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Info From Big Maryland Supporters On Franklin!

I love how Ped St fans see things! The scandal was the administration covering up the Sandusky crimes.

Seriously Man, don't you ever get sick of bringing up the same things over and over? You're as bad as one of the Joebots on the BWI site. It's over with. Sandusky is in jail, Paterno's dead, and everyone else Is awaiting trial. No one else associated with it is at Penn State. If you want to talk football, lets talk. Otherwise, you can discuss what you have for the last 3 years straight with someone else.
 
Lets discuss after the trial of 3 of the top 4 Admin go to trial. The 4th would be there as well if he were alive. Lets just sweep everything under the rug. Do you think the victims are not anxiously awaiting these trials for some sort of justice?
 
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Lets discuss after the trial of 3 of the top 4 Admin go to trial. The 4th would be there as well if he were alive. Lets just sweep everything under the rug. Do you think the victims are not anxiously awaiting these trials for some sort of justice?

I don't know what the victims are thinking, but I don't think they are reading football messageboards looking for discussions on it. I discussed this case 3+ years ago and am happy to let the court system play out. My not discussing it is not sweeping it under the rug it just has nothing to do with me or anyone currently at Penn State. If they are found guilty, I hope they live a miserable life in prison.
 
You were the one that said “it is over” & I am simply pointing out that it is not.

I hope they burn for their participation ( by not acting ).




I don't know what the victims are thinking, but I don't think they are reading football messageboards looking for discussions on it. I discussed this case 3+ years ago and am happy to let the court system play out. My not discussing it is not sweeping it under the rug it just has nothing to do with me or anyone currently at Penn State. If they are found guilty, I hope they live a miserable life in prison.
 
I just read this in the PPG….this is not over


Man says Sandusky assaulted him at Penn State camp

I have no idea how this turned into another discussion about Sandusky, but guess what? It is over for ME. If this guys story is found to be true, Sandusky can have another few years added to his life sentence, but guess what? It will not change anything. All are in jail or possibly going to jail. The saddest part is you are somehow hoping it's not over so it benefits Pitt and hurts Penn State. That is the sad reality of why you bring it up. For me, I pray for the kids and hope the remaining burn in hell, but I'm not going to discuss it on a football thread in a discussion about Franklin and Maryland.
 
AG Kane has said the most recent victim at the football camp has passed the statue of limitations.
 
I do not think anyone is pointing to just recruiting classes as to why Penn State will more than likely be better and favored in each game. I think people point to Penn State's 51-9 record prior to the sanctions being announced. Yes, Penn State struggled recently due to sanctions, but they are in the rearview mirror. Many Penn State fans could not wait until Joe Paterno retired, because they felt Penn State had untapped potential due to Paterno's age and lack of willingness to recruit his final years. Even with that, Penn State had 3 11-1 seasons. Does that guarantee they will be great going forward? No. Does that guarantee they will beat Pitt all 4 years? No. Does it even guarantee they will beat Pitt 1 out of the 4 years? No, but if I were a betting man I know where I'd lay my money, but that is why they play the games.

I'll bring this back to football. How does Penn St's record before the sanctions have any correlation whatsoever to what happens now and going forward? Pitt was 9-2 and ranked in the top 10 in 2009 before pissing away a game against Cincinnati for the Sugar Bowl. We finished that year in the top 15. Does that somehow predict good things for us 6 years and 3 head coaches later?

You're 3 head coaches and some very mediocre football later. There is no continuity in personnel from that 51-9 period except your team colors and the football above all else mindset of the fanbase. The recruiting better argument has merrit. Franklin is actually an experiences HC compared to our guy...you could argue that point. But acting like a very successful period of football in the past has some impact on what's happening today, outside of the general history of Penn St football success, is a gigantic stretch, don't you think? It's borderline silly. If you really believe that three 11-1 seasons before 2010 means that you'll be doing that again 2 head coaches and almost a decade later, I don't know what to tell you. Congratulations on your optimism?
 
I'll bring this back to football. How does Penn St's record before the sanctions have any correlation whatsoever to what happens now and going forward? Pitt was 9-2 and ranked in the top 10 in 2009 before pissing away a game against Cincinnati for the Sugar Bowl. We finished that year in the top 15. Does that somehow predict good things for us 6 years and 3 head coaches later?

You're 3 head coaches and some very mediocre football later. There is no continuity in personnel from that 51-9 period except your team colors and the football above all else mindset of the fanbase. The recruiting better argument has merrit. Franklin is actually an experiences HC compared to our guy...you could argue that point. But acting like a very successful period of football in the past has some impact on what's happening today, outside of the general history of Penn St football success, is a gigantic stretch, don't you think? It's borderline silly. If you really believe that three 11-1 seasons before 2010 means that you'll be doing that again 2 head coaches and almost a decade later, I don't know what to tell you. Congratulations on your optimism?

That 9-2 Pitt record was the first time in 30 years that Pitt had the opportunity to win 10 games during the regular season. That season was not the norm for Pitt. They have since moved to a little bit better of a conference and the mediocre stretch has continued. There is a chance Narduzzi could change everything that has happened since 1982 and Pitt could win 11 games, but would you bet on it? I wouldn't.

Penn State, on the other hand, has won 11 games over ten times since 1982. The coaches are gone from the 51-9 stretch, but it will be much easier to get back to recruiting at the level they are. I am not saying they will be 11-1 this year, next year, or the year after, but if I was betting on the potential of 1 team getting there I sure wouldn't be betting Pitt.

The ceiling at Penn State is much higher than Pitt's. Just like the ceiling at Alabama is much higher than Penn State's.
 
I'll bring this back to football. How does Penn St's record before the sanctions have any correlation whatsoever to what happens now and going forward? it doesn't


Pitt was 9-2 and ranked in the top 10 in 2009 before pissing away a game against Cincinnati for the Sugar Bowl. yeah, I watched that game....45-44? awful

We finished that year in the top 15. Does that somehow predict good things for us 6 years and 3 head coaches later? nope

You're 3 head coaches and some very mediocre football later. There is no continuity in personnel from that 51-9 period except your team colors and the football above all else mindset of the fanbase. oh geez...c'mon man...lol. that's weak

The recruiting better argument has merrit. agreed

Franklin is actually an experiences HC compared to our guy...you could argue that point. But acting like a very successful period of football in the past has some impact on what's happening today, outside of the general history of Penn St football success, is a gigantic stretch, don't you think? agreed

It's borderline silly. no..it's just plain silly. but a lot of silly things are said on these boards, so why quit now?

If you really believe that three 11-1 seasons before 2010 means that you'll be doing that again 2 head coaches and almost a decade later, I don't know what to tell you. it doesn't?...gosh, i sure hope it has some correlation

Congratulations on your optimism? i mean...i'm a little optimistic. wouldn't you be? worst case scenario, Franklin fails and some other hot shot will take over with a fully loaded roster. quite a juxtaposition from where we were 3 years ago when Pitt fans were giggling like school girls when the Freeh report came out.
 
I'll bring this back to football. How does Penn St's record before the sanctions have any correlation whatsoever to what happens now and going forward? Pitt was 9-2 and ranked in the top 10 in 2009 before pissing away a game against Cincinnati for the Sugar Bowl. We finished that year in the top 15. Does that somehow predict good things for us 6 years and 3 head coaches later?

You're 3 head coaches and some very mediocre football later. There is no continuity in personnel from that 51-9 period except your team colors and the football above all else mindset of the fanbase. The recruiting better argument has merrit. Franklin is actually an experiences HC compared to our guy...you could argue that point. But acting like a very successful period of football in the past has some impact on what's happening today, outside of the general history of Penn St football success, is a gigantic stretch, don't you think? It's borderline silly. If you really believe that three 11-1 seasons before 2010 means that you'll be doing that again 2 head coaches and almost a decade later, I don't know what to tell you. Congratulations on your optimism?


You will also notice I mentioned in my post that the 51-9 record prior guarantees nothing, but everything is in place for Penn State to succeed with the right coaching staff. Do they have the right one right now? No one knows, but if Franklin isn't the right one I'm sure Penn State will pony up the money and resources to look for the next one.
 
You will also notice I mentioned in my post that the 51-9 record prior guarantees nothing, but everything is in place for Penn State to succeed with the right coaching staff. Do they have the right one right now? No one knows, but if Franklin isn't the right one I'm sure Penn State will pony up the money and resources to look for the next one.

I think what bugs a lot of Pitt fans about Penn St fans is the blind optimism coming off a 6-6 year that didn't feature a single quality victory as if that somehow validates Franklin's ability to win big at Penn St. I don't see many on here arguing that Penn St's progam has a higher ceiling than Pitt's or that Pitt will eventually out-recruit Penn St. We'll get our fair share of top WPA guys, but we'll never dominate on the Eastern half of the state.

However, even though I'll give you credit for admitting that Penn St's past success is no guarantee of future success, in the same breath you're also using that as the basis for your optimism. Essentially, "we were great under Paterno for a long time, we'll be great again." I'm not so sure. It really does have zero impact on what Franklin does. It might improve his ceiling, but good luck taking that to the bank. Penn St recruited just as well if not better under Paterno until the sanctions. It hasn't yielded big results more than once or twice in two decades. One outright Big Ten title in 20+ years, right?

Penn St has at best the third highest ceiling in their own Division. They have been nationall relevant from a competing for a National Championship standpoint maybe twice since 1993? Missouri, Boise St, Baylor, TCU, etc, have been more relevant from a BCS standpoint than Penn St in that time. Both Ohio St and Michigan now have proven, successful coaches. A couple of good recruiting classes really won't matter if your new staff can't figure out a way to beat more talented teams like OSU and Michigan. Franklin has never beaten more talented teams unless they had mass injuries during a down year (Georgia, Florida). You'll be playing in the Alamo bowl every year at 9-3 or 8-4.

Pitt had a 10 year stretch in the 70's/80's where we were basically Pete Carrol's USC team. It had zero impact going foward once we continually made bad coaching decisions. Look at Miami. How about Tennessee for over a decade now? Florida over the last 5 years. Georgia hasn't won sh*t since the 1980s. Clemson was down forever. Basically, being Penn St is no guarantee of anything is you don't really have anything on those schools and their name and history alone have not enabled them to return to greatness.

Please notice I'm not saying Pitt is better right now. I'm just questioning your optimism. Narduzzi hasn't proved anything yet. Maybe he can coach, maybe he can't. I'm not sure what Franklin is either - you seem to be sure. It's one thing to win at a lower level job where there are no expectations, it's another to do it at someplace like Penn St. History is littered with big shot coaches who failed at higher levels. If Frankling gives you a boner with a good recruiting year and 6-6 record, congrats. However, at least in 2016, there is not going to be much of a talent descrepency between Pitt and Penn St when they play. Depending on what Narduzzi can do, there may not be much of a discrepency beyond that as well.

You can thump your chest on recruiting results, but I'd be mucher happier to see progess on the field. Penn St took a step back last year from O'Brien's final year. How many years in a row now has ND had a top 10 or 15 class? They can't even beat Pitt unless the refs gift them games.
 
I think what bugs a lot of Pitt fans about Penn St fans is the blind optimism coming off a 6-6 year that didn't feature a single quality victory as if that somehow validates Franklin's ability to win big at Penn St. I don't see many on here arguing that Penn St's progam has a higher ceiling than Pitt's or that Pitt will eventually out-recruit Penn St. We'll get our fair share of top WPA guys, but we'll never dominate on the Eastern half of the state.

However, even though I'll give you credit for admitting that Penn St's past success is no guarantee of future success, in the same breath you're also using that as the basis for your optimism. Essentially, "we were great under Paterno for a long time, we'll be great again." I'm not so sure. It really does have zero impact on what Franklin does. It might improve his ceiling, but good luck taking that to the bank. Penn St recruited just as well if not better under Paterno until the sanctions. It hasn't yielded big results more than once or twice in two decades. One outright Big Ten title in 20+ years, right?

Penn St has at best the third highest ceiling in their own Division. They have been nationall relevant from a competing for a National Championship standpoint maybe twice since 1993? Missouri, Boise St, Baylor, TCU, etc, have been more relevant from a BCS standpoint than Penn St in that time. Both Ohio St and Michigan now have proven, successful coaches. A couple of good recruiting classes really won't matter if your new staff can't figure out a way to beat more talented teams like OSU and Michigan. Franklin has never beaten more talented teams unless they had mass injuries during a down year (Georgia, Florida). You'll be playing in the Alamo bowl every year at 9-3 or 8-4.

Pitt had a 10 year stretch in the 70's/80's where we were basically Pete Carrol's USC team. It had zero impact going foward once we continually made bad coaching decisions. Look at Miami. How about Tennessee for over a decade now? Florida over the last 5 years. Georgia hasn't won sh*t since the 1980s. Clemson was down forever. Basically, being Penn St is no guarantee of anything is you don't really have anything on those schools and their name and history alone have not enabled them to return to greatness.

Please notice I'm not saying Pitt is better right now. I'm just questioning your optimism. Narduzzi hasn't proved anything yet. Maybe he can coach, maybe he can't. I'm not sure what Franklin is either - you seem to be sure. It's one thing to win at a lower level job where there are no expectations, it's another to do it at someplace like Penn St. History is littered with big shot coaches who failed at higher levels. If Frankling gives you a boner with a good recruiting year and 6-6 record, congrats. However, at least in 2016, there is not going to be much of a talent descrepency between Pitt and Penn St when they play. Depending on what Narduzzi can do, there may not be much of a discrepency beyond that as well.

You can thump your chest on recruiting results, but I'd be mucher happier to see progess on the field. Penn St took a step back last year from O'Brien's final year. How many years in a row now has ND had a top 10 or 15 class? They can't even beat Pitt unless the refs gift them games.


I think the problem between the two fan bases on a difference of opinion of the effect of the sanctions. The majority of Penn State fans feel it has held them back a great deal. Pitt fans feel they still should have won 9-10 games while on them. The fact of the matter is that from the time the sanctions were announced it was know that they would start to have their biggest effect in year 3. Why? Because most college football players shine as sophmores, juniors, and seniors. Bill O'Brien focused the majority of his 15 scholarship classes on skill positions, because they can come in and help you right away. There was not a lot of talent brought in on the oline. It probably had a lot to do with O'Brien knowing he was not in it for the long haul. Penn State is still recovering from this and will not even be back to full strength this year on their oline.

Comparing Pitt to USC is a bit of a stretch as well as the amount of time. Pitt had great stretch of 4 years out of 6. For the most part, outside of that stretch, they have been hovering around .500 since 1950. That is a pretty large sample size.

Penn State has had a lot of small samples sizes in each decade since 1950. To agree with you, that was under the same coaching staff, so there is no guarantee a new one will have the same success. Although many would argue that staff held Penn State back in a lot of the recent years.

I happen to think Penn State will get back to being a top10 or top 15 program. I'm not expecting Alabama. I'm expecting a Georgia type maybe, yes they aren't playing for national titles, but they are pretty good pretty often.

I happen to think Penn State has a pretty good chance of being favored in all 4 games against Pitt. I think Pitt's best chance to win a game in the series will be the first game in 2016. I could be wrong, but that's just my opinion.
 
I think what bugs a lot of Pitt fans about Penn St fans is the blind optimism coming off a 6-6 year that didn't feature a single quality victory as if that somehow validates Franklin's ability to win big at Penn St. what would've been a quality victory last year? OSU & MSU? who else?

I don't see many on here arguing that Penn St's progam has a higher ceiling than Pitt's or that Pitt will eventually out-recruit Penn St. We'll get our fair share of top WPA guys, but we'll never dominate on the Eastern half of the state.

However, even though I'll give you credit for admitting that Penn St's past success is no guarantee of future success, in the same breath you're also using that as the basis for your optimism. Essentially, "we were great under Paterno for a long time, we'll be great again." I'm not so sure. It really does have zero impact on what Franklin does. It might improve his ceiling, but good luck taking that to the bank. Penn St recruited just as well if not better under Paterno until the sanctions. ehhh, that's not true. outside of 2006, we barely scratched the top 25. Franklin will consistently be within top 15. and we sure as heck weren't getting the hot shot skilled position recruits from Paterno.

It hasn't yielded big results more than once or twice in two decades. One outright Big Ten title in 20+ years, right? well...2 in the last 10 years. you know how many Michigan has had in that time?....0

Penn St has at best the third highest ceiling in their own Division. you might be right...sorta like Alabama, Auburn, LSU?.....they all won championships recently, so i'll take that any day.

They have been nationall relevant from a competing for a National Championship standpoint maybe twice since 1993? Missouri, Boise St, Baylor, TCU, etc, have been more relevant from a BCS standpoint than Penn St in that time. Both Ohio St and Michigan now have proven, successful coaches. A couple of good recruiting classes really won't matter if your new staff can't figure out a way to beat more talented teams like OSU and Michigan. Franklin has never beaten more talented teams unless they had mass injuries during a down year (Georgia, Florida). You'll be playing in the Alamo bowl every year at 9-3 or 8-4. sounds like you have a crystal ball just like said PSU prognosticators....just with a pessimistic view.

Pitt had a 10 year stretch in the 70's/80's where we were basically Pete Carrol's USC team. It had zero impact going foward once we continually made bad coaching decisions. Look at Miami. How about Tennessee for over a decade now? Florida over the last 5 years. Georgia hasn't won sh*t since the 1980s. Clemson was down forever. Basically, being Penn St is no guarantee of anything is you don't really have anything on those schools and their name and history alone have not enabled them to return to greatness. of course not...who's guaranteed greatness? i like our chances to get back to that status, though. Alabama was quite average in the mid-90s...so was USC...and Oklahoma....and Auburn. remember Miami in the 70's & now?....it's cyclical

Please notice I'm not saying Pitt is better right now. I'm just questioning your optimism. Narduzzi hasn't proved anything yet. Maybe he can coach, maybe he can't. I'm not sure what Franklin is either - you seem to be sure. It's one thing to win at a lower level job where there are no expectations, it's another to do it at someplace like Penn St. History is littered with big shot coaches who failed at higher levels. If Frankling gives you a boner with a good recruiting year and 6-6 record, congrats. However, at least in 2016, there is not going to be much of a talent descrepency between Pitt and Penn St when they play. Depending on what Narduzzi can do, there may not be much of a discrepency beyond that as well. based on recent recruting classes alone, I disagree. that being said, it doesn't guarantee us victory

You can thump your chest on recruiting results, but I'd be mucher happier to see progess on the field. yeah right...you guys wouldn't be thumping your chests too?..please. but i don't disagree, you have to win on the field

Penn St took a step back last year from O'Brien's final year. dude...worst year of our sanctions were last year. all PSU fans know this. you think O'Brien would've automatically won more games last year? you must have missed how our defense performed in 2013 under O'Brien....god awful.

How many years in a row now has ND had a top 10 or 15 class? i get your point, and it happens all the time (B Hoke). but they did go to the National Championship game a few years ago (yes, i know you should've beat them....and we should've beat OSU...but both didn't happen)

They can't even beat Pitt unless the refs gift them games.
 
^^^ It is theoretically possible to schedule a quality non conference team!

In all fairness, did Pitt not have Akron, FIU, Delaware, and Iowa as a schedule last year? We have you scheduled next year. Do you not consider yourself a quality non conference team? We also play in the B1G East which for the near future will be much tougher than the ACC coastal. I'm not happy with PSU's out of conference schedule this year, but I think it may have been made with the sanctions in mind. In the future PSU has Va Tech, Pitt, WVU, and hopefully Georgia.
 
Thank you, but I never was in the Armed Forces and would never even come close of saying such a thing due to the deep respect and precious honor, all men and women deserve the recognition in serving in Harms Way and I don't care if it was in supplies or combat ......service to our nation to defend my country, my family, friends and citizens freedom is not a vice!

I was in ROTC in High School and turned down Scholarship for College and was invited to join the Marines OTC, but they called 3 weeks after I accepted an offer to work at a Top 20 Fortune 500 Company!

I always feel now I should have taken the ROTC Offer and since I cannot be counted as one that did serve, I am dedicated forever being thankful to men and women like yourself that did serve and always in glory with your memories of service will be forever your story.


I crossed a line once and was banned well deserved and had to comeback under a another name just like as "CaptainSidneyReilly" that changed his name and was considered the best spy in British History and spoke 7 languages and in the book Ace of Spies & PBS Series!

When Sidney Rosenblum changed his name to Reilly, he was quoted, "The Irish Are Welcomed In All Countries Except One (Great Britain)" and I am allowed on all message Boards except one, and so be it!
LINK:
http://spymuseum.com/sidney-reilly/
People serve in various ways - much of the tecnology that kept me alive can be attributed to Fortune 500 companies and I appreciate that - on to football - I always enjoy your thoughtful and logical statements. I don't come to this Board often!! If I could get around better you would be welcome at my tailgate anytime.

I agree with your assessments of the three local programs, especially WVU and the head coach. I believe that WVU may look to Bradley from the West coast as a possible replacement.
I hope Pitt does well under Narduzzi and brings back some excitement to the region. It will take some time to get his players and intregrate them into his system. I beleive he will bring a toughness to the program which I think has been lacking. I will always pull for PSU and hope we win every game (which we're still far way from) but realize in Franklin's case as well that it will take time.

Again thanks for the kind words regarding vets but always remember that everyone has a roll to play and what we recieved from Corporate America was very important to all of us.
 
Agree, and thanks for the comments. I am not against Holgrosen and wish him success. I like posters that speak their minds on Posters Board and that is how we all learn together we can make great points together or give a view others did not think about. Many Pitt, WVU & Penn State Posters have changed my mind many times and I have no shame in thanking them teaching me something I did not think about.

Nothing against Holgrosen at all, just that I know some High WVU Contributors and they told me they are demanding a 9 to 10 Win Season "NOW", and will be very upset if they see 6 or 7 wins again?

I like your Bradley thought and feel that could happen and should happen. I met Bradley and was always a funny guy with a relax attitude and his Dad was a PITT Doctor. Tom badly wanted the Pitt job, and wanted to do at Pitt what Paterno did at PSU regarding the Football Program on recruits, graduation, and building a self supporting Program..

If it was up to me, I would prefer Penn State, WVU, and PITT in the Top 5 every year in any order or ranking and would enjoy that kind of finishing and banter that goes with it.

It has been my Dream since the Internet Age and Football Posting Boards that Pitt-Penn State meet in a National Championship game. The fact is when Pitt & Penn State played in the 1975-1983, they played some of their best Football together and against each other and helped each other become National Champions in 1976 and 1982-86!

Pitt, Penn State, Miami, WVU, ND, BC, CUSE, FSU, BYU as Independents dominated the Big Four Bowls from 1980 to 1993.

Thank you and hope more Penn State Posters post here on future discussions.




People serve in various ways - much of the tecnology that kept me alive can be attributed to Fortune 500 companies and I appreciate that - on to football - I always enjoy your thoughtful and logical statements. I don't come to this Board often!! If I could get around better you would be welcome at my tailgate anytime.

I agree with your assessments of the three local programs, especially WVU and the head coach. I believe that WVU may look to Bradley from the West coast as a possible replacement.
I hope Pitt does well under Narduzzi and brings back some excitement to the region. It will take some time to get his players and intregrate them into his system. I beleive he will bring a toughness to the program which I think has been lacking. I will always pull for PSU and hope we win every game (which we're still far way from) but realize in Franklin's case as well that it will take time.

Again thanks for the kind words regarding vets but always remember that everyone has a roll to play and what we recieved from Corporate America was very important to all of us.
 
In light of our discussions, I decided to look at the entire 1970-1993 Era when Notre Dame, then Penn State, then Pitt as Independents started to bring Eastern Football back and later joined by WVU, Cuse, Miami, FSU, VT, Bc and even Temple and Rutgers.

As far as I am concern, it shows how together some of best College Football and Players was played right with the Independents and the success they had in the Bowls actually led to Conferences ending their reign so they could keep most of the bowl Money.

PART I
AP POLL RANKINGS 1970-80 THE RISE OF THE INDEPENDENTS:

1970 - Final AP Poll
2 Notre Dame (IN)
18 Penn St.
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
COTTON 1971 Notre Dame (IN) 24 Texas 11
1971 - Final AP Poll
5 Penn St.
13 Notre Dame (IN)
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
COTTON 1972 Penn St. 30 Texas 6
Fiesta 1971 Arizona St. 45 Florida St. 38*
(Fiesta Became A New Bowl And Was Not A Top Four Bowl until 1981 In Payouts)*
It Is My Contention That The Independents Actually Were Responsible Into Building The Fiesta Bowl Into A Top Four Bowl And Replaced The Cotton Bowl Based On How Many Independents Played Some Great Games Against Conferences And Other Independents, Especially In The 1980s!


1972 - Final AP Poll
10 Penn St.
14 Notre Dame (IN)
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
SUGAR 1972 Oklahoma 14 Penn St.0
ORANGE 1973 Nebraska 40 Notre Dame (IN) 6


1973 - Final AP Poll
1 Notre Dame (IN)
5 Penn St.
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
SUGAR BOWL 1973 Notre Dame (IN) 24 Alabama 23
ORANGE 1974 Penn St. 16 Louisiana St. 9
Fiesta 1973 Arizona St.28 Pittsburgh (PA) 7
1974 - Final AP Poll
6 Notre Dame (IN)
7 Penn St.
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
ORANGE 1975 Notre Dame (IN) 13 Alabama 11
COTTON 1975 Penn St. 41 Baylor (TX) 20


1975 - Final AP Poll
10 Penn St.
15 Pittsburgh (PA)
20 West Virginia
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
SUGAR 1975 Alabama 13 Penn St. 6


1976 - Final AP Poll
1 Pittsburgh (PA)
12 Notre Dame (IN
17 Rutgers (NJ)
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
SUGAR 1977 Pittsburgh (PA) 27 Georgia 3


1977 - Final AP Poll
1 Notre Dame (IN)
5 Penn St.
8 Pittsburgh (PA)
14 Florida St.
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
COTTON 1978 Notre Dame (IN) 38 Texas 10
Fiesta 1977 Penn St. 42 Arizona St. 30


1978 - Final AP Poll
4 Penn St.
7 Notre Dame (IN)
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
SUGAR 1979 Alabama14 Penn St.7
COTTON 1979 Notre Dame (IN) 35 Houston (TX) 34


1979 - Final AP Poll
6 Florida St.
7 Pittsburgh (PA)
17 Temple (PA)
20 Penn St
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
Fiesta 1979 Pittsburgh (PA) 16 Arizona 10

Now Part II will show how with the numbers together the Independents especially Pitt, Penn State, and WVU actually by competing together that help all of us to hate each other by winning and losing. Yet, it was actually all of our Programs finest Eras because we played for and won National Championships and major Bowls.




 
PART II

THE INDEPENDENT DOMINATION OF TOP FOUR BOWLS
1980 - Final AP Poll
2 Pittsburgh (PA)
5 Florida St.
8 Penn St.
9 Notre Dame (IN
18 Miami (FL)
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
SUGAR 1981 Georgia 17 Notre Dame (IN) 10
ORANGE 1980 Oklahoma 24 Florida St. 7
Fiesta 1980 Penn St.31 Ohio St. 19


Every Independent That Played In These Bowls Below Received A Full Share Of Each Bowl And Kept The Entire Bowl Share Without Sharing It With Conference Teams Because They Had None. This Really Started To Make SEC Angry And By The End Of The Decade, It Was The Independents Dominating Shares Of Top 4 Bowl!

1981 - Final AP Poll
3 Penn St.
4 Pittsburgh (PA)
8 Miami (FL)
17 West Virginia
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
SUGAR 1982 Pittsburgh (PA) 24 Georgia 20
ORANGE 1981 Oklahoma 18 Florida St. 17
FIESTA 1982 Penn St. 26 Southern California 10
(Fiesta Bowl Become A New Year’s Day Bowl With Big Payouts)*
(The Cotton Bowl Stated To Lose Its Position As A Top Four Bowl)


1982 - Final AP Poll
1 Penn St.
10 Pittsburgh (PA)
13 Florida St.
19 West Virginia
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
SUGAR 1983 Penn St.27 Georgia 23
COTTON 1983 Southern Methodist (TX) 7 Pittsburgh (PA) 3


1983 - Final AP Poll
1 Miami (FL)
16 West Virginia
18 Pittsburgh (PA)
19 Boston College (MA)
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
ORANGE 1984 Miami (FL) 31 Nebraska 30
FIESTA 1984 Ohio St. 28 Pittsburgh (PA) 23


1984 - Final AP Poll
5 Boston College (MA)
17 Florida St.
18 Miami (FL)
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
ORANGE 1986 Oklahoma 25 Penn St. 10
FIESTA 1985 UCLA 39 Miami (FL) 37
COTTON 1985 Boston College (MA) 45 Houston (TX) 28


1985 - Final AP Poll
3 Penn St.
9 Miami (FL)
15 Florida St.
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
SUGAR 1986 Tennessee 35 Miami (FL) 7


1986 - Final AP Poll
1 Penn St.
2 Miami (FL)
19 Boston College (MA)
20 Virginia Tech
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
FIESTA 1987 Penn St. 14 Miami (FL) 10


1987 - Final AP Poll
1 Miami (FL)
2 Florida St.
4 Syracuse (NY)
17 Notre Dame (IN)
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
SUGAR 1988 Auburn (AL) 16 Syracuse (NY) 16
ORANGE 1988 Miami (FL) 20 Oklahoma 14
FIESTA 1988 Florida St. 31 Nebraska 28
COTTON 1988 Texas A&M 35 Notre Dame (IN) 10


1988 - Final AP Poll
1 Notre Dame (IN)
2 Miami (FL)
3 Florida St.
5 West Virginia
13 Syracuse (NY)
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
SUGAR 1989 Florida St. 13 Auburn (AL) 7
ORANGE 1989 Miami (FL) 23 Nebraska 3
FIESTA 1989 Notre Dame (IN) 34 West Virginia 21


1989 - Final AP Poll
1 Miami (FL)
2 Notre Dame (IN)
3 Florida St.
15 Penn St.
17 Pittsburgh (PA)
21 West Virginia
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
SUGAR 1990 Miami (FL) 33 Alabama 25
ORANGE 1990 Notre Dame (IN) 21 Colorado 6
FIESTA 1990 Florida St. 41 Nebraska 17


1990 - Final AP Poll
3 Miami (FL)
4 Florida St.
6 Notre Dame (IN)
11 Penn St.
14 Louisville (KY)
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
ORANGE 1991 Colorado 10 Notre Dame (IN) 9
FIESTA 1991 Louisville (KY) 34 Alabama 7
COTTON 1991 Miami (FL) 46 Texas 3


1991 - Final AP Poll
1 Miami (FL) JOIN BIG EAST 1991
3 Penn St.
4 Florida St.
11 Syracuse (NY) JOIN BIG EAST 1991
13 Notre Dame (IN)
(PITT JOIN BIG EAST 1991)
(WVU JOIN BIG EAST 1991)
(BC JOIN BIG EAST 1991)
(RUTGERS JOIN BEC 1991)
(TEMPLE JOIN BIG EAST 1991)
(VT JOIN BIG EAST 1991)
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
SUGAR 1992 Notre Dame (IN) 39 Florida 28
ORANGE 1992 Miami (FL) 22 Nebraska 0

FIESTA 1992 Penn St.42 Tennessee 17
(Cotton 1992 Florida St. 10 Texas A&M 2)


1992 - Final AP Poll
2 Florida St. JOIN ACC 1992
3 Miami (FL) BEC
4 Notre Dame (IN)
6 Syracuse (NY) BEC
21 Boston College (MA) BEC
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
SUGAR 1993 Alabama 34 Miami (FL) 13 MIAMI NOW IN BEC VS SEC
ORANGE 1993 Florida St. 27 Nebraska 14 NOW FSU IS IN ACC VS BIG-8


1993 - Final AP Poll
1 Florida St. ACC
2 Notre Dame (IN)
7 West Virginia BEC
8 Penn St. JOIN BIG TEN 1993
13 Boston College (MA) BEC
15 Miami (FL) BEC
22 Virginia Tech BEC
24 Louisville (KY) (JOIN CUSA 1996)
BIG FOUR BOWLS:
SUGAR 1994 Florida 41 West Virginia 7 SEC VS BEC
ORANGE 1994 Florida St. 18 Nebraska 16 FSU/ACC VS BIG-8


BY 1993, ALL CONFERENCES HAD THE MAJORITY OF BOWL MONEY AS INDEPENDENTS JOINED CONFERENCES EXCEPT FOR NOTRE DAME THAT LATER BECAME BIG EAST BOWL RELATED AND TODAY ACC BOWL RELATED!

SEC Actually Started To Dominate The Big Four Bowls And Created The BCS System. Now You Know The Rest Of The Story…..SEC Knew If It Could Remove The Independents They Would Dominate The Big Four Major Bowls That Paid Out The Most Money To Each Program That Was Shared For That Conference Even Notre Dame Was Bowl Tamed And Had To Share In The Revenues!

Remember the Rose Bowl Now even joined the BCS Bowl System in 1996 that allow other Conferences to play in it, besides the Big Ten and PAC-12. This was again advocated and led to passing it among the 6 BCS Conferences.

By 1996, The BCS Conferences were ACC, BEC, B12, B12, P12, & SEC. Some Teams were left out of the Big-8 SWC Merger, and some Independents like ULou had joined the CUSA. The BCS then developed its Bowl Rotation System trying to match #1 with #2 Best Teams in the nation. Soon after, around 2003-2005 Conference Expansion and TV Money for BCS Conference kept increasing and the Big Ten Channel Network was developed. More expansion happen in due to TV Cable Subscribers and in 2010-13 Expansions happen in ACC, Big Ten, Pac-12, and SEC becoming a Top 5 Power Conference and Big East Became the AAC breaking from the Basketball Schools.

I put this information up showing how at one time Independents like ND, Penn State, Pitt, WVU, Miami, FSU, BC, VT, Rutgers, Temple and ULou all became Top 25 Ranking at this era and was taking more money from Conferences that needed that Bowl money to share among all Teams within the Conference.

During this same period, Notre Dame, Penn State, Miami, WVU, FSU, and Pitt played for the National Championships multiple times against the Conferences and other Independents. This really upset SEC, B10, ACC and Big-8, and SWC!

LINK:AP POLLS
http://cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/national_championships/ap_poll.php?year=1970

LINK; CURRENT BOWLS:
http://cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/bowls/current_bowls.php






 
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He beat Kentucky 3 times, Tennessee 2, Ole Miss 2, Wake Forest 3 times, Georgia 1, Florida 1, Auburn 1, NC State 1, Missouri.

This is why I think, expect, and will be proven right that Coach Franklin will be a good Head Coach and compete in the Top Level of the Big Ten and Top 25! It will take this year to make all his players execute properly, but if the OL is just average, Penn State Backs in Barkley and Lynch will just make it easier for Hackenberg and he can throw if protected properly. The Defense will be good too.

I have no problem anyone telling me I was wrong later this year if they do not win 9 to 10 games. There is nothing wrong in praising what Franklin is doing at Penn State and Pitt should have no fear there either. To me it is challenge for Coach Pat & Staff to meet and beat and that is on Pitt.

These are good wins for Franklin at Vandy and something Vandy seldom did before or after Franklin!



Each of those schools recruits at a higher level than Vanderbilt and some at a much much higher level, so if you use that argument last year to explain how Franklin is not a good coach, how do you explain the years at Vandy where he beat teams with less 4 stars/talent?
DITTO!
 
In all fairness, did Pitt not have Akron, FIU, Delaware, and Iowa as a schedule last year? We have you scheduled next year. Do you not consider yourself a quality non conference team? We also play in the B1G East which for the near future will be much tougher than the ACC coastal. I'm not happy with PSU's out of conference schedule this year, but I think it may have been made with the sanctions in mind. In the future PSU has Va Tech, Pitt, WVU, and hopefully Georgia.

Until Pitt proves otherwise... Pitt is not a quality non conference team. We have been 6-6 3 yrs. running. What I find interesting is It seems we even aren't a soft enough opponent for Franklin's liking.
 
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I love how Penn State fans feel they are superior to Pitt as a football team (as a program, like Captain I concede no doubt PSU is bigger and badder) but the pure on the field product is "better" because....they have better recruiting classes. Really? That's your argument? You don't think Miami has had better recruiting classes than 99% of the ACC over the past 10 years? How many titles did they win? You don't think Michigan had better classes than Michigan State? Who's the better football team? How do you think TCU ranks nationally in recruiting over the last 5-6 years? How have they been as a program.

This is my point exactly, although Pitt posters will recognize that Penn State is a Top Ten Program, it has not been winning in the Top Ten since joining the Big Ten? During that’s same period Pitt has not won as much and has a smaller Top 40-50 Program. Yet, Pitt has produced better quality Players and set records better than the bigger PSU Program even in the Paterno Era?

Now I will admit this may end sooner if Franklin makes them a Top Ten Winning Program again, and he is doing it with good Staff Selection & Recruiting!


Not saying recruiting isn't important, it is extremely important. But because you recruit a does not mean you add b and get c. It is not always linear. Of course, the brilliant grads and students of a prestigious school like Penn State understand this. That there is always x. Or y. Coaching. Injuries. Schedule. Youth. Luck. Who knows.....

Exactly, the other thing that drives many Fans crazy not just Pitt fans, is the arrogance many of the Penn State Posters, Fans, and Alumni apparently thinks is accurate about the Penn State Program has some kind of superior class, levels, and is above all other College Football Programs?

When one sees after a Top Recruit some Penn State fans adore and brags about coming to Penn State and then changes his mind, all of sudden these mental midgets say:
  1. Penn State pulled the Scholarship?
  2. The Recruit did not qualify by his grades??
  3. The Recruit is stupid and lacks the character???
  4. Not Penn State Material????
  5. Recruits took money?????
Now these are just outright direct intentional lies to make them feel good about talking down a Recruit that chose not to go to Penn State? It also reveals the stupidity of such a fan that has to knock down someone to make himself feel good?

But to read that PSU is going to KILL Pitt because James Franklin had a better recruiting class.....come on. How long have you followed college football?

The sadder part is the good Posters on BWI do not correct the dummies that say such things. This is what was wrong with the Paterno Public Relations that made this stuff up and some of the more stupid PSU Fans bought into thinking it reflects on them is some superior way!!! Fact is does reflect on them, and why Penn State Program is mocked by many other Boards not just the Lair. There is no upside in talking down about a recruit that chose another program.

Sure, you can post eh made a mistake, or think he was wrong to do it, but don’t play the game we really want him, got him, and we are great and then all of sudden…..he stinks, and is afraid because he knows he can’t play here….then that recruits goes on and beats the heck out of PSU and sets records in the NCAA and NFL, and showing the only one stupid are the posters that believe and say such things for their own egos and to be mean. This alone shows Penn State Program is not superior with that kind of thinking and bragging?

The Monitors on BWI should take down the dumb post and after while ban that Poster for saying such things because it makes Penn State look petty, pompous, and small not superior in anyway?
 
Until Pitt proves otherwise... Pitt is not a quality non conference team. We have been 6-6 3 yrs. running. What I find interesting is It seems we even aren't a soft enough opponent for Franklin's liking.
In my opinion, from Harris To Wannstedt To Graham to Chryst Pitt had 4 New Systems that all Recruits and Players had to adapt to and required big changes in rebuilding....And the Pederson Sanctions kept Pitt Recruiting Classes on quicksand every 2 years?:eek:

Harris burned out and did a bad job with High School Coaching & tired of Recruiting. He was also burden with low salaries of Staffers that came and left bringing his Program many problems with stability. He did a very good job in light of all these burdens he had to deal with as Pitt was rebuilding and could NOT take advantage of the 4 of 5 years Paterno had from 200-2004. However, the real thing I saw he did not have his Teams ready for Games he should have won and usually lost 2 games that way every year. At the same time, he would then win a game most expected Pitt to lose and just burned out by 2004!:confused:

Wannstedt comes in and talks a big program but takes 3 years to get the players he needed to win under his system that was far different than Harris. Yet, Wannstedt did rebuild High School Recruiting relations with coaches. Increased his Staff salaries had decent recruits and won 8 to 10 games, but even then, he lost 2 games he could have won every year too? He made a mistake never recruiting a great QB either! Yet, Nordenberg that hired him, abandon him in favor of keeping Pederson and we all know that either both should have gone or Pederson, not just Wannstedt! Today, I remember Wannstedt best win when he beat WVU 13-9, and I cringe when thinking how he could not see that Pitt QB in the Bowl game stunk from his first pas, but kept him in all game long until last 5 minutes, and Pitt lost 0-3?o_O

Graham was a ham that scrammed knowing Pederson was poison for any Football Program. Toad made sure the way he left Pitt was a sign that he could not work with, for, or under Pederson. Toad also lost 2 games he should have won.:mad:

Chryst was a mixture of Harris and Graham. He could build an Offense but had trouble on Defense and Special team’s costs him 2 to 3 games every year. Chryst reminded me of Dumbo when he couldn’t fly, as he watched his Teams not prepared for YSU, Cincy, Cuse, ULou, ND, UConn, all games he could have won in first year but just lacked the Head Coaching Smarts and finished losing his last 3 games with big losses? In his second year, Dumbo still did not have his feather to give him confidence to fly, as he dropped Navy, GT, UNC, and Miami on very bad Special Teams and crucial play calling that could have won 10+ games. In his Third Year, his special Teams just melted down to nothing and let the entire Team and Players down with his Dumbo response that he will coach Special Teams? Pitt lost to Duke, UNC, and Houston with just awful special Teams and that was at the end of the seasons. Dumbo Paul went on to make terrible calls in the Iowa and Duke games at crucial times. In addition, never had Team ready for Akron and GT, and could not figure out to run Voytik until the VT game, and lost the UVA that way. Again, 10 win season gone due to poor Head Coaching!:confused:

Narduzzi on deck? Just a hunch he will not make the same mistakes of the previous four, but I still expect losing at least 2 games as Coach Pat & Staff adjust to these players as a team, but I have a hunch he will have way better special teams, and the Defense will improve as the season goes along. Nevertheless, one major injury to Voytik, Boyd, or Conner could cost Pitt 6 games? Yet, I will predict still 8 wins!:p
 
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Did he really say PSU was "leading" for Tyler Boyd?? Lolololololol. :rolleyes:

Pitt benefited by PSU Sanctions. Tyler Boyd really did like Penn State and Johnson and Holtz switched to Pitt, and all three are contributors to this great Pitt Offense.:cool:

At the same time, Penn State hurt Pitt back last year when they grabbed their last few recruits from taking Pitt commits and I still think those players were needed and would play faster at Pitt, but I wish them the best in any event going to Penn State.:oops:

I also thought Chryst blew it not getting Henry that went to WVU! o_O

Just my opinion, not gospel?;)
 
In 2016, the game at Heinz will determine if Narduzzi is able to beat PSU. All the advantages that PSU has will be limited to how Franklin can win a big game on the road. Franklin is hesitant to play Pitt beyond the four game series. All the scheduling nonsense about seven games is nonsense. Things change but the OCC scheduling at PSU for the next 5 years is a joke. No one on the NC selection committee can look at that and select PSU for the games. Yet Franklin talks of winning a NC as if it is a given. Mr. Hype strikes again.
 
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I really don't think Franklin is afraid to play Pitt.He's under the assumption that if he beats The Ohio State,Michigan State , Michigan and the rest of his Big 10 games he'll get in the playoff.You know what he's probably right too.BWDIK I'm a Cal State of Pa grad!
 
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Captain your right on about the Johnson,Holtz,and Boyd!People don't realize that Boyd was a PSU lean for awhile.I play softball on the Senior Softball Tour with Tom Nola(Clairtons old coach) and he keep me informed on recruiting of his players.Cal U 2015 Woman's Basketball National Champs and Final Four in softball!
 
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Captain your right on about the Johnson,Holtz,and Boyd!People don't realize that Boyd was a PSU lean for awhile.I play softball on the Senior Softball Tour with Tom Nola(Clairtons old coach) and he keep me informed on recruiting of his players.Cal U 2015 Woman's Basketball National Champs and Final Four in softball!

80, if informed, Lamont Wade where is he leaning ?
 
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Good points and I think the 2016 Game comes down to whether Hackenberg stays at Penn State for his last year or goes Pro next year? I say this because I think Voytik wil stay at Pitt another year and having a well seasoned QB with lots of experience should never be underestimated. Also, it depends if PITT OL stays too, and how much progress coach Pat & Staff develop the Defense??? Plus, Coach Pat & Staff needs this year to show he can be a good head coach right away.

I can see why Penn State Fans feel they have the advantages for 2016 to 2019 and have a right to brag about it, even if all of us do not know what will happen. Franklin's Staff Coaching still has a jump on Coach Pat & Staff by 2 years, and their Top 20 Recruiting is a great advantage, until we see if Coach Pat is another Coach Dantonio?

Yet, remember this too, it took Coach Dantonio and Coach Pat next to him to rebuild MSU Football Program into a 10 Win season going 7-4, 9-4 with John Smith's Recruits and Coach D & Pat Coaching, then 6-7? After that 11-2, 11-3, 13-1, & 11-2 last year? Coach Pat is being given a terrific Offense Team at Pitt this year, and if he can rebuild the Defenses and Special Teams he could do really good so long has they avoid Major Injuries.

On the other hand, Penn State OL should be great by 2016 with even great running backs and Wideouts, and that may be hard to stop even if Penn State is breaking in a New QB if Hack is gone?


I truly enjoy what Penn State Posters and Pitt posters think will happen, but there are many unknowns that must be considered right now for both programs.......Can Franklin Offense develop an Average to Great OL this and next few years and does have the talent to run, throw and catch behind it in my opinion.

And

Can Coach Pat & Staff from Game One change the Attitude and adapt to the Players he does have and turn them into a way better Team even with less than 4 Star Talent right away, until he can rebuild like Coach D at MSU did?

Finally, if anything happens to Hack or Voytik at either program, that could be big trouble, never underestimate the importance of a talented QB with experience, except when he can't play due to injuries?


In 2016, the game at Heinz will determine if Narduzzi is able to beat PSU. All the advantages that PSU has will be limited to how Franklin can win a big game on the road. Franklin is hesitant to play Pitt beyond the four game series. All the scheduling nonsense about seven games is nonsense. Things change but the OCC scheduling at PSU for the next 5 years is a joke. No one on the NC selection committee can look at that and select PSU for the games. Yet Franklin talks of winning a NC as if it is a given. Mr. Hype strikes again.
 
Daminals76, is more correct!

I think he was considering them until the rumors on trouble at PSU came out, but in any event it was a Penn State Graduate that got Tyler Boyd to make Pitt Is It?


Yet, after a quick review of Headlines at that time, Daminals76,
is quite correct and the only places that claimed Boyd wanted to come to Penn State was on Penn State recruiting boards like 247, BWI, and Scout!


Boyd never seriously considered PSU like Johnson and holtz did.

Two Links:
Boyd had long considered West Virginia to be his favorite, but Pittsburgh wide receiver coach Bobby Engram made up a lot of ground over the past few months. Boyd visited the Panthers in November and has not taken any other official visits. There were reports back in December that Boyd would visit Arizona and Penn State. He never made either trip. Boyd cancelled the Penn State visit and showed up on Pitt's campus the same weekend.
LINK

http://pitt.247sports.com/Article/Clairton-standout-Tyler-Boyd-commits-to-Pittsburgh-109894

Penn State 247 LINK:
Tyler Boyd, a leaning Lion?
http://pennstate.247sports.com/Board/18/Contents/Tyler-Boyd-a-leaning-Lion-11436881?Page=2#M11456267
 
Yep, Franklin is doing what Johnny Majors did in 1973 when he said we will build a Fence around Western PA and although he did not shut out Paterno & Penn State all together, he did get the best recruits in the region talking about bringing Pitt back to winning a National Title like it did in the 1910s-1920s,-1930s when it was a Top Ten Winning Team and Program and doing well in 1950s.

Pitt did enough to get Paterno to improve his own recruiting and Paterno went south to grab great Recruits from VA, MD, GA, NJ, and SC! Pitt won the National Championship 6 years before Paterno won his first one as a result.

UVA London has done the same thing to VT Beamer taking some great VA Recruits enough from VT that is hurting Beamer now, in my opinion. Same with Coach D at MSU hurting Michigan until Harbaugh attempts to change it!

After all, remember 2 to 3 Players making 4 to 5 Plays can win most games.. Paterno taught this and he was right back in the 1960s-1990s. Today, there are more plays now

Franklin is convincing Pennsylvania Players it is them and us at Penn State against OSU, Michigan, MSU and the other Top 25 Programs and so far many Top 4 Star Recruits are buying into it!

Meanwhile, it is not just Pitt that Franklin is taking 4 Star Recruits from but he is really hurting Rutgers, Maryland, BC, Temple, UVA, and VT too! Yet, some Smarter Recruits are going to see they can play faster at these other Programs rather sitting the bench at Penn State? Pitt, UVA, and VT have been able to take Recruits that chose not to go to Penn State due to the success of Paterno and just 4 to 5 of those recruits did way better at Pitt, VA, and VT and later in the NFL than many that chose Penn State, and I have put those numbers, names, and links up before showing it. Yet, Franklin's 4 Star March continues with taking Menet just this week


I really don't think Franklin is afraid to play Pitt.He's under the assumption that if he beats The Ohio State,Michigan State , Michigan and the rest of his Big 10 games he'll get in the playoff.You know what he's probably right too.BWDIK I'm a Cal State of Pa grad!
 
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Thanks Vulcan80, I heard similar things but in the end I think the Sanctions & Bobby Engram & Boyd wanting to play near Home made Pitt is It!

Captain your right on about the Johnson,Holtz,and Boyd!People don't realize that Boyd was a PSU lean for awhile.I play softball on the Senior Softball Tour with Tom Nola(Clairtons old coach) and he keep me informed on recruiting of his players.Cal U 2015 Woman's Basketball National Champs and Final Four in softball!
 
Bobby Engram did a very good job at Pitt and also was a good player in his own right!Boyd made the right choice in going to Pitt.I'm glad that he's doing the job on and off the field.Far to many Valley athletes haven't done this in the past!
Chains I don't really think Nola knows that much about Mathews or Wade since he's at Gateway now.The last time I talked to him he did say that Wade was a really good kid with his head on straight and The Ohio State was after him hard.
 
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People serve in various ways - much of the tecnology that kept me alive can be attributed to Fortune 500 companies and I appreciate that - on to football - I always enjoy your thoughtful and logical statements. I don't come to this Board often!! If I could get around better you would be welcome at my tailgate anytime.

I agree with your assessments of the three local programs, especially WVU and the head coach. I believe that WVU may look to Bradley from the West coast as a possible replacement.
I hope Pitt does well under Narduzzi and brings back some excitement to the region. It will take some time to get his players and intregrate them into his system. I beleive he will bring a toughness to the program which I think has been lacking. I will always pull for PSU and hope we win every game (which we're still far way from) but realize in Franklin's case as well that it will take time.

Again thanks for the kind words regarding vets but always remember that everyone has a roll to play and what we recieved from Corporate America was very important to all of us.

Corporate America made gazillions of dollars from the Vietnam conflict just as they are doing in the Middle East today. Don't believe there were many of Corporate America's family members flying home on the Silver Bullet.
 
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even Alabama has busts. but when you have a 15 man class, and you have 6 kids that won't even see the field...that hurts. yes, Franklin will have busts just like anybody else, but his 25 man classes will be loaded w/4* & 3* (with very few "reaches", if any), so he'll be able to weather that storm much easier in the near future than in 2014.

also, every fanbase has idiots. I can't (and won't) speak for who you're referring to. I'm only speaking for myself. obviously, we all don't know each other regardless of what school you root for.
Folks, a round of applause for PSUPALY for a fair presentation of the PSU point of view here.
 
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