OT Jake Guentzel

[pittbb80]

Interesting article. Do the Pens sign him or trade him. Dubas is going to have to make a heck of a trade to get a younger player that has enough talent to get Sid on Board it looks like he may be able to create a bidding war and get great value but does it end up making the team less competitive short term ?

Jake probably could get more as a FA. So does he take below market value to play with Sid or does he go Fa or force a trade ?

Looks like this will be Dubas first big test

Kaplan's latest NHL buzz: Guentzel's future, Gauthier trade among hot topics

We're less than two months away from the trade deadline, and there are plenty of intriguing storylines around the league, including the latest on Cutter Gauthier and what happens with Jake Guentzel in Pittsburgh.

www.espn.com

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

William Nylander just signed an 8 year, $92 million contract. $11.5 million per season.

If Guentzel wants as much money as he can get, or anything close to it, the Penguins can't afford him.

 

[ratking17]

Sid will decide if Jake gets traded or not.

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

Sid will decide if Jake gets traded or not.

At one time that would have been 100% true. And even though Sid is still very good I don’t know that he wields that much power any more. His end is near.

His opinion will have some weight, but I don’t think it’s as clear cut as you’re saying. If they can’t sign him they have to move him if they can get a good return.

 

[Dan1911]

I'd trade him and add young talent. If he was that committed to staying, he would have gotten an extension done already. He wants free agency and a big payday. He's entitled. But that also.means the Pens likely lose him for nothing in the off-season. Trade him and bid for his services in the off-season. A perfect hedge. If he signs, you rented him out for young talent. If he doesn't sign, you wouldn't have afforded him anyway and would have lost him and got nothing.

 

[Millerton24]

Trade him and start building for life after Sid. It's about championships. Pens aren't winning any championships anytime soon with the way they are constructed and they are up against salary cap. Turn the page Dubas

 

[Fk_Pitt]

William Nylander just signed an 8 year, $92 million contract. $11.5 million per season.

If Guentzel wants as much money as he can get, or anything close to it, the Penguins can't afford him.

And why wouldn’t he, right? This is biggest contract he will sign in his lifetime. Time to cash in.

 

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

We haven't won a playoff series with Jake in over 4 years. Great player. But this franchise has traded Recchi, Coffey, Nedved, Jagr, Kovalev, Cullen, etc....etc....

Sometimes you got to give to get.

 

[pittbb80]

And why wouldn’t he, right? This is biggest contract he will sign in his lifetime. Time to cash in.

Agreed which is why I think Dubas will trade him.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

And why wouldn’t he, right? This is biggest contract he will sign in his lifetime. Time to cash in.

Yeah, I certainly do not begrudge him looking for as big a payday as he can get. And he isn't going to get that in Pittsburgh.

All you need to know is that it's already January and the Pens haven't even talked numbers with his agent yet. They won't say this, but unless they win a ton of games between here and the trade deadline they are going to trade him. The only way he stays is if it somehow looks like they are a serious Cup contender before the deadline gets here. And that doesn't seem very likely at all.

 

[joeydavid]

William Nylander just signed an 8 year, $92 million contract. $11.5 million per season.

If Guentzel wants as much money as he can get, or anything close to it, the Penguins can't afford him.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

Nylander? He's a pretty good player. His career numbers and Guentzel's are pretty similar. Which means that you can expect Guentzel to get a contract similar to that on his next contract.

 

[forbesfield]

We need a first round pick in return if he goes. We can't keep trading them away. This year's pick is gone, although it's protected if it is high enough, but the farm system is bare. We need more picks.

I really hate that we all have to just tread water until the 3 Musketeers are finished.

 

[CaptainMurphy]

We need a first round pick in return if he goes. We can't keep trading them away. This year's pick is gone, although it's protected if it is high enough, but the farm system is bare. We need more picks.

I really hate that we all have to just tread water until the 3 Musketeers are finished.

I’d have entertained the idea of trading the big 3 long ago. Honestly should have kept Sid and gone full rebuild a few years ago with the goal of being championship level competitive again before he is done. Too late now.

 

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

We need a first round pick in return if he goes. We can't keep trading them away. This year's pick is gone, although it's protected if it is high enough, but the farm system is bare. We need more picks.

I really hate that we all have to just tread water until the 3 Musketeers are finished.

Well....I have a plan. So...... A little bit more on that later.

Anyways, I advocated trading Jake in the past offseason. I mean the core is no longer winning. Timing is bad.

 

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

I’d have entertained the idea of trading the big 3 long ago. Honestly should have kept Sid and gone full rebuild a few years ago with the goal of being championship level competitive again before he is done. Too late now.

So. Say they miss the playoffs. Would you...........consider a trade of Sid (if he is amenable) to a younger upcoming contender for a boatload of younger players and picks??

 

[PittPharm2002]

At one time that would have been 100% true. And even though Sid is still very good I don’t know that he wields that much power any more. His end is near.

His opinion will have some weight, but I don’t think it’s as clear cut as you’re saying. If they can’t sign him they have to move him if they can get a good return.

Frankly Sid is playing like the NHL’s best player so far this season .

 

[PittPharm2002]

So. Say they miss the playoffs. Would you...........consider a trade of Sid (if he is amenable) to a younger upcoming contender for a boatload of younger players and picks??

You don’t trade Sid
He retires a Pen just like Mario before him .
Don’t be silly
Anyone else is moveable .
Sid is not

 

[pittbb80]

You don’t trade Sid
He retires a Pen just like Mario before him .
Don’t be silly
Anyone else is moveable .
Sid is not

Why. Despite how great Sid still is the team is mediocre with him. I get the sentimental value and loyalty but keeping him but if you trade him now you fast frack rebuilding the team. Keep him to the end and you extend that process.

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

They should trade him, and anyone else they can trade. Their number one priority should be rebuilding the farm system, getting young players, and stockpiling as many draft picks as possible.

They're old and have one of the worst farm systems in the NHL. They also won't have a 1st, 3rd, or 5th round draft pick this year, and no 2nd next year. That's after giving away close to three years of draft picks over the last 6 drafts.

What has been done to this organization to keep a bunch of aging veterans together to sell tickets is ridiculous.

 

[PittPharm2002]

Why. Despite how great Sid still is the team is mediocre with him. I get the sentimental value and loyalty but keeping him but if you trade him now you fast frack rebuilding the team. Keep him to the end and you extend that process.

Because he wants to be here and he’s on a very franchise friendly deal

He’s making $8.7mil/year
Which makes him the 40th highest paid player in the NHL
he’s got one more year on his contract and they’ll likely extend him a few more .

His productivity and value is way over his salary.
It doesn’t make any sense

 

[PittPharm2002]

They should trade him, and anyone else they can trade. Their number one priority should be rebuilding the farm system, getting young players, and stockpiling as many draft picks as possible.

They're old and have one of the worst farm systems in the NHL. They also won't have a 1st, 3rd, or 5th round draft pick this year, and no 2nd next year. That's after giving away close to three years of draft picks over the last 6 drafts.

What has been done to this organization to keep a bunch of aging veterans together to sell tickets is ridiculous.

You’re going to trade a top 5 all time player who is still playing like a MVP for draft picks and minor leaguers ?!?
Why? To get much worse - piss off the fans and team - to gain $8.7mil of cap space ?
GTFOH

 

[BTisinDC]

You’re going to trade a top 5 all time player who is still playing like a MVP for draft picks and minor leaguers ?!?
Why? To get much worse - piss off the fans and team - to gain $8.7mil of cap space ?
GTFOH

Well, you sure didn't provide a good reason to keep him, but I expect they will. How loyal will the fan base be as this team continues its decline with the big 3 getting older and slower?

I expect he'll re-up for $6.1 like Malkin and Letang. The question is how Syd reacts to Guentzel being traded. They can't afford to keep him - if for no other reason than it's their best chance to replenish the talent base.

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

You’re going to trade a top 5 all time player who is still playing like a MVP for draft picks and minor leaguers ?!?
Why? To get much worse - piss off the fans and team - to gain $8.7mil of cap space ?
GTFOH

The qualifier is anyone else they can trade. And yes, I would trade Sid if he was willing to be traded. Maybe the dude wants a chance to win another cup before he retires. It's not going to happen here. It would depend where his mind is at.

He would bring a haul of prospects and draft picks. I don't care about his cap hit.

 

[pittbb80]

Because he wants to be here and he’s on a very franchise friendly deal

He’s making $8.7mil/year
Which makes him the 40th highest paid player in the NHL
he’s got one more year on his contract and they’ll likely extend him a few more .

His productivity and value is way over his salary.
It doesn’t make any sense

It’s not abkut rhe salary and performance

Unless they can add the pieces to win or make a deep run he’s more valuable in getting a boat load of talent (assuming you can) in return. For example if you could trade him and draft a generational talent or acquire several talented guys it makes sense to trade him. All Im saying is that it’s sillly to completely eliminate any trade consideration if you can get significant return for him

 

[yourhired]

Trade him this team needs to start the rebuild

 

[Millerton24]

Why. Despite how great Sid still is the team is mediocre with him. I get the sentimental value and loyalty but keeping him but if you trade him now you fast frack rebuilding the team. Keep him to the end and you extend that process.

Malkin and Letang would fast track it enough.... and Guentzel

 

[forbesfield]

Trade him during his last contract year, and then re-sign him at the end of the season. He retires a Penguin.

 

[pittbb80]

The qualifier is anyone else they can trade. And yes, I would trade Sid if he was willing to be traded. Maybe the dude wants a chance to win another cup before he retires. It's not going to happen here. It would depend where his mind is at.

He would bring a haul of prospects and draft picks. I don't care about his cap hit.

Bingo. For example if you could get a guy like Bedard you’d make the trade in a heat beat. Now that’s easier said than done but if you can get a haul to jump start the rebuild you do it

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

They've traded away almost 3 full drafts of picks over the last 6 years. The cupboard is about as bare as it can be, and they don't have a 1st, a 3rd, or a 5th this year.

People need to wake up and quit thinking it's still 2017.

 

[PittPharm2002]

The qualifier is anyone else they can trade. And yes, I would trade Sid if he was willing to be traded. Maybe the dude wants a chance to win another cup before he retires. It's not going to happen here. It would depend where his mind is at.

He would bring a haul of prospects and draft picks. I don't care about his cap hit.

So -
To recap
Trade away the franchise player who is still great and cheap-
So we can be worse faster - to maybe improve in 5 years ?
Silly thinking

 

[PittPharm2002]

Bingo. For example if you could get a guy like Bedard you’d make the trade in a heat beat. Now that’s easier said than done but if you can get a haul to jump start the rebuild you do it

You think someone is trading a bedard like top draft pick for anyone on this roster ?

Holy shit

You trade Sid - it’s going to be for minor leaguers and draft picks -
Which guarantees pens are in lottery for a decade

 

[pittbb80]

So -
To recap
Trade away the franchise player who is still great and cheap-
So we can be worse faster - to maybe improve in 5 years ?
Silly thinking

So to recap keep him and get nothing in return for perhaps two or three good years so the team can be a marginal playoff team. Then when he retired enjoy being the worst team in the NHL
For years versus getting a boatload of talent to jump
Start the rebuilding process

 

[pittbb80]

"I talked to Guentzel's agent this week, he's taking it slow," Dhaliwal said. "The deadline is still weeks away. The problem with Guentzel is the cost is going to be high. We're looking at a first rounder, a top prospect, and a player."

https://thehockeynews.com/nhl/pittsburgh-penguins/latest-news/report-pittsburgh-penguins-set-asking-price-jake-guentzel

 

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

You don’t trade Sid
He retires a Pen just like Mario before him .
Don’t be silly
Anyone else is moveable .
Sid is not

I know. I know. I subscribe to the root for the logo not the name on the back. But exceptions for 66 and 87.

I am just going to Sid sincerely and tell them we are burning this down, we need to finally rebuild, do you want to stay through it, or do you want to go to a contender? I think if it gets to a point, that is a worthy conversation. Because his contract is up after next season I believe. So there needs and has to be that conversation.

 

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

Another thing to think about. This is my "solution later". So many of the guys like Malkin, Letang, Rackell, Rust have iron clad no movement clauses for the most part. Fire Sully bring in a Therrien/Torts type. That will remove the comfortability and get these guys willing to waive these clauses.

Dirty? Maybe. But they are going to have to play a disciplined style for awhile, the current players don't want to, the current coach doesn't want to coach that.

So................you have to make hard choices in management.

 

[ShipofFools]

They should trade him, and anyone else they can trade. Their number one priority should be rebuilding the farm system, getting young players, and stockpiling as many draft picks as possible.

They're old and have one of the worst farm systems in the NHL. They also won't have a 1st, 3rd, or 5th round draft pick this year, and no 2nd next year. That's after giving away close to three years of draft picks over the last 6 drafts.

What has been done to this organization to keep a bunch of aging veterans together to sell tickets is ridiculous.

Bingo. It is what the Rangers did a few years back when they woke up and realized they were not SC contenders. They stockpiled good, young prospects and draft picks from other teams. Finished low enough a few years for some top 5 draft picks to add to it.

You bite the bullet after having 15 years of successful hockey. Sid would probably be the only one they wouldn't trade without his sayso.

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

So -
To recap
Trade away the franchise player who is still great and cheap-
So we can be worse faster - to maybe improve in 5 years ?
Silly thinking

The recap is you decided to turn this into a trade Crosby exchange. I said you trade Guentzel and whomever else you can trade. Crosby is only being traded if he wants it.

You know what's silly? Toiling to maybe make the playoffs with a bunch of old guys, no farm system, and no draft picks so you can be in the toilet in 5 years.

 

[Burgh15]

You think someone is trading a bedard like top draft pick for anyone on this roster ?

Holy shit

You trade Sid - it’s going to be for minor leaguers and draft picks -
Which guarantees pens are in lottery for a decade

Trading Crosby is basically like asking a player like Tony Dorsett to free up a scholarship for an incoming freshman. You aren't going to get value for him and it's basically a GM asking to get fired.

 

[pbrad]

At one time that would have been 100% true. And even though Sid is still very good I don’t know that he wields that much power any more. His end is near.

His opinion will have some weight, but I don’t think it’s as clear cut as you’re saying. If they can’t sign him they have to move him if they can get a good return.

Sid will play 4 more years.