How will you feel about Stallings if
- Thread starter JS School
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What is expected? Some expect a single digit season with zero ACC wins. Some expect a low teens win total with up to 4 ACC wins. Which do we measure against in determining what is better than expected?
Let's pick something in between as the expectation--Say 11-12 total wins (with 1-2 ACC wins0). In that case, 13-15 total wins (with 3-4 ACC wins) would constitute slightly better than expected.
The above being said, personally, I won't feel any better about Stallings unless he finishes at least one game over 0.500 and Pitt is at least in consideration for an NIT bid.
Some people are saying this (not for this year but) for next year...
I'll feel better if we end up with 3-4 conference wins, perhaps a win in the conference tournament, and are generally trending upward at the end of the season. I'll be optimistic if we have identified 2-3 of the new guys as pieces we can build around moving forward. Its all about upward momentum at this point.
I don't think the outcome of this year will change my opinion at all. What matters is his next recruiting class and what he decides to keep from this roster. If anyone in this bunch shows some promise, and he adds a little talent to that, maybe there is cause for optimism.
As was said above, I don't think there's really much difference between failing spectacularly and finishing 0-18 as opposed to failing just mediocrely and being 4-14. Unless he pulls a Pastner and wins 7 ACC games, the season will still suck.
As was said above, I don't think there's really much difference between failing spectacularly and finishing 0-18 as opposed to failing just mediocrely and being 4-14. Unless he pulls a Pastner and wins 7 ACC games, the season will still suck.
For me, next year's standard is 19-20 wins.
You're a clown. When are you going to stand true to your promise of abandoning the program until Stallings is gone?
I know the consensus is that he's not a good Xs and Os coach. I'm willing to keep an open mind, and consider that the problems last year were mainly because of players he didn't recruit. This is his chance to sell me on his coaching ability. Looking at the non conference schedule, Pitt has 9 games at the Pete. They need to win every one except WVU. Even a bad ACC team should be able to handle these schools. Penn St should clean our clock, but Chambers is a bad coach, so you never know. At Navy, and Duquesne at PPG are the two wild cards.Any road game will be tough for us, and DeChellis is a pretty good coach, so I see this as a tossup. Duquesne's talent level looks to be about what it was last year, but they have a better coach now. They beat us last year, so I can't make this any better than a tossup. Pitt has a chance to win 10-11 games here. Anything less than 9 wins will indicate that the disaster scenario (0-1 ACC wins) will unfold. I don't see any road wins in ACC play, but I do see about 5 home games, where if we prove good enough to win 10 games in the non conference, we might be able to get wins. BC, GT, Cuse, NCST, and Wake. I guess Clemson could be a possible road win. If they could end up getting those 10 nonconference wins, along with 5 in ACC play, I'd be convinced that Stallings could do pretty well, provided recruiting picks up. Of course, if the NCAA crushes Louisville, and Miami, we might have a shot at another win or two.
A lot depends on what your expectations are. If you expect to have a coach who will surpass what Dixon did, Stallings has no chance. If instead, you are afraid that we may become anchored at the bottom of the league, and just want us to become competitive again, Stallings might be able to achieve that.
A lot depends on what your expectations are. If you expect to have a coach who will surpass what Dixon did, Stallings has no chance. If instead, you are afraid that we may become anchored at the bottom of the league, and just want us to become competitive again, Stallings might be able to achieve that.
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Right exactly where I stand. If he retains most of this roster and it seems like some of the guys are worthy acc players, I’ll be content
In terms of ACC games:
0-1 win is expected
If he wins 2-3, I'd feel like, ok whatever
If he wins 4, I'd feel somewhat good about him
If he wins 5, I'd be actually excited for next year
If he wins 6, he should be ACC COY.
It won't matter to me what he does this year. His recruiting so far has been mediocre, and that is being very complimentary to him by saying that. Frankly, his recruiting has sucked so far. He's going to have to get a few 4* and 5* guys in here next year for my opinion of his recruiting to improve. That's first.
Next, for this year to be somewhat successful, I'd have to see a winning season, 5 or 6 ACC wins, win most of the OOC games, and an NIT bid. This year. That isn't going to happen in anyone's wildest dreams. We'll be lucky to get out of the OOC with 5 wins.
Face it....we don't have a coach that could even be an assistant on Dixon's staff let alone be a head coach. It is impossible for him to approach any level of success that Dixon achieved, even in Dixon's worst years. But he's the coach and we're stuck with him until he leaves or is fired. Neither of those is happening any time soon. Lyke isn't paying attention.
Next, for this year to be somewhat successful, I'd have to see a winning season, 5 or 6 ACC wins, win most of the OOC games, and an NIT bid. This year. That isn't going to happen in anyone's wildest dreams. We'll be lucky to get out of the OOC with 5 wins.
Face it....we don't have a coach that could even be an assistant on Dixon's staff let alone be a head coach. It is impossible for him to approach any level of success that Dixon achieved, even in Dixon's worst years. But he's the coach and we're stuck with him until he leaves or is fired. Neither of those is happening any time soon. Lyke isn't paying attention.
We are going off of Jamie's horrible recruiting. He only left Stallings 2 ACC-level underclassmen (Johnson and Luther). You cant expect to win many games with 11 new players brought upon by the fact that you had to cut most of what was left you.
This is pretty much where I stand. Frankly the wins won't be there this year especially in the ACC.
More important to me is that some of the younger guys show talent and promise for developing and he gets a strong 2018 incoming class. Unfortunately, the 2018 class doesn't look to be strong as we have missed on a number of high end targets so I am not optimistic.
Hope I am wrong.
I agree....a rebuild was inevitable, especially when so many on the team left or were cut loose by Stallings. My contention is that with most any other head coach, we'd have more wins with THIS team than we will under Stallings. Maybe not 20+, like we have been accustomed to, but more than 5 or 6 total, which is what we're faced with.
So what is a reasonable "rebuild" time frame? It's basketball not football so we shouldn't be talking about 4 or 5 years. It would be a disappointment to me if a good veteran coach couldn't get a team to the tourney by year 3. It does not appear that we're on track to meet that expectation.
Year 1: should have made NCAAT, Dixon would have
Year 2: total new team, 100% the fault of Dixon, will suck bad
Year 3: contend for an NIT bid
Year 4: NCAAT
He would have gotten much more leeway if he didn't take a tournament team and then it into a bottom feeder.
Definitely true. If there were any fans out there that thought he might be the guy to move the program forward then he didn't do himself any favors with last season. Making the tourney last year would have pretty much guaranteed him being here through year 4. Now, i really can't see it if he doesn't make in in year three. You can argue that time line but when the current AD didn't make the hire i think that shortens the window.
I won't argue that. I certainly am not defending Stallings.
I am just saying that no matter who was the coach, a rebuild was going to happen so holding that new coach to the same standards Dixon was held to in years 10+ is obviously not fair and common sense.
I don't agree about NCAA tourney in year 3 for this situation. I think the Program was in tough shape when Stallings took over. I know many don't agree with that and as much as a I liked Dixon(best coach in Pitt history), I really think he left this program in bad shape talent wise at the underclass level.
Now, Stallings took a program in tough shape and sunk the ship instead of moving it forward.
Can he bring the sunken ship back to the surface any time soon? I don't have a lot of confidence that he can because frankly his recruiting has been no better and we don't seem to be landing impact kids.
The program was going to need a bit of rebuild, but it should not have been to this level.
Valid points but i think in the majority of P5 new coaching hires the tourney in year 3 is the expectation. Optics also plays a role. If you made the tourney the last time under the old head coach and haven't done so in 3 or 4 years with the new coach how is that going to play with recruits? They're not going to care/remember what Dixon did or didn't leave on his roster.
Agree not to this level but certainly more than "a bit of rebuild" also as you are phrasing it.
The way he went about the rebuild made things worse. The process he took with the rebuild was terrible, ie....not bringing in any of his own guys year 1, sticking with Dixon recruits only to push them out after year, not landing the top 100 recruits in 17 and so far in 18, etc...
We should have made the NIT with last years team.And looking back now that should have been the goal all along.Last years team making the NCAA was a pipedream.This years team making NIT is a pipedream.And if the ACC tournament is something you had to qualify for it would be a pipedream this year too....I don't expect much from this year, but we better see improvement next year for sure.
I can't believe that I've lowered myself to this level, but in all honesty, I've had hopes for some "moral" wins: playing the better teams tough enough so that they don't embarrass themselves or the university.
Bu then I start thinking that maybe if they do play horribly, that such a poor performance will embarrass the Administration enough that they'll take major steps to correct the problems.
Bu then I start thinking that maybe if they do play horribly, that such a poor performance will embarrass the Administration enough that they'll take major steps to correct the problems.
We're in total agreement here. Just want to see a few positive signs this year. They don't have to make the tournament next year, but the upward momentum will need to be very apparent. If they go from 9-10 wins this year, to 17-18 next year, with a trip to the NIT, and young guys leading the way, it would be beyond stupid to get rid of him then. Prospective coaches would be scratching their heads, and their mentors would be advising them to steer clear of the graveyard. If the team is 12-19, or something similar, it might be time to swallow hard, and eat the rest of his deal.
I think it’s safe to say just about everyone whose a Panther bb fan would’ve preferred either retaining JD or hiring someone other than KS . The problem with replacing KS if satisfactory progress isn’t made is whose going to make the decision on hiring the next HC ( another search firm ) and who’d want to take the job ? Firing entails a buyout and the revenue the bb program is ( or isn’t ) going to generate will surely handcuff Pitt in attracting any top candidates . Pitts in a pickle , they need KS to slowly ( because it’s not going to happen quickly ) build a competitive team over the course of his contract . He’ll be in his early sixties and ready to retire at the end of his contract . Then Pitt might have the cash and stability to attract a good candidate . Wishing for KS to fail will just guarantee more years of losing Pitt bb .
If the newcomers show flashes of potential and the team at least looks like they'll be competitive when they come together I'll have some faith that stallings can get some players and have a solid program in a few years.
What I don't wanna see is 10 games into their freshman years guys completely tuning him out. If nobody cares, this is gonna go further downhill than we ever thought possible. I really doubt it will get that bad though with a new group. Stallings does however need to be patient with these kids, this is not a senior led team anymore.
What I don't wanna see is 10 games into their freshman years guys completely tuning him out. If nobody cares, this is gonna go further downhill than we ever thought possible. I really doubt it will get that bad though with a new group. Stallings does however need to be patient with these kids, this is not a senior led team anymore.
I will readily admit I've been against Stallings from Day 1, but the clearest path for bringing this program back involves Stallings being successful. We all want the same thing, and I will happily eat crow if Stallings can turn this roster into a winner in the next 2 seasons (he won't get more than that to do it).
If Stallings can win 3 ACC games that will be exceeding expectations this year.
Only looney birds and JIGers believe that last year's team was a tournament team. It was stocked with Dixon garbage: 2 lazy egocentric players and 3 guys none of whom could shoot, a trademark of Dixon recruits. Dixon wouldn't know a div, 1 G if one bit him on the rump.
All good points. The only real and preferable options were keep Dixon or get someone other than Stallings, both preferable to what we have right now. But Stallings is here and we're stuck with him, at least for now. So we hopefully can scrape some wins together and get some recruits between now and the time he leaves, then hope again that someone with a pulse and who is a real ACC-level head coach will want to coach here. It will take the money and identifying the right coach.
Yes.......unless he has a great class lined up. A great 2019 gets him a 4th year no matter what.
Even if Stallngs would go undefeated and won the national championship I would despise him. The only time I will be happy for him is when he no longer is coaching Pitt basketball
I have never liked him even when he was at Vanderbilt. There is something about him that really rubs me the wrong way. Just a personal thing
I have zero expectations for this team this year. I mean, how could I? Only two have ever played D1 ball; one of which is a decent rotation guy, the other isn't. The others are totally unproven, and other than a few clips we've seen against junior competition, we've never seen them play.
What I'm hoping is that several of these guys show during the season that they are capable of playing at a high level in the ACC in a year or two. If they do that, even if they go winless in conference, I'll be encouraged going forward.
What I'm hoping is that several of these guys show during the season that they are capable of playing at a high level in the ACC in a year or two. If they do that, even if they go winless in conference, I'll be encouraged going forward.
