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Vader: RJ Davis, Elijah Taylor, Timberlake, and September 21st weekend

Vader_Storm

Vader_Storm

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Dec 16, 2018
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"Junkyard Dog Mentality"

This is the type of player Jeff Capel looks for. This is a saying that he is repeating to certain players and those players are repeating those words as the type of player they are. An underrated junkyard dog with a chip on their shoulder. The same mold of player of the last 2 classes Pitt targeted and brought in.


The same pitch to RJ Davis, Earl Timberlake, Elijah Taylor, etc...


I mentioned several months ago that Elijah Taylor was a major priority player for Jeff Capel when he was blowing up at the Nike EYBL. And Im going to give a fast comparison real quick from the Nike EYBL.

Elijah Taylor

11.9 PPG
7.3 RPG
56% FG %

John Hugley

9.2 PPG
6.8 RPG
50% FG %



Taylor's numbers were better than Gordon, Collier, and John Hugley at Nike in ppg, rpg, shooting percentage, rebound percentage and rebound rate. Taylor is one of Florida's top overall targets in the entire 2020 recruiting class and Florida chose to target Taylor over Hugley. And if no one believes me on this then ask any person or insider dialed in to Florida recruiting.

Taylor also played for Team Final which finished a respectable 4th at Nike in the B division.

Here is the offensive EFG % field goal percentage rankings for the entire Nike EYBL circuit. Taylor is 10th overall in the entire country regardless of class for good measure. He is insanely underrated.

D9gfJdSW4AEPWj1




Taylor fits in that Bonzie Colson mold as an undersized menace in the paint. A true athletic bully that plays extremely hard.

I also said previously I wasn't going to make an A vs B list or anything like that. But Taylor is better than Gordon and Collier right now on offense and defense and ignore the rankings on this because all 3 players played on the same exact AAU team together.


Taylor is a major priority for Jeff Capel and Pitt. In fact, 3 Pitt coaches will be watching and visiting with Taylor next week after he completes his visit to Florida this weekend. The staff will also be attending his schools open gym practice before he visits Pitt with RJ Davis.


Taylor is down to 5 schools. He is visiting Pitt with RJ Davis together the 3rd week of September. There is a reason our coaches are going to see him next week and a reason he is coming in with RJ Davis. He is a priority player over other players that do not even have a committable offer right now.


Davis is also still visiting North Carolina. Davis is visiting North Carolina the same weekend as Earl Timberlake for a reason, Roy Williams wants both of them. The 2 have already spoken about "potentially" playing together in college and they both carry that chip on their shoulder quiet assassin dog mentality.

These 3 players play have a "toughness element" Jeff Capel wants to build and put into place here.

Getting back to Taylor, he wants to major in psychology. He is strongly considering Notre Dame and Florida and he takes academics very seriously. Notre Dame was said to be the leader in the past but Pitt and Florida have both come on very, very strong. Pitt and Jeff Capel would love to get commitments from Davis and Taylor early which is why the September 21st weekend is huge as Davis is one of our top 2 targets on the entire big board. Pitt fully wants these three along with Timberlake who Pitt is a major player for.

And as a side nugget, Pitt has made up ground with Cliff Omoruyi. Big Cliff is supposed to be cutting his list one more time on his upcoming birthday. There is a chance he visits Pitt a 3rd time, officially, in the future. Evan Daniels, who is the director of recruiting for 247 sports, now has Cliff as having "high " interest with Pitt. Family is a potential factor in this recruitment as big Cliff has ties in Pittsburgh.
 
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Vader_Storm said:
"Junkyard Dog Mentality"

This is the type of player Jeff Capel looks for. This is a saying that he is repeating to certain players and those players are repeating those words as the type of player they are. An underrated junkyard dog with a chip on their shoulder. The same mold of player of the last 2 classes Pitt targeted and brought in.


The same pitch to RJ Davis, Earl Timberlake, Elijah Taylor, etc...


I mentioned several months ago that Elijah Taylor was a major priority player for Jeff Capel when he was blowing up at the Nike EYBL. And Im going to give a fast comparison real quick from the Nike EYBL.

Elijah Taylor

11.9 PPG
7.3 RPG
56% FG %

John Hugley

9.2 PPG
6.8 RPG
50% FG %



Taylor's numbers were better than Gordon, Collier, and John Hugley at Nike in ppg, rpg, shooting percentage, rebound percentage and rebound rate. Taylor is one of Florida's top overall targets in the entire 2020 recruiting class and Florida chose to target Taylor over Hugley. And if no one believes me on this then ask any person or insider dialed in to Florida recruiting.

Taylor also played for Team Final which finished a respectable 4th at Nike in the B division.

Here is the offensive EFG % field goal percentage rankings for the entire Nike EYBL circuit. Taylor is 10th overall in the entire country regardless of class for good measure. He is insanely underrated.

D9gfJdSW4AEPWj1




Taylor fits in that Bonzie Colson mold as an undersized menace in the paint. A true athletic bully that plays extremely hard.

I also said previously I wasn't going to make an A vs B list or anything like that. But Taylor is better than Gordon and Collier right now on offense and defense and ignore the rankings on this because all 3 players played on the same exact AAU team together.


Taylor is a major priority for Jeff Capel and Pitt. In fact, 3 Pitt coaches will be watching and visiting with Taylor next week after he completes his visit to Florida this weekend. The staff will also be attending his schools open gym practice before he visits Pitt with RJ Davis.


Taylor is down to 5 schools. He is visiting Pitt with RJ Davis together the 3rd week of September. There is a reason our coaches are going to see him next week and a reason he is coming in with RJ Davis. He is a priority player over other players that do not even have a committable offer right now.


Davis is also still visiting North Carolina. Davis is visiting North Carolina the same weekend as Earl Timberlake for a reason, Roy Williams wants both of them. The 2 have already spoken about "potentially" playing together in college and they both carry that chip on their shoulder quiet assassin dog mentality.

These 3 players play have a "toughness element" Jeff Capel wants to build and put into place here.

Getting back to Taylor, he wants to major in psychology. He is strongly considering Notre Dame and Florida and he takes academics very seriously. Notre Dame was said to be the leader in the past but Pitt and Florida have both come on very, very strong. Pitt and Jeff Capel would love to get commitments from Davis and Taylor early which is why the September 21st weekend is huge as Davis is one of our top 2 targets on the entire big board. Pitt fully wants these three along with Timberlake who Pitt is a major player for.

And as a side nugget, Pitt has made up ground with Cliff Omoruyi. Big Cliff is supposed to be cutting his list one more time on his upcoming birthday. There is a chance he visits Pitt a 3rd time, officially, in the future. Evan Daniels, who is the director of recruiting for 247 sports, now has Cliff as having "high " interest with Pitt. Family is a potential factor in this recruitment as big Cliff has ties in Pittsburgh.
Click to expand...

Just curious to your thoughts on comparing Karim Coulibaly's game to Taylor's? They look very similar to me with Taylor being a bit more athletic.
 
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joeydavid said:
Just curious to your thoughts on comparing Karim Coulibaly's game to Taylor's? They look very similar to me with Taylor being a bit more athletic.
Click to expand...

There are some major differences.

Coulibaly is pushing a 7 foot wingspan. Taylor is about 6'7 in wingspan.

Coulibaly will float around sometimes on the perimeter. He has a lot more 4 in his game than 5 but can manage some 5 if needed. Coulibaly will dribble penetrate from the outside and use a number of spins and finishes, floaters, hooks, etc.. with both hands off of dribble penetration to create space. He is skilled enough to beat quality defenders off the bounce.

Taylor is more of a power player down low with a soft jumper. He loves contact and has a lot of 5 in his game with some 4 in his game. Think of players like Coleson or Ontario Lett or even Troutman. He uses his strength well to fight for position as opposed to Coulibaly who uses his length more on defense and rebounding. Coulibaly is better off the bounce.

Taylor finishes very well in the paint. If the EYBL numbers don't stand out enough which they should, Taylor put up over 13 ppg and 8 rpg at the Peach Jam. He improved as the summer went on. He is just strong, athletic, and physical. A junkyard dog.

Coulibaly is a much better shot blocker with his length and wingspan. Both players can rebound. Taylor is more athletic and much stronger and Taylor is a better finisher in the low interior, Coulibaly is better when he creates space. Taylor just takes contact well and can finish. Both are good defenders but Coulibaly is a better defender with his length.

I can see Taylor being much more comfortable at the 4 in time as opposed to Coulibaly being a 5 for longer stretches. Coulibaly really is a 4 man PF. Both of these players are significantly better than some of the other players being mentioned on our board.

I would make the argument that Taylor was the best player on Team Final all summer long. And that include Niels Lane, a 4 Star Top 60-100 nationally rated recruit. Lane is rumored to be Florida bound which could maybe hurt our chances. Collier and Gordon were never even on Florida's board. Florida wants Taylor.
 
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Vader_Storm said:
There are some major differences.

Coulibaly is pushing a 7 foot wingspan. Taylor is about 6'7 in wingspan.

Coulibaly will float around sometimes on the perimeter. He has a lot more 4 in his game than 5 but can manage some 5 if needed. Coulibaly will dribble penetrate from the outside and use a number of spins and finishes, floaters, hooks, etc.. with both hands off of dribble penetration to create space. He is skilled enough to beat quality defenders off the bounce.

Taylor is more of a power player down low with a soft jumper. He loves contact and has a lot of 5 in his game with some 4 in his game. Think of players like Coleson or Ontario Lett or even Troutman. He uses his strength well to fight for position as opposed to Coulibaly who uses his length more on defense and rebounding. Coulibaly is better off the bounce.

Taylor finishes very well in the paint. If the EYBL numbers don't stand out enough which they should, Taylor put up over 13 ppg and 8 rpg at the Peach Jam. He improved as the summer went on. He is just strong, athletic, and physical. A junkyard dog.

Coulibaly is a much better shot blocker with his length and wingspan. Both players can rebound. Taylor is more athletic and much stronger and Taylor is a better finisher in the low interior, Coulibaly is better when he creates space. Taylor just takes contact well and can finish. Both are good defenders but Coulibaly is a better defender with his length.

I can see Taylor being much more comfortable at the 4 in time as opposed to Coulibaly being a 5 for longer stretches. Coulibaly really is a 4 man PF. Both of these players are significantly better than some of the other players being mentioned on our board.

I would make the argument that Taylor was the best player on Team Final all summer long. And that include Niels Lane, a 4 Star Top 60-100 nationally rated recruit. Lane is rumored to be Florida bound which could maybe hurt our chances. Collier and Gordon were never even on Florida's board. Florida wants Taylor.
Click to expand...
Nice assessment— thank you.
 
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I tell you what's so frustrating to me is you see these other schools getting commitments already because those guys know they want to go there and another thing I get tired of seeing 2021 top prospects are already visiting schools already and I'm not hearing one person in the 2021 recruiting class talking about visiting us. I don't know I don't have any connections on the inside but I know we need to start getting on those guys.
Vader do you have any info on this matter?
 
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DT_PITT said:
Del .., while we rarely share the same disposition, I would agree that it’s become somewhat difficult too get excited about recruiting (and following recruiting) based on the last several years. It seemingly has just become so darn difficult for us to land our top targets.
Click to expand...

And yet- Capel has greatly elevated the roster in under 2 years.

Keeping with Vader's "Junkyard Dog Mentality" recruiting- Capel implemented a full court press last season on about 19% of his possessions; this year's roster will allow him to increase the amount of pressure. Off of the press Pitt fell back into either a matchup 2-3 zone or straight man. Expect this class to add more switchable athletes that allows the Panthers to take risks on defense and force turnovers.

VA's transition is so effective because they don't need match up with specific players when rotating back on defense. I expect Pitt to have a roster full of players who can effectively guard anyone on the court in transition. X and Trey should be free to take more chances knowing the back end defense can prevent easy transition buckets and clear rebounds on misses.

I expect Capel to break through a bit this year with a class of something like Davis, Hugley, Gordon and Taylor would all fit the description of players who can effectively guard multiple positions in transition while pressing.
 
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DT_PITT said:
Del .., while we rarely share the same disposition, I would agree that it’s become somewhat difficult too get excited about recruiting (and following recruiting) based on the last several years. It seemingly has just become so darn difficult for us to land our top targets.
Click to expand...
We just need the time to build relationships.
 
DT_PITT said:
Del .., while we rarely share the same disposition, I would agree that it’s become somewhat difficult too get excited about recruiting (and following recruiting) based on the last several years. It seemingly has just become so darn difficult for us to land our top targets.
Click to expand...
It’s going to be an uphill battle to get the guys everyone wants until Pitt bb has regained the buzz and there are only way two ways to do that , the Pitt way is to WIN and that takes longer than the other way !
 
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Fsgolfdr said:
It’s going to be an uphill battle to get the guys everyone wants until Pitt bb has regained the buzz and there are only way two ways to do that , the Pitt way is to WIN and that takes longer than the other way !
Click to expand...
No doubt. I’m just acknowledging the way @Delpanther felt on the matter. It’s understandable.
 
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joeydavid said:
And yet- Capel has greatly elevated the roster in under 2 years.

Keeping with Vader's "Junkyard Dog Mentality" recruiting- Capel implemented a full court press last season on about 19% of his possessions; this year's roster will allow him to increase the amount of pressure. Off of the zone Pitt fell back into either a matchup 2-3 zone or straight man. Expect this class to add more switchable athletes that allows the Panthers to take risks on defense and force turnovers.

VA's transition is so effective because they don't need match up with specific players when rotating back on defense. I expect Pitt to have a roster full of players who can effectively guard anyone on the court in transition. X and Trey should be free to take more chances knowing the back end defense can prevent easy transition buckets and clear rebounds on misses.

I expect Capel to break through a bit this year with a class of something like Davis, Hugley, Gordon and Taylor would all fit the description of players who can effectively guard multiple positions in transition while pressing.
Click to expand...
Yes, he’s certainly upgraded the roster. But it was an upgrade from complete rock bottom. The roster previously was that of a team that was around #225 according to Kempom etc.

So now we are somewhere around #100.

The much harder work to be done is getting us under #50.
 
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DT_PITT said:
Yes, he’s certainly upgraded the roster. But it was an upgrade from complete rock bottom. The roster previously was that of a team that was around #225 according to Kempom etc.

So now we are somewhere around #100.

The much harder work to be done is getting us under #50.
Click to expand...
You can't say we are going in the wrong direction.
 
7 and 5?
HCJC will get a top 20 class OR a top 100 He's not settling and I admire that
 
rockypanther said:
They have much much better recruiting assistants with recent proven success that can create excitement on the recruiting trail and have the trust in the AAU world.
Click to expand...
No they cheated! We hired the #1 bag man in the world and we will excuse losing out on kids by saying THEY paid.

If that was what it took, Capel would’ve known the stakes and adjusted accordingly. He wouldn’t have wasted time if he thought he needed to pay, or he would’ve bucked up and paid.

So, to summarize, you can’t excuse every recruiting loss as they got paid. Because either our coach is too dumb and naive to realize that’s where these recruitments were going or....

He didn’t offer a bag big enough. Guy has been involved with CBB major recruitments too long for it to be any other option
 
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BballinsiderfromPitt said:
No they cheated! We hired the #1 bag man in the world and we will excuse losing out on kids by saying THEY paid.

If that was what it took, Capel would’ve known the stakes and adjusted accordingly. He wouldn’t have wasted time if he thought he needed to pay, or he would’ve bucked up and paid.

So, to summarize, you can’t excuse every recruiting loss as they got paid. Because either our coach is too dumb and naive to realize that’s where these recruitments were going or....

He didn’t offer a bag big enough. Guy has been involved with CBB major recruitments too long for it to be any other option
Click to expand...
I commenting as a whole not on a individual player. If you look at the assistants I am referring to, many had very good success with bringing in recruits at smaller schools before where there wasn’t the same kind of bagmen. Whether they are better at building relationships, having key connections, or doing shady things, they weren’t caught and are counting their success at a bigger school.

Look at Illinois and Louisville and their assistants track record prior to joining these schools.
 
BballinsiderfromPitt said:
No they cheated! We hired the #1 bag man in the world and we will excuse losing out on kids by saying THEY paid.

If that was what it took, Capel would’ve known the stakes and adjusted accordingly. He wouldn’t have wasted time if he thought he needed to pay, or he would’ve bucked up and paid.

So, to summarize, you can’t excuse every recruiting loss as they got paid. Because either our coach is too dumb and naive to realize that’s where these recruitments were going or....

He didn’t offer a bag big enough. Guy has been involved with CBB major recruitments too long for it to be any other option
Click to expand...
Capel is fully aware of the bagmen and the importance of recruiting dirty. He felt burned in his prior head coaching position at Oklahoma by ppl on his staff and around him with shady recruiting. And played it very safe with choosing his assistants at Pitt. He clearly stated he wanted assistants at Pitt he could trust.
 
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rockypanther said:
I commenting as a whole not on a individual player. If you look at the assistants I am referring to, many had very good success with bringing in recruits at smaller schools before where there wasn’t the same kind of bagmen. Whether they are better at building relationships, having key connections, or doing shady things, they weren’t caught and are counting their success at a bigger school.

Look at Illinois and Louisville and their assistants track record prior to joining these schools.
Click to expand...
I was agreeing with you while being a smart ass!
 
Might have a long sleep--maybe like last season with no signings until late. May be wrong; but, with the trend to so many kids not signing to the spring nationally anyway, we may need to show some continued improvement over last season in terms of Ws and Ls before we get LOIs signed. Might not get any LOIs signed in early November. If not, it won't be the end of the world given the new trend.
 
RJ, Hugley, Timberlake, Gordon, Collier are all supposed to early signers and currently 52 of the Rivals Top 150 are committed. The greater majority now go early. If we don't have a signing this fall I would be surprised. I think we leave the fall with most of our class done. I think we end up with Hugley, RJ, Gordon and Collier. I would love to see Timberlake sign but am not holding my breath. I still think this will be a 5-6 man class. We have 3 spots open already, with X widely thought to be heading to the NBA, Sampson I think is graduating and will be moving on as well and then there is always the chance that someone else feels PT is gone and they got recruited over and leaves as well.
 
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Good news, Earl Timberlake cancelled his OV to Alabama one week after visiting us. He's seeing Miami this weekend and then Seton Hall on September 25.
 
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Ajntrw said:
RJ, Hugley, Timberlake, Gordon, Collier are all supposed to early signers and currently 52 of the Rivals Top 150 are committed. The greater majority now go early. If we don't have a signing this fall I would be surprised. I think we leave the fall with most of our class done. I think we end up with Hugley, RJ, Gordon and Collier. I would love to see Timberlake sign but am not holding my breath. I still think this will be a 5-6 man class. We have 3 spots open already, with X widely thought to be heading to the NBA, Sampson I think is graduating and will be moving on as well and then there is always the chance that someone else feels PT is gone and they got recruited over and leaves as well.
Click to expand...

"The greater majority now go early."

Am nit-picking but, believe you should have said "still go early" rather than "now go early." It used to be that only a very, very few didn't sign early (in November) so that if you didn't have a strong class signed by mid-November you were totally sol.

That is a lot less true now as over the last few years many more recruits are waiting until later to sign. Nevertheless, you are correct that it remains true that most still sign in November despite the increasing numbers waiting until later.

Hopefully we sign some in November--particularly the desperately needed big men we need to compete for a regular annual spot in the upper 1/2 to 1/3 of the ACC and the NCAA bid that will accompany it.
 
For as good of a college player as X is, he's not ready for the NBA. Maybe give him another 2 years and he might be ready.
 
HailToPitt1985 said:
For as good of a college player as X is, he's not ready for the NBA. Maybe give him another 2 years and he might be ready.
Click to expand...

Doesn’t matter that much any more. Depends on how they see a kid developing and how he projects. Steven Adams wasn’t ready either. I realize with him being a 7 footer this isn’t apples and oranges but the point remains. It only takes a few teams to see something in him.
 
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