Urban Meyer sounding like SMF on NIL
- Thread starter Sean Miller Fan
- Start date
What did I make up? There's never been a fan collective created. You want to know why? Because you arent allowed to circumvent the salary cap by doing stuff like this.
You know what else has never been created? A rule like the one you made up.
I don't think it would count against the cap, you're claiming this, so go find in the NFL cap rules how a group of fans paying players extra money while not being affiliated with the actual team counts against the cap?
Not unless it was negotiated into the collective bargaining agreement, show us the clause in the NFL cap rules that states this?
What if the team had nothing to do with it? Again, show us the clause in the NFL cap rules that states this?
SMF: NIL IS FLAT OUT CHEATING!!!
ALSO SMF: PITT NEEDS TO CHEAT!
You don't have a lane on this topic. Just playing both sides.
Uh, yea. Why would I be against Pitt "cheating?" The NCAA doesn't enforce it and I said Pitt should cheat even before this NIL era.
I dont have access to the NFL legal documents. However, it is pretty much common sense that there would be some boilerplate language in there to prevent teams (and by extension, their fans) from paying players to circumvent the salary cap.
I am railing against the NCAA not enforcing pay for play. As long as they dont enforce it, you'd be pretty stupid not to do it. And Pitt is certainly doing pay for play. Not much success in football but their efforts in basketball look promising.
Pure silliness: "by extension their fans". Fans don't (directly) pay salaries. Teams do. Salary cap rules are for the teams and not the fans. For good reason. Your made-up premise is ridiculous.
Last September, Cochrane car dealership paid Pickett for his endorsement. Why isn't it circumventing the salary cap in your world? It obviously applies only to the Pittsburgh area and wouldn't be good if Pickett played elsewhere. In fact, Cochrane removed the commercial from Twitter.
Yep. Seems fairly obvious, right? Every pro athlete can have a commercial agreement outside of their contract and team salary.
Are you honestly asking that question? How many times do I have to explain that a car dealership is a real business. A fan collective is not. A fan collective exists 100% to pay players TO PLAY. If a group of fans start a collective to try to keep good players to stay, that money will count against the cap. NFL owners, especially ones who have smaller fanbases, arent going to allow Steeler fans or Packers fans or Cowboys fans to pay players and have that count cap-free. This is all basic common sense. 3rd grade type stuff here.
Cochrane paid Pickett as long as he played in Pittsburgh.
A Pitt collective (as you creatively define it) pays players as long as they play in Pittsburgh.
There is no difference to the player being paid. And neither is paying the player a salary.
I wanted to separate this answer from the above.
You created 3 premises to make your narrative fit:
1. "You keep saying that a fan collective exists 100% to pay players". That is 100% false. Alliance 412 includes a marketing branch called Oakland Originals to promote the players' brands. The Alliance also facilitates matching of "real companies" with players. That is not the Alliance paying the players.
2. You keep saying that a collective is not a "real company". That is 100% false. The reality is that it is a non-profit LLC, just like the YMCA, Salvation Army, and many others. Are they not "real companies"? When players were paid to appear in United Way ads, how is that different from a collective? To preempt your answer, Alliance 412 is receiving benefits from announcing deals with players by spreading the word of their success to potential contributors.
3. You keep saying that the NFL would never allow a collective to pay a player. That is 100% false. Obviously, no such rule exists or you would have posted it. Also, the NFL (and anyone with common sense) knows that salary caps apply only to team spending and not third-party spending, as I already stated. Pay from collectives and other businesses are not team-based.
In short, every premise you used to justify your argument is 100% false.
#1 Cochran is a REAL COMPANY. Their primary objective is to MAKE MONEY. They paid Kenny Pickett when he was with the Steelers because they felt the sponsorship deal would MAKE THEM MORE MONEY!!!! How do you still not understand this? This is so simple.
Fan collectives are NOT real companies. Their primary objective is to pay players to play for their favorite team. They do not exist to make any type of profit. Do you really not understand the difference between a fan collective and a car dealership? One is trying to make money, the other is just trying to pay players to play for their team
I apologize if this was already posted.
Also it looks like a short article on this topic just posted. https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profo...ts-arrive-in-pro-sports-salary-caps-be-damned
Article 13 | NFL Collective Bargaining Agreement (CBA) | Over The Cap
NFL Collective Bargaining Agreement | Over the Cap
overthecap.com
- A player’s Salary shall also include any and all consideration received by the player or his Player Affiliate from a Club or Club Affiliate, even if such consideration is ostensibly paid to the player for services other than football playing services, if the NFL can demonstrate before the Impartial Arbitrator that the consideration paid to the player or Player Affiliate for such nonfootball services does not represent a reasonable approximation of the fair market value of such services as performed by such player. The Impartial Arbitrator’s determination may take into account, among other things: (1) any actual dollar amounts the player or Player Affiliate received for similar nonfootball playing services from an independent third party; and (2) the percentage of total compensation for nonfootball services received from third parties versus the Team or Team Affiliate.
Also it looks like a short article on this topic just posted. https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profo...ts-arrive-in-pro-sports-salary-caps-be-damned
Get the eff out of here with this. I really hope you are messing with me because no human can possibly be this stupid. A412 might say it exists to help students build their brand but what do you want them to say? Everyone knows A412 and every other collective like it is straight-up pay for play. Would anyone on this board disagree with that?
I swear you have an intellectual disability. I really need to put you on ignore because I cant be wasting so much time conversing with someone with the intelligence level of an elementarty student. I cant believe you are comparing the YMCA or United Way to fan collectives and cant comprehend what I mean by "real company."
Boom. Another W. And I didn't even need to read any contract. It just takes basic human intelligence to figure out you can't form a fan collective to get around a salary cap.
Some of you might be fascinated to find out that every player on the WNBA Las Vegas team just signed a $100,000 sponsorship deal with the Las Vegas visitor bureau to "promote the city". That amount of money is more than several players on the team make in salary for the whole season.
Some people are arguing that this is a violation of the WNBA salary cap. The Aces say that they had no prior knowledge of the deal and that they are not paying the money, so how could there be a salary cap violation?
Oddly enough, seems like exactly what is being talked about here. Not surprisingly, it isn't nearly as cut and dried as some people in this thread seem to think.
Some people are arguing that this is a violation of the WNBA salary cap. The Aces say that they had no prior knowledge of the deal and that they are not paying the money, so how could there be a salary cap violation?
Oddly enough, seems like exactly what is being talked about here. Not surprisingly, it isn't nearly as cut and dried as some people in this thread seem to think.
This is an interesting case because it deals with a city paying players. I would think it violates the salary cap but my guess is that being that WNBA players make such low salaries, there would be too much bad press if they dont allow this.
If the City of Pittsburgh paid TJ Watt 100K to promote the city, that would seem like somewhere in the neighborhood of market value because Watt is a recognizable superstar in the most popular American sport. Now if the city of Pittsburgh paid Watt $10 million because they didnt want to lose him to a different team, then that would count against the cap because its far more than market value to have him do a few ads.
Better read that again, dumbass. Key words = "from a Club or Club Affiliate". In other words, the pay has to come from the team.
Boom. Another L for you.
from the A412 website:
"Alliance 412 strengthens the University of Pittsburgh's reputation as a top destination for elite athletes by providing innovative Name, Image, and Likeness Opportunities to current and future stars of the program."
1. "Facilitate relationships between businesses, charitable organizations, and individuals with student-athletes."
2. "Provide strategic marketing and communications services for student-athletes and their corporate and nonprofit partners."
3. "Serve as an ambassador for the University of Pittsburgh and city of Pittsburgh for the betterment of the entire student body."
4. "Provide student-athletes with opportunities and resources to enhance their life skills and job readiness."
Like I said, they not only directly pay players, but they provide marketing services and match companies to players.
You really are a child.
You have a weird definition of real company that excludes 2 million companies in the USA.
Guess what - the NFL is a non-profit. I guess it isn't a real company.
I am sorry. I really hate to put people down and argue with people on here but you are truly have to be one of the biggest idiots on the planet. I cannot fathom how stupid a human has to be to read the language that guy posted and STILL believe that a Steeler Fan Collective, which would exist SOLELY to pay players outside the cap would not he be considered a "club affiliate." Just stop. Every post you make on this is dumber than the last.
HOLY SHIT! WHY ARE YOU COPYING AND PASTING THE A412 WEBSITE?????
What the heck do you think they are going to say? "Hey yinz, we are just a pay for play but please dont sanction us." Of course they are going to make it sound like they are anything but a pay for play. They have to. Do you really not undestand that.
Let me say this real slow so that even some redneck Appalachian hillbilly with a 3rd grade education such as yourself can understand:
Alliance 412 and every other fan collective is a straight-up pay for play. 100%.
It must be lonely in your fantasy world that ignores facts and truths. That's obviously why you spend so much time here.
I am certainly no expert in this and don’t really care one way or the other, but I think the thing keeping a “NFL NIL” from occurring and supplement payer play because a player signs a significantly below market contract is the NFLPA. I seem to remember the NFlPA contested a player contract years ago for being too low and won. Not sure that is correct but it sticks in my mind.
That's the other thing. The owners arent going to allow it because it gives teams with bigger fanbases the ability to pay players outside the cap and the NFLPA would never allow players to take less money so they can get paid by the fans outside the cap.
Not sure I can be more clear.
1. I think the NCAA should either enforce their own rules or make pay for play legal
2. As long as they arent enforcing the rules, Pitt should do pay for play. And we do.
Completely made up.
The reason that NIL doesn't exist for professional sports is that the amounts that could be raised by fans is inconsequential to the salaries and endorsement money. The NFL and the NFLPA couldn't care less about fan collectives.
The fact that you think money paid to players by a Steeler Fan Collective wouldn't count against the cap is comical. Nobody agrees with you.
