OT: For Those Who Saw Endgame

[pitt-girl]

Valkyrie in the comics is Bisexual as well.

the Carol Danvers Captain Marvel is straight, however the romantic side of her character isn't really a major part. She sort of had a thing for Mar-Vel, who in the comics was a man (played by Annette Benning in the movie), but ultimately there isnt a notable romantic plot to her stories for the most part.

They could certainly make a change from the comics, but I actually don't expect it. I would say she is likely to just be sort of what she is in the comics, and thats just not really romantically linked at all.

Going out on a HUGE limb here (and I never read the comics), but I'm wondering if they aren't setting up a relationship with her friend who has a daughter that I think may become part of the Universe in some way. (Sorry for the lack of names but I can't remember off the top of my head).

Like I said, I could be ALL wrong here. It's just a gut feel I had watching the Captain Marvel movie.

 

[h2p012]

I quit reading the comic books long before Black Widow showed up so maybe I missed stuff in the published history. But, there was always a strong emotional undertone/history between Natasha and Barton. I was surprised when Barton semi-retired and was shown as married with children.

There was no romantic relationship in the movies between the Black Widow and Hulk. She was just the "Hulk-whisperer" who could "sooth the savage beast" when he was out of control.

In fact, she had virtually the same effect in bringing Barton back from executing the Yakuza.

in Age of Ultron, the major reason why she was the "hulk-whisperer" was due to Banners feelings for Natasha. While those feelings may have never manifested into an actual relationship, Age of Ultron did go to great lengths to show the emotional connection between the two, especially on Banner's end. Which would make Banner sacrificing Natasha make sense.

While the first avengers hinted at a past between Barton and Natasha, it never suggested that their relationship was anything more than friendly coworkers reminiscing about "budapest" The introduction of Barton's wife and kids puts to bed any sort of romantic connection the two had. Especially considering how old the children were; Its very clear Barton and his wife were together for quite some time.

Now, if you want to get technical, with his family dead, you could argue that Natasha's friendship is the thing that he still has that he loves the most, and I could agree with that. The whole "great love" rule is clearly not bound by romantic love. The big problem then falls with the 2nd requirement for the Soul Stone. The sacrifice. Barton emphatically and undeniably did not sacrifice Natasha. He did not make the choice to give her up. He actively fought against her sacrifice, which flys in the face of the rules set forth.

 

[h2p012]

Going out on a HUGE limb here (and I never read the comics), but I'm wondering if they aren't setting up a relationship with her friend who has a daughter that I think may become part of the Universe in some way. (Sorry for the lack of names but I can't remember off the top of my head).

Like I said, I could be ALL wrong here. It's just a gut feel I had watching the Captain Marvel movie.

I don't think it would be a romantic thing between them. Her daughter actually becomes a Superhero as well. She was actually called Captain Marvel for awhile before her name got changed. Changed a couple of times I think.

I guess they could make something out between the mother and her, put like I said I dont think so. I think Captain Marvel 2 is going to be closer to the present day MCU than the first, and that time jump would put a big dent in any sort of relationship between the two.

 

[pitt-girl]

I don't think it would be a romantic thing between them. Her daughter actually becomes a Superhero as well. She was actually called Captain Marvel for awhile before her name got changed. Changed a couple of times I think.

I guess they could make something out between the mother and her, put like I said I dont think so. I think Captain Marvel 2 is going to be closer to the present day MCU than the first, and that time jump would put a big dent in any sort of relationship between the two.

Yeah - sounds reasonable. It was just an undertone I picked up on.

 

[DruidTM]

Ant Mans daughter also I believe will have a super hero future...

And of course I believe if you are in Mile Morales world Peter Parker is gone by that point too

There’s a ton of directions Marvel could take if they do choose

 

[h2p012]

Ant Mans daughter also I believe will have a super hero future...

And of course I believe if you are in Mile Morales world Peter Parker is gone by that point too

There’s a ton of directions Marvel could take if they do choose

Clint Bartons daughter too. Thats what his Disney+ series is likely going to be, Him teaching his daughter to be a hero.

Vision and Wanda's son (not yet in the MCU) becomes an insanely powerful hero.

I am a little surprised that they introduced a daughter to Tony and Pepper. When they talked about having a daughter in Infinity War I would have guessed they would have adopted Riri, who essentially replaces Ironman. Especially now that Iron man is gone, having Ironheart replace him would of made all the sense in the world.

I was a little surprised they went straight for Peter Parker. I kind of expected them to just start with Miles.

The problem with introducing more of the Spider-Man universe is that Sony still owns the rights. They have a deal in place to work with Marvel, but the vast majority of the Spider-Man universe isn't able to be in the MCU. I would assume that prevents Miles Morales from entering the MCU. Especially with the Spiderverse movie being Miles-Focused. Sony might want to hang onto him.

 

[steelcurtain55.]

Questions... When Loki took the tesserect how did they get it back? And where is Loki?

How was thanos able to hold Thor's hammer? I get captain America being able to hold because he proved he was worthy, but I don't understand thanos...

The movie showed just how powerful thanos was.

Very entertaining movie, but I left the movie with an empty feeling.

 

[h2p012]

Questions... When Loki took the tesserect how did they get it back? And where is Loki?

How was thanos able to hold Thor's hammer? I get captain America being able to hold because he proved he was worthy, but I don't understand thanos...

The movie showed just how powerful thanos was.

Very entertaining movie, but I left the movie with an empty feeling.

They didnt get that tesseract back, they went further back in time to 1970 when they knew its location.

That particular 2012 Loki is kinda just out there. Like the 2014 gamora. Both are alive, but they aren't the versions we know of.

 

[passedout]

Questions... When Loki took the tesserect how did they get it back? And where is Loki?

How was thanos able to hold Thor's hammer? I get captain America being able to hold because he proved he was worthy, but I don't understand thanos...

The movie showed just how powerful thanos was.

Very entertaining movie, but I left the movie with an empty feeling.

I had the same empty feeling... mostly in my wallet. Superhero movies are not my cup of anything, IMO they are horribly over-acted and cheesy. I don't have FPP (Fantasy Prone Personality) and prefer my fiction based on reality rather than dream worlds. That's just me though...to each their own. I give it a C-, Brie Larson was ok to look at the 2 minutes she appeared in the film.

 

[pitt-girl]

I had the same empty feeling... mostly in my wallet. Superhero movies are not my cup of anything, IMO they are horribly over-acted and cheesy. I don't have FPP (Fantasy Prone Personality) and prefer my fiction based on reality rather than dream worlds. That's just me though...to each their own. I give it a C-, Brie Larson was ok to look at the 2 minutes she appeared in the film.

Well you're no fun.

 

[Fk_Pitt]

Questions... When Loki took the tesserect how did they get it back? And where is Loki?

How was thanos able to hold Thor's hammer? I get captain America being able to hold because he proved he was worthy, but I don't understand thanos...

The movie showed just how powerful thanos was.

Very entertaining movie, but I left the movie with an empty feeling.

Stormbreaker does not require the “worthiness” that the hammer required. It’s why Thor was able to use stormbreaker to open bottles of beer. I had the same question after watching the movie a 2nd time this afternoon, and my son set me straight.

And we all liked the movie much more the 2nd time.

One thing I picked up on that I wouldn’t have the 1st time...just before Tony Stark gets all the stones and performs the snap, Dr Strange looks at him and holds up the number 1, as if to tell Tony that this is the 1 only way they win.

 

[PosterToBeNamedLater]

Stormbreaker does not require the “worthiness” that the hammer required. It’s why Thor was able to use stormbreaker to open bottles of beer. I had the same question after watching the movie a 2nd time this afternoon, and my son set me straight.

And we all liked the movie much more the 2nd time.

One thing I picked up on that I wouldn’t have the 1st time...just before Tony Stark gets all the stones and performs the snap, Dr Strange looks at him and holds up the number 1, as if to tell Tony that this is the 1 only way they win.

I had assumed that’s what they meant in that scene.... but I thought it was strange that tony knew he had to know swap the stark gauntlet with his own hand. I assumed that it was his tech so he could swap them but I wasn’t sure

 

[Fk_Pitt]

Questions... When Loki took the tesserect how did they get it back? And where is Loki?
.

I think someone may have said it here, but Loki is lurking somewhere, and that scene from endgame may be the reason Disney will have the streaming Loki series on their platform.

 

[Alan Partridge]

I thoroughly enjoyed it. I thought 'Dear Mr. Fantasy' as the musical intro was genius.

Seeing Hawkeye lose his entire family immediately post-snap was rough and now an understandable decision why he was entirely left out of Infinity War.

Only loose thread for me was what becomes of Vision. Do they make the pale white version like the comics based on what Suri was able to download of him from the last movie or more time travel hijinks to bring him back. I guess the upcoming TV show will clarify that one.

 

[h2p012]

I thoroughly enjoyed it. I thought 'Dear Mr. Fantasy' as the musical intro was genius.

Seeing Hawkeye lose his entire family immediately post-snap was rough and now an understandable decision why he was entirely left out of Infinity War.

Only loose thread for me was what becomes of Vision. Do they make the pale white version like the comics based on what Suri was able to download of him from the last movie or more time travel hijinks to bring him back. I guess the upcoming TV show will clarify that one.

reportedly that TV series is going to be set in the 50s, so who knows.

 

[WeaverIsComing]

I would have loved to see Banner give that stone back to that time lady. Captain Marvel needs a watch, she always seems to show up a few minutes late. Haven't seen her solo movie. The cast quarrel is amusing, but the MCU doesn't need to turn into the Steelers locker room.

 

[passedout]

Well you're no fun.

lol .... I beg to differ. I made fun of the movie the whole way through and had people in the rows in front and back of me in stitches.

 

[pitt-girl]

I would have loved to see Banner give that stone back to that time lady. Captain Marvel needs a watch, she always seems to show up a few minutes late. Haven't seen her solo movie. The cast quarrel is amusing, but the MCU doesn't need to turn into the Steelers locker room.

That reminds me - I was very surprised the Ancient One gave up the time stone so easily.

 

[PosterToBeNamedLater]

That reminds me - I was very surprised the Ancient One gave up the time stone so easily.

I don’t think she gave it up easily. I think the moment that Hulk mentions Strange gave it up she understood that if he had given it up.... it was intended for her to give it up when they came to get it. Only 1 out of 14 millions

 

[h2p012]

That reminds me - I was very surprised the Ancient One gave up the time stone so easily.

She only did so after banner bringing up strange. I think they used that moment to sort of prop up Strange and his place as Sorcerer Supreme, because in the Dr. Strange movie she makes it pretty clear she couldn't see past the moment of her death despite her trying to.

She gives up the stone as a way of showing how much she trusts him, sort of indirectly give him a little more sway moving forward in the MCU.

 

[BIGPanther]

Loved it - thought it was very well done. Was not my favorite MCU film, but wow - there was so much going on there, can't wait to see it again. I disagree with the whining about "plot holes", which aren't really plot holes, but rather complaining that the movie didn't do what they would have done. But we're talking about a $1B+ opening, so it would seem they know what they're doing more than us internet critics.

 

[h2p012]

Loved it - thought it was very well done. Was not my favorite MCU film, but wow - there was so much going on there, can't wait to see it again. I disagree with the whining about "plot holes", which aren't really plot holes, but rather complaining that the movie didn't do what they would have done. But we're talking about a $1B+ opening, so it would seem they know what they're doing more than us internet critics.

Can you explain how the vormir scene isnt a plot hole?

A film can have issues and still be good. No one here is saying they disliked it, just pointing out it's got some very notable problems.

Liking a film, and criticizing specific portions are not mutually exclusive actions.

 

[BIGPanther]

Can you explain how the vormir scene isnt a plot hole?

A film can have issues and still be good. No one here is saying they disliked it, just pointing out it's got some very notable problems.

Liking a film, and criticizing specific portions are not mutually exclusive actions.

Normally, it's incumbent on the person making a statement to prove it is correct, and not on another to disprove it - but as I have seen your other posts, here is my position - the two "rules" you set forth are incorrect.

• Red Skull simply says you must lose that which you love. He never says the thing you love most. As friends and fellow Avengers, there is no doubt love between them.
  
  
• Red Skull also says "a sacrifice", a soul for a soul. Your second rule creates additional restrictions that were not there in the movie. He does not state that you must sacrifice someone else. Personal, self-sacrifice for the greater good of a cause or others is also a sacrifice.

 

[h2p012]

Normally, it's incumbent on the person making a statement to prove it is correct, and not on another to disprove it - but as I have seen your other posts, here is my position - the two "rules" you set forth are incorrect.

• Red Skull simply says you must lose that which you love. He never says the thing you love most. As friends and fellow Avengers, there is no doubt love between them.
  
  
• Red Skull also says "a sacrifice", a soul for a soul. Your second rule creates additional restrictions that were not there in the movie. He does not state that you must sacrifice someone else. Personal, self-sacrifice for the greater good of a cause or others is also a sacrifice.

You can "love" many things. Losing one of many isn't a sacrifice, which Red Skull plainly states what is needed.
As Before I can agree that if you consider his family doesn't count, as they are already dead, I can agree of the love between the two, as it is clear that Romantic love isnt a requirement. I've said that in a post before.

But the sacrifice, is absolutely undeniably a requirement. Its giving up something. Not only does the Red Skull say that its required, but at the very end of Infinity War, Young Gamora hammers home the importance of the sacrifice when she asks Thanos about it.

The line Redskull uses in Infinity War is " To Ensure whoever possesses it understands it power, the stone demands a sacrifice"

That means Self Sacrifice wouldn't work. As the person who is willingly sacrificing themselves can't acquire the stone themselves. They're dead. By the exact words Red SKull used, the person who is doing the sacrificing would be the one who was deemed to understand its power. Not some other person sitting there watching everything going down.

While personally I dont agree with the "love" between them, I can agree that it COULD pass the test. The 2nd half absolutely and undeniably does not. Self Sacrifice just wouldn't work.

Barton did NOT want Natasha to die. He wouldn't have been deemed worthy to possess the stone. He would have been witness to a suicide.

 

[Ski11585]

Finally saw it. Loved it. Lots to digest.

 

[DT_PITT]

While I absolutely loved the movie and thought it was extremely well done while concluding the series well ... a couple days later I did start coming up with a HUGE plot hole that has caused problems for me.

This plot hole has nothing to do with time travel which is all so within the fantasy realm that I’m ok with whatever happens.

Instead, I realized that they doubled the same earth’s population in an instant which would have have been absolutely devastating. Over the previous five years, losing half of the population would have been devastating on its own, probably much more than was shown in the movie. But to return everyone five years later would have completely broken every social system that existed. The biggest problem would have been that their would have been no food or water to accommodate this new population. Something near the amount of people restored would have died within weeks.

I’m not sure this issue causes me to like to movie any less (as the whole thing is a fantasy anyway) but I couldn’t dismiss it regardless.

 

[h2p012]

While I absolutely loved the movie and thought it was extremely well done while concluding the series well ... a couple days later I did start coming up with a HUGE plot hole that has caused problems for me.

This plot hole has nothing to do with time travel which is all so within the fantasy realm that I’m ok with whatever happens.

Instead, I realized that they doubled the same earth’s population in an instant which would have have been absolutely devastating. Over the previous five years, losing half of the population would have been devastating on its own, probably much more than was shown in the movie. But to return everyone five years later would have completely broken every social system that existed. The biggest problem would have been that their would have been no food or water to accommodate this new population. Something near the amount of people restored would have died within weeks.

I’m not sure this issue causes me to like to movie any less (as the whole thing is a fantasy anyway) but I couldn’t dismiss it regardless.

there was actually a study done after infinity war (i cant seem to remember where i saw it off the top of my head) that actually concluded that even by eliminating half the population, Earth was doomed. Because it didnt just eliminate half the Human population, but animals, bugs, etc etc. Essentially it would cause a chain reaction that would lead to the world effectively starving itself.

But you do bring up a pretty big point, unforseen ramifications of coming back instantly. You came back where you where "snapped"... what if you were on a plane during it?

 

[pitt-girl]

there was actually a study done after infinity war (i cant seem to remember where i saw it off the top of my head) that actually concluded that even by eliminating half the population, Earth was doomed. Because it didnt just eliminate half the Human population, but animals, bugs, etc etc. Essentially it would cause a chain reaction that would lead to the world effectively starving itself.

But you do bring up a pretty big point, unforseen ramifications of coming back instantly. You came back where you where "snapped"... what if you were on a plane during it?

Yikes. I think when it comes to this, you can "over think" a movie.

 

[steelcurtain55.]

Wouldn't mind seeing "origin" films of

• Thanos
• Thor/Odin
• Sorcerers Supreme

 

[pitt-girl]

While I absolutely loved the movie and thought it was extremely well done while concluding the series well ... a couple days later I did start coming up with a HUGE plot hole that has caused problems for me.

This plot hole has nothing to do with time travel which is all so within the fantasy realm that I’m ok with whatever happens.

Instead, I realized that they doubled the same earth’s population in an instant which would have have been absolutely devastating. Over the previous five years, losing half of the population would have been devastating on its own, probably much more than was shown in the movie. But to return everyone five years later would have completely broken every social system that existed. The biggest problem would have been that their would have been no food or water to accommodate this new population. Something near the amount of people restored would have died within weeks.

I’m not sure this issue causes me to like to movie any less (as the whole thing is a fantasy anyway) but I couldn’t dismiss it regardless.

Just my $.02 but I think you should stop over analyzing it. I've done it and it's irksome, but not every movie makes complete sense especially these movies. Enjoy it for what's worth?

 

[DT_PITT]

Just my $.02 but I think you should stop over analyzing it. I've done it and it's irksome, but not every movie makes complete sense especially these movies. Enjoy it for what's worth?

I hear you. Like I said ... I enjoyed it very much.

 

[pitt-girl]

I hear you. Like I said ... I enjoyed it very much.

When I get the chance I look forward to seeing it again. I have been known to see a movie in the theaters more than once, but rare. This is repeat viewing.

 

[h2p012]

Wouldn't mind seeing "origin" films of

• Thanos
• Thor/Odin
• Sorcerers Supreme

We might actually be getting something of a Thanos origin film. One of the phase 4 movies they are making are an Eternals movie, which is what Thanos is. Angelina Jolie is in it.
https://www.cnet.com/news/marvels-eternals-movie-with-angelina-jolie-explained/

 

[Fk_Pitt]

While I absolutely loved the movie and thought it was extremely well done while concluding the series well ... a couple days later I did start coming up with a HUGE plot hole that has caused problems for me.

This plot hole has nothing to do with time travel which is all so within the fantasy realm that I’m ok with whatever happens.

Instead, I realized that they doubled the same earth’s population in an instant which would have have been absolutely devastating. Over the previous five years, losing half of the population would have been devastating on its own, probably much more than was shown in the movie. But to return everyone five years later would have completely broken every social system that existed. The biggest problem would have been that their would have been no food or water to accommodate this new population. Something near the amount of people restored would have died within weeks.

I’m not sure this issue causes me to like to movie any less (as the whole thing is a fantasy anyway) but I couldn’t dismiss it regardless.

Very good points. Never thought of that. That’s certainly the biggest plot hole of many. At this point, there are too many to count. But still a lot of fun.