As I said 2 weeks ago, its a WR problem, not a QB problem/

[Sean Miller Fan]

Forget Henderson, he isnt even used in the passing game. Not sure why but he's not even an option. I honestly think he will seriously consider a grad transfer to a spread team where he can get the ball more in space. Not sure he can get to the NFL on kick returns alone if he doesn't do anything at WR.

If you look up and down the depth chart at WR, you see a lot of recruiting failure.

- Weah - not a P5 primary receiver. He took advantage of loading the box last year and an NFL QB. Pitt was his only P5 offer.

- Matthews - his recruitment was mostly as a DB and would not have been a high-level WR recruit

- Arujo-Lopes - Pitt was his only P5 offer

- Ffrench - Pitt and RU were his only P5 offers until Franklin tried to steal him late

- Flowers - lower P5 offers from Illinois and Kentucky and also a good P5 offer in Iowa. Doesn't say much but he's the highest recruited player but he's not even good enough to get on the field

- Tipton - injured but Mich St was only P5 offer besides Pitt.

We talk a lot about LB recruiting failures but WR is probably worse. Its hard to imagine that Pitt has ever had a weaker group of WRs.

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

Both positions are sorely lacking. It’s definitely a QB problem. It’s the most important position on the field for crissakes and ours just aren’t near good enough.

 

[jt0716]

Forget Henderson, he isnt even used in the passing game. Not sure why but he's not even an option. I honestly think he will seriously consider a grad transfer to a spread team where he can get the ball more in space. Not sure he can get to the NFL on kick returns alone if he doesn't do anything at WR.

If you look up and down the depth chart at WR, you see a lot of recruiting failure.

- Weah - not a P5 primary receiver. He took advantage of loading the box last year and an NFL QB. Pitt was his only P5 offer.

- Matthews - his recruitment was mostly as a DB and would not have been a high-level WR recruit

- Arujo-Lopes - Pitt was his only P5 offer

- Ffrench - Pitt and RU were his only P5 offers until Franklin tried to steal him late

- Flowers - lower P5 offers from Illinois and Kentucky and also a good P5 offer in Iowa. Doesn't say much but he's the highest recruited player but he's not even good enough to get on the field

The only real difference in the passing game is the QB an ot, and the RB. And oh yeah, the oc. I wouldn't blame this offense on the WR. Especially when the entire group is back from a season they set offensive scoring records.

 

[Jpripper88]

Both the WR and QB positions are awful.

 

[rpost3]

WR's are not good
TE's are not good (slightly better than the WR's)
QB's are not good (slightly better than the WR's)
RB's and OL are not good in pass protection (as bad as the WR's)

Safe to say the offensive coordinator is not good based on his past results elsewhere, but who knows.

The sad part about the passing game is the QB's might be the best part of it.

 

[Las Panteras]

And two weeks later, your post Is every bit as stupid.

 

[Deer Head]

The receivers create very little separation. Having a pro like Peterman covered this up for a few years to a degree. Very often there is no one open.

 

[vegasgreed]

This and our recruiting has not been good enough.

WR's are not good
TE's are not good (slightly better than the WR's)
QB's are not good (slightly better than the WR's)
RB's and OL are not good in pass protection (as bad as the WR's)

Safe to say the offensive coordinator is not good based on his past results elsewhere, but who knows.

The sad part about the passing game is the QB's might be the best part of it.

 

[Pittx9]

With weah though, the guy has so much speed he should be a much better receiver. Can't get any separation though, has fairly bad hands. They're not throwing the ball downfield ever though, no matter who is in at qb, why not get Henderson involved? We saw him against ok st catch a screen and take it for a long game. There's ways to get him involved.

Regardless though, they aren't getting it done. We have several good young receivers, why aren't they seeing the field more?

 

[thebadby2]

It's an everything problem offensively. We won;t even get into the D, but on O:

• the QB play has been woeful;
• the OL can't protect the passer;
• the RBs have looked lackluster in every way;
• the OL is getting pushed around on run plays;
• the play calling has been unimaginative and poorly choreographed;
• the offense for all of the above reasons has not been able to establish any rhythm, tempo or flow;
  
• the WRs have had limited touches, so hard to fully judge them yet:
• as others have noted, it doesn't look like the downfield WRs are getting any separation in their routes;
  
• the QBs haven;t had enough time to go deep downfield;
• the WRs, particularly Weah, have dropped too many balls;
• the WRs are struggling with their blocking on run plays;
• there has been a general failure to execute by just about everyone, which makes one wonder how effective the coaching was in spring and fall camp.

Other than that we are in great shape.

 

[thebadby2]

With weah though, the guy has so much speed he should be a much better receiver. Can't get any separation though, has fairly bad hands. They're not throwing the ball downfield ever though, no matter who is in at qb, why not get Henderson involved? We saw him against ok st catch a screen and take it for a long game. There's ways to get him involved.

Regardless though, they aren't getting it done. We have several good young receivers, why aren't they seeing the field more?

The rub on Weah has always been that he's an elite athlete, but a marginal football player. Last year he appeared to put it together, but last year we were so effective running the ball and keeping defenses off-balance, many of his catches were one on one, deep downfield and did not have high degrees of difficulty. He still had his drops, but he at least fulfilled the role of stretching the field for us. This year, he is being covered on every play, there is no run game to loosen up the pass, and the QBs have had neither the time nor the ability to go deep.

One significant criticism I have of these coaches is that they don't take any chances early in the game, and on favorable down and distance situations. For instance, why not be aggressive on the first possession and try to hit one over the top on first down? Even if it doesn't connect, the D has to account for that and will loosen up. And the QB will have a much better chance trying to throw the ball on first down, before the front 7 pins its ears back and the DBs press the receivers on 3rd and long. Likewise, on those rare occasions we find ourselves in a nice 2nd and 1 or 2, take a shot down the field--that;s when the D will least expect it. Browne and Nooch have been bad, but give 'em a chance to be successful at least. You're not going to make much of a living as a QB being in 3rd and long all the time.

There is definitely a stubbornness on the part of this coach and staff.

 

[Mikefln]

Henderson- Lacks real football skills. Yes if he has the ball in his hands in the open he is exciting and and great because he is so fast and athletic. But he lacks the nessisary football skills to get open as a WR that he is only good as a return man or the jet sweep.

Weah- Speed deamon who like Henderson lacks actual football ability.

Mathews- A football player but still learning the position. I will go on record that he will be the most improved player next season

Ffrench- Still young, I feel he can be coached up, do we have the coaches capable of it?

Flowers- not willing to comment yet, to small of a sample against bad situations, can't comment yet fairly.

Tipton- As mentioned he is injured, it is a shame as he is a solid player. He is not going to blow anyone away with his ability but he is good enough to be a solid contributor on any P5 team outside of the Alabama's of the world.

 

[Jpripper88]

The rub on Weah has always been that he's an elite athlete, but a marginal football player. Last year he appeared to put it together, but last year we were so effective running the ball and keeping defenses off-balance, many of his catches were one on one, deep downfield and did not have high degrees of difficulty. He still had his drops, but he at least fulfilled the role of stretching the field for us. This year, he is being covered on every play, there is no run game to loosen up the pass, and the QBs have had neither the time nor the ability to go deep.

One significant criticism I have of these coaches is that they don't take any chances early in the game, and on favorable down and distance situations. For instance, why not be aggressive on the first possession and try to hit one over the top on first down? Even if it doesn't connect, the D has to account for that and will loosen up. And the QB will have a much better chance trying to throw the ball on first down, before the front 7 pins its ears back and the DBs press the receivers on 3rd and long. Likewise, on those rare occasions we find ourselves in a nice 2nd and 1 or 2, take a shot down the field--that;s when the D will least expect it. Browne and Nooch have been bad, but give 'em a chance to be successful at least. You're not going to make much of a living as a QB being in 3rd and long all the time.

There is definitely a stubbornness on the part of this coach and staff.

And he dropped one and Browne missed on at least 2 deep balls.

 

[Jpripper88]

Henderson- Lacks real football skills. Yes if he has the ball in his hands in the open he is exciting and and great because he is so fast and athletic. But he lacks the nessisary football skills to get open as a WR that he is only good as a return man or the jet sweep.

Weah- Speed deamon who like Henderson lacks actual football ability.

Mathews- A football player but still learning the position. I will go on record that he will be the most improved player next season

Ffrench- Still young, I feel he can be coached up, do we have the coaches capable of it?

Flowers- not willing to comment yet, to small of a sample against bad situations, can't comment yet fairly.

Tipton- As mentioned he is injured, it is a shame as he is a solid player. He is not going to blow anyone away with his ability but he is good enough to be a solid contributor on any P5 team outside of the Alabama's of the world.

I think the fact Flowers can't even get on the field, considering those ahead of him, tells you an awful lot about where he is and his potential.

I think you are giving Tipton an unbelievable amount of credit and I am not sure what it is based on. He caught 12 balls last year and looked to be solid, but certainly nothing jumped out. I think on most teams with a decent WR crops he would be a 4th option, at best.

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

Lopes and Matthews are the two best receivers. Henderson is good with the ball in his hand, but doesn't have any receiving skills. Ffrench has potential. Weah, Flowers, and Clark can't catch.

 

[President Stache]

I agree with everyone else on here. If you look at last year, and I posted it as well, we entered the season with no options. We had Ford that was injured the first game before the penn state game, and left us with no experienced receivers entering that game.

Yet, Peterman orchestrated the best offense in Pitt history the rest of the year.

Now, with even more experience at the WR spot, we are woeful. True, the receivers are not playing well, but I think a correlation is more leaned to the QB in this case.

 

[BuffetParrothead]

When I read this post and other posts it appears that we don't have competitive P5 at QB, WR, LB, DL, CB, OL ?
If this is the case what has HCPN been doing for the last three years?

Stocking up players for our move to the MAC?
With our MAC AD leading the way!
And our MAC oriented PITT admin.?

When do we start behaving like a ACC P5 team?

 

[Mikefln]

I think the fact Flowers can't even get on the field, considering those ahead of him, tells you an awful lot about where he is and his potential.

I think you are giving Tipton an unbelievable amount of credit and I am not sure what it is based on. He caught 12 balls last year and looked to be solid, but certainly nothing jumped out. I think on most teams with a decent WR crops he would be a 4th option, at best.

Fair enough with Flowers. As far as Tipton, i may be more optimistic than you but we are basically saying the same thing. He is solid and a contributor but not a world beater. That is what I said and it appears you are admitting it. The problem for Pitt is not Tipton, being a bad WR because he is not. The problem is he is the top 1 or 2 WR here but at most other P5 schools he would be the number 4.

 

[sibleyfan91]

We

When I read this post and other posts it appears that we don't have competitive P5 at QB, WR, LB, DL, CB, OL ?
If this is the case what has HCPN been doing for the last three years?

Stocking up players for our move to the MAC?
With our MAC AD leading the way!
And our MAC oriented PITT admin.?

When do we start behaving like a ACC P5 team?

He and the staff likely have been diligently pursuing top guys, who seem to like what they hear ... then ultimately dad or mom or the high school coach sticks his palm out ... and instead of keys to a free Escalade lease, or blue book with all the freshman year essays prewritten ... Narduzzi can only slap em five. And the interest ceases. Repeat with the next, until he finds guys not yet accomplished or hyped enough to be able to demand that. Sometimes such guys surprise and do well. More often they find exactly the level the stars say they will.

 

[vegasgreed]

The WR recruiting has sucked.

 

[Jpripper88]

We

He and the staff likely have been diligently pursuing top guys, who seem to like what they hear ... then ultimately dad or mom or the high school coach sticks his palm out ... and instead of keys to a free Escalade lease, or blue book with all the freshman year essays prewritten ... Narduzzi can only slap em five. And the interest ceases. Repeat with the next, until he finds guys not yet accomplished or hyped enough to be able to demand that. Sometimes such guys surprise and do well. More often they find exactly the level the stars say they will.

That is just not true. It is a pathetic and incorrect excuse.

 

[Jpripper88]

Lopes and Matthews are the two best receivers. Henderson is good with the ball in his hand, but doesn't have any receiving skills. Ffrench has potential. Weah, Flowers, and Clark can't catch.

Lopes is unbelievably pedestrian. He shouldn't be the #5 on a good P5 team.

 

[BuffetParrothead]

The WR recruiting has sucked.

It was pretty good in the past with Fitz, Baldwin, Street, & Boyd.

Running backs weren't bad McCoy, Lewis, & Conner

QB's recent good ones same with OL & DL

We could go thru lots of positions with great Panther players now in the NFL and all of a sudden we hit a wall with recruiting?

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

The WR recruiting has sucked.

It was pretty good in the past with Fitz, Baldwin, Street, & Boyd.

Running backs weren't bad McCoy, Lewis, & Conner

QB's recent good ones same with OL & DL

We could go thru lots of positions with great Panther players now in the NFL and all of a sudden we hit a wall with recruiting?

Devin Street and Tyler Boyd were the last 2 legitimate major D1 WRs. Everyone since has been lower P5 to MAC level.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Forget Henderson, he isnt even used in the passing game. Not sure why but he's not even an option. I honestly think he will seriously consider a grad transfer to a spread team where he can get the ball more in space. Not sure he can get to the NFL on kick returns alone if he doesn't do anything at WR.

If you look up and down the depth chart at WR, you see a lot of recruiting failure.

- Weah - not a P5 primary receiver. He took advantage of loading the box last year and an NFL QB. Pitt was his only P5 offer.

- Matthews - his recruitment was mostly as a DB and would not have been a high-level WR recruit

- Arujo-Lopes - Pitt was his only P5 offer

- Ffrench - Pitt and RU were his only P5 offers until Franklin tried to steal him late

- Flowers - lower P5 offers from Illinois and Kentucky and also a good P5 offer in Iowa. Doesn't say much but he's the highest recruited player but he's not even good enough to get on the field

- Tipton - injured but Mich St was only P5 offer besides Pitt.

We talk a lot about LB recruiting failures but WR is probably worse. Its hard to imagine that Pitt has ever had a weaker group of WRs.

And you are wrong. Not that WR is not a problem, but QB sure is a problem. Our QB's suck.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

I think the fact Flowers can't even get on the field, considering those ahead of him, tells you an awful lot about where he is and his potential.

I think you are giving Tipton an unbelievable amount of credit and I am not sure what it is based on. He caught 12 balls last year and looked to be solid, but certainly nothing jumped out. I think on most teams with a decent WR crops he would be a 4th option, at best.

What is scary is that of all the positions, WR is the one position more than any other where a FR should be able to have an impact. Look at AB, Fitz, Boyd, Baldwin, I mean from the moment they went to August camp they were making impacts.

 

[Jpripper88]

What is scary is that of all the positions, WR is the one position more than any other where a FR should be able to have an impact. Look at AB, Fitz, Boyd, Baldwin, I mean from the moment they went to August camp they were making impacts.

Exactly. It tells we either have a really big problem that the guys this staff is bringing in aren't very good or this staff is for some reason "saving" them and is overly committed to some stupid notion that they have decent players ahead of them, so it is more important to save redshirts than have clear talent upgrades on the field. Either way, it is a big problem. As of right now we have 1 WR commit and he is a middling recruit who had few other P5 options when he committed.

Recruiting needs to get better REAL quick.

 

[PittGuyYessir]

It was pretty good in the past with Fitz, Baldwin, Street, & Boyd.

Running backs weren't bad McCoy, Lewis, & Conner

QB's recent good ones same with OL & DL

We could go thru lots of positions with great Panther players now in the NFL and all of a sudden we hit a wall with recruiting?

Recruiting has been mediocre at best since Wanny left. It doesn't appear to be trending in the right direction currently, and the city's apathy towards Pitt football is no longer just a local secret.

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

Lopes is unbelievably pedestrian. He shouldn't be the #5 on a good P5 team.

No doubt, simply shows how bad the other guys are.

 

[President Stache]

It was pretty good in the past with Fitz, Baldwin, Street, & Boyd.

Running backs weren't bad McCoy, Lewis, & Conner

QB's recent good ones same with OL & DL

We could go thru lots of positions with great Panther players now in the NFL and all of a sudden we hit a wall with recruiting?

Please...

Are you going to honestly tell me if tomorrow we get a commitment from a 5'7" 3 star RB or a 3 star DE that we want to move to linebacker you would label those recruits as 'pretty good'?

I call BULL

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Exactly. It tells we either have a really big problem that the guys this staff is bringing in aren't very good or this staff is for some reason "saving" them and is overly committed to some stupid notion that they have decent players ahead of them, so it is more important to save redshirts than have clear talent upgrades on the field. Either way, it is a big problem. As of right now we have 1 WR commit and he is a middling recruit who had few other P5 options when he committed.

Recruiting needs to get better REAL quick.

But it doesn't seem to. I am wondering if we even pull in Kwantel Raines.

What is scary, is that Miami, UVa, Syracuse and VT have all significantly upgraded their programs with good coaching choices over the past few years. Not sure right now about us.

These schools are recruiting better too. We need to step it up. I am not calling for Narduzzi to be fired, but I am calling for significant staff changes with some hired gun recruiters.

 

[vegasgreed]

I doubt were getting Raines.

 

[Jpripper88]

But it doesn't seem to. I am wondering if we even pull in Kwantel Raines.

What is scary, is that Miami, UVa, Syracuse and VT have all significantly upgraded their programs with good coaching choices over the past few years. Not sure right now about us.

These schools are recruiting better too. We need to step it up. I am not calling for Narduzzi to be fired, but I am calling for significant staff changes with some hired gun recruiters.

Yeah, at this point, even with great coaching, I am not sure how we ever have a chance for a division title, unless we somehow land a multi year star QB and others whiff badly there.

 

[JokePa]

But it doesn't seem to. I am wondering if we even pull in Kwantel Raines.

What is scary, is that Miami, UVa, Syracuse and VT have all significantly upgraded their programs with good coaching choices over the past few years. Not sure right now about us.

These schools are recruiting better too. We need to step it up. I am not calling for Narduzzi to be fired, but I am calling for significant staff changes with some hired gun recruiters.

Totally agree. We need some recruiting pedigreed person. Didnt Wanny have a guy that was a recruiting guru? Recruiting is half the game in the college ranks, we need some bad ass recruiters. I think Narduzzi is a good recruiting, parents will like him, kids feel he is a players coach. But, we need some great ones.

 

[DiehardPanther]

But it doesn't seem to. I am wondering if we even pull in Kwantel Raines.

What is scary, is that Miami, UVa, Syracuse and VT have all significantly upgraded their programs with good coaching choices over the past few years. Not sure right now about us.

These schools are recruiting better too. We need to step it up. I am not calling for Narduzzi to be fired, but I am calling for significant staff changes with some hired gun recruiters.

Syracuse - what exactly has he done? He has recruited worse than Narduzzi, and the records speak for themselves.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Syracuse - what exactly has he done? He has recruited worse than Narduzzi, and the records speak for themselves.

OK. So we finish above Syracuse. YAY! NARDUZZI FOR PRESIDENT! You people just reward and perpetuate mediocrity then wonder why no one goes to games.

 

[DiehardPanther]

OK. So we finish above Syracuse. YAY! NARDUZZI FOR PRESIDENT! You people just reward and perpetuate mediocrity then wonder why no one goes to games.

You are the one that made the comment about them slappy.

 

[vegasgreed]

People are now getting excited on this board when our D holds teams to less than 35 points...

 

[Jpripper88]

Totally agree. We need some recruiting pedigreed person. Didnt Wanny have a guy that was a recruiting guru? Recruiting is half the game in the college ranks, we need some bad ass recruiters. I think Narduzzi is a good recruiting, parents will like him, kids feel he is a players coach. But, we need some great ones.

Jeff Hafley. He was connected big time in NJ and is a great guy and a fantastic recruiter. He is now a DB coach for the 49ers and I think is comfortable with the NFL job and not looking to return to the college game, but he would be a great addition to the staff.

 

[sibleyfan91]

That is just not true. It is a pathetic and incorrect excuse.

It's true more often than it isn't.