Seems like Greene has been focused on building ties with larger donors first. I know that is being done at smaller, in person events. I’m guessing broader efforts will follow via mail/email.
Reality with AD Greene
- Thread starter CrazyPaco
- Start date
Seems like Greene has been focused on building ties with larger donors first. I know that is being done at smaller, in person events. I’m guessing broader efforts will follow via mail/email.
While I do agree to a certain extent with what you said about baseball, there is no way that Pitt can get rid of the sport. It is a current Varsity sport at Pitt and it should remain as one. Add a men's lacrosse team??? WHY! If the people in Pittsburgh will not support a baseball team, there is on way they support a men's lacrosse team. The sad reality of it is, the sport of lacrosse is going nowhere in this country. Could care less about any data that would show otherwise. I've been to two lacrosse games in my life to watch my a couple of my students play and after you removed the kids families (and a couple of friends) from the sparse crowd, there may gave been 20 people (if that) who came to watch the game. If Pitt is going to add another sport, it should have added men's and women's Ice Hockey as a Varsity sport instead of women's lacrosse.
If anything, lacrosse is much more of a "warm weather" sport.
Victory Heights has been approved and is under construction. This may be the last major sports construction project at Pitt for a while.
When completed it will be a nice addition to the Pitt campus connecting the upper campus with the lower campus.
Aesthetically pleasing transition.
HAIL TO PITT!!!!
When completed it will be a nice addition to the Pitt campus connecting the upper campus with the lower campus.
Aesthetically pleasing transition.
HAIL TO PITT!!!!
No, Pittsburgh isn't going to support a men's lacrosse program but it will draw slightly better than baseball since it will be the region's premier lacrosse team, whereas Pitt baseball is a distant 3rd behind the Pirates and Wild Things. Lacrosse could develop a pretty good fanbase similar to soccer. And it's a Mid-Atlantic sport, not a southern sport, so Pitt is not at a recruiting or weather disadvantage. Also, we would save money by not renting out Highmark for the women's program.
If the calculation for determining which sports a university should offer is based on number of fans that attend, then Pitt shouldn't have any sports other than football, men's basketball, and probably volleyball. And volleyball is a new phenomenon, the sport would have been dropped years ago if attendance dictated whether a sport was worthy.
Maybe it's just anecdotal from what I see and those I talk to, but lacrosse has really blown up in the last 15ish years up here in the North Hills - to the point where its probably tied or surpassed baseball as the preeminent spring school sport.
Status quo for competing at the top level of collegiate competition costs more and more.
Yes, the system is broken. It was broken forever the minute NIL was introduced.
But Pitt must operate in the system. There is no operating outside of it. A single school cannot change the system, especially one like Pitt.
Pitt either operates in the system at the top tier or drops out of it. There is no in between.
Some self-proclaimed fans are communicating to the university, with their wallets, that it doesn't matter.
College lax isn't remotely close to college baseball, either in attendance or media coverage.
No question. Lax is still a pretty niche sport on a national level, I was just pointing out it has gotten pretty popular around here.
Definitely. Baseball used to have a lot of teams, games, tournaments for Little League, Pony League, American Legion. School baseball teams aren't as active or numerous as 20 or 25 years ago, when my kids played baseball. The baseball fields are now mostly sitting idle in the spring and summer, with a few exceptions. But lacrosse in the schools is getting a lot of interest and taking over where baseball used to be.
Maybe it is anecdotal. I don't know. I'm just speaking about the North Hills, North Allegheny areas.
There was a documentary a few years ago about a couple of young guys from the Dominican who got sent by their MLB team to a short season A ball team someplace like Iowa or somewhere else in the mid-west, and the guys were completely lost because they didn't speak any English and at that time the club didn't have any Spanish speaking people on staff. They basically went from the ball park to the apartment they were staying in and back again, over and over, and no where else, because they could not communicate with most of their teammates and any of the locals.
Most teams have wised up recently and probably all at this point have a Spanish speaking coach/advisor on the staff of all their minor league teams, just so that sort of thing doesn't happen any more. Because most of those players simply cannot speak English at all when they get here.
Pretty good summary of the situation. Given the reality of the world of college athletics I would opt to play at a lower level. Note that it pains me to say that I think we should drop down because I started at Pitt when we were at the very top of the college football world. I enjoy Pitt sports and would love to see us compete for another NC but I simply don't see how this is possible. We are not likely to have the financial resources to compete with the big dogs and candidly even if we could find such resources I'm not sure that spending the type of money it would require is a the proper prioritization of University funds.
What I really don't want to see is a "halfway" effort where we try to compete at the highest level but don't have the resources to do so and we end up as a perennial mediocre (or worse) program. It's just too painful. I'd personally rather watch nothing than waste my time making believe we're going to compete for a NC on a shoestring budget. I feel a bit bad for our new AD (although not horribly bad given that he's well compensated to re-arrange the deck chairs on the Titanic). He's inherited a real mess between the Victory Heights spending, Narduzzi's 200 year contract, Capel's deal and the new required spending for House. Not much flexibility. Sad state of affairs IMO with no clear path to success. Depressing actually.
Of course, my opinion and $5 will buy you a latte.
Cruzer
If you think it is National Championship or bust, than Pitt should have dropped sports 40 years. ago, along with 75% of the rest of universities.
Sorry, NC or nothing attitude is not realistic.
Lax is one of the fastest growing sports, that is for sure, but it just isn't close to baseball at the college level.
Only 3 lax programs averaged over 3K in home attendance. 24 programs over 1K. Everyone else, which is about 54 more schools that sponsor men's lax, averaged under 1K. That is with about 9 or 10 home games per season. All the games of the NCAA tournament were on ESPNU until the 2 final four games on ESPN2, and the championship game on ESPN.
For college baseball, 300 schools sponsor it at D1 (compared to 78 for men's lax). 3 programs average over 10K per game (and that is with 30 to 40 home dates per season), with 36 over 2K (the collective average of the SEC, Big 12, and ACC were each over 2K). Well over 50 programs, at least over 60 before the list was cut off, average over 1K for all their 30 or so home games. ESPN scheduled the broadcast of 153 postseason games on its networks and all 17 possible games of the College World Series were scheduled to be on ESPN, except one on ESPN2, and one championship game on ABC.
Lax isn't even close to the media coverage or attendance.
I didn't say it was realistic but that's my personal perspective. Either we're playing to win at the highest level or not which is why I suggest dropping down. It's not realistic for Pitt to compete for an NC and I for one am not interested in less. Others are entitled to accept whatever results fits their personal taste.
Cruzer
Start with dumping our overpaid head coaches in Narduzzi and Capel .
Free up some cash
With all due respect, you can close up shop on a practical level, and on an absolute level. With regards to the schools that aren't in the upper echelon (all 10-12 of them), the result is pretty much the same. No matter what the choice, Pitt will never win a national championship in football ever again.
However, being in the ACC still brings in way more money than being in the Patriot League, even if the likely end result is the same either way. Administration isn't going to flush away ACC money for some misguided virtue-signaling de-emphasis. That would be beyond dumb.
Yep. All of that makes sense. I'm just not personally going to continue watching a team that goes 7-6 forever. And I'm sure as heck not donating to such a mediocre outcome.
Cruzer
Here you go: https://forums.college-sports-journal.com/viewforum.php?f=1
Nice having you on the Pitt board while you were a "fan."
Yes, it would be beyond dumb. Like rock bottom stupid type of dumb on all sorts of levels. Yet people are gobbling it up.
And here is the thing... no one, absolutely no one, can predict, what will college athletics look like in 10 years, or 20 years, or 50 years. No one had any idea what it would look like today just 10 years ago. Things can and are changing rapidly. The impossibility of Pitt winning anything in today's environment may not apply in the future. But one thing is certain, if Pitt drops out of the top tier, that opportunity will absolutely be gone, forever. So right now, it is about survival and hopefully successfully riding out the chaos.
But the quitters are "I'm not participating if we can't win a natty now."
Last edited:
Hey Paco, if you choose to spend your time following mediocrity that's your choice, but some of us have been following Pitt for 40+ years.....we're not quitters...far from it... we've stuck with this program for years despite zero improvement. At some point people simply move on out of frustration. So stuff your condescending attitude.
Says the person who just posted that they'd be ok with Pitt moving to the Patriot League. Quitting doesn't have a time limit. You finish the race or you do not. Which is it?
Yes, I choose to keep supporting Pitt, when they were good, when they were god awful in the 1990s, through all sorts of frustrating mediocrity that followed, regardless if the transient people running it made decisions that I agreed with or not. I'm not alone on that, not by any stretch. I will continue to do what I can, and give what I can, as many others are according to their circumstance because they understand the necessity of collectively pulling on the same end of the rope. And you betcha, I think that is superior to people bragging on a public fan message board about quitting with their support and being okay with the university quitting.
Last edited:
Maybe winning a National Championship in the era of NIL and Transfer Portal maybe turning off others.
The National Championship game between Ohio State and Notre Dame had a 12.1% reduction in TV viewership.
Additionally, the college sports system is broken with NIL and the Transfer Portal and needs to be fixed.
Ohio State's athletic dept. lost $38 million in 2024. If Ohio State (B1G member and with over 100,000 fans attending home football games) can't make money, then 98% of all football programs will lose money every year.
System is broken and university presidents need to collectively step in and discuss what needs to be done to fix it or losses will continue to mount to unsustainable levels. Pitt isn't unique in this perspective.
Why watch a National Championship game that goes to the program that losses the most/least.
Fading national interest in National Championships.
As I stated previously, colleges and universities will face severe financial pressure with the loss of tuition paying students now and in the next 15 years caused by the "Baby Bust" generation. Many institutions will have to close.
HAIL TO PITT!!!!
Last edited:
Now compare northeast college baseball to northeast lacrosse and run your numbers again
I'd also add that lacrosse is associated with better academic schools. ACC lacrosse is VERY good and PITT could ramp up quickly in recruiting based on that case alone.
If Pitt didn't have any athletics besides football and basketball, and was told they had to add X number of teams, baseball wouldn't be one of them. Lacrosse likely would for the simple reason that you want to add sports that give you a chance to be good. When you are good, you can develop a fanbase which cuts into the cost a little and as AD Greene said, Olympic sports make alums feel good.
Pitt will never be good at baseball. Its impossible as a cold-weather team in a warm-weather sport. With lacrosse, they at least would have a chance.
If long periods of mediocrity, or worse, is good enough to jettison your fandom, why the heck to people bother with the Pirates? How long until the Steelers aren't worth a couple of hours on Sunday? The Pens? Penn State is way closer to a NC than Pitt in football but has had just as much success in winning one since many of are old asses were in high school. Should their fan base give up?
I look back at the ACC Championship and I really can't remember a more enjoyable season and yet, many on this board love to lament on the Western Michigan game or the QB opting out of a meaningless bowl game. The number of people who checked in to crap all over the volleyball program after four straight final four appearances was amazing. I honestly don't know what it would take for this fan base to just support its sports teams. Many don't even open their wallet yet cry and complain about outcomes. Caviar taste on an Eat n' Park budget.
I look back at the ACC Championship and I really can't remember a more enjoyable season and yet, many on this board love to lament on the Western Michigan game or the QB opting out of a meaningless bowl game. The number of people who checked in to crap all over the volleyball program after four straight final four appearances was amazing. I honestly don't know what it would take for this fan base to just support its sports teams. Many don't even open their wallet yet cry and complain about outcomes. Caviar taste on an Eat n' Park budget.
Yea, a significant portion of the fan base is delivering a message to the university. You just have misinterpreted the message which is: “ until you demonstrate that you have a clue on running a successful athletics department, we’re not investing in YOU because for 40 years all you have given us is incompetence and indifference, as reflected in the quality of the university’s major sports teams, which continues to be the case until this very moment.”
I see your point but i THINK MANY ARE FRUSTRATED BECAUSE nil IS DESTROYING COLLEGE ATHLETICS AS WE KNEW IT.
"we’re not investing in YOU because for 40 years all you have given us is incompetence and indifference, as reflected in the quality of the university’s major sports teams, which continues to be the case until this very moment.”
I can't argue with that...However, on the flip side
Greene is saying out loud what a lot of posters have been saying, and others won’t accept. It’s about money. Not facilities, attendance, or recruiting ability.
The same posters who demand national championships and better results want:
An on-campus stadium…
Buy up Narduzzi’s multi-million-dollar contract…
Get a better head coach and pay him whatever it takes to get him…
Pay whatever it takes to get better coaches and recruiters…
Get better players in the portal by outbidding everyone else….
And when you tell the same poster Pitt doesn’t have the money, they come back and say, “Well I guess you’re happy with mediocrity!”
If you want to send a message to the administration, fair enough. But be willing to accept mediocrity without complaining....
Unless Pitt is going to build an academic building or a dorm a parking lot is the only thing that can be built on that hillside.
