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Don't blame Dixon, Blame the higher ups

How many 18 year olds REALLY know what they want to do with their life? I know I didn't. I was into my second grad program until I really did.

Arguably, college should be delayed for an awful lot of people. The universal junior college idea I mentioned earlier might be a meaningful intermediate reform and allow many to find their way, and save $50K or so.

I think that was kind of my point although I may not have stressed enough that the parents and students aren't necessarily at fault. There's a stigma about college, that once upon a time was far more true. Not everyone is made for it. Not everyone needs it. And quite frankly I've found over time that at least two years of it (save some engineering, technical, and medical fields) are a complete waste of time.

The answer to your question? Not many 18 year olds truly know. And even those who think they do - as most of us can attest - find themselves in a place 20 years later they never would have expected. And too many people find that their four year degree has absolutely no bearing on their field in the end.

So yes, I think the system is flawed and I do think the money involved will bring about change at some point. The costs of education will only continue to go up as they always have. At some point, many people simply won't be able to afford it. The good news is that knowledge is far more accessible and available to far more people today at no cost and that trend will continue.
 
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I think that was kind of my point although I may not have stressed enough that the parents and students aren't necessarily at fault. There's a stigma about college, that once upon a time was far more true. Not everyone is made for it. Not everyone needs it. And quite frankly I've found over time that at least two years of it (save some engineering, technical, and medical fields) are a complete waste of time.

The answer to your question? Not many 18 year olds truly know. And even those who think they do - as most of us can attest - find themselves in a place 20 years later they never would have expected. And too many people find that their four year degree has absolutely no bearing on their field in the end.

So yes, I think the system is flawed and I do think the money involved will bring about change at some point. The costs of education will only continue to go up as they always have. At some point, many people simply won't be able to afford it. The good news is that knowledge is far more accessible and available to far more people today at no cost and that trend will continue.
Unfortunately back in the day, high school graduation meant it was time to grow up & get a job or go to college. Today a college degree is the equivalent to a high school degree to get an entry level job. It sucks for the kids who don't want to go to school & for the kids that do,...it sucks for the parents footing the bills. I've paid $120k & have another $120k the next four years, so my kids have only their staffers loans to pay.
 
Mark Cuban has the best idea regarding student debt that I've heard and that's to limit the amount of money one can borrow. As long as the money is available why wouldn't the universities and colleges continue to raise tuition. If all you could borrow is 50/100k the 50-60k/ year schools would either be forced to lower coasts or disappear. I also feel that once you declare a major the university is obligated to review future employment opportunities and salary. The loss of high paying blue collar jobs is a problem in our society and with a world economy there not coming back.
 
many people end up in careers they didn't even have a degree for. Not that this a bad thing.
Unfortunately, the undergraduate degree HAS been devalued already. It's basically just an entry ticket into the market in many jobs.

Mostly, an undergrad degree demonstrates you have the ability to learn and hopefully have an understanding of the learning process. That's NOT a bad thing. Designing a course of study for a particular job is often futile because the market has moved on before the student has completed the process.

Anyone who has looked seriously at the curriculum high school graduates had to master 100 years ago understands that many of them had more of the basic classic liberal arts education knowledge than many college grads today.

I'm not saying they were prepared for life in the 21st century. Technology is completely different. But, a huge number of college freshmen are routed through remedial courses to acquire basic knowledge 8th graders had then.

Our entire education system needs an overhaul. I took some education courses at a college level and am or was technically qualified to teach high school chemistry although I worked in industry. I also sat on my local school district's Strategic Planning Committee for several years during my career. There are just a lot of nearly insurmountable problems everywhere and arguably, it should be blown up and redesigned from the ground up.

We have to give kids basic knowledge and prepare them to be "lifetime learners." That's one thing the modern education system has right. They may not do it well, but they understand that goal.
 
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Mark Cuban has the best idea regarding student debt that I've heard and that's to limit the amount of money one can borrow. As long as the money is available why wouldn't the universities and colleges continue to raise tuition. If all you could borrow is 50/100k the 50-60k/ year schools would either be forced to lower coasts or disappear. I also feel that once you declare a major the university is obligated to review future employment opportunities and salary. The loss of high paying blue collar jobs is a problem in our society and with a world economy there not coming back.
This thread has certainly taken a strange turn but it is relevant for those with kids or grand children in the education system.

Too many colleges and universities , and Pitt is as guilty as anyone else, have effectively become too greedy. They admit many more kids into their entry level classes than they could hdle in the core, junior and senior courses in most majors. Basically, they are happy to take one or two years's tuition and then slam the door on a significant portion of candidates in many majors.

Yeah, it's natural selection. If a kid can't get into the program in his or her desired major after sophomore year, they probably would not have been successful there professionally. But ethically, I have real problems when the ideals of higher education actually seem to be reduced to scheming on how many kids can they squeeze into this freshman class and harvest 30 or 40 grand from before they fall out. Or are pushed into frequently worthess majors.
 
There are many reasons for this, and blaming pitt would be far down that list.

Nope. I totally disagree. The last decade or so was possibly one of the most important decades in Pitt history for attracting NEW athletic donor population, and Pitt fumbled badly.
 
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Anyone who has looked seriously at the curriculum high school graduates had to master 100 years ago understands that many of them had more of the basic classic liberal arts education knowledge than many college grads today.

I get your point, but how many people 100 years ago were learning calculus at 17?
 
Nope. I totally disagree. The last decade or so was possibly one of the most important decades in Pitt history for attracting NEW athletic donor population, and Pitt fumbled badly.
I don't think that's unreasonable at all..which was #1 reason why Steve needed to go.

We hired a fundraising specialist in the AD..so, hopefully, he works on improving it.
 
I get your point, but how many people 100 years ago were learning calculus at 17?
In a quick search, I did't find ANY mention of calculus, but most studied Algebra and geometry. In 1970, my high school did not offer calculus.
 
In a quick search, I did't find ANY mention of calculus, but most studied Algebra and geometry. In 1970, my high school did not offer calculus.
My 3 year old aced first derivatives. A little struggle with "shells".
 
In a quick search, I did't find ANY mention of calculus, but most studied Algebra and geometry. In 1970, my high school did not offer calculus.

I took algebra I & II, pre-calculus, calculus I & II, geometry, statistics, and computer programming by the time I graduated high school. Different priorities these days.
 
In a quick search, I did't find ANY mention of calculus, but most studied Algebra and geometry. In 1970, my high school did not offer calculus.
Well, you had to navigate by Sextant...so geography was more important.
copy-of-100_2522.jpg
 
Well, you had to navigate by Sextant...so geography was more important.
copy-of-100_2522.jpg
I was reading an article last week on the early generation Boeing 747's. They were made with a top cockpit window to navigate by taking star and sun sightings with a sextant. Seems hard to believe.
 
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