So this means you will no longer be posting here and will be taking your spectacular BB knowledge to the Bowling Green board? I am not sure how we will do with the loss.
Nelly Cummings carves up North Catholic
- Thread starter Drax1975
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So this means you will no longer be posting here and will be taking your spectacular BB knowledge to the Bowling Green board? I am not sure how we will do with the loss.
God, I wish Notre Dame would do that for us in football. They seemed to have missed the memo.
The only knock on the kid his his height. If he were 6'4 and the still 6th leading scorer in the history of the WPIAL, he'd have offers from everyone.
Both Indiana (Crean) and San Diego State (Fisher) had a lot of interest. Temple offered. Brandin Knight was down Midland's gym weekly. As I said, a few different people told me recruiting is like a game of chess. Especially with players like Nelly, who passes the eye test, but coaches can't get over the height. Knight said he wanted to offer Nelly to play for Pitt. This was last season. A day later, Dixon came down and watched practice for a few minutes. He went over to someone and asked how old Nelly was. After that, he left, and no offer came. Both Crean and Fisher had to be wondering why Pitt, who had this kid in their own backyard, wouldn't offer, so they backed off as well.
BK liked him cause he said Nelly reminded him alot of himself. Bowling Green had been great to him since the start, and it was close by so his family could watch, so he figured if BG was loyal to him, he'd return the favor.
If Dejuan Blair was 6'10" instead of 6'5", he would have been a lottery pick. But it doesn't make him a lottery pick. If TJ McConnell in HS was the size he was by the time he got to Arizona, he would have likely been recruited and played for Pitt. That is just the way it is.
I have no dog in this fight but the notion that Crean and Fisher didn't offer out of respect for letting the local team offer first is beyond dumb.
This is as cut throat a business as any in the world and that is certainly not going to happen especially in an industry where many times the first offers carries significant importance to the player getting the offer.
Any suggesting that to Cummings or telling that story is flat out delusional.
This is as cut throat a business as any in the world and that is certainly not going to happen especially in an industry where many times the first offers carries significant importance to the player getting the offer.
Any suggesting that to Cummings or telling that story is flat out delusional.
You need to limit the praise to "western PA." Better squads since then in towns like NY/Philly/DC, etc.
Kids today are bigger, faster, better conditioned, better shooters, better handles.
That's true about TJ and this board paid him no attention either, too small, the Dukes can have him, etc. What we're saying is don't turn your back on your back yard.
Best in the country buddy. The three seniors went on to star in the 1st Dapper Dan Classic, clubbing the U.S. Stars. The seniors, along with Yates from Uniontown went to tourneys up the East coast and kicked butt. You can be bigger and faster, but you do have to put the ball in the hoop. When you have a 6'7 forward who could shoot from all angles and dunk on you plus a guard who ended up in the pros running the show, then maybe you understand where I'm coming from.
VanLier did go to the courts of NY to see if he could compete, the rest is history. He was also a great baseball and football player.
It was or so I thought
ambridge had three payers go to Duke UNC and I think Purdue
No matter what advantage today no team in the Wpial since would have beaten them.
I'll stick by that.
Brashear with Clancy was pretty good. Of course, the only school to recruit better than Blackhawk and Midland was Farrell. Nothing like jobs in the mill as incentives.
Saw Brashesr play.
But not WPIAL
Farrrel had consistently outstanding teams ....but Ambridge
Wow.
You're right. The schools carrying the name of the town....whose dads were mill workers put out the ball players around WPA
You stating Midland recruited shows you have zero knowledge and just talk to hear yourself speak.
Lemme know who on that 1965 team that was recruited.
We'll be waiting quite a long time.
Don't let jealousy get in the way of truth.
I was too busy watching better ball in Philly. Remind me where Van Lier went to college. Seriously, I can't recall that one....great NBA player.
Well things didn't work out so well for Crean, as he was fired. If Knight loved him so much he would have offered from his current gig at Rutgers. Where is the SDSU offer?
I've never seen the kid play, but given his choices it would seem like you see things most D1 coaches don't.
And if you were busy watching better ball in Philly, it's because teams from this side of the state must've been playing.
As Ookie said, "Western Pennsylvania is football country, but my years are considered the golden era of basketball not only in the state but maybe the country. Uniontown, Midland, Schenley and Ambridge could play with anybody, anytime and in any era in the country."
I'll take his word over yours.
P5 coaches are blinded by height. I see a scorer and a leader.
Norm Van Lier was under recruited for being 6'1. So he went to St Francis (Pa). I'd say it turned out ok for him as he went on to be a 3 time NBA All-Star for the Bulls.
Kaufman, Wycek Devinzio, originally from Shaler, maybe this started the recruiting! Nobody would beat Midland, close like great Schenley teams, but not defeat.
Farrell not in same class as Midland, Ambridge, Schenley, Brashear. Eliminate WPIAL when referring to this great team, I said best anywhere and bring Alcindor if you wanted.
VanLier went to the same college as the late great Maurice Stokes. If you by some chance knew Wilt, should have asked him if he thought Norman was a great player.
VanLier was drafted by the KC Royals baseball, turned down football scholarships because back then schools frowned on black qbs, they wanted him for a defensive back so on to basketball career. Maybe you or some will learn a little bit if you keep watching.
This could quite possibly be the most off the rails, stupid thread on this board in a long, long time. And that is really saying alot.
You are wrong. Chuck DeVenzio was the HC at Springdale and his son was the star PG. Chuck moved to Ambridge and took the HC job there. That is when his son joined Ambridge.
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Dear Mr. Drax,
I wish Cummings and Lincoln Park all the best. I posted the following in 2009 and thought you might enjoy it.
Best regards
17-15
Norm Van Lier
I never met Norm Van Lier but we go way back, to around this time in 1965. My father and I would walk up our street and watch the WPIAL games at a neighbor's house on Channel 13. I didn't know it then, but we were there to comfort my father's friend, who had lost his own son to muscular dystrophy at the age of 16 just a couple years before. We would watch them all. Midland. Schenley. Uniontown.
The Midland Team of 1965 might have been the best team ever to come out of Western Pennsylvania. I really can't say. I watched them and they were great, but when I was eight years old I thought everyone was great. I used to watch a player named Walt Zinn play for our team, Churchill High. I thought he was Jerry Lucas. We called him Waldo. He played against the greats and near greats of our section, players like Cliff Parsons of Gateway, who was 6-10 and it turned out actually could play, 20 a game at the Air Force Academy, and Larry Johnson of Penn Hills who was about 6-9, 270 as I recall, and I don't know what happened to him. I was startled to find out a few years later that Waldo Zinn was the walk-on they cheered for in the final minutes on one of the great Duquesne teams of the late 1960s.
So I can't really rate the 1965 Midland team. But I can name just about all of them--Simmie Hill, Norm Van Lier, Brent Lake, Ron Brown. When the Steelers drafted Carnell Lake out of UCLA, I guessed right away that he was tied to the Midland Lakes, just like another Lake from Pitt days gone by, Herb Lake, from Youngstown. There were always the families up there in Beaver County. Lake. Samuels. Slappy. Lay. Still are.
For me, it was the 1971 Schenley team. The one with Ricky Coleman, Maurice Lucas, Jeep Kelley, Thomas Thornton and Jeffrey Matthews, in that order I might add. The one that came to our school, Taylor Allderdice, ran the court in warm-ups in floppy red hats and chanting "One-two-three, Schen-ley, Schen-ley", and then put down 151 points in a 32 minute game. But if you told me that the 1965 Midland team was better, I couldn't argue with you and I wouldn't want to try. They had two pros, and one of them, Norm Van Lier was a great one, and, when I was old enough to know, one of the best defensive guards who has ever played basketball. And now he is gone.
A partner of mine stopped by at work yesterday on something else, and when I told him Norm Van Lier had died he told me a story. My friend was the seventh man on a Springdale team in 1965 that, he tells me, lost to Midland by 20, but was down only 5 at the end of the third quarter, which I told him was pretty darn good. Many years later, my friend went to a sports banquet and Norm Van Lier was there. My friend went up to him and said, as people do, "I'm sure you don't remember me," and Van Lier looked at him and said "Springdale."
The reason that Springdale played Midland as close as it did was its coach, Chuck DeVenzio and his son, Dick. Most people remember Dick DeVenzio on the great Ambridge team of 1967, the one that dethroned Schenley, state champions of 1966, and the excellent Petey Gibson and the truly great Kenny Durrett, who, even after a serious knee injury, was the fourth pick in the 1971 NBA Draft. But, truth be told, Dick DeVenzio was a ringer on that Ambridge team. As great as it was, with not only DeVenzio, who played at Duke, but two other players who later started on Final Four teams, Dennis Wuycik of North Carolina and Frank Kaufmann of Purdue, who guarded Lew Alcindor in his last college game, the 1967 Ambridge team always will have an asterisk to me for that. I know this for certain not only because my friend told me yesterday but because I saw Dick DeVenzio play in person, for Springdale, at Churchill High School, against the great Waldo Zinn.
When I was eight years old, Norm Van Lier, Dick DeVenzio and Kenny Durrett were like gods to me. I didn't know they were just high school kids. And now they are all gone.
Posted on 2/28 10:01 AM | IP: 67.109.84.5
A few years back, Kenny Durrett was voted as the best Big 5 player, ever. Really nice guy, my kid brother had several classes with him....he showed up, too. Did a lot of good work with kids after coming home. BTW, the best Philly team in that poll was the 69 LaSalle team....Larry Cannon, Bernie Williams Fatty Taylor, Stan Wlodarczyk & Ken. 4 seniors & that soph from Pgh. Only loss was to the Gamecocks....Frank McGuire played stall ball, beat them by a couple.
Thanks for the post. Midland played Springdale in 1963. In 65 they played North Union, Gateway, Mt. Lebanon & Aliquippa in the WPIAL. Norman treated everybody alike, friend sports stars, made no difference, he was a great guy. Again thank you.
Minnie transferred to Eastern Michigan lol.
Sat out this year & can play this upcoming year.
Durrett, Gibson, Snowden, great team! Basketball was a great event back in the day, packed gyms, great players & coaches. If today's youth would have witnessed these games they would be in awe.
You should have seen Wilt Chamberlin go 28 for 32. And he was a terrible FT shooter.
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