While football pays the bills, it can also drain you. The plight of UCONN

[HailtoPitt]

Big 10 would have generate more conference revenue for Pitt. Plus ticket revenue would be higher.

It doesn't matter for football operations as the budget would be the same in either conference. But, there would be more money for Quidditch.

 

[pitt90seven]

Big 10 would have generate more conference revenue for Pitt. Plus ticket revenue would be higher.

It doesn't matter for football operations as the budget would be the same in either conference. But, there would be more money for Quidditch.

yeah, we'd get 25K away fans for most games. plus more tv $$. i wouldn't want to be maryland or rutgers though.

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

Big 10 would have been awesome but I’d suspect they’d put us in the division with osu, mich and Tosu. We’d basically be looking at battling with MSU for fourth place on good years.

 

[HailtoPitt]

Big 10 would have been awesome but I’d suspect they’d put us in the division with osu, mich and Tosu. We’d basically be looking at battling with MSU for fourth place on good years.

And still get a better bowl game.

Indiana was 4th in that division last season and they played Tennessee in the Gator Bowl.

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

And still get a better bowl game.

Yeah but man, imagine having mich, tosu and the nitters every year? That’s a guantlet. Plus you have a 9 game conf schedule. Pitt fans cry about our schedule now, imagine that one?

 

[HailtoPitt]

Yeah but man, imagine having mich, tosu and the jitters every year? That’s a guantlet. Plus you have a 9 game conf schedule. Pitt fans cry about our schedule now, imagine that one?

What does it matter? Pitt won the Coastal and the reward was the Sun Bowl. Indiana finishes 4th and they go to the Gator. I'd take those results AND more revenue any day of the week.

It's funny how Pitt plays in the Atlantic Coast Conference Coastal division but is more likely to end up in Detroit while Big Ten also-rans can finish 4th and end up going to the beach on the Atlantic Coast.

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

What does it matter? Pitt won the Coastal and the reward was the Sun Bowl. Indiana finishes 4th and they go to the Gator. I'd take those results AND more revenue any day of the week.

It's funny how Pitt plays in the Atlantic Coast Conference Coastal division but is more likely to end up in Detroit while Big Ten also-rans can finish 4th and end up going to the beach on the Atlantic Coast.

Yep, I would too. I’d love being in big ten. Even if it meant having to deal with 30k annoying buckeye fans every other year, infesting my city for a weekend in the fall.

 

[HailtoPitt]

Yep, I would too. I’d love being in big ten. Even if it meant having to deal with 30k annoying buckeye fans every other year, infesting my city for a weekend in the fall.

Yep. The Big Ten is pretty clearly better for Pitt, unless you want to role out CrazyPaco's demographic stats about how the southeast is growing while the Midwest isn't, as if that matters one iota.

And PSU should support Pitt, because they would beat us 4 out of 5 times. More money for Pitt. More state dominance for PSU. Sounds like a win win.

 

[Ronnyp91]

And still get a better bowl game.

Indiana was 4th in that division last season and they played Tennessee in the Gator Bowl.

Have to be eligible for a bowl to go to a bowl. And with the way we schedule out of conference....

 

[cease10]

A year prior to us getting an invite to the ACC, Nordenberg sent a letter to the Big East office and presidents informing them that Pitt would actively pursue opportunities to change conferences. This letter has previously been posted publicly, but I can no longer find it.

I had doubts about the above comment that Nordenberg communicated to BE that "Pitt would actively pursue opportunities to change conferences". That just didn't make any sense for Nordenberg to make a definitive statement like that and it not have become public and caused disarray in the conference at that time.

Nordenberg made the below statement when Pitt left, which differs from "actively pursue". I have no doubt that Pitt was actively pursuing an exit, however communicating those intentions to the BE would be ludicrous. Wording matters and I doubt a legal person like Nordenberg would have communicated the above.

Pitt chancellor Mark Nordenberg, meanwhile, said, "We did make it clear within the Big East, we were willing to improve the conference in any way we were asked. At the same time, we made it very clear that if other opportunities did arise, we would feel obligated to seriously assess them and look at the long-term future of the University of Pittsburgh."

https://www.espn.com/mens-college-b...sy-spell-end-big-east-know-college-basketball

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

Yep. The Big Ten is pretty clearly better for Pitt, unless you want to role out CrazyPaco's demographic stats about how the southeast is growing while the Midwest isn't, as if that matters one iota.

And PSU should support Pitt, because they would beat us 4 out of 5 times. More money for Pitt. More state dominance for PSU. Sounds like a win win.

Midwest is dwindling, that’s why the big ten has a terrible tv deal. Oh wait. Never Mind.

 

[cease10]

We should help them out. Schedule them for the foreseeable future.

No thanks. We don't need any more embarrassing losses.

If we lose, let's at least lose to a respectable program. I'm just saying.

 

[CrazyPaco]

I had doubts about the above comment that Nordenberg communicated to BE that "Pitt would actively pursue opportunities to change conferences". That just didn't make any sense for Nordenberg to make a definitive statement like that and it not have become public and caused disarray in the conference at that time.

Nordenberg made the below statement when Pitt left, which differs from "actively pursue". I have no doubt that Pitt was actively pursuing an exit, however communicating those intentions to the BE would be ludicrous. Wording matters and I doubt a legal person like Nordenberg would have communicated the above.

Pitt chancellor Mark Nordenberg, meanwhile, said, "We did make it clear within the Big East, we were willing to improve the conference in any way we were asked. At the same time, we made it very clear that if other opportunities did arise, we would feel obligated to seriously assess them and look at the long-term future of the University of Pittsburgh."

https://www.espn.com/mens-college-b...sy-spell-end-big-east-know-college-basketball

Well no, that was me paraphrasing from something I saw 8 years ago or so. These types of things are always communicated subtly in letters between institutions especially when one is a lawyer, but even so, one can read between the lines. That said, I actually found the letter and the language is shockingly blunt. Dated May 28, 2010: https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/4906656-2018-09-19-16-20.html#document/p1

Keep in mind the history here. Nordenberg (and Pitt) had become the defacto leader of the Big East football playing members from 2003 on. Nordenberg was the one that tipped the conference off to the ACC raid, and with his legal background he was heavily involved with the lawsuit filed in Connecticut to try hold it off, and he then led the charge to keep the conference together and viable in retaining its BCS bid, had spearheaded expansion with UL, Cincy, USF to replace the defectors, keep the basketball and football side from splitting which almost happened immediately thereafter, and later, spearheading communications on expansion with TCU and was pushing for UCF.

That letter, even with the language it used, signaled a dramatic shift for Pitt, which until then had worked tirelessly to try to keep the Big East viable. It was clear Pitt realized other football members could not be counted on to commit to the conference. Fairly unusual to so clearly inform everyone, in writing, that a school most responsible for holding it together the last six years would no longer be committed to staying either. You don't have to be brilliant to read between those lines to see that it essentially stated "we're out and we just need an invite somewhere." The Big East's fate was sealed. Of course it also reaffirmed Pitt would do what it could for the Big East while it was still a member, and it did, because there was no guarantee an invite would ever come.

Publicly, around this time there was also a subtle change in the public statements coming out of Pitt in regards to conference commitment. Subtle changes, but telling for anyone paying close attention and it was a giveaway something had changed or was about to.

May 2010 was also was right around the time the Big Ten it announced that it was exploring expansion. That is an unbelievable coincidence, is it not?

From what I remember, major rumors swirled of the Big Ten talking to Pitt emerged in December 2010 and January 2011. Then nothing, until June 2011, when Nebraska was formally invited to the Big 10. Then all heck broke lose on the B12. Years later it was confirmed a former Big Ten AD during a speaking engagement they had evaluated Pitt.

Pete Thamel reported in August 2011 that Pitt was involved in discussion with the B12.

The ACC invite came in September 2011.

 

[TFBaum]

But Cincy is still doing okay, didn't spend millions and millions on a stadium and have always made good coaching decisions.

Cincy had some history. If my memory serves me correct UConn thought they could invest their way into big time football. They built a stadium in the middle of nowhere near their campus.

 

[Slick Manager of Champs]

Yep. The Big Ten is pretty clearly better for Pitt, unless you want to role out CrazyPaco's demographic stats about how the southeast is growing while the Midwest isn't, as if that matters one iota.

And PSU should support Pitt, because they would beat us 4 out of 5 times. More money for Pitt. More state dominance for PSU. Sounds like a win win.

Hobo with the PSU envy again, surprised you're still not pining for Bradley.

 

[TempleBAPittMPA]

Pitt went 4-5 against the Huskies. That rankles me more than any of our losses to Temple ever did. Pitt should have beaten UConn at least 6 times.

Einstein had an aphorism that applied to kicking to Nick Williams.

 

[NTOP]

We should help them out. Schedule them for the foreseeable future.

Or maybe schedule Duquesne for football? Call it the City Game.

 

[cease10]

Nordenberg (and Pitt) had become the defacto leader of the Big East football playing members from 2003 on

Yes, the letter does confirm that the conference was a "dead man walking".

I blame the weak conference commissioner leadership for that. Good league commissioners are able to lead their team owners/universities and gain consensus on issues. Instead, the Big East was being led by universities with individual agendas to bail. And the conference Commissioner could do absolutely nothing about it.

A year later after that letter, the Big East turned down an $11mill per team deal from ESPN. Pitt was blamed for leading the refusal, but Nordenberg denied leading the charge. I'm so glad that we're out of that mess of a conference.

The Big East voted to turn down a contract offer with ESPN in May that the Boston Globe reported would have paid up to $11 million per team.. Nordenberg and Pitt Athletic Director Steve Pederson have received criticism that has asserted that they led the charge in persuading the members of the Big East not to accept the offer.

Nordenberg said that Pitt acted along with the rest of the teams in the conference, and did not actively campaign against the deal.

“Any characterization that either Pitt, Steve or I led a charge against consummating a contract with ESPN is simply inaccurate,” Nordenberg said. “In the end, when the conference did decide not to accept the ESPN offer, it was an unanimous vote of all 16 members that was not led by us or by anyone else.”

https://www.uwire.com/2011/09/19/pitt-syracuse-to-leave-big-east-for-acc/

 

[CrazyPaco]

Yes, the letter does confirm that the conference was a "dead man walking".

I blame the weak conference commissioner leadership for that. Good league commissioners are able to lead their team owners/universities and gain consensus on issues. Instead, the Big East was being led by universities with individual agendas to bail. And the conference Commissioner could do absolutely nothing about it.

A year later after that letter, the Big East turned down an $11mill per team deal from ESPN. Pitt was blamed for leading the refusal, but Nordenberg denied leading the charge. I'm so glad that we're out of that mess of a conference.

The Big East voted to turn down a contract offer with ESPN in May that the Boston Globe reported would have paid up to $11 million per team.. Nordenberg and Pitt Athletic Director Steve Pederson have received criticism that has asserted that they led the charge in persuading the members of the Big East not to accept the offer.

Nordenberg said that Pitt acted along with the rest of the teams in the conference, and did not actively campaign against the deal.

“Any characterization that either Pitt, Steve or I led a charge against consummating a contract with ESPN is simply inaccurate,” Nordenberg said. “In the end, when the conference did decide not to accept the ESPN offer, it was an unanimous vote of all 16 members that was not led by us or by anyone else.”

https://www.uwire.com/2011/09/19/pitt-syracuse-to-leave-big-east-for-acc/

The Big East thought it could do better by taking its media package to the open market. It was probably right if the league had stayed together. And the $11 million was going to be grossly behind the other power conferences. But then the ACC invites to Pitt and SU came and there was no way they were going to get the $11 million that ESPN offered after that.

That said, even if the Big East has signed a more lucrative deal, Pitt and any other football playing member were leaving due to the untenable internal situation that had developed. WVU was trying to solicit an SEC invite. Louisville and others were looking around too. Everyone, and I mean everyone, was out for themselves by that point. There was no trust left because everyone knew the Big East was falling behind other power conferences, specifically because of football, and there wasn't enough internal commitment to try to fix it, and the bigger problem was, it probably wasn't fixable outside of Notre Dame joining up and that wasn't happening.

 

[SoufOaklin4Life]

wow, didn't research to see that was the actual record. How can we have such a poor record against a school that just started playing D1? Record should have been no worse than 7-2.

Everything was in place for us to step up and take control of the Big East. Pitt & WVU had the most tradition, a big name coach in Wannstedt. Resources, recruiting base, etc. Instead UCONN & Cinnci filled the void.

Two words
Dave Wannstedt

 

[pitt-girl]

Well no, that was me paraphrasing from something I saw 8 years ago or so. These types of things are always communicated subtly in letters between institutions especially when one is a lawyer, but even so, one can read between the lines. That said, I actually found the letter and the language is shockingly blunt. Dated May 28, 2010: https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/4906656-2018-09-19-16-20.html#document/p1

Keep in mind the history here. Nordenberg (and Pitt) had become the defacto leader of the Big East football playing members from 2003 on. Nordenberg was the one that tipped the conference off to the ACC raid, and with his legal background he was heavily involved with the lawsuit filed in Connecticut to try hold it off, and he then led the charge to keep the conference together and viable in retaining its BCS bid, had spearheaded expansion with UL, Cincy, USF to replace the defectors, keep the basketball and football side from splitting which almost happened immediately thereafter, and later, spearheading communications on expansion with TCU and was pushing for UCF.

That letter, even with the language it used, signaled a dramatic shift for Pitt, which until then had worked tirelessly to try to keep the Big East viable. It was clear Pitt realized other football members could not be counted on to commit to the conference. Fairly unusual to so clearly inform everyone, in writing, that a school most responsible for holding it together the last six years would no longer be committed to staying either. You don't have to be brilliant to read between those lines to see that it essentially stated "we're out and we just need an invite somewhere." The Big East's fate was sealed. Of course it also reaffirmed Pitt would do what it could for the Big East while it was still a member, and it did, because there was no guarantee an invite would ever come.

Publicly, around this time there was also a subtle change in the public statements coming out of Pitt in regards to conference commitment. Subtle changes, but telling for anyone paying close attention and it was a giveaway something had changed or was about to.

May 2010 was also was right around the time the Big Ten it announced that it was exploring expansion. That is an unbelievable coincidence, is it not?

From what I remember, major rumors swirled of the Big Ten talking to Pitt emerged in December 2010 and January 2011. Then nothing, until June 2011, when Nebraska was formally invited to the Big 10. Then all heck broke lose on the B12. Years later it was confirmed a former Big Ten AD during a speaking engagement they had evaluated Pitt.

Pete Thamel reported in August 2011 that Pitt was involved in discussion with the B12.

The ACC invite came in September 2011.

The ACC invite was orchestrated so privately (and quickly?) that some members of the AD were literally shocked by the ESPN announcement arriving in Iowa City for the game to be played on 9/17/2011.

 

[joefromlancaster]

If I remember correctly the AD's didn't even know about the ACC offer to Pitt.

 

[happjack]

The ACC invite was orchestrated so privately (and quickly?) that some members of the AD were literally shocked by the ESPN announcement arriving in Iowa City for the game to be played on 9/17/2011.

I guess they learned their lesson from the first ACC raid when Skip Prosser and others spilled the beans about the raid of BC, Miami and Syracuse. Remember the plan was to announce the switch late enough in the year where the Big East football conference wouldn't have enough teams and they would have lost their status as a conference. Also everyone seems to forget that the ACC didn't want VT and only took them due to politicians in Virginia getting involved.