bridges didn't put us in this top five this is what he told Pittsburgh now.

Pittsburgh Sports Now contacted Bridges and asked why Pitt was unable to make the final cut and he gave the following answer, “they wanted me to cancel my official visit to Miami and come there instead and when I said no they stopped recruiting me.”

Sounds like total bullshit

 

[superstein61a]

Probably.......but we're going to get RJ and Hugley.

Which will be a much better result !

 

[Tonyt66]

Hey Drew1208 I'm just asking why do you think it's BS?

Sounds like total bullshit

IMO he could've just said this is who I'm going with. I think he's telling the truth about that but we'll see if Pitt dispute his claim and if they did leave him alone what's a man to do.

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

Pitt isn't going to reply to his claim. They spent a lot of time on him and they are out of the picture now, for whatever reason.

Now they can focus their efforts on others.

 

[Drew1208]

Hey Drew1208 I'm just asking why do you think it's BS?

IMO he could've just said this is who I'm going with. I think he's telling the truth about that but we'll see if Pitt dispute his claim and if they did leave him alone what's a man to do.

I have no info on that, but it sounds like from everything that went on with his recruiting that he has disingenuous people in his ear.
And that his quote doesn't strike me as the full story.
I believe bballerinsider might understand the situation much better than me.
His quote just seems way too simplistic.

 

[Pizzaboy2]

Things sure changed between Wvu and Bridges this week.He's taking his official visit next week to Wvu.I'm shocked on this one,it must be the pepperoni rolls!

 

[GomerTV]

Why would Pitt not find another date if they wanted him?