Keatts at NC State out
- Thread starter NC Panther
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Only an $8M buyout. Sounds like ours would be closer to $18M. Imagine that: extending a coach for having a great season while recognizing that it very well may have been an aberration, as his time in that position on the whole has been underwhelming. Way to go, ADHL.
It's wild to think that Miami was in the Final Four in 23 & NC State last year and now neither qualify for the ACC Tournament in a year when the ACC is ass.
UNC and NC St negotiated their contract extensions very well. Added years but didn't increase the buyout. There is talk that Capel's buyout drops significantly after next year so maybe she did the same?
Who do they hire? I think it's gotta be Will Wade. Guaranteed to be near the top of the ACC. Can they steal an SEC coach? Chris Beard?
And both coaches are now gone. I remember when people on here claimed they would gladly suffer through a few down years, if Dixon’s team made a final 4. Be careful what you wish for!
I remember a well known poster on this site (cough, cough, SMF, cough) who was touting Keatts as a replacement for Stallings back in the day. It appears that neither Keatts nor Capel are legitimate college head coaches. Maybe good assistants or in a lower division, but not at the ACC level.
while some of the last few years were fun and even this year early, I'd have an easy time choosing one over the other
| 2017–18 | NC State | 21–12 | 11–7 | T–3rd | NCAA Division I Round of 64 |
| 2018–19 | NC State | 24–12 | 9–9 | T–8th | NIT Quarterfinal |
| 2019–20 | NC State | 20–12 | 10–10 | T–6th | Postseason not held |
| 2020–21 | NC State | 14–11 | 9–8 | 9th | NIT Quarterfinal |
| 2021–22 | NC State | 11–21 | 4–16 | 15th | |
| 2022–23 | NC State | 23–11 | 12–8 | 6th | NCAA Division I Round of 64 |
| 2023–24 | NC State | 26–15 | 9–11 | 10th | NCAA Division I Final Four |
| 2024–25 | NC State | 12–19 | 5–15 | 16th | |
| NC State: | 151–113 (.572) | 69–84 (.451) |
| 2018–19 | Pittsburgh | 14–19 | 3–15 | T–14th | |
| 2019–20 | Pittsburgh | 16–17 | 6–14 | T–13th | |
| 2020–21 | Pittsburgh | 10–12 | 6–10 | 12th | |
| 2021–22 | Pittsburgh | 11–21 | 6–14 | T–11th | |
| 2022–23 | Pittsburgh | 24–12 | 14–6 | T–3rd | NCAA Division I Round of 32 |
| 2023–24 | Pittsburgh | 22–11 | 12–8 | 4th | |
| 2024–25 | Pittsburgh | 16–11 | 7–9 | ||
| Pittsburgh: | 113–103 (.523) | 54–76 (.415) | |||
| Total: | 275–213 (.564)* |
Definitely Keatts is a better coach than Capel. Their records show that. Keatts has done well in early years then in 22-23 and 23-24. Capel did well in 2 years with only 1 NCAAT. NCState went to 5 postseason tournaments under Keatts. Pitt went to 1 under Capel, and only into a qualifying game to get into the field. And Keatts is the one who got fired while Capel is still here. Makes no sense.
I haven't watched enough NCSt with Keatts to know if he's a good coach and being honest while I didn't think Capel was a good coach I thought his ability to identify and get good enough players that fit well and his team to play with confidence would/could overcome his actual poor X's and O's coaching
if he'd been able to keep this year rolling and not totally fumble it and been able to do nothing to adjust I'd think differently
I've said before I'm satisfied with just making the tournament as my bar so I will give him this, if he makes the ACCT run starting with ND and wins it I'd hold everything else against him but give him 2 more years for sure
Jeff Goodman said NC State's player payroll was about $2 million, which again gives you a very good idea of what we paid this season. About $2 million.
I think if Capel can get this Pitt team to actually win the ACCT, which means eventually beating Duke in all likelihood, he gets 2 more years. If not, he gets next year to get us back to the NCAAT or we cut him loose.
yes it does !!
I used 2 exclamation points so THERE
how about adding info to your position statement
I want Pitt to win ACC titles and compete in NCAA’s , but in todays game without the bankroll to get the players you need in the portal or one and done freshman it’s virtually impossible to do so . Sure on any given year you might get lucky with an under appreciated player like Bub , but to do it consistently no way .
Pitt could’ve never signed Bub if other coaches realized just good he was . Think if Blake had been healthy during his first three years of college ball Pitt could’ve signed a 6’8” bull who could shoot from half court …no way .
No one wants to give credit to the staff for finding these two players or Lowe , Ish or Zack . Pitt just can’t enough of these players and there’s only one reason in today’s game that I can think of .
No one wants to be realistic, but unless Pitt gets a whale or two to underwrite the Bb and Fb teams it won’t matter who the coach is they’ll continue to be mediocre . Maybe a great coach wins 1 or 2 more games , but beating the teams at the top of the NIL pyramid just isn’t in the cards .
Think Pitts staff didn’t want or knew they needed an established three point shooter and a great rebounder from the portal ?
Think Pitt wants to buyout either HC for millions when they play to empty seats and what desirable coach would choose to come to a school with an underfunded NIL ?
Pitts two revenue sports are just like the Pirates , they don’t have the bankroll to compete at the level we all want .
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How about if you’re a program like Pitt that can’t afford big buyouts you don’t ever, ever, give coaches huge contract extensions?
remind me where HCJC's contract ranks in the country and then let me know if the team finished the year near that same rank whether they get into the NCAAT
then do the same exercise for Duzz who at this point I'd say is closer to having earned his pay relative to rank and on field success yet still short
You can do your own calculations, but remember when Pitt was trying to find a Bb coach to replace KS Pitt was flailing in the wind .
There’s a zillion coaches that would take the money these guys make , but the question is are they the ones you really want ?
The real question is , is any college coach worth millions of dollars / yr !
yes, some are worth millions, just like some players are
UConn's Calhoun was worth his millions years ago, Dixon was worth his, there's many others back then and now
Jeff is not, Duzz is not either but closer to his contract in value
Well the went hard after Cam Corhen, so it certainly seems like they either had no idea they needed a great rebounder or they actually thought that Corhen would be that guy.
Don't know what they need or can't properly evaluate players, you decide which it was and which would be worse than the other.
The worst part about that is it’s not like Corhen was from some lower tier conference where you’re not sure how his rebounding will translate, the guy was from their own freaking conference where they could plainly see what he was.
Capel said his low rebounding numbers were because FSU switched 1 through 5
Capel has shown throughout his career he is incapable of any kind of serious X’s and O’s analysis. For him to state that is pure word salad and him basically hoping. Corhen’s rebouding numbers improved.
They did a pretty good job when they evaluated both Bub and Lowe and they got two guys who could play anywhere that none of the big boys wanted . They also did a pretty good job in picking up Blake . Let’s not forget Ish and Zack .
This years team with an excellent rebounder wins 4/5 more games with a marksman maybe 6 .
Maybe they did evaluate Cam incorrectly ,maybe they thought they’d get more out of him and more out of Papa , I can’t say , but I haven’t seen anything about the guys they wanted and struck out on .
I know everyone wants them to win and thinks that recruiting to Pitt should be easy . JD struggled finding players his last 5 yrs and JC has brought some talented guys in to a program that was all but dead in the water , some were problems , but the problem is not enough of them . With NIL selling your program got a lot harder if you’re without the cash to back it up .
Ps…No one , not even you are correct 100% of the time !
My proof is the talent on the roster . Show me the money and I’ll believe you and you can’t ..
Listen to Hurley on 60 minutes if you don’t believe it’s all about the money .
I read so many of these NIL tweets and articles, I feel I have a good grasp of it. Pitt's payroll is right in that $2 million neighborhood that is about the minimum these programs are asking for to compete. When PSU lost Micah Shrewbury, there was talk that to hire any decent coach, they needed to guarantee the players $2 million/year and it was said they accomplished that. And look at their players. A Pitt roster, A PSU roster, An NC State roster, those cost around $2 million give or take. Louisville is probably around $3 million. The SEC is around $3 million-$4 million mostly.
Lowe and Leggett were HIGHLY sought after and are paid very well. Corhen and Austin are also paid well but not at the level of those 2. Those 4 alone are in the ballpark of $1.5 million.
You don’t know , these numbers aren’t verified.
I’d like to hear from JC saying that he has sufficient support to field a tournament team .
of course JC can't say that, it would prove his 25th or so ranked salary is NOT worth it
so you understand that?
and yet you want to hear from JC
you are oddly obtuse with. your posts
And you’re in wonderland thinking that Pitt has enough money to compete with schools with highly active booster support . The proof is on the court and field . ( Pitt Fb which has more support than Bb is the home of 2&3* recruits )
What Pitt pays their coaches has nothing to do with their NIL funds .
The only thing I’ll agree with you is that both coaches are overpaid as are everybody who coaches at that level .
The numbers are never going to be verified but there's enough rumors from excellent sources to piece together what these teams are paying? How much do you think Pitt is paying? 250K for the entire roster? 500K?
what schools pay coaches can relate to what's paid in NIL and should correlate and set some bar of expectations even if they can't directly be school funded under current rules
stop being so simple and not understanding how they SHOULD be proportionate to make sense and if anything the NIL should be expected to make up for a lower paid coach who has deficiencies rather than expecting less of an overpaid coach's program success because of lower NIL available
unless you're just saying Pitt hasn't adapted yet due to the albatross placed by genius Lyke's lack of seeing what was happening with the entire FB and MBB world at the highest level
Actually, no one thinks that recruiting to Pitt should be easy. But most people think that Pitt should be able to recruit good enough players to make the tournament more often than once every seven seasons.
I mean we all know that YOU don't think that. You think that Pitt's situation is hopeless. But pretty much everyone else does.
Imagine Capel (or any other coach for that matter) saying "no, I have all the support and everything I need to make the tournament. I'd ask that you please ignore the fact that I didn't actually make it this year. Or last year. Or six of my seven years. But yeah, everything else is fine."
I have no idea, I just realize I have no idea .
Saying that I’m willing to guess that it’s not in the top tier of the ACC . A good guess would be in the middle and that’s exactly where they’re at .
Hopeless to be a national contender yes , hopeless to be a decent program that’s a borderline tournament team no .
The history of the past fifty years of Pitt Bb excellence was when the Golden Panthers were involved and the Howland early Dixon era the rest of those years mediocre best describes the program . Like it or not Pitt is not a historical excellent Bb school .
What don’t you get , Pitt doesn’t have the booster support and they’ve lost more than half of their season ticket holders . The damn place is empty .
You’re also confusing Pitt with schools who truly value excellence in sports , they seem to be more interested in being know for educational excellence…..imagine that !
