New US News ranking

[CrazyPaco]

Pitt has to go full throttle on this in some way, because kids/parents use these rankings ALL the time, fair or not. Shoot - we did the same. That's not to say we didn't exercise due diligence beyond that, but many use this as a way of coming up with a list.

Which is exactly why I post this stuff. Pitt is not above the fray. It has to start gaming the rankings like other schools. It just is what is happening everywhere and these schools are passing, and have passed, Pitt. I know the previous provost thought Pitt was above doing these things. All that does is shoot yourself in the foot just like raising admission standards for athletes did in the 80s. It is dumb.

And alumni have to do their part, which is to give something every year. Giving or not giving something as small as $20 is a vote yes or no on their alma mater. ~87% of undergrad alumni are voting no. Think about that...87%.

 

[HailtoPitt]

Stop blaming the guidance counselors. Many of them have formed their opinions over decades, and Pitt rising in academic standing is relatively new by comparison. Pitt has a PR/perception problem and it is on Pitt to improve people's opinions. In fact, it should be part of the University's strategic plan or at least made more of a priority.

As an example, Pitt's neighbor CMU has the same issue. CMU is a very good school and has many highly ranked programs, including the world's #1 Computer Science program. But... many folks don't know this. Look at this press release from last year, where CMU's President introduced the strategic planning process, especially the following two paragraphs:

Critical to our future is how the University identifies and presents itself to the rest of the world in an increasingly competitive landscape for talent, resources and leadership. Recently, we announced a realignment of our University Marketing and Media Relations group to report directly to me as well as the initiation of a national search for a Vice President of Marketing and Communications. These are critical steps toward enhancing our reputation nationally and globally to match our extraordinary achievements.

As an important component of the Strategic Planning effort, I am also pleased to announce the launch of a Brand Development project. In partnership with the global branding and communications firm, Edelman, we will explore what makes Carnegie Mellon such a special place, how we perceive ourselves and how we are perceived by the world around us. The Brand Development project is not about changing our culture, creating new logos or launching advertising campaigns. Rather, it will be about taking our existing unique culture and strengths, and articulating them more powerfully and coherently to an increasingly global audience.
​

Pitt needs to engage in a similar endeavor. Perception is reality.

 

[CrazyPaco]

Stop blaming the guidance counselors. Many of them have formed their opinions over decades, and Pitt rising in academic standing is relatively new by comparison. Pitt has a PR/perception problem and it is on Pitt to improve people's opinions. In fact, it should be part of the University's strategic plan or at least made more of a priority.

Formed opinions over decades of doing what? How many schools does your typical guidance counselor have 1st hand knowledge of? How many different fields of study do they have first hand knowledge of? What training and upkeep do they have in higher education guidance? These are people with bachelors and masters degrees, typically in psychology or education, and giving advice on colleges to apply to is a small part of their job and they often turn to these rankings just like everyone else. Do you think they're even reading the Chronicle? At least the higher ed administrator surveys are for people that should know a lot more and have experience and knowledge of many schools and fields of study, even those have been exposed as a joke (google Florida peer survey). If people want to know where to go, they should talk to people actively engaged in the field they are interested in. If a student wants to become a guidance counselor, then they are perfect person to ask where to go and what to do.

That said, as you say, Pitt has to combat the ignorance and bias of your average guidance counselor with a plan. It's part of gaming these rankings, and that is what everyone else is doing. So yes, it is on Pitt to participate in gaming the ranking methodology that US News has invented out of their own whim. It's not like their methodology was derived as academic endeavor with appropriate researched justification for its development like some others with less notoriety have been, but that doesn't matter. You have to deal with the reality of the US News marketing machine.

 

[Darth_VadEER]

Do you even Chronicle, bro?

 

[CrazyPaco]

Do you even Chronicle, bro?

Do you mean read it?

Off and on. Myself and family and friends have been in higher ed as professors, researchers, instructors, and/or coaches for a long time, at all types of schools, all over the country. My colleagues and I are considerably better qualified to guide a typical high school student into any bio/health science field than any high school guidance counselor, and I have done so, including when participating in dozens of high school college fairs.

 

[pitt-girl]

Stop blaming the guidance counselors. Many of them have formed their opinions over decades, and Pitt rising in academic standing is relatively new by comparison. Pitt has a PR/perception problem and it is on Pitt to improve people's opinions. In fact, it should be part of the University's strategic plan or at least made more of a priority.

As an example, Pitt's neighbor CMU has the same issue. CMU is a very good school and has many highly ranked programs, including the world's #1 Computer Science program. But... many folks don't know this. Look at this press release from last year, where CMU's President introduced the strategic planning process, especially the following two paragraphs:

Critical to our future is how the University identifies and presents itself to the rest of the world in an increasingly competitive landscape for talent, resources and leadership. Recently, we announced a realignment of our University Marketing and Media Relations group to report directly to me as well as the initiation of a national search for a Vice President of Marketing and Communications. These are critical steps toward enhancing our reputation nationally and globally to match our extraordinary achievements.

As an important component of the Strategic Planning effort, I am also pleased to announce the launch of a Brand Development project. In partnership with the global branding and communications firm, Edelman, we will explore what makes Carnegie Mellon such a special place, how we perceive ourselves and how we are perceived by the world around us. The Brand Development project is not about changing our culture, creating new logos or launching advertising campaigns. Rather, it will be about taking our existing unique culture and strengths, and articulating them more powerfully and coherently to an increasingly global audience.
​

Pitt needs to engage in a similar endeavor. Perception is reality.

I agree it isn't all or even most of the problem, but the experience with our guidance counselor was real and true. And keep in mind this is at one of the highest rated school districts in the Pittsburgh suburbs who annually have kids accepted to the most prestigious universities and colleges in the nation. So yes, I can blame them. They need to DO THEIR JOB and exercise due diligence on these institutions, most especially within their own state! What a cop out to say that they aren't part of the problem! It's their JOB to know this, not rely on antiquated information or worse yet, perception. Shame on them.

 

[CrazyPaco]

I agree it isn't all or even most of the problem, but the experience with our guidance counselor was real and true. And keep in mind this is at one of the highest rated school districts in the Pittsburgh suburbs who annually have kids accepted to the most prestigious universities and colleges in the nation. So yes, I can blame them. They need to DO THEIR JOB and exercise due diligence on these institutions, most especially within their own state! What a cop out to say that they aren't part of the problem! It's their JOB to know this, not rely on antiquated information or worse yet, perception. Shame on them.

And they're giving potentially life changing advice to students based on, most of the time, absolutely nothing.

 

[HailtoPitt]

I agree it isn't all or even most of the problem, but the experience with our guidance counselor was real and true. And keep in mind this is at one of the highest rated school districts in the Pittsburgh suburbs who annually have kids accepted to the most prestigious universities and colleges in the nation. So yes, I can blame them. They need to DO THEIR JOB and exercise due diligence on these institutions, most especially within their own state! What a cop out to say that they aren't part of the problem! It's their JOB to know this, not rely on antiquated information or worse yet, perception. Shame on them.

True, it is their job, but mediocre guidance counselors aren't going away. Pitt needs to adapt, and not the other way around. Since the opinions of guidance counselors are now part of the ranking, and Pitt is not likely to change this new addition to the methodology, they need to think a bit creatively so that this does not continue to be a weakness.

I would hold a joint conference or information session with CMU inviting all high school guidance counselors in the area to come and hear about what the two schools have to offer, where each of their strengths are, and how both are collaborating to improve the region and world.

Also, I would invite all guidance counselors from Pitt and Penn State to the game next year, let them sit in their own section, and have a meet and greet before the game in a tent just for them. Do the same with WVU. Bill it as an opportunity for reps from each school to show them their value of each school. Pitt is doing this. Penn State is doing that. We have these new scholarships available. Our undergraduates are involved in this type of research. Etc. Etc.

All it takes is recognizing the problem, and then allocating resources towards solving it.

I would also survey guidance counselors and find out what their opinions are about Pitt. Consider that they might be right about certain things.