OT; Amazon Again

[bubba31]

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/w...fordable-metro-area-in-the-country-2017-11-16

I still do not think Pittsburgh will win these sweepstakes...but this news can only help

I suspect once announced there will be a top ten or top 25 finalists. While I did not think Pittsburgh would make the top 25, I am now thinking our showing may be better than originally expected.

Meaningless of course....but interesting debate

Bubba

 

[DiehardPanther]

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/w...fordable-metro-area-in-the-country-2017-11-16

I still do not think Pittsburgh will win these sweepstakes...but this news can only help

I suspect once announced there will be a top ten or top 25 finalists. While I did not think Pittsburgh would make the top 25, I am now thinking our showing may be better than originally expected.

Meaningless of course....but interesting debate

Bubba

Pittsburgh should be doing everything possible to bring Amazon here.

 

[Slick Manager of Champs]

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/w...fordable-metro-area-in-the-country-2017-11-16

I still do not think Pittsburgh will win these sweepstakes...but this news can only help

I suspect once announced there will be a top ten or top 25 finalists. While I did not think Pittsburgh would make the top 25, I am now thinking our showing may be better than originally expected.

Meaningless of course....but interesting debate

Bubba

stranger things have happened, who though Don Barden would get the casino licence with no equity? This might be closer than we think.

 

[Sarge25]

Pittsburgh should be doing everything possible to bring Amazon here.

The united states should be doing everything possible to put some restraints against amazon. Where are people supposed to work once all of the manual labor jobs have been replaced by robotics and automation? Why would you want to strengthen a company who’s goal is to close all brick and mortar stores?

 

[DiehardPanther]

The united states should be doing everything possible to put some restraints against amazon. Where are people supposed to work once all of the manual labor jobs have been replaced by robotics and automation? Why would you want to strengthen a company who’s goal is to close all brick and mortar stores?

It is 2017. You either adapt or else end up getting left behind.

 

[KennyTheKangaroo]

The united states should be doing everything possible to put some restraints against amazon. Where are people supposed to work once all of the manual labor jobs have been replaced by robotics and automation? Why would you want to strengthen a company who’s goal is to close all brick and mortar stores?

If that is amazon’s goal, why did they buy Whole Foods? Why are they experimenting with brick and mortar convenience stores?

 

[topdecktiger]

It is 2017. You either adapt or else end up getting left behind.

Problem is, in some situations there simply isn't a way to adapt.

 

[Sarge25]

It is 2017. You either adapt or else end up getting left behind.

lol adapt? Oh that’s right, with Bernie Sanders plan, everybody can go to college for free, and we won’t need laborers anymore.

 

[Sarge25]

If that is amazon’s goal, why did they buy Whole Foods? Why are they experimenting with brick and mortar convenience stores?

Because they have issues with people thinking you shouldn’t buy perishables online. Whole foods is a direct attack at Krogers and Walmart. They’re now attempting to become a drug wholesaler to go after Walgreens and CVS. Keep letting the beast grow and you’ll see.

 

[PittGuy2000]

Because they have issues with people thinking you shouldn’t buy perishables online. Whole foods is a direct attack at Krogers and Walmart. They’re now attempting to become a drug wholesaler to go after Walgreens and CVS. Keep letting the beast grow and you’ll see.

Man your argument is all over the place. Walgreens and CVS are Mom & Pop stores now?! What’s next - mean old Amazon going after a Wal-Mart? Cry me a river....

Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.

 

[Wagyu Beef]

If that is amazon’s goal, why did they buy Whole Foods? Why are they experimenting with brick and mortar convenience stores?

I saw Amazon going after Whole Foods as an attempt to get into the resturaunt supply business. Many small mom and pop resturaunts buy their food supplies at Sam's Club and pick it up themselves because it is cheaper than having it delivered by Sysco or GFS or whoever else. I think Amazon wants to get into that market which is why they bought Whole Foods

 

[Swervin27]

Amazon created the reality of me not having to go to the mall during Christmas season. for that alone I love them. no toys stores, no Southhills village in December, the greatest Christmas gift of all.

One day in the not so distant future shopping malls will disappear. They will be the blockbusters, I can't wait for that day. now we need some technology or company to make Walmart irrelevant

 

[BuffetParrothead]

[QUOTE="Sarge25, post: 2088946, member: 52028"]The united states should be doing everything possible to put some restraints against amazon. Where are people supposed to work once all of the manual labor jobs have been replaced by robotics and automation? Why would you want to strengthen a company who’s goal is to close all brick and mortar stores?[/QUOTE]

First off its not the governments job to get in the way of free enterprise and technology development. China and Russia do that stuff!

Not all functions can be automated but when they are people should upgrade their skills and move along with the automation by learning to program, maintain, and work with/support the automation. This actually results in a more developed work force and better paying jobs.

Instead alot of losers especially union losers will live in the past and keep trying to do the same old stuff and will be left behind!

Amazon put a large distribution center in the Lehigh Valley and they've employed alot of people. In fact there's a shortage of workers now so Amazon is moving people into the area, training them to support their automated operations! Fed X did the same thing.

 

[upj87]

I saw Amazon going after Whole Foods as an attempt to get into the resturaunt supply business. Many small mom and pop resturaunts buy their food supplies at Sam's Club and pick it up themselves because it is cheaper than having it delivered by Sysco or GFS or whoever else. I think Amazon wants to get into that market which is why they bought Whole Foods

I saw Amazon going after Whole Foods as an attempt to get into the overpriced organic hippie food business....and here I thought they were invincible. Now if you will excuse me I am off to Aldi followed by gray tuesday holiday specials at the dollar tree.....

 

[Swervin27]

This is a successful American company that has redefined the commerce industry. why are we rooting against them?

By the way, aren't they getting into the mail order prescription business? two things we love as Americans prescription pills and not having to leave our homes

 

[BuffetParrothead]

I saw Amazon going after Whole Foods as an attempt to get into the overpriced organic hippie food business....and here I thought they were invincible. Now if you will excuse me I am off to Aldi followed by gray tuesday holiday specials at the dollar tree.....

The organic food business is a scam.

We sell some products to the food industry.

A guy who I know who worked for a company that supplies Whole Foods and others said there's not enough growing/production capacity to supply the organic market so most "organic" foods are grow/produced just like other foods, with minor differences so the can be labeled organic.

Whole Foods got busted a few months ago for buying organic food from China that obviously wasnt organic but they were selling it as organic???????What a joke !

 

[upj87]

This is a successful American company that has redefined the commerce industry. why are we rooting against them?

I'm not...Quick story. Ordered an window AC unit on amazon to be delivered to my kid's house in South Oakland. Got it on prime but the wife wanted it delivered the day we arrived in August. Fed ex screwed up and delivered a day early. As hard as this is to believe, the unit was not on the porch and was stolen. Lots of back and forth with fed ex (their fault) they insisted my wife take the issues up with amazon. Not their fault I thought but was pissed enough to give it a try. Gave them the order number. Full immediate refund. Stuff like that makes you endeared to a company and root for them. It does bring to mind thought the burgeoning porch stealing business kicking into high gear. Anyone want to go in on a large porch lock box business? See I already came up with an idea to hire those folks replaced by automation.

 

[upj87]

The organic food business is a scam.

We sell some products to the food industry.

A guy who I know who worked for a company that supplies Whole Foods and others said there's not enough growing/production capacity to supply the organic market so most "organic" foods are grow/produced just like other foods, with minor differences so the can be labeled organic.

Whole Foods got busted a few months ago for buying organic food from China that obviously wasnt organic but they were selling it as organic???????What a joke !

yeah, Prager U (before it was found out to be evil and subversive by Youtube) had a great short video on the organics business..

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

This is sick, but I am so rooting for Amazon for two primary reasons.

a) I just built a new house in 2015. Nice brand new neighborhood. It would be the kind that would attract Amazon folks, and I would expect if and when I would sell, my house value would go threw the roof.

b) that kind of money and youth and people, could only help Pitt football and athletics.

 

[Swervin27]

This is sick, but I am so rooting for Amazon for two primary reasons.

a) I just built a new house in 2015. Nice brand new neighborhood. It would be the kind that would attract Amazon folks, and I would expect if and when I would sell, my house value would go threw the roof.

b) that kind of money and youth and people, could only help Pitt football and athletics.

im seriously missing the reason why people don't like this company? I love a good rant, a good conspiracy theory. please tell me what im missing? is there some belief that it will put the working man out of business? Is this an automation vs. American work force thing?

 

[Sarge25]

Man your argument is all over the place. Walgreens and CVS are Mom & Pop stores now?! What’s next - mean old Amazon going after a Wal-Mart? Cry me a river....

Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.

Brick and mortar stores does not mean mom and pop stores. You have no idea what Amazon is doing to Krogers, Wegmans, Meijer, Giant Eagle, HEB, Albertson’s, Publix and such.

 

[Sarge25]

im seriously missing the reason why people don't like this company? I love a good rant, a good conspiracy theory. please tell me what im missing? is there some belief that it will put the working man out of business? Is this an automation vs. American work force thing?

For me it is. You put 100 strip malls out of business which equals 10,000 jobs to employ 2 Amazon warehouses that employ 400. Where are those other 9,600 going to go to put food on their table? Will the usa let them starve? Of course not, the american taxpayer will be picking up the bill for them. Like it or not, there will always be a large % of americans who will be uneducated and rely on physical labor to provide for their families. You can’t eliminate their jobs by going overseas or allowing automation to take it all away.

 

[Slick Manager of Champs]

The organic food business is a scam.

We sell some products to the food industry.

A guy who I know who worked for a company that supplies Whole Foods and others said there's not enough growing/production capacity to supply the organic market so most "organic" foods are grow/produced just like other foods, with minor differences so the can be labeled organic.

Whole Foods got busted a few months ago for buying organic food from China that obviously wasnt organic but they were selling it as organic???????What a joke !

interesting fact: those chalkboards at whole foods that make you think their local fish monger just got the fish and wrote the price with chalk that morning......all those boards are from the corporate office. Nothing local or organic about them

 

[Swervin27]

For me it is. You put 100 strip malls out of business which equals 10,000 jobs to employ 2 Amazon warehouses that employ 400. Where are those other 9,600 going to go to put food on their table? Will the usa let them starve? Of course not, the american taxpayer will be picking up the bill for them. Like it or not, there will always be a large % of americans who will be uneducated and rely on physical labor to provide for their families. You can’t eliminate their jobs by going overseas or allowing automation to take it all away.

ok, I disagree sarge but thank you for at least making an argument. I mean it, at least now I see what the debate is.. I hate, HATE, HATE malls. if im at a mall, im in hell. single dad, two little kids, doing Christmas shopping is nightmare. Amazon fixed this for me so I have a warm spot in my heart for them..

I still haven't gone all in with buying clothes online. maybe for my kids, shirts, sweaters, etc but I cant do it for myself. I know if I do, i'll get them and they wont fit right. so for that, I still have to drag my sorry ass into a macy's and try on the pants. ill never buy my groceries online, that is something I don't ever see happening.

 

[BuffetParrothead]

interesting fact: those chalkboards at whole foods that make you think their local fish monger just got the fish and wrote the price with chalk that morning......all those boards are from the corporate office. Nothing local or organic about them

This guy I spoke to explained that without using the standard chemicals and fertilizers there's no productivity and growing things becomes a loss business.
So the growers grow the so called organic stuff just like everything else and make a slight change to call it organic.
There's are very few checks and balances in the organic food industry so they can call almosst anything organic.
Wait until some "watchdog" digs into this industry.

Here's another thing Kosher food. One of our product lines is food ingredients so a Rabbi would come to our plant to certify that we pass the Kosher test.
Noone could ever figure out what he was looking for? We didnt have a special production line for Kosher food. He inspected, he gave us a invoice, we paid the invoice and we got the Kosher ok and can put the K on the stuff just like that? Amazing all in the span of about 45 mins?

 

[upj87]

This guy I spoke to explained that without using the standard chemicals and fertilizers there's no productivity and growing things becomes a loss business.
So the growers grow the so called organic stuff just like everything else and make a slight change to call it organic.
There's are very few checks and balances in the organic food industry so they can call almosst anything organic.
Wait until some "watchdog" digs into this industry.

Here's another thing Kosher food. One of our product lines is food ingredients so a Rabbi would come to our plant to certify that we pass the Kosher test.
Noone could ever figure out what he was looking for? We didnt have a special production line for Kosher food. He inspected, he gave us a invoice, we paid the invoice and we got the Kosher ok just like that? Amazing all in the span of about 45 mins?

if the cast of Seinfeld can't figure it out I'm not surprised you struggle with it...

 

[Las Panteras]

Amazon potentially moving to Pittsburgh......

to the legitimacy of kosher food...

I love you guys.........

 

[MarshallGoldberg]

I don't have a problem with Amazon putting their headquarters wherever they want. I buy amazon stuff all the time. They seem to have some good goals for what they're looking for in a city -- a high quality airport, good public transit, an educated workforce, good universities, and so on. Things I believe in too.

I do have a problem with them asking for massive tax exemptions and free land deals to make it happen. Why should they get big special deals that no small business ever would?

 

[Swervin27]

I don't have a problem with Amazon putting their headquarters wherever they want. I buy amazon stuff all the time. They seem to have some good goals for what they're looking for in a city -- a high quality airport, good public transit, an educated workforce, good universities, and so on. Things I believe in too.

I do have a problem with them asking for massive tax exemptions and free land deals to make it happen. Why should they get big special deals that no small business ever would?

because they can offer more than a small business can. employment, tax revenue, etc.. It's really quite simple marshallgoldberg. They know what they bring and they are offering up their services to the highest bidder.

 

[MarshallGoldberg]

because they can offer more than a small business can. employment, tax revenue, etc.. It's really quite simple marshallgoldberg. They know what they bring and they are offering up their services to the highest bidder.

No offense, but I'm not an idiot. In a literal sense I understand the bargaining power they have.

What I meant was I think it's a shame the way large corporations and large sports teams play cities off each other to get corporate welfare. Really it should be one of those times were principled free market conservatives/libertarians can agree with progressives. Government should't be choosing winners and losers based a race to the bottom.

 

[upj87]

I don't have a problem with Amazon putting their headquarters wherever they want. I buy amazon stuff all the time. They seem to have some good goals for what they're looking for in a city -- a high quality airport, good public transit, an educated workforce, good universities, and so on. Things I believe in too.

I do have a problem with them asking for massive tax exemptions and free land deals to make it happen. Why should they get big special deals that no small business ever would?

Why should they get big special deals that no small business ever would?..............because they can so why not ask. Hiring tens of thousands local income tax payers kind of gives you that kind of sway.

 

[BuffetParrothead]

No offense, but I'm not an idiot. In a literal sense I understand the bargaining power they have.

What I meant was I think it's a shame the way large corporations and large sports teams play cities off each other to get corporate welfare. Really it should be one of those times were principled free market conservatives/libertarians can agree with progressives. Government should't be choosing winners and losers based a race to the bottom.

If you understand this fully its not Corp welfare.

One of my jobs over the years was to find places to locate our mfg plants so I did alot of this stuff.

The Corps do get tax breaks for hiring and mantaining a specified minimum number of employees for each year of the deal.

What alot of people dont realize is the additional boost to the local economy related to that facility and the new employees like:
- maintenance spending for the plant & equipment
- purchasing of equipment /parts, office supplies, etc
- outside services from local companies for all sorts of things related to the plant and office
-employee spending for simple things like food
-company sponsored meeting, diners, lunches etc which reguire local catering
-spending at local hotels for business guests
-more traffic for the local airport

This list of local added spending goes on and on not to mention the employees now have more disposable income to spend locally.

It turns out to be a win, win for the Corp and the locality!

 

[MarshallGoldberg]

It could be a win without saying "ok you don't have to pay your taxes" to company X and then say "ok but you do" to company Y then we all somehow are shocked when company X becomes too big to fail or takes up monopolistic pricing schemes.

 

[Mikefln]

No one is debating that Amazon has that power and they provide great benefit. The question is what is a law supposed to be and how is it to be enforced. The way it is supposed to work is 1 law covers everyone in that jurisdiction. I understand that is not how it works but that is how it is supposed to work.

 

[Saboteur]

I don't have a problem with Amazon putting their headquarters wherever they want. I buy amazon stuff all the time. They seem to have some good goals for what they're looking for in a city -- a high quality airport, good public transit, an educated workforce, good universities, and so on. Things I believe in too.

I do have a problem with them asking for massive tax exemptions and free land deals to make it happen. Why should they get big special deals that no small business ever would?

I don't think they care what people think about them just so long as you buy from them.
Money talks.

 

[Swervin27]

No one is debating that Amazon has that power and they provide great benefit. The question is what is a law supposed to be and how is it to be enforced. The way it is supposed to work is 1 law covers everyone in that jurisdiction. I understand that is not how it works but that is how it is supposed to work.

what laws are you talking about? is there a law that states a county, city, town cant offer incentives to companies?

 

[Mikefln]

what laws are you talking about? is there a law that states a county, city, town cant offer incentives to companies?

A tax on one person/entity should be a tax on all people/entities for the purpose of the tax. So if there is a property tax then everyone should have it not a few select getting exempt.

 

[MarshallGoldberg]

I am surprised some of the economic conservatives on this board seem to be pretty comfortable with the idea of more of the coercive state being seized by a few corporations (like the infamous Goldman Sachs problem.) Amazon just got a contract to do the new cloud for the department of defense. At what point is the state and private enterprise too intertwined?

Ideals aside, the devil is in the details too.

There is a pretty big difference practically between smaller incentives that help seal a deal and the sort of massive offer that Wisconsin made to Foxconn, where the state wouldn't break even on the other revenue generated by that company until at least 2044 if Foxconn is telling the truth about how big they would be -- and possibly well into the 22nd century if they are overselling the down the supply chain job growth.

 

[President Stache]

Because they have issues with people thinking you shouldn’t buy perishables online. Whole foods is a direct attack at Krogers and Walmart. They’re now attempting to become a drug wholesaler to go after Walgreens and CVS. Keep letting the beast grow and you’ll see.

GOOOOOOODDDD. Walmart is the one that started the decline of the US. They unabashedly bought everything from China and low social-economical areas and pushed out most every US supplier

 

[upj87]

I am surprised some of the economic conservatives on this board seem to be pretty comfortable with the idea of more of the coercive state being seized by a few corporations (like the infamous Goldman Sachs problem.) Amazon just got a contract to do the new cloud for the department of defense. At what point is the state and private enterprise too intertwined?

Ideals aside, the devil is in the details too.

There is a pretty big difference practically between smaller incentives that help seal a deal and the sort of massive offer that Wisconsin made to Foxconn, where the state wouldn't break even on the other revenue generated by that company until at least 2044 if Foxconn is telling the truth about how big they would be -- and possibly well into the 22nd century if they are overselling the down the supply chain job growth.

Amazon just got a contract to do the new cloud for the department of defense.........are they good at it and was it bid out legally? Economic conservative are on board with the government contracting to buy ford or chevy vehicles for the DOD so I'm not sure why they would have a problem here..