Seems pretty obvious at this point we are going to collapse again.
what roster and staff changes need to be made?
what roster and staff changes need to be made?
Where do we go from here?
- Thread starter BballinsiderfromPitt
- Start date
I'm not a big fan of the staff changes idea. Jeff Capel is an experienced head coach. The 3 AC's have been HC's. Milan Brown took a team to the NCAA Tournament. I don't think an "X and O" assistant helps much. Sure, they could use a recruiter but that's supposed to be Capel. When you start blaming recruiting on assistants, the problem is really with the HC.
I'd love for Antigua, Knight, or Rice to come back but I dont see it.
They need staff changes and it can be someone outside of those 3. Antigua isn’t leaving an established program for less money and a less stable job. Knight won’t come without the associate head title and Rice will never and should never coach in college basketball again. I’ll never understand the affinity for Rice. He had 2 top 10 prospects tied to him and still couldn’t get approved by even Robert Morris for the 3rd assistant spot.
A coherent recruiting plan would be my starting point, but it may be a bit late for that. We lack depth at multiple spots and have been overly reliant on transfers. By this point, we should have the “next man up” identified either on the current roster or in the upcoming class for the guys were expecting to lose. The time we spent swinging for the fences on the trail really came back to bite us in this area.
Quite honestly, it’s time to identify a coach in the grassroots game who can bring a talented kid/kids with him and add him to the staff. Personally I hate that approach but it’s the way of the world currently. The talent level just isn’t where it needs to be and, barring a drastic change, it’s not going to get there anytime soon
Quite honestly, it’s time to identify a coach in the grassroots game who can bring a talented kid/kids with him and add him to the staff. Personally I hate that approach but it’s the way of the world currently. The talent level just isn’t where it needs to be and, barring a drastic change, it’s not going to get there anytime soon
With recruiting limited to online evals and zoom until at least September, this should be the best offseason for grassroots coaches to get hired. They’re talking about an AAU coach getting the freaking head job at Fordham.
I think more programs, especially as bad as Fordham, should hire AAU coaches who can bring their entire team, similar to Penny. Pitt shouldn't be above this either.
I don't disagree that a staff change would be appropriate of at least one assistant right now but I also wonder how much of this is tied to the original class that was brought in. It was late and based on who was available and I wonder if they really fit the culture Capel wants.
Trey has already transferred due to locker room divisions and this is the second straight season where Toney and/or his family are butt hurt over his status or perceived status and are talking about transferring.
Not sure what happened with Horton at the end of the game Saturday. Has anyone heard anymore on that? Is it part of another locker room division like last year?
I knew building from 0-18 would be difficult but I don't think starting over again with a whole new coaching staff is the right way to go.
They need to find a way to right the ship.
Trey has already transferred due to locker room divisions and this is the second straight season where Toney and/or his family are butt hurt over his status or perceived status and are talking about transferring.
Not sure what happened with Horton at the end of the game Saturday. Has anyone heard anymore on that? Is it part of another locker room division like last year?
I knew building from 0-18 would be difficult but I don't think starting over again with a whole new coaching staff is the right way to go.
They need to find a way to right the ship.
I didn’t suggest a whole new staff. But something is obviously off and if Champ leaves we’re starting at zero again next year. If he doesn’t make staff changes he is essentially coaching for his job in 2022.
The biggest issue is that Capel's first full class, which is usually the best for a new HC as they can sell their "vision" was subpar. He whiffed on 10 big guys and ended up with Coulibaly, who is a bench player on a good team. Drumgoole and Murphy were complete misses. Only Champagnie turned out to be a P6 level player. That's just bad. He hasnt brought in anyone to challenge Johnson and Toney.
If you look at Young/VT, he inherited who I thought was a pretty good PG in Wadissa Bede and immediately recruited over him to the point that Bede barely plays.
IMO JC seems like another Foge, great guy but not HC material. The players look to him as another buddy and not the boss. Maybe Duke was pulling another Wisconsin seeing if Capel could right the ship here and then bring him back to replace Coach K. Hope things get better H2P!
I Didn't think - you did -- I was addressing some of the other threads as well that are calling for Capel's head in my response as well. Sorry for the confusion.
I don’t think anyone is calling for his head right now, but there are clearly some serious issues that need to be fixed ASAP.
I don't see it as Xs and Os but just general game-planning, development, and motivation. I said earlier in the year, and got hammered for it, that Capel has not developed a single player on a Pitt roster. Everyone wanted to anoint Toney as having some great leap forward and now the same people want to throw him under the bus.
For the first time since Stallings squandered Young and Artis, I think the talent level on this team is underperforming due to the staff leadership. I think a lot of other coaches would be getting more out of this roster.
Every scenario I imagine at this point involves looking for a new HC in 2-3 years.. which is depressing..
that is unless Capel finally recruits this spring the way he was paid to
that is unless Capel finally recruits this spring the way he was paid to
Yea maybe but honestly I think its just a bad bunch. Kids with talent but arent team players or winning players. Huggy gets guys like this at WVU and then kicks them off rather quickly. Capel's problem is he hasnt recruited well enough to bench these guys or "encourage" them to leave. Its pretty evident from Capel's comments that these guys aren't even practicing properly or listening to gameplans. Most of that is on the players. We need new players more than anything but its hard to turn over a roster in college hoops.
If he finishes 6-12 and in the bottom 4 this year and then finishes in last place next year, I think he's gone.....unless he has a great 2022 class lined up. If you cant get out of the basement by Year 4, that's probably a sign its not going to work out
The thing to me that makes no sense is... everybody says Capel wanted a head coaching job to audition for the Duke job.. seems realistic, who knows if it’s fully the truth, but ok...
How do you sit under K for 7 years and then audition for his job and hire such an underwhelming staff (including your brother) and recruit so poorly and just seem so disorganized?
I don’t get it... is Pitt just that bad of a place that he can’t recruit here? I don’t really buy that considering the places recruits go but maybe that’s the case...
Just doesn’t make sense to me. You get your 2nd chance to be a P5 HC and either audition for your dream job OR become a legend at Pitt and you hire a retread staff and lack any true plan recruiting/team-building wise..
It just seems like the effort you’d see out of Kevin Stallings who’s packing it in at the end of his career and not Jeff Capel. Why not just stay at Duke as the AC and coast if this was the effort you were going to put forth?
I’m not saying he’s not trying, because he is. He clearly cares, but the staff and recruiting just tells me he’s not that urgent. And I don’t get that.
How do you sit under K for 7 years and then audition for his job and hire such an underwhelming staff (including your brother) and recruit so poorly and just seem so disorganized?
I don’t get it... is Pitt just that bad of a place that he can’t recruit here? I don’t really buy that considering the places recruits go but maybe that’s the case...
Just doesn’t make sense to me. You get your 2nd chance to be a P5 HC and either audition for your dream job OR become a legend at Pitt and you hire a retread staff and lack any true plan recruiting/team-building wise..
It just seems like the effort you’d see out of Kevin Stallings who’s packing it in at the end of his career and not Jeff Capel. Why not just stay at Duke as the AC and coast if this was the effort you were going to put forth?
I’m not saying he’s not trying, because he is. He clearly cares, but the staff and recruiting just tells me he’s not that urgent. And I don’t get that.
The further you get from being able to blame the previous HC for the records, the harder it is to recruit if you aren’t doing well. Unless Capel somehow bucks that trend but I’d think it would’ve been easier in either the 2020 or 2021 class than it will be moving forward if we keep looking so poor.
Part of it was he wanted guys he can trust. He had an assistant at OU paying players but at the same time how much of his success was related to this guy paying dudes? You pretty much have to give something to Top 75 players and this staff isnt going to do that.
I think we need to stop waiting for Capel to suddenly turn into a great recruiter. I see no evidence to suggest that will happen. Whether it’s because the staff stinks or he lost his touch or Pitt is a terrible place to recruit or we don’t cheat enough. Whatever reason, I don’t see any evidence recruiting will exceed Dixon’s before his decline.
I pretty much agree. And I honestly believe its the lack of cheating. I don't buy for 1 second that Pitt is harder to recruit to than Morgantown, Blacksburg, State College, Omaha, Lubbock, Iowa City, etc.
It seems pretty obvious that he thought a lot of what happened at Duke was due to him, and he was pretty clearly wrong. He came here and went after some pretty high profile guys and mostly struck out. His ego was probably boosted after XJ/Trey/Toney committed and performed better than we could've expected.
It boggles my mind that their game prep can be so ****ing bad with four head coaches on the staff.
Just a lame excuse. We might not cheat like Auburn, Zona, and LSU, but I guarantee we bend the rules similar to many other P5 programs.
And likewise, why hire Capel if you know he’s going to be very handicapped in recruiting?
I’d rather have Schmidt or Mike Young type coach if this is the recruiting we’re going to get.
The ONLY reason Capel had some success at Oklahoma was FOR CHEATING, and once that got stuffed, he is what he is , bad x and o and an avg at best recruiter, truth hurts but accept it. I was a supporter of his until the end of last year, supported the hire but I finally faced reality
I disagree with what you are saying however I understand your thinking behind it. I think recruiting has been about as good as it’s gonna get when the program was in the tank as poorly as it was.
O’Toole, Brown and even Jason for that matter have been failed head coaches. They failed for a reason and these aren’t shots at them, being a head coach is tough and it’s not like they were in better situations than they are now. Does anyone here think any of these three are ever gonna get another shot at being HC? Maybe O’toole because of his personality but the other two zero chance.
If this team was a better fundamental team that just lacked talent I wouldn’t care because I believe that’s how you develop good players. However this team just doesn’t do one small thing correct that makes me say this is going to improve in the future.
I can’t reiterate this enough, they can’t set a simple f’!:$: down screen correctly in year three. We can’t set up cuts, nobody moves well without the ball. I don’t watch a lick of women’s basketball but my wife had it on the other night, might’ve been Providence I have no clue. For the five mins that I watched, I was amazed and how well both teams moved away from the ball, their ability to get others open.
I know it looks bad, and my sense is they are most likely to continue to spin out.
But, there is just too much season left.
This team WAS playing a pretty decent level just a few week ago.
HCJC and these young men need to find a way to dig deep and pull it back together.
YOLO - just bagging this year will be pretty much wasting X, Toney and Champ (assuming he is going to go NBA early) entire college careers ...
But, there is just too much season left.
This team WAS playing a pretty decent level just a few week ago.
HCJC and these young men need to find a way to dig deep and pull it back together.
YOLO - just bagging this year will be pretty much wasting X, Toney and Champ (assuming he is going to go NBA early) entire college careers ...
Yep this times 1000.
I’d much rather have an elite X and O’s and practice guy as head coach because they can get the most of their players.
and the assistants #1 job should be to recruit and keep those players happy. If you’re not having daily talks with players about expectations of them and how they can help themselves in to the future you’re pretty much useless. And given the fact we’ve seen a total collapse from a few multiple years now it seems as if that’s not getting done.
When BK was there, he was seen as a coach and a big brother. Kids knew they could go to him for anything. Which guy on the staff do you think has those types of relationships?
Or...we could go out and smack the number 16 team in the country.
My solution is that most of you either go to the TCU or UCONN message boards...
Kudos to JC and team for a great win! Nice bounce back win!!! H2P!
Agreed! And I don’t think I should go to another board for agreeing!
Still seem pretty obvious we’re going to collapse?
I wonder which of the assistants have those relationships with X and Horton? Or is it our awful HC Capel?
If you do go to another board, please take SMF with you. And Wannyandwalt
It was a terrific move by coach to set a precedent with those two that they exhibited clearly unacceptable behavior that was detrimental to the team and they responded.
Not sure what else you could ask for out of a win.
No, I wouldn't call that development. He broke out halfway through his freshman year and has been our MVP ever since. He's played at a very high level his whole career.
I wouldn't suggest Dixon "developed" Blair either.
Disagree that he had no plan. He had a plan - hire staff he can trust completely (i.e., family) so that he doesn't get burned again - and recruit high level players near what he got at Duke. The issue is that neither of those tactics has proved successful.
We spent too much time on guys like Cole Anthony and Lester Quinones, guys that were never coming here, instead of dudes who were more realistic prospects. Someone like RJ Davis should have been our #1 PG target instead of our #3-4. Losing John Hugley also hurts so badly. It took us 3 years to recruit him and he was off the team after 2 months. No 2021 recruits to this point is also brutal.
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