Easier when late leads are surrendered with less than 2 minutes to go.
In back to back games.
And the game before that 4 goals surrendered on 13 shots in the first 23 minutes of the game.
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Ot: penguins
- Thread starter SoufOaklin4Life
- Start date
In back to back games.
And the game before that 4 goals surrendered on 13 shots in the first 23 minutes of the game.
Or both are right.
In any event, it's another squandered lead and wasted point.
The best player in the game can win the face off too. You know, if we’re talking about botches. He let The Flyer go around him too. It’s very easy to blame the goalie even though 6-5 and 3-3 OT has sucked all year.
The best thing about hockey is that the Pens get to try again in two days. Good night and talk to you then.
By now you would think our players would wisen up and be smart like you Souf, and realizing that our goalie sucks, go out and get a couple more goals for him so he doesn't have to worry about giving it away at the end!
Is it me or does Cullen never win a faceoff when it matters?
As for Murray... again, I don’t get the criticism in this one. What were the possession numbers in OT? Carolina had the tail end of a regulation PP and then a full 2:00 PP. They had to have possessed the puck 75 or 80% of the time and Murray made some great saves, including in the shootout.
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Phil Kessel 0 goals in his last 24, Patrick Hornquist 0 goals in his last 28 at even strength.
We always look to the goalie, but especially with Malkin out, these guys need to step up. Some. At least. They are invisible at even strength. Johnny Blandisi, straight off the set as an extra in Goodfellas was more of a threat than Phil or Hornquist last night. This is really a serious problem, the biggest issue the Pens have going into the playoffs, if they make it. Without these guys scoring, they are empty suits.
And in OT, when you know when it comes to shootouts they are essentially a coinflip (especially when you don't have Malkin and Letang)....why would you not have Sid on that last PK?
Matt Cullen is about done as a hockey player, yet we play him as if he was a 28 year old.
And stupid, stupid, stupid, low IQ stuff. Letang just shut up and go to the box. JJ, you can't do that.
And finally, we played another middling goalie who outplayed our goalie. Not that Murray was bad, but Mrazek made all the saves when he had to. Murray gagged up that glove.
And in the shootout, I can't blame Murray for 3 of the lamest attempts by Pens players.
Meh, playoffs start in 21 days. Focus on getting Malkin and Maatta healthy. Rest players with bumps abd bruises. Whether 2, 3 or wc seed, it's going to require a better effort than they've given in the playoffs. I don't read too much into regular season consistency or individual performances. These guys can turn it on or off as they wish, which the "experts" like to think that teams can't do that.
To make this simple we're getting out hustled throughout the game especially at the end of the game and in OT.
When you have the talent the PENS have, and lose, the problem comes down to game day hockey sense and hard work.
A hungry young team like Carolina is a dangerous team.
A few years ago the PENS were a hungry young team with a few star players.
Now the PENS are loaded with star players who aren't very hungry.
The balance of stars to hungry young talent is a tricky one. Maybe the PENS
are star heavy!?
When you have the talent the PENS have, and lose, the problem comes down to game day hockey sense and hard work.
A hungry young team like Carolina is a dangerous team.
A few years ago the PENS were a hungry young team with a few star players.
Now the PENS are loaded with star players who aren't very hungry.
The balance of stars to hungry young talent is a tricky one. Maybe the PENS
are star heavy!?
The thing I have with Murray, and it isn't all that much really, but he plays lights out brilliant for 58 minutes in the game. He needs to stay brilliant for that last 2 minutes. It is a point in time thing. There he sits, having gotten the team to that point, leading by a goal with a couple of minutes, or a couple of seconds left. He needs to stop those last second goals that tie the game.
Sure it would be nice to have more goals and a 3 goal lead or whatever, but this team is offensively challenged right now. Malkin is out and that is huge. All the other guys seem to have caught Phil Kessel's virus, even Sid! He's missed on 3 breakaways now including the lame shootout effort and also some really good chances on the PP and even strength.
A big thing is the pathetic passing, especially when coming out of their own end. Watch them closely, they rarely connect cleanly, and oftentimes put the puck right on the stick of the opposition, as if they were the target! Murray has bailed them out more times than he should after those sloppy passes.
The PP is pathetic, period. It needs work and fast. Doesn't help that Malkin is out, and Kessel needs to go to a psychiatrist or the bench he's THAT bad. Recently they haven't been getting a lot of scoring from anywhere, really, but they have trouble even getting shots on the PP!
I know, or I think I know they'll make the playoffs, but so what? If they play like this a young hungry team or a hot goalie will take them out in the first round! Not what we hoped for or expected from them with all the supposed firepower and two time Cup winning goalie and coach!
Sure it would be nice to have more goals and a 3 goal lead or whatever, but this team is offensively challenged right now. Malkin is out and that is huge. All the other guys seem to have caught Phil Kessel's virus, even Sid! He's missed on 3 breakaways now including the lame shootout effort and also some really good chances on the PP and even strength.
A big thing is the pathetic passing, especially when coming out of their own end. Watch them closely, they rarely connect cleanly, and oftentimes put the puck right on the stick of the opposition, as if they were the target! Murray has bailed them out more times than he should after those sloppy passes.
The PP is pathetic, period. It needs work and fast. Doesn't help that Malkin is out, and Kessel needs to go to a psychiatrist or the bench he's THAT bad. Recently they haven't been getting a lot of scoring from anywhere, really, but they have trouble even getting shots on the PP!
I know, or I think I know they'll make the playoffs, but so what? If they play like this a young hungry team or a hot goalie will take them out in the first round! Not what we hoped for or expected from them with all the supposed firepower and two time Cup winning goalie and coach!
And yet Phil selfishly plays everyday to keep his "streak" alive, even though he looks horrible out there and is not producing.
Cullen plays everyday, even though that was never the intention when he was signed.
Agree about Cullen. It's the 4th line and all, and they aren't out there to score, but he's had some great chances to put in bunnies and he can't do it.
Regarding Kessel, I'm sure if they sit him, he'd pull an "Operation Shutdown", not that he hasn't already!
The other thing, and more importantly, who do you replace him with??
His deteriorated play is probably the biggest reason the Pens haven't done well 3 on 3. His speed and shot used to give them a huge advantage with all that open ice. He and Malkin used to work very well together, giving them 2 very dangerous pairings with Letang in those situations. Now, he's more a liability with his bad passing and poor shooting.
Had hoped he'd flip the switch and get back to being the sniper, but it isn't happening and he looks pathetic!
Again...............
Kessel. No goals at even strength for the past 24 games.
Hornquist. No goals at even strength for the past 28 games.
These two guys, they aren't defensive, two way hockey stars. They aren't particularly good on the forecheck. Hornquist is not a speed demon. Kessel has definitely seem to have lost a step. Kessel is a good playmaker, but Hornquist isn't.
Between the two of them they are paid around 14 million in cap space, and they are contributing less than what Garrett Wilson is giving the Pens. Without them scoring goals, they have little use out there. Yes I am picking on them, because they are killing us, especially with Malkin out. Riley Sheahan was more of a threat than they are.
What is worse, it is not like they are that snakebitten either. Sure a game or 2, Phil has had some decent chances, but overall these guys aren't even getting great chances.
I am not sure if it is a huge, prolonged slump or perhaps the new normal for two 30 something wingers who have played a lot of hockey over the past few seasons.
Yeah, I just posted my post above as you were posting yours.
I am starting to worry that these guys are quickly on the downslide of their careers. Happens to a lot of players in their 30's, especially guys who have played in so many high stakes games.
They just look like shell of themselves, I thought once they got a goal that the floodgates have opened and while both have scored recently on the PP they are generating nothing at even strength and Phil's passes seem to always find an opponent's stick before a Penguins stick.
Hornqvist is supposed to be the in front of the net guy. The garbage man, the screener, the PITA if you would.
He hasn't been doing that lately. Maybe it's the concussion or fear of another one? I don't know, but recently the Pens are getting one shot, with no screening, and no one crashing the net for any rebound, although goalies recently have played like Roy lately so no rebounds!
Pretty goals make nice highlight films, but dirty goals win games! If a goalie is seeing it good, you have to overwhelm him with bodies and shots to beat him. Not happening for us now.
Yep. One of the most curious decisions of the year, if you remember....is when Hornquist was out for a couple of weeks with a concussion and he returned for the game that preceded their "bye" week+all star game. They had like a 9 day break. You would have thought, well with an extra week and few days, no use bringing him back for one game. But they did. I am not saying playing in that game did damage, just it was not a smart move.
I may get crucified for this but I think that Kessel IS trying hard and putting forth effort. To me, he actually seems to have stepped up lately (last two weeks) in his pursuit of the puck. He appears to have more jump in his legs. It has not resulted in any more goals but it does appear that the effort is there. I actually saw him dive about a week or so ago to try to make a pass to a teammate in front of the net.
Sorry. Maybe I need glasses but my wife said the same thing. Maybe she needs them too!
Sorry. Maybe I need glasses but my wife said the same thing. Maybe she needs them too!
I tend to agree for the most part..........What I have noticed is he doesnt shoot that often and when he does he doesnt seem to have much on his shot.......but the effort has generally been there
Oh he's flying around alright, but to what purpose?
His shot is off, and his passes are off and he's still nonexistent on the back check.
Like recruits says, he's a sniper and if he isn't scoring, what good is he?
I am not saying he is or isn't trying hard. I just see a guy now a step slow in his skating/passing/shooting/decision making.
So Carolina is playing really well and the Pens stole a point in their building. OK, got it.
Cullen's biggest gaffe came on the tying goal. He stood and watched his man go get the puck Crosby stalemated on the faceoff. He was late to react and the puck gets passed to the point for the initial shot. Then Rust ignores his man (who scored on the rebound) to try and block the slap shot from the point. Cullen and Rust were as culpable as Murray on that last goal.
Sound defensive hockey is why Cullen is there at that situation, and also to be the backup faceoff guy if Sid gets tossed. You can't stand and watch in that situation. Cullen gets there first there first and knocks it back, there is no shot and a likely clear by the D man.
It was a weak flutter shot which Murray couldn’t handle - and instead batted it to a wide open net.
There is 1 person to blame for the tying goal .
He played really well -
But that gaffe cost them a point
No. Faceoffs and defensive coverage is all part of hockey. It’s funny we never used to focus on Every. Single. Goal Against when Fluery was here or when DeSmith plays. Seems a bit personal by you.
Desmith is a backup .
Fleury lost his starters job by giving up goals too often .
I watched that tying goal a dozen times.
Tell me what is inaccurate at all with what I said.
It was a low danger shot which he misplayed .
These aren’t steal a win moments
These are the team has the lead and relatively low danger shots are given up
Fleury lost his starting job because Murray was Sullivan’s guy. Sullivan all but said that in 2017 in the regular season when he named Murray the starter and again in the playoffs once Murray was healthy. Fleury absolutely stole game 7 against Washington and he was replaced as soon as Murray was healthy.
No, Fleury was replaced after his first mediocre game vs Ottawa, but it did feel as if Sully was just waiting for that moment to pull the trigger.
Correct, but you left out the part where Murray went on and pitched one shut out and allowed a total of 6 goals in the final 4 games against Ottawa and then shut out Nashville in the last two games of the Stanley Cup Final.
That's what I am talking about. Never seen home "fans" so against their goalie. They remember 2nd rd wins, but forget what happened in the finals as if it was a preseason game.
Seems to be a lot of discussion about the loss to Carolina yesterday and especially the tying goal late in the 3rd period when Carolina had pulled their goalie and it was 6v5 ...... just wanted to give a few of my thoughts ......
Murray made a lot of terrific saves ..... 37 saves on 39 shots ..... .949 save %.
On the first goal by Carolina, there was a pass across and a high danger shot from the left inner hash marks ..... Murray was a little deep, tried to telescope out but a really good shot beat him .... that was a tough save.
Now, on the second Carolina goal ..... it was 6v5 with a face-off from the right face-off dot in the Pens defensive zone ...... Carolina lined up with a player near the boards, a player taking the face-off, 2 players between the hash marks and 2 players on the points (both at or just above the level of the top of the circles, one in line with the near hash marks and one in line with the inner part of the opposite/left circle) ..... the Pens had one player line up near the boards, Crosby taking the face-off, Cullen and Rust between the hash marks, and Letang to the left of Murray a few feet from the bottom of the left circle ...... in this alignment, Carolina had 4 players to the left of the face-off man and the Pens effectively had 2 (Cullen and Rust as Letang was on the opposite side of Murray and too far away to take anyone from Carolina off the face-off) ..... it was essentially a 4 on 2 in front of Murray ...... Crosby lost the face-off, the Hurricane beat Cullen to the puck in the circle and passed the puck out to the near point man who was unguarded and shot a knuckleball at Murray who muffed the puck (it hit off the cuff over his wrist) and left a rebound which was shot in by the other Hurricane who initially lined up opposite Rust near the hash marks ..... Rust didn't take his man (the scorer) and if he did, Rust could have cleared the rebound toward the corner and in addition, Rust tried to block the initial shot by jumping feet first toward the line of the puck which distracted Murray a little .....
If Letang lines up right next to Cullen by the hash marks instead of way over to the left of Murray, he could have taken the Carolina player who went into the circle and passed the puck out to the point, Cullen's man should then have been the man on the point who initially shot the puck not the man going into the circle (Cullen may have been able to deflect the pass out to the point or block the initial shot) ...... Rust should have taken his man (the one that scored the goal) as if he did, he could have cleared the puck out of danger and he wouldn't have distracted his goalie ..... Murray needed to catch the puck and not give up a bad rebound (although if Rust covers his man, Carolina likely wouldn't have scored even with the bad rebound).
Therefore, IMO, what happened on that play ..... 1) Crosby lost the face-off .... 2) Letang lined up in the wrong position and covered no one, leaving a 4 on 2 in front of Murray ..... 3) Cullen took the wrong man (should have covered the point) ..... 4) Rust didn't cover his man allowing him to score the goal and in addition Rust distracted his goalie on the initial shot..... 5) Murray muffed the shot and left a bad rebound that ended up in the net ...... other then that, we played it perfectly !
Blame whoever you want, there is plenty to go around !
Murray made a lot of terrific saves ..... 37 saves on 39 shots ..... .949 save %.
On the first goal by Carolina, there was a pass across and a high danger shot from the left inner hash marks ..... Murray was a little deep, tried to telescope out but a really good shot beat him .... that was a tough save.
Now, on the second Carolina goal ..... it was 6v5 with a face-off from the right face-off dot in the Pens defensive zone ...... Carolina lined up with a player near the boards, a player taking the face-off, 2 players between the hash marks and 2 players on the points (both at or just above the level of the top of the circles, one in line with the near hash marks and one in line with the inner part of the opposite/left circle) ..... the Pens had one player line up near the boards, Crosby taking the face-off, Cullen and Rust between the hash marks, and Letang to the left of Murray a few feet from the bottom of the left circle ...... in this alignment, Carolina had 4 players to the left of the face-off man and the Pens effectively had 2 (Cullen and Rust as Letang was on the opposite side of Murray and too far away to take anyone from Carolina off the face-off) ..... it was essentially a 4 on 2 in front of Murray ...... Crosby lost the face-off, the Hurricane beat Cullen to the puck in the circle and passed the puck out to the near point man who was unguarded and shot a knuckleball at Murray who muffed the puck (it hit off the cuff over his wrist) and left a rebound which was shot in by the other Hurricane who initially lined up opposite Rust near the hash marks ..... Rust didn't take his man (the scorer) and if he did, Rust could have cleared the rebound toward the corner and in addition, Rust tried to block the initial shot by jumping feet first toward the line of the puck which distracted Murray a little .....
If Letang lines up right next to Cullen by the hash marks instead of way over to the left of Murray, he could have taken the Carolina player who went into the circle and passed the puck out to the point, Cullen's man should then have been the man on the point who initially shot the puck not the man going into the circle (Cullen may have been able to deflect the pass out to the point or block the initial shot) ...... Rust should have taken his man (the one that scored the goal) as if he did, he could have cleared the puck out of danger and he wouldn't have distracted his goalie ..... Murray needed to catch the puck and not give up a bad rebound (although if Rust covers his man, Carolina likely wouldn't have scored even with the bad rebound).
Therefore, IMO, what happened on that play ..... 1) Crosby lost the face-off .... 2) Letang lined up in the wrong position and covered no one, leaving a 4 on 2 in front of Murray ..... 3) Cullen took the wrong man (should have covered the point) ..... 4) Rust didn't cover his man allowing him to score the goal and in addition Rust distracted his goalie on the initial shot..... 5) Murray muffed the shot and left a bad rebound that ended up in the net ...... other then that, we played it perfectly !
Blame whoever you want, there is plenty to go around !
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