Uh you take the 2 point lead, you stop the other team after the kickoff, then you run the clock out.
Football 101
When this sorry excuse for a head coach elected
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Uh you take the 2 point lead, you stop the other team after the kickoff, then you run the clock out.
Football 101
It was the right call. It still is. The offense is terrible. You take the 2 point lead and rely on your defense.
Pitt hasn’t shown the ability to have a power running game to even consider going for it. Even if it was the right decision to do it which it wasn’t
3rd and goal. Play action bootleg to the right with option to run it with Pickett or throw it. And if a sack happens it wouldn’t have been the end of world. Straight dive wasn’t the best playcall.
With the defense playing well the FG was the right call . The next offensive series showed what little faith they have in the offense . Two first downs and they win the game even one and a good punt .
I’m not a PN fan , but calling for the FG didn’t lose the game .
The sad truth is that it was 2 very mediocre programs playing today .
I’m not a PN fan , but calling for the FG didn’t lose the game .
The sad truth is that it was 2 very mediocre programs playing today .
Taking the hot hand Carter out on third and goal for Davis was the first mistake.
Playing not to lose like Wannstedt would have on the next offensive series after the FG by running Davis up the middle three times was the worst move by far. Again the hot hand Carter should have been in there on the last series and they should have run similar plays with him that already proved to be effective against Miami’s defense.
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No doubt a bitter defeat but still a lot to be optimistic about this year.
I think we will play better the rest of the season and win the remaining games.
Next year the schedule is not as challenging and we will benefit from that with more wins.
We escaped with close wins today not as fortunate and paid the price for allowing Miami stay close and win the game with one play.
Going to forget about this one and see what we can do with Georgia Tech.
I think we will play better the rest of the season and win the remaining games.
Next year the schedule is not as challenging and we will benefit from that with more wins.
We escaped with close wins today not as fortunate and paid the price for allowing Miami stay close and win the game with one play.
Going to forget about this one and see what we can do with Georgia Tech.
It may have been, but it’s debatable and the people here saying no one would go for it there must not watch much football.
Had Kessman missed this board would’ve been deluged with people screaming he should’ve gone for it and he missed one that close in the Penn St game. Fans are dumb by nature and think just because something worked means it was the right decision.
If you told Narduzzi he could have a 12-10 lead with 6:00 left kicking off, he would have signed up for that.
you don’t need a power running game to get in from 6 inches out. You need a 6 inch push from the middle of your OL and a QB with a little leg drive.
anyone who thinks a 2 point lead with 8 minutes to play is a winning strategy -
Doesn’t have enough guts to try to win when the opportunity arises
I thought the same thing when they got the ball with 4 minutes left. Pitt happened. How and when it happens matters not.
Whether Pitt should have gone for a TD vs kicking a FG is not really worth arguing...
A TD puts Pitt up by 6.
But then Miami scored a TD anyway and would have gone for an extra point - which puts them back in the lead by 1.
Pitt never got close enough again to even attempt another FG
A TD puts Pitt up by 6.
But then Miami scored a TD anyway and would have gone for an extra point - which puts them back in the lead by 1.
Pitt never got close enough again to even attempt another FG
This is correct, didn’t see that until later.
We are in the small minority here, but I think most of the sharper posters will agree that it’s at the very least up for debate.
You’re missing the fact that Pitt would’ve gone for 2. The lead would have been either 5 or 7.
Bad argument anyways because game strategy changes for both sides if the lead is less than 3, we have no idea how it would’ve played out.
Football 101 in 1971. “Conventional” coaching wisdom that in the analytics age has been proven to be severely flawed.
You asked what coach wouldn’t have kicked a FG in this situation? Highly unlikely Bill Belichik would have kicked one, and he might be a better, smarter coach than Nardon’tzi.
Read this-maybe it will enlighten you:-there are numerous other studies that say the same. With more than 4 minutes left, winning or losing in a one score game, the statistics overwhelmingly favor going for it on 4th and goal from the 1:
https://www.sharpfootballanalysis.com/analysis/nfl-fourth-downs-eagles-doug-pederson/
Ever heard of a 2 point conversion attempt? That would’ve been a no brainer had we scored a TD. Whether we convert it or not is another story.
I purposely didn’t bring math or analytics into this discussion because I knew it would just make these people double down on their argument and it would probably tilt me.
Serious question. When was the last time we scored an offensive TD? We didn't score any today and I don't think we scored any in the second half of the Duke game. I could be wrong.
Not exactly a guarantee that Pitt makes the 2 point conversion.
How exactly did the strategy change for Miami by being down by two- They went down the field and scored a TD. Pitt would have played with the same overly conservative offensive strategy on their part.
if Pitt did score a TD and got the 2 point conversion, Miami either goes for the tie or tries their own 2 point conversion for the win.
My main point is that the decision to go for the FG was not the big mistake that caused Pitt to lose-
The play calling on the next series was basically Pitt saying - we aren’t even going to try on offense and cross our fingers that our defense holds once again. That was a much worse move.
From the article, do you know why Tomlin kicked the field goal on the one yard line down 20? Because he had zero confidence in his line against New England’s line. He also punted on fourth and short against them earlier in the game. And Tomlin isn’t a particularly conservative coach, evidenced by his fake punt against New Orleans last year, in the fourth quarter with the lead.
sometimes you need to look at your personnel when making these types of decisions but again in the Pitt game it was a no brainer. You kick. Pitt lost because they didn’t run time off the clock with the ball and the lead.
Does Pitt make the 2 point conversion? Probably less than 50% likely that the do.
And what if Pitt gets stopped on 4th and goal and doesn’t get the TD? Then Pitt (with its inept offense) is really in bad shape.
nope the more glaring bad move was the personnel and play calling the next series. It was a joke.
It seems that with this offense, we need to have at least a 2TD lead going into the second half to have a chance to win against another mediocre team. We don't score that much in the second half of any games and our defense can take us only so far.
Another way to look at it Hugh is like you’re playing blackjack and you always assume the dealer has a face card down. You’re 4th and goal from the one. You have to assume the other team is going to score either 3 or 7 with 8 minutes left in the 4th. You can’t assume you will get another chance to score any points in that time frame. If you take it one step further and assume you have to prevent a TD from beating you, you want to score the TD and convert the 2 points to give yourself the best possible odds of winning. If you score the TD and miss the 2 you prevent a FG from beating you. If you get the TD and the 2 a TD won’t beat you. If you don’t get in the other team, which is struggling terribly, is stick on its own goal line against a defense that has been manhandling that O all day. The O can’t take many chances because a turnover will be the ballgame there. The odds are overwhelming that Pitt gets the ball back around midfield down 1 point with 5-6 minutes to play. The odds of a Pitt win in that situation are much higher than the odds of holding onto a 2 point lead for 7-8 minutes.
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Your argument would be a lot better if the FG would have given us a 3 point lead. Kicking would still be the wrong call per the analytics, but the justification would be a lot more sound. Likewise if there were less than 4 minutes left in the game.
As it was, kicking for a 2 point lead with all that time left was just dumb.
There is probably as good a chance of us getting a safety there than them going 99 yards. If they take over at their 1 there is a very high probability Diaz just hands off up the middle at least twice.
The more I think about it the more I’m becoming convinced that going for it was definitely the right move.
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lol a 2 point lead against a team with no place kicker is huge. But again Pitt let Miami score a td instead of forcing them to kick
Agree. I think at the very least you end up with great field position to take the lead with at least a FG
But while I think going for it was the better choice I also dint think kicking the field goal is an awful decision
And you sit on a 2 point lead for 8 minutes? That’s your winning strategy?
you don’t need a personnel advantage to score from inside a yard. You need a quick push from the middle of your O line, a QB with some leg drive, and some guys behind him to give him a push.
Auburn did it textbook a little while ago on 4th and goal from the one. All you have to do is break the plane.
Anyway, it’s literally all academic at this point. Narduzzi did it your way—and lost.
where do you get 8 minutes? How much time was left when Pitt got the ball back from Miami?
anyway that is how football is played. You get a lead and control the clock once you get the lead and the ball late in the game.
Getting the lead in that situation was fine. The defense followed up with the stop they needed. All we needed were a few first downs on the following drive from the offense and Pitt likely would have won. Instead they tried to milk the clock. Zero situational awareness from the offensive side of the ball on that drive.
Sorry Bad...not really making the connection with the blackjack analogy. You certainly want to give yourself the best chance to win, but there is a lot of plays you are talking about doing that statistically are not likely going to turn out how you had hoped which will make your odds of winning the game even less likely.
I see a clearer mistake - the one thing that statistically would have helped Pitt win the game was the personnel and play calling used on 3rd and goal and during the following offensive series.
They played the game in a way that statistically was al but guaranteeing they would not be successful by using Davis (instead of Carter) and calling such predictable runs up the middle three times. The likelihood of Miami to stop those three plays and cause Pitt to punt was very, very high. So why do it? It was the obvious mistake.
I don’t think that’s the way football is played anymore, at least not nearly to the extent you think it is.
And if they didn't get it and Miami moves the ball or hits a big play they might never have another opportunity to take the lead. Then, the same people lambasting the decision would say he's an idiot for not kicking the field goal.
Easy to second guess and assume they would get a stop and good field position back. Heck, the stupid play call on 3rd and 5 with 4 minutes left used the same type of rationalization.
I had no problem whatsoever with the FG. The run on 3rd and 5 into a stacked box was way too conservative.
Or you could sit on a 1 point deficit and hope your defense bails you out again over the next 8 minutes.
Not really second guessing, had posted it even before the play call. Analytics are on my side, but will say Miami’s kicking game a mitigating factor.
Pretty sure the mathematics agree with me.
I wasn’t even saying that the decision was obvious, more stating that the posters claiming kicking the FG was a no brainer were wrong.
this is a long 2-page thread already, haven’t read through it but I’m guessing what I say here has already been said.
At any rate, definitely don’t see anything wrong with kicking the FG there, unlike the PSU fiasco, this FG was for the lead and then you count on your defense.
However, I definitely fault the sum total of the 3 plays before that that led to the 4th down. At the start of that 1st and goal, I feel like the coaches (whether it be PN or Whipple) already decided that we’re going to try to get the TD by running it 3 times and not even consider a pass to avoid risking something bad happening.
same with the series inside 5 minutes after stopping the Canes. One first down likely seals the game but they go 3 runs even on 3rd and 5. I could accept it if I thought they were really calling 3 plays that they felt gave them the best chance of getting a 1st down. Unfortunately, I think their play-calling was more influenced by the fear of something bad happening.
playing not to lose, living within your fears, pick your sad cliche to describe it, end result is another loss.
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