Florida State

[NCanton Panther]

I'm not discounting those examples at all. I asked for opinions. No opinions are wrong because they aren't facts. I never said they were wrong.

I just have a difference of opinion. I think that the groups who have selected the teams for the playoffs have generally got it right enough to have included the teams that got the ultimate champion right. Frankly, once a season is over, I can barely remember who the champion was. I'm not going argue with someone who thinks that USC was the best team in 2003 and OSU didn't deserve it in 2014 because I have no recall of anything about those teams.

My sole point was that the committees almost always included the 1 team that everyone agreed was a legitimate champ at the end of the playoffs. The rest is just noise.

Sorry but you most certainly discounted those examples. Your words below:

College Football playoff era. And I asked about "champion" not about "opportunity". Has the ultimate champion been undeserving because the committees didn't include a team that would have won instead?

 

[NCPitt]

It'll be worse. What would the point of yesterday's games be? FSU, Bama, UGa, Mich, Texas would already be in. 10-2 PSU with 10 wins over girls teams would be resting up preparing for the playoff.

Do conference tournaments in BB have a point?

 

[NCPitt]

Sorry but you most certainly discounted those examples. Your words below:

College Football playoff era. And I asked about "champion" not about "opportunity". Has the ultimate champion been undeserving because the committees didn't include a team that would have won instead?

That isn't discounting. I was clarifying what MY discussion point was.

 

[NCanton Panther]

That isn't discounting. I was clarifying what MY discussion point was.

Then your discussion point was meaningless.

I listed what I consider the only 2 ways a championship could be considered not deserved. One, if that champion didn’t deserve 1 of the only 4 opportunities handed out to pursue a championship and the 2nd being given an undeserved win on the field due to wrong ref call or other reason.

You definitely discounted undeserved opportunity as a way and this whole discussion surely isn’t about bad or wrong ref calls. So your discussion point as you’re defining it was meaningless. Unless you can list some other way that anyone could consider a championship undeserved?

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Do conference tournaments in BB have a point?

Not really but its an actual tournament so you get that tournament vibe. These football championships go from defacto quarterfinals to utterly meaningless.

 

[pittbb80]

No undefeated P5 team has never failed to make the playoffs to the best of my knowledge. If that's right, your premise of a team winning all of its game and failing to be champion isn't right.

I have always thought an expanded playoff would be a better way to determine a champion. The problem is that adding those games to the schedule is abusing the players. The right way to compensate for those games is to reduce the regular season and most teams don't want to take the revenue hit from that.

lol. Like the NCaa is worried about abusing players. A playoff is done at all lower levels of football in the NCAa. It can be done

 

[BFo8]

It'll be worse. What would the point of yesterday's games be? FSU, Bama, UGa, Mich, Texas would already be in. 10-2 PSU with 10 wins over girls teams would be resting up preparing for the playoff.

But it will eliminate a lot of debate, and move us much closer to a champ actually being decided on the field. As I’m sure you’re aware of even the NY6 bowls are becoming increasingly meaningless exhibitions, at least this will give us many more games that actually count for something. You also won’t have to wait for the will he won’t he opt out game with the star players, at least not in the beginning. I’m sure eventually you will probably see guys opting out of playoff games as well, I don’t think that can be helped.

FWIW some of the offshore books have listed odds on who will make the playoff, and currently they have FSU on the outside looking in, which somewhat surprises me.

 

[HailToPitt725]

Adding my two cents to this thread:

1. This exact scenario- three undefeated power conference champions- is literally the reason why we ditched the BCS for the CFP. If Florida State is left out, regardless of the context, the playoff is a sham in my eyes.

2. I absolutely hate the take that’s going around that “P5 programs shouldn’t schedule tough non-conference games if Alabama gets left out.” Florida State’s win over a top five LSU team is one of their saving graces at the moment. Instead of complaining about the games you scheduled, maybe win them?

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

Adding my two cents to this thread:

1. This exact scenario- three undefeated power conference champions- is literally the reason why we ditched the BCS for the CFP. If Florida State is left out, regardless of the context, the playoff is a sham in my eyes.

2. I absolutely hate the take that’s going around that “P5 programs shouldn’t schedule tough non-conference games if Alabama gets left out.” Florida State’s win over a top five LSU team is one of their saving graces at the moment. Instead of complaining about the games you scheduled, maybe win them?

An OOC win would also be what puts Texas in, should they make it. Definitely cuts both ways. If the argument is teams shouldn't *lose* OOC games, I concur!

But I guess I see the SEC perspective: With the perception of the conference being what it is, they have more to lose and less to gain.

This is all just a self-imposed soap opera to me until they introduce completely objective measures.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Adding my two cents to this thread:

1. This exact scenario- three undefeated power conference champions- is literally the reason why we ditched the BCS for the CFP. If Florida State is left out, regardless of the context, the playoff is a sham in my eyes.

2. I absolutely hate the take that’s going around that “P5 programs shouldn’t schedule tough non-conference games if Alabama gets left out.” Florida State’s win over a top five LSU team is one of their saving graces at the moment. Instead of complaining about the games you scheduled, maybe win them?

You people arent listening. With Travis, they are in. Its a no-brainer. Without Travis, their offense is putrid. Probably worse than Pitt. Their D is top-notch though. Its not a Top 4 team without Travis. You would have to give them "credit" for going 10-0 with a team that it cant bring to the CFP

 

[HailToPitt725]

You people arent listening. With Travis, they are in. Its a no-brainer. Without Travis, their offense is putrid. Probably worse than Pitt. Their D is top-notch though. Its not a Top 4 team without Travis. You would have to give them "credit" for going 10-0 with a team that it cant bring to the CFP

I totally get that, but I still think the on-field results need to matter. They just defeated a top 15 team with a third string QB. I’d rather see FSU get blown out than only assume they’d get blown out because Travis isn’t there.

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

You people arent listening. With Travis, they are in. Its a no-brainer. Without Travis, their offense is putrid. Probably worse than Pitt. Their D is top-notch though. Its not a Top 4 team without Travis. You would have to give them "credit" for going 10-0 with a team that it cant bring to the CFP

Okay, you keep using extreme examples in one direction. How about this:

Alabama has a stud QB and a reigning Biletnikoff winner go down in September, after they opened the season by beating an eventual 12-1 Ohio State team that won the BIG, 56-0.

Alabama finishes the season 9-3, against a brutal schedule, with backups.

That QB and WR would be healthy by mid-December and would return to the team if they made the playoff.

Should they be in? It would literally be the same logic.

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

Also... Florida State has a stud d-lineman who wasn't eligible to play this semester but would be allowed to play in a bowl game in January. So that defense would only get better.

 

[HailToPitt725]

Found this on Twitter, thought it was an interesting simply because it’s an entirely different perspective on this debate:

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Okay, you keep using extreme examples in one direction. How about this:

Alabama has a stud QB and a reigning Biletnikoff winner go down in September, after they opened the season by beating an eventual 12-1 Ohio State team that won the BIG, 56-0.

Alabama finishes the season 9-3, against a brutal schedule, with backups.

That QB and WR would be healthy by mid-December and would return to the team if they made the playoff.

Should they be in? It would literally be the same logic.

If its close, then yes. If it was 9-3 Bama with a returning 1st Round QB and Belitnikoff winner vs, say an 11-2 Clemson team who won the ACC but didnt have a great resume, then I go Bama. They would be the best team with their returning players and they are close enough to 11-2 Clemson. Now, if Clemson was 12-1, then I go Clemson

 

[Millerton24]

I think FSU is in with a win even if it’s the ugliest 1 point win possible. Will add that Louisville was briefly a 1 point favorite earlier, now I pretty much see the game at even everywhere.

I still can’t believe a team with Jack Plummer at QB is playing for a conference title.

I know. Plummer is pretty bad

 

[NCanton Panther]

An OOC win would also be what puts Texas in, should they make it. Definitely cuts both ways. If the argument is teams shouldn't *lose* OOC games, I concur!

But I guess I see the SEC perspective: With the perception of the conference being what it is, they have more to lose and less to gain.

This is all just a self-imposed soap opera to me until they introduce completely objective measures.

3 P5 conferences have 3 OOC games and 2 have 4. I give credit to FSU for at least scheduling 2 decent OOC games even if 1 was because of in-state rival. Bama you give them credit for scheduling Texas but the other 3 were soup cans. UGA worse, they have their instate rival GAtech and then 3 soup cans.

Based on the typical poor OOC scheduling practice, I’d give more weight to schools that scheduled stronger OOC opponents and won those games.

 

[NCPitt]

Then your discussion point was meaningless.

I listed what I consider the only 2 ways a championship could be considered not deserved. One, if that champion didn’t deserve 1 of the only 4 opportunities handed out to pursue a championship and the 2nd being given an undeserved win on the field due to wrong ref call or other reason.

You definitely discounted undeserved opportunity as a way and this whole discussion surely isn’t about bad or wrong ref calls. So your discussion point as you’re defining it was meaningless. Unless you can list some other way that anyone could consider a championship undeserved?

Thanks for your opinion. I disagree. My discussion point was about the consensus of the ultimate champion reflecting that the committees generally got their selections right. If you want to start a different discussion, the forum is open for you to do so.

Undeserved opportunity is 100% opinion. My logic on cases like 2014 OSU was that their winning the championship proved that they deserved an opportunity because they beat other teams that were unquestionably deserving.

Feel free to disagree with my opinion. There is no right and wrong on that. There is a right and wrong on trying to redefine MY discussion point to something that you want to discuss instead.

 

[NCPitt]

Not really but its an actual tournament so you get that tournament vibe. These football championships go from defacto quarterfinals to utterly meaningless.

If you don't care about conference championships, then why have conferences?

Oh wait. You probably don't want conferences. You want a pro minor league.

 

[NCPitt]

lol. Like the NCaa is worried about abusing players. A playoff is done at all lower levels of football in the NCAa. It can be done

The NCAA doesn't control football. That should be clear to you. If not, now you know.

The schools do care about student abuse.

 

[S.R.M.]

Not really but its an actual tournament so you get that tournament vibe. These football championships go from defacto quarterfinals to utterly meaningless.

The ACC championship was apparently meaningless this year. It can't be a defacto quarterfinal if you win and don't make the semifinals

 

[TD_6082]

Ironically, this move might possibly have cost UGA a playoff spot over Texas.

SEC directs Georgia, Tennessee to nix OU series

Given Oklahoma's upcoming move to the SEC, along with Texas', the SEC announced on Wednesday it directed Georgia and Tennessee to postpone their series with the Sooners.

www.espn.com

 

[DrTongue]

Bill Capece...ha ha!

 

[rpastir]

I totally get that, but I still think the on-field results need to matter. They just defeated a top 15 team with a third string QB. I’d rather see FSU get blown out than only assume they’d get blown out because Travis isn’t there.

This.

And now we’ll never know how the 2nd string QB would do against any of the other playoff teams because that committee decided they weren’t good enough….even though they won every game of a P5 conference schedule.