What are some of the oldest and best rivalries in the WPIAL?

[forbesfield]

A lot of these school districts, especially near the city. I never understood why they combined some of their schools. I never understood why Woodland Hills exist let alone why you’d combine some of these areas together. Maybe someone can give me the back story because I always wondered why some of these areas were so lopsided in their district lines ( like North Allegheny, Pine Richland etc ) ……someone fill me in lol

I don't remember the specifics, but there was a law passed in the state legislature in the early-ish 60's that mandated school district mergers. It was highly unpopular, and it took a while for the mergers to occur because they all challenged the mandated mergers in court, but ultimately the challenges all got shot down and the mergers occurred. It took until the 70's to start rolling, because of the court battles. I don't remember what the rationale was at the time, because a lot of the smaller schools were still doing fine since the steel industry was still quite healthy at that time. In the North Hills area, Avalon and Bellevue had a forced merger. Shaler and Etna had a forced merger. Coraopolis and Neville Island merged. Carnegie and Crafton merged. Etc etc. Churchill and Braddock was particularly contentious, obviously. But they all lost in the courts.

As far as PR goes, they didn't exist back then. It was just Richland. Pine really didn't have much population until the late 80s with their building boom. I don't remember when Richland became PR, but Richland was not a particularly big district at the time.

 

[str61166]

It's crazy how times change ... from my day, the biggest Quad A rivalries were probably Woodland Hills-McKeesport, North Hills-North Allegheny, and Mt. Lebanon-Upper Saint Clair. Are any of those rivals in the same classification anymore?

Is Mt Lebanon - Upper St Clair bigger than Bethel Park - Upper St Clair? I went to Bethel Park, but just for HS, and oddly lived in Castle Shannon at the time - weird district lines. So not as familiar. But I remember in the gym of their old high school they had a countdown clock to how many months/days until they played them.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Is Mt Lebanon - Upper St Clair bigger than Bethel Park - Upper St Clair? I went to Bethel Park, but just for HS, and oddly lived in Castle Shannon at the time - weird district lines. So not as familiar. But I remember in the gym of their old high school they had a countdown clock to how many months/days until they played them.

Lebo-USC is bigger. BP is a mediocre football program, historically. They arent bad but Lebo and USC are regulars in competing for championships.

 

[Burgh15]

Is Mt Lebanon - Upper St Clair bigger than Bethel Park - Upper St Clair? I went to Bethel Park, but just for HS, and oddly lived in Castle Shannon at the time - weird district lines. So not as familiar. But I remember in the gym of their old high school they had a countdown clock to how many months/days until they played them.

I went to the USC-BP game a couple of years ago. While it wasn't sold out, the parking lot was packed being an outsider, you got the sense there is a rivalry there. Never been to a Mt. Lebo-USC game.

NA-Central Catholic is a good one going on today. Absolutely massive crowd for the regular season game and a good crowd for the championship game. Some back and forth going on between the fans during the week as well.

 

[Pittisit4me]

I would say Burrell vs Valley was a bigger rivalry…😁

I am a 1984 grad of Burrell high. Burrell vs. Valley was a huge game until the late 90's. After that the talent in the AK Valley went to hell and they both started to suck. They still play, but, it is not nearly what it once was.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

I went to the USC-BP game a couple of years ago. While it wasn't sold out, the parking lot was packed being an outsider, you got the sense there is a rivalry there. Never been to a Mt. Lebo-USC game.

NA-Central Catholic is a good one going on today. Absolutely massive crowd for the regular season game and a good crowd for the championship game. Some back and forth going on between the fans during the week as well.

USC/BP is a rivalry but just not as big as USC/Lebo. Lebo and USC would each list each other as their biggest rival. BP would list USC. Peters may even list USC as well. Heck, SF may list USC as well. USC is right in the middle there and are a historically good program. Not sure that's going to continue like it once was. Demographics are changing.

 

[Chris46]

Mt. Pleasant and Southmoreland

 

[boseman7]

Is Mt Lebanon - Upper St Clair bigger than Bethel Park - Upper St Clair? I went to Bethel Park, but just for HS, and oddly lived in Castle Shannon at the time - weird district lines. So not as familiar. But I remember in the gym of their old high school they had a countdown clock to how many months/days until they played them.

The biggest rivalry that I remember, was Penn Hills vs. Woodland Hills. I also remember USC having a rivalry with Mount Lebanon. Central was a natural rival to a lot of people in the Quad A days it would be whoever was good that year. Also, when I was a kid, Penn Hills main rival was actually Plum If you can believe it. I think they even beat us when we were number one in the nation.

 

[Cap pitt]

In 1970, the first HS FB game ever played @ 3 Rivers Stadium, was NC v. CCHS.
NC won, unfortunately; but there were 15-20,000 in attendance. I was a 13 y.o.
Fr @ CCHS. Big night in Pgh HS FB!

I was glad NC won that game, actually if you are referring to a playoff game in 1970 NC , new castle didn’t make the playoffs, they went 10 - 0 destroyed everybody they played, but the Gardner points kept them out of the playoffs

 

[Conemaugh]

This thread peaked my interest, so I did a little research. Johnstown High has 3 WPIAL championships (at the highest classification), which is 3 more than Altoona. Johnstown - Altoona was a big game before Johnstown high shrunk to small school status.

Also interesting is how succesful Wilkinsburg was in the early years of the WPIAL.

The late 60's early 70's show the strength went from the mill towns to the suburbs.

 

[Pitt grad and dad]

Penn Hills-Wilkinsburg, 1950-60 era. Games had to be moved to an 8:00 am starting time to better control the aftergame fights .

 

[TempleBAPittMPA]

Clairton-Duquesne

I miss that one (DHS grad here, but when I played, we didn't meet on the gridiron because Clairton played up a class).

 

[pittdan77]

This thread peaked my interest, so I did a little research. Johnstown High has 3 WPIAL championships (at the highest classification), which is 3 more than Altoona. Johnstown - Altoona was a big game before Johnstown high shrunk to small school status.

Also interesting is how succesful Wilkinsburg was in the early years of the WPIAL.

The late 60's early 70's show the strength went from the mill towns to the suburbs.

I'm told that back in the day, there would be a train to go from Altoona to Johnstown, or vice versa, for the games. Altoona would play home basketball games against Johnstown at the Jaffa Mosque to accommodate the crowd.

Neither is worth much for football, now. Johnstown has done okay in basketball. Both has had the rare athlete that made it onto a college roster but Bishop Guilfoyle (Altoona) and Bishop McCort (Johnstown) have drawn many of the better players.

 

[TempleBAPittMPA]

Back in the day Scott High N.B. VS. Braddock

Someone mentioned Duquesne-Clairton, but I noted that that one was on hiatus during my playing days (at Duquesne)because Clairton was playing up a class. So, our rivalry was with (North Braddock) Scott.

 

[TempleBAPittMPA]

West Mifflin North - McKeesport
Penn Hills
Duquesne
longtime ago

Yes. I'm from Duquesne, and back then West Mifflin had two high schools-WM North and WM South. We had intense rivalries with both.

 

[pittchagg]

I don't remember the specifics, but there was a law passed in the state legislature in the early-ish 60's that mandated school district mergers. It was highly unpopular, and it took a while for the mergers to occur because they all challenged the mandated mergers in court, but ultimately the challenges all got shot down and the mergers occurred. It took until the 70's to start rolling, because of the court battles. I don't remember what the rationale was at the time, because a lot of the smaller schools were still doing fine since the steel industry was still quite healthy at that time. In the North Hills area, Avalon and Bellevue had a forced merger. Shaler and Etna had a forced merger. Coraopolis and Neville Island merged. Carnegie and Crafton merged. Etc etc. Churchill and Braddock was particularly contentious, obviously. But they all lost in the courts.

As far as PR goes, they didn't exist back then. It was just Richland. Pine really didn't have much population until the late 80s with their building boom. I don't remember when Richland became PR, but Richland was not a particularly big district at the time.

The Woodland Hills SD was formed in the early 80’s as a result of a federal lawsuit filed under the Civil Rights Act. In short, the individual district lines of the merged districts were so racially segregated at the time that they were originally drawn that it was unconstitutional under the equal protection clause.

 

[TempleBAPittMPA]

The current LH school district area was part of Uniontown school district until 1965 when I am guessing they seceeded for the same reasons TJ spun off from Clairton.

Incorrect. Uniontown has always been Uniontown. Laurel Highlands was a merger of two previous smaller districts, North Union and South Union. The merger went into effect for the 1967-68 school year, and the merged school won the state basketball championship in its first year of existence.

"The same reasons TJ spun off from Clairton" has been a fallacy as well. Viewed in terms of present-day demographics, it's easy to believe that, BUT, back in the late 1950s when the West Jefferson Hills school district was created, the demographics of the area were much, much different.

 

[razzaba]

It's crazy how times change ... from my day, the biggest Quad A rivalries were probably Woodland Hills-McKeesport, North Hills-North Allegheny, and Mt. Lebanon-Upper Saint Clair. Are any of those rivals in the same classification anymore?

North Hills vs NA was huge when I was growing up. Evolved into NA vs Seneca Valley, and PR to a degree.

 

[TempleBAPittMPA]

On the small school level - Duquesne vs Clairton was a great rivalry.

I guess we'll see it again fairly soon. I believe Duquesne's new HS is supposed to be up and running soon.

What! This is news! Certainly something I hadn't heard. I guess all the clowns who f'd up the school district so badly that the state had to close it down have died.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

North Hills vs NA was huge when I was growing up. Evolved into NA vs Seneca Valley, and PR to a degree.

A NH friend of mine said when they played, NA student section had signs that read "Your dads work for our dads." That type of stuff is great.

 

[Pitt1975]

Yes. I'm from Duquesne, and back then West Mifflin had two high schools-WM North and WM South. We had intense rivalries with both.

Born in Duquesne. Went to WMN. Thx.
Remember cops on horses with Billy clubs….

 

[TempleBAPittMPA]

The Woodland Hills SD was formed in the early 80’s as a result of a federal lawsuit filed under the Civil Rights Act. In short, the individual district lines of the merged districts were so racially segregated at the time that they were originally drawn that it was unconstitutional under the equal protection clause.

What preceded the Woodland Hills merger was the General Braddock merger of the 1970s (combining Braddock, North Braddock, and Rankin). A court case was filed claiming that the state had created a racially segregated district, and the ruling that came out of that created Woodland Hills.

 

[steelcurtain55.]

What! This is news! Certainly something I hadn't heard. I guess all the clowns who f'd up the school district so badly that the state had to close it down have died.

They have a junior high class right now. What I'm not sure is if the school will be brick and mortar or will be some kind of cyber school with athletics lol..

 

[Pittpharm77]

I'm told that back in the day, there would be a train to go from Altoona to Johnstown, or vice versa, for the games. Altoona would play home basketball games against Johnstown at the Jaffa Mosque to accommodate the crowd.

Neither is worth much for football, now. Johnstown has done okay in basketball. Both has had the rare athlete that made it onto a college roster but Bishop Guilfoyle (Altoona) and Bishop McCort (Johnstown) have drawn many of the better players.

Altoona played virtually all of their home b-ball games at the Mosque. Main reason was Altoona High had
both a boys' and girls' gym, but neither had any seating. That changed in the 70's when Altoona built an
addition that they called a "field house" even though there was no indoor track. St. Francis University
(Loretto) played their home games at the Mosque as well, with an occasional one at the War Memorial
in Johnstown. Mosque was a good facility, auditorium seating on three sides with a stage behind the one
basket.

 

[PittPharm2002]

New Castle vs. Butler used to be one of the best, now both schools are usually down, although NC has a good year here and there, Butler I'm not sure what happened, it's a big school and I think they dropped off the map, and totally out of the WPIAL? NC is now definitely a basketball school.

More of a basketball rivalry now

 

[PittPharm2002]

played on uniontown's field in 92 or 93, remember this field being ridiculously bad even then. not quite as bad as not seeing the other sideline but pretty close. you'd be running down hill then hit a big indent or crater in the ground and then be running up hill again.

If you haven’t run on a cinder track you haven’t lived -
Of still have shrapnel in your knees

 

[PITTstorm]

More of a basketball rivalry now

This was a fierce rivalry in the 90s when former Pitt assistant John Sarandrea was the coach and recruited kids from Texas to play at NC. Intense, packed gyms. Great games. Died down after Sarandrea left and PIAA went to 6 classes. Butler played 6A while NC played 4A/5A. NC just recently moved back into 6A a couple years ago.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

They have a junior high class right now. What I'm not sure is if the school will be brick and mortar or will be some kind of cyber school with athletics lol..

How do they decide which kids go to West Mifflin and which go to East Allegheny? Is it geographical because I thought I heard it wasnt. And am I the only one who confuses SA and EA? The schools are only 9 miles apart despite having different directional names. EA seems misnamed. Reminds me of South Florida. Yes, EA is in the Eastern half of Allegheny county, but its more south than east. I'd say a school in Gateway's location should be called "East Allegheny." Really, with McKeesport's enrollment dropping, EA and SA should just be merged into McKeesport. Too many small school districts.

 

[steelcurtain55.]

How do they decide which kids go to West Mifflin and which go to East Allegheny?

I was told 99% of the football players go to West Mifflin and it's been that way for awhile.

I don't know how they decide.

 

[TempleBAPittMPA]

I was told 99% of the football players go to West Mifflin and it's been that way for awhile.

I don't know how they decide.

From my understanding, it's been up to the family. For a cousin of mine who graduated a few years ago, West Mifflin HS was closer than Duquesne HS would have been.

 

[hoclaw]

I was glad NC won that game, actually if you are referring to a playoff game in 1970 NC , new castle didn’t make the playoffs, they went 10 - 0 destroyed everybody they played, but the Gardner points kept them out of the playoffs

Was referring to North Catholic (the old one; on Troy Hill)

 

[TheSpecialSauce]

Was referring to North Catholic (the old one; on Troy Hill)

It used to be a huge game and could be once again if NC wanted to fully commit to their football program and allow an increase in enrollment.

 

[TempleBAPittMPA]

North Braddock Scott High vs Braddock High Tigers at Scott High Stadium was one of the best. The stadium was a concrete bowl U-shaped stadium. Both teams used it as their home field. Braddock High used to draw about 10,000 fans when they went on their 66 game winning streak with Coach Chuck Klausing.

That reminds me of how it was common in the Allegheny County sector of the Mon Valley for neighboring rival schools to share athletic facilities. The current West Mifflin building was originally WM North, and for years there was no stadium there, so WM North played its home games at Duquesne's stadium (which was on the other side of town from where the high school was, and actually closer to WMN). And because Duquesne's bandbox gym was too small (and unsafe) for crowds, they played home basketball games at WMN. There was a similar arrangement between Homestead and Munhall before those two merged to form Steel Valley.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

EA seems misnamed. Reminds me of South Florida. Yes, EA is in the Eastern half of Allegheny county, but its more south than east.

The only three school districts in Allegheny County that go further east than East Allegheny are Gateway, Plum and Highlands.

It would be like saying that Miami isn't in south Florida because it's on the east coast and not half way between the Atlantic and the Gulf.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

The only three school districts in Allegheny County that go further east than East Allegheny are Gateway, Plum and Highlands.

It would be like saying that Miami isn't in south Florida because it's on the east coast and not half way between the Atlantic and the Gulf.

EA is more south than east though and SA and EA being so close for being 2 different directions remind me so much of USF and UCF. All those Florida state schools were founded around the same time, they probably should have named USF, Florida Gulf Coast. Then FIU should have been USF. FAU is a cool name. Then FGCU could have been Southwest Florida (which the airport down there is called) or Florida Tech.

 

[TempleBAPittMPA]

EA is more south than east though and SA and EA being so close for being 2 different directions remind me so much of USF and UCF. All those Florida state schools were founded around the same time, they probably should have named USF, Florida Gulf Coast. Then FIU should have been USF. FAU is a cool name. Then FGCU could have been Southwest Florida (which the airport down there is called) or Florida Tech.

UCF was originally Florida Tech when it was founded, but why is all of that in a thread about the WPIAL?

 

[mas1021]

One of the confounding things about Butler FB: the school district has probably the preeminent
TF program in the WPIAL. Yet FB is perennially bad

As a Butler grad who participated in TF (multiple district qualifier) and not FB…..the issue is the youth programs and athletes playing different sports. The FB program has no juice. Kids grow up dreaming of being champions at other sports.

The basketball program had/has a great program with kids starting camps and travel teams around 3/4 grade. It is a great development and feeder system for the high school. Joe Lewendowski was one of the starters of this program then Matt Clement built off his success.

 

[mas1021]

The WPIAL toyed around with locally-based cross-classification conferences during the last cycle. Other states do this and have formulas to setup the playoffs. IMO, this would've been ideal because you get local rivals playing and more of a competitive balance. It was a win-win.

Central PA does this and it works very well. They have different conferences regionally that all different size classifications are in. You get points based on how well you do vs the size of the school you play.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

UCF was originally Florida Tech when it was founded, but why is all of that in a thread about the WPIAL?

Because it apparently boggles someone's mind that one of the eastern-most schools in Allegheny County, that happens to actually be on the eastern border of Allegheny County, is called East Allegheny.

 

[Pitt79]

It would be like saying that Miami isn't in south Florida because it's on the east coast and not half way between the Atlantic and the Gulf.

USF is not in southern Florida either. More in the middle.