A lighter scoring Hartnell is a good comp IMO. Wilson's physical impact on the game is more significant though, especially when he's allowed to go knocking guys out of the game with dirty hits.
OT: Penguins
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A lighter scoring Hartnell is a good comp IMO. Wilson's physical impact on the game is more significant though, especially when he's allowed to go knocking guys out of the game with dirty hits.
I hated Rick Tocchet. Hated him. I was also one of the happiest guys when we traded for him.
But guys like Cooke, Hartnell, Marchand, they are dirty for sure, but it is pure cheap nasty stuff. They also never fight. Wilson hurts people with borderline to cheap hits, but they hurt people because he is so big and strong.
The ONE person I have seen Wilson back down from is Reaves.
Those guys were really rats, not goons. Wilson isn’t technically a goon either. Goon implies that the guy cannot play. Wilson can definitely play. However, he loses control of his emotions from time to time and we should be able to take advantage of that.
The biggest rat in the current game is Brad Marchand in Boston.
Who’s staying up for the late night Pens game in LA? I love any chance I get to watch them on TV out here in Kansas City!
On a side note, I hope the NHL eventually decides to expand past 32. Maybe I’m bias, but KC would be a great hockey market. Would love to get to watch my team in person, especially if it’s right down the road.
On a side note, I hope the NHL eventually decides to expand past 32. Maybe I’m bias, but KC would be a great hockey market. Would love to get to watch my team in person, especially if it’s right down the road.
Staying up definitely. Bad start. Letang takes a penalty, LA scores. 1-0 Kings.Who’s staying up for the late night Pens game in LA? I love any chance I get to watch them on TV out here in Kansas City!
On a side note, I hope the NHL eventually decides to expand past 32. Maybe I’m bias, but KC would be a great hockey market. Would love to get to watch my team in person, especially if it’s right down the road.
Marleau had a great scoring chance on one of his first shifts. Nearly got one.
Yeah, that first penalty kill looked a little sluggish. They’re starting to come alive now.
And just as I type this, Crosby scores!
EDIT: Just kidding. Tough luck.
I know Sully wants to be a speed team that forechecks like crazy and play in your face. I like that idea too. What I am truly worried about come playoff time is that we get beaten and abused in a 7 game series and we won't be able to hold up physically. The trades have made us smaller. We have absolutely no one to stand up to the big hitters the Caps and Lightning have all over their lineups.
As we all know, Sullly has won cups with his style. With Boston, Tampa, and Washington all in the East, we are likely going to be involved in two long series if we plan to make a deep run. I doubt this team can hold up through the punishment it will take.
I also think the loss of Guentzel is too much to overcome. Rutherford has really shaken up the roster in an effort to find a replacement for him, but, so far, I am unimpressed with the acquisitions. We have really had problems scoring the last so many games. The secondary scoring we were getting has gone away.
I am not counting us out. That said, a season with a ton of promise is suddenly turning into a season with alot of questions.
As we all know, Sullly has won cups with his style. With Boston, Tampa, and Washington all in the East, we are likely going to be involved in two long series if we plan to make a deep run. I doubt this team can hold up through the punishment it will take.
I also think the loss of Guentzel is too much to overcome. Rutherford has really shaken up the roster in an effort to find a replacement for him, but, so far, I am unimpressed with the acquisitions. We have really had problems scoring the last so many games. The secondary scoring we were getting has gone away.
I am not counting us out. That said, a season with a ton of promise is suddenly turning into a season with alot of questions.
I’m not super concerned. This is the first real losing streak of the season for the Pens and they still have games in hand on a few teams. It was bound to happen. Happens to everyone — Washington just went through their little downturn. Get it out of the way now and finish strong down the stretch.Remember Super Bowl Sunday when the Pens beat the Capitals, Pitt beat Miami and everything was good. A lot of L’s since
Tough game tonight, makes it four straight losses. They are closer to the wildcard spot than first place. My, how a week changes things.
They actually played decent the last two games. Tonight they outplayed La by a fair bit but just didn’t get the bounces. They will finish well if they can continue to play with the level of intensity they played with tonite
And the shame of it is, Marchand can really play.
pittdan77
Athletic Director
There's a difference. The Pirates are using analytics solely for financial reasons.
Do you think they have curve plotted that determines the optimal number of bobbleheads needed to increase attendance, before any more bobbleheads will cease to bump attendance enough to justify the spending? Sort of like WAR, but maybe Suckers Above Replacement.
On the analytics point, I definitely agree that you have to take them with a grain of salt.
For whatever reason, often times, people will take that as an anti-analytics viewpoint, but it’s actually just the opposite. It’s just the next step in the evolution of being more sophisticated than just going by the numbers.
In baseball, analytics are a much cleaner match because what you’re trying to do in the first inning is really not that much different than what you’re trying to do in the fifth or even the ninth inning, regardless of the score of the game.
A double in the first inning and a double in the ninth-inning basically serve the same purpose.
However, in hockey, that’s not the same thing. Everything is situational and what you might be trying to accomplish on the first shift of the first period might be very different than what you’re trying to accomplish on the last shift of the third period, while trying to protect one goal lead.
It’s even more complicated than that based on where you take the face off to start your shift, do you start the shift on face off, special teams, game situation, etc. There’s no analytics in the world that can accurately account for all of those variables.
However, they can measure large parts of the game like how effective you are five on five, how much puck possession your team has when you are on the ice, your ability to drive play, your ability to stay for your opponents shots, etc.
Still, if you just go by the score sheet or even the analytics data, it can lead to some crazy conclusions which are simply untrue.
The analytics have definitely come a long, long way in a very short period of time in all sports – most especially hockey. However, you do still have to eyeball it as well or you will definitely love to regret it. You will be a team it looks great superficially but which cannot win.
For whatever reason, often times, people will take that as an anti-analytics viewpoint, but it’s actually just the opposite. It’s just the next step in the evolution of being more sophisticated than just going by the numbers.
In baseball, analytics are a much cleaner match because what you’re trying to do in the first inning is really not that much different than what you’re trying to do in the fifth or even the ninth inning, regardless of the score of the game.
A double in the first inning and a double in the ninth-inning basically serve the same purpose.
However, in hockey, that’s not the same thing. Everything is situational and what you might be trying to accomplish on the first shift of the first period might be very different than what you’re trying to accomplish on the last shift of the third period, while trying to protect one goal lead.
It’s even more complicated than that based on where you take the face off to start your shift, do you start the shift on face off, special teams, game situation, etc. There’s no analytics in the world that can accurately account for all of those variables.
However, they can measure large parts of the game like how effective you are five on five, how much puck possession your team has when you are on the ice, your ability to drive play, your ability to stay for your opponents shots, etc.
Still, if you just go by the score sheet or even the analytics data, it can lead to some crazy conclusions which are simply untrue.
The analytics have definitely come a long, long way in a very short period of time in all sports – most especially hockey. However, you do still have to eyeball it as well or you will definitely love to regret it. You will be a team it looks great superficially but which cannot win.
Yeah. Here's my first problem all of these new analytics. I have no historical basis to compare to. What was Mario or Gretzky or Messier? Secondly, (I think) alot of these are based on possession and "chances", I can remember those 90's Pens teams just coming down bing, bang, bong...GOAL!
Because still the ultimate analytic (for a forward at least) is scoring. Maybe for a 3rd or 4th line (if you still have them) then possession and chances are good way to determine their contribution, but if you are say Dominick Simon and on the top line, and aren't scoring goals, I don't care what your analytics are doing.
+/- has its weaknesses. But in some ways, it is a good snap shot. When Malkin was a -20 last year and Sid was a +25, those were real numbers indicating how they were both playing.
I always argue on Twitter with Pittsburgh's preeminent Analytics guy (Jesse Marshall) and he is so married to this doctrine, he doesn't want to even acknowledge that these numbers also have their shortcomings.
pittdan77
Athletic Director
Josh Anderson from Columbus is almost the exact same player. Anderson is faster and probably not quite as chippy, but they’re both true power forwards in a league that doesn’t have many of them anymore.
Kansas City has everything but an owner willing to pay for it all. If they had someone willing to run a team in KC, they would definitely have one by now.Who’s staying up for the late night Pens game in LA? I love any chance I get to watch them on TV out here in Kansas City!
On a side note, I hope the NHL eventually decides to expand past 32. Maybe I’m bias, but KC would be a great hockey market. Would love to get to watch my team in person, especially if it’s right down the road.
Who did we have standing up those to those tough guys when we won back to back cups a few years ago? It’s overrated – I’m telling you it’s wildly overrated.
If you skate, skate, skate, skate, skate, and you can manage to stay out of the box, you will wear teams down. I have seen it work with my own two eyes multiple times now.
Oh, he’s one of the best players in the league. However, nobody considers him to be in that class because he’s such an unrepentant rat. However, make no mistake about it, he is definitely one of the top 10 forwards in the NHL.
They theoretically have an owner, Lamar Hunt Jr, but he’s more focused on his ECHL team and growing the sport organically in the area. He’s been opening a lot of rinks in the area and is even building a smaller arena for a junior league team. I think it’s smart to build that type of interest before the NHL comes.
Kansas City would also be an ideal fit when you look at the recent expansion cities. Vegas and Seattle were both cities that craved sports and the NHL got there first, beating out the NFL (and MLB?) in Vegas and the NBA in Seattle. Kansas City will be a candidate once the NBA expands as well, so it may become a race to see who can become the third major sports league in KC.
Maybe a more realistic scenario would be landing a team through relocation, though I would hate to see that from a league standpoint. Arizona is an obvious choice, but the one team that many people aren’t talking about is Calgary.
They should move the Miami franchise to Kansas City
The biggest problem right now is a lack of good outlet passes from the D, it's been stifling the offense for weeks. Dumoulin & Marino will change that, even if they don't come back strong, which I expect to see happen.
Jack Johnson spending more time in the bench will help .
he playerd well most of the season - but he’s back into being garbage again
Yeah Doc - hockey is impossible to describe from a purely analytics perspective. But doing your eyeball scouting while heavily informed by analytics has made a huge impact, and the Pens have had long stretches since JR has arrived as the best in Hockey at it.
Check out the insane goals against numbers in the NHL the year Gretsky scored 92. It's practically a different sport.
81/82
Minnesota North Stars 288
Winnipeg Jets* 332
St. Louis Blues* 349
Chicago Black Hawks 363
Toronto Maple Leafs 380
Detroit Red Wings 351
Edmonton Oilers* 295
Vancouver Canucks* 286
Calgary Flames* 345
Los Angeles Kings* 369
Colorado Rockies 362
Montreal Canadiens* 223
Boston Bruins* 285
Buffalo Sabres* 273
Quebec Nordiques* 345
Hartford Whalers 351
New York Islanders* 250
New York Rangers* 306
Philadelphia Flyers* 326
Pittsburgh Penguins* 337
Washington Capitals 338
18/19
Tampa Bay Lightning* 222
Boston Bruins* 215
Toronto Maple Leafs* 251
Montreal Canadiens 236
Florida Panthers 280
Buffalo Sabres 271
Detroit Red Wings 277
Ottawa Senators 302
Washington Capitals* 249
New York Islanders* 196
Pittsburgh Penguins* 241
Carolina Hurricanes* 223
Columbus Blue Jackets 232
Philadelphia Flyers 281
New York Rangers 272
New Jersey Devils 275
Nashville Predators* 214
Winnipeg Jets* 272
St. Louis Blues* 223
Dallas Stars* 202
Colorado Avalanche* 260
Chicago Blackhawks 292
Minnesota Wild 237
Calgary Flames* 227
San Jose Sharks* 261
Vegas Golden Knights* 230
Arizona Coyotes 223
Vancouver Canucks 254
Anaheim Ducks 251
Edmonton Oilers 274
Los Angeles Kings 263
The Canadians, Buffalo, Boston, & NYI were the only good defensive squads in the whole League in 82. It's really hard to compare the eras.
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The City of Calgary announced a new arena for the Flames that will be opening in 2022 or ‘23 so they won’t be going anywhere now.
Must be why they’re not talking about them anymore! I knew they were at an impasse for a while, glad to see they got that figured out. Would be a shame if professional hockey ever left Calgary.
People are also forgetting.....there is still a quarter of the season left (20 games) for all teams. So alot of these white hot teams like Philly, there is alot of time for a "regression to the mean".
I would rather start getting hot the last 20 games, especially like the last 15 or so.
I would rather start getting hot the last 20 games, especially like the last 15 or so.
No, definitely not Calgary. After years of haggling, they announced earlier this year that they are going to build a new arena to replace the aging Saddledome. That’s definitely off-the-table.
I do believe that Arizona is a strong candidate for relocation. Their arena situation is really bad.
Glendale, which is also where the Cardinals play, is located about 20 miles west of the Phoenix city center and that’s always a bad deal for teams who play at least half of their home schedule on weeknights.
It is especially bad for a team in a nontraditional market in which most of the population is east of the city. People are just not going to drive 45 minutes to an hour each way on a Tuesday night to watch the Coyotes play the Winnipeg Jets.
I don’t think it’s coincidental that Florida, Arizona and Ottawa are the three most likely relocation candidates and all three teams have arenas located well outside their city‘s center.
That said, I think Houston is easily the most likely choice to land a relocated team. That is the fourth largest city in the country and the Rockets owner, Tillman Fertita has made his interest in owning an NHL team very clear. That is why I would be surprised if they didn’t have an NHL team (probably Arizona) within the next four or five years.
Yeah you’re right, didn’t see the deal got announced. I agree that the Coyotes moving to Houston is the most likely scenario, especially since they’re moving to the Central Division once Seattle joins. Although I will say that I hope the Coyotes stay in AZ, would be a nice to keep a team in that market. I really think they’d do better if they played closer to Phoenix, even if it was in Tempe. At least if, say, the Panthers move, there’s still another Florida NHL team in Tampa.
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