to me, this is the biggest mystery of Capel. His father was a coach, he played at Duke and "interned" as an assistant there. He has experience as the head man at the P4 level. To be this poor at his job is really hard to fathom.
Fire Capel
- Thread starter TheSpecialSauce
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to me, this is the biggest mystery of Capel. His father was a coach, he played at Duke and "interned" as an assistant there. He has experience as the head man at the P4 level. To be this poor at his job is really hard to fathom.
He’s earned the fan disinterest and criticism
It’s one thing to be lacking talent
But it’s clear he’s lost this team They play with little enthusiasm or intensity. They are undisciplined on offense and defense There is little structure to anything they do. It’s really because one on one playground basketball. IF he’s doing any coaching at all it’s clear they’ve tuned him out. Would love to see what one of his practices looked like before the crash and now.
I don’t have a clue what the answer is but I’d be curious to know how many teams have the same staff as long as Pitt has. And while I said I don’t know the answer I’m certain it’s very few if any.
And it is. There are so many components to developing a good football team. Hoops you need one to two difference makers and the rest decent players who are willling to do whatever it takes to win. I’m not sure this team has any of those things And if they do they are being coached poorly
No, not even close. Ed Bozik, hands down.
But I'm beginning to think that by default we can say Pederson was the best AD since Cas. And that's a pretty scary thought.
I think there’s a difference between coaching a team of four and five start players who already have high basketball IQs and scads of talent and putting together a team and developing the talent and getting them to play disciplined team basketball. If his dad emphasized those things he clearly has forgotten them or simply is not an alpha that’s needed to lead a team. He might be a good bench coach but it’s apparent he’s not head coach material
These days, I believe it is going to be very, very difficult for Pitt to go after any established head coaches with proven track records even if they throw a big base salary at them. The program's reputation isn't in good shape. The facilities are mediocre. And more importantly, I think any coach is going to want to know what Pitt's NIL warchest looks like, and that should concern everyone greatly. Hope I'm wrong, but don't expect to land a new coach that is a "can't miss" type.
No way he is going to accept a low buyout after this stench from this collapse. He'd never want to leave like that voluntarily.
I'm guessing he's going to have one more season if the info about his buyout dropping next year are true.
I didn't think it was anything close to a great hire.
Capel bombed at OU & had some NCAA issues. At Duke, Capel went 4-3 with a really talented Duke team when he subbed for K while he was out after back surgery. I don't think getting fired at a program like OU and spending the next 7 years as an assistant is something that screams great hire.
However, I can see some logic behind the hire and reason for optimism. The Capel name carries some weight in ACC circles & Pitt had been without an identity since joining the league & he had the rep of a strong recruiter. (even though that can almost always be said about the assistants at blue bloods)
But Capel has always been a mediocre coach.
Most thought he was pretty "high level" candidate who guy who could certainly energize the program and recruit at a much higher level. Things turned in a weird way at Oklahoma. Coming here to reestablish himself made plenty of sense.
Perhaps you saw differently when the hire was made, but you would have been one of the few who did.
Again, most thought he really checked so many important boxes. If you saw differently, then you were one of the few.
I loved the hire, especially coming off the 2 Stallings seasons. But I also knew after year 3 that he wasn't gonna work out. It was getting obvious. Year 4 solidified that belief. Then Hugley pouted and Capel changed up some things in year 5 and they still barely got a play-in game invite. Year 6 we were all so hopeful and with a 1st round draft pick and Blake Hinson they still couldn't make the NCAA Tournament. This season is back to year 1 and 2.
I mean enough is enough with Jeff Capel already. And it's criminal he's been allowed to keep the same useless staff and promoting them too the whole 7 seasons. What the hell have they done to earn the right to be here 7 seasons in? His whole tenure has been a failure.
You’d like to think, however, that Pitt can at least hire candidates who were successful coaches at a lower level. There is no substitute for having the experience of being the head of the entire operation including assembling a staff, game planning, making in game decisions, dealing with the fans and media etc. The limited experience of running an O or a D or being the number 2 or 3 asst. on the bench makes candidates with those credentials a big risk, and then when you hire 4-5 coaches in a row with that limited experience and have poor results, you are asking for the kind of problems and fan disillusionment Pitt is experiencing and has confronted now for decades.
Yeah, a few people definitely pointed to this at the time. I admit I assumed his time at Oklahoma (namely, the post Blake Griffin failures) was a lot less relevant than it actually was, as I would have guessed the seven years at Duke after that would have taught him a thing or two.
But lot of people were even happy we got Capel over Hurley, which is kind of funny now.
Wasn't Mark Schmidt's name also leaked (possibly by design to see how the fans would react)? Presumably, he was way too close to what Stallings was (old white guy coming from a lesser program) for that to go over well.
No school is out there hiring coaches that are "cant miss" types. Dan Hurley was far from a can't miss & he really did nothing of note at UCONN until the NCAA Tourney run of 2023, which UCONN entered as a #5 seed.
FWIW, Almost the entire Top 25 is filled with coaches that are either retreads, coaches with huge skeletons in their closet that made them unhirable to a lot of schools, (There are A LOT of those that are killing it) or up and comers who might be viewed as somewhat risky.
Funny thing, THREE were former Longhorns. Rick Barnes, Shaka Smart, and Chris Beard.
Schmidt's name was mentioned. I took that one about as seriously as the Tom Bradly leaks for football.
I generally agree HC experience is preferred. It will all depend on how hot the candidate is and what options he perceives that he has. These days, any candidate is going to want to discuss what type of NIL they are going to have to work with. Half the fan base appears to refuse to even consider NIL as a option for support, so I'm not optimistic. I hope I'm wrong.
It sounded like he had interviewed (assuming multiple times) and they were ready to pull the trigger on him. No idea how valid it was, but it didn't like someone just throwing something at the wall.
Yeah, I got the sense that Mark Schmidt was Lyke’s preferred choice but the backlash to the leak caused them to regroup… I’ll let someone “in the know” confirm/dispute this.
I guess that's entirely possible. I remember reading about it at the time, but I just assumed it was a courtesy interview somebody had pulled some strings for his time at Bobby Mo.
There's so much smoke and deliberate bullshit leaked during coaching searches, it's really hard to tell what is and isn't true. I usually just wait for the chosen one to be walked to the podium
Compared to the rumors of candidates -
I was thrilled . Still patient with him the first 5 years.
Now -
It’s time
We will never compete for a national championship in football again.
Hoops there’s a chance
I think the lack of talent in the frontcourt really hurts this team. I don't think Pitt has the most coachable guards/wings & I don't think holding players accountable is Capel's strong suit.
I think it almost mirrors exactly what we see going on right now at UNC.
Yea, as I said, it was just a relief that Pitt didn’t hire the stiff most prominently associated with the job that made the Capel hire acceptable…he hadn’t done squat to give confidence he would be successful….. but that Duke branding cast such a bright public light that most folks just fell into a state of resigned relief. Heather made the hire which won the PR war at the time.
Maybe. Maybe not.
For starters, this year still isn't over. While they appear to a team that has checked out, perhaps they can regroup and at least play hard and compete the rest of the year.
I think whether it's time to move on or not depends on the money. I don't think you just stroke a check to make a change for a coach that is under contract through 2030. Encourage them to look for other enticing opportunities. (longshot, but worth a try). Depending on how much the buyout drops, start to choke out their NIL $$$ to coincide with the drop in the buyout. Let them bleed out. You're really not accomplishing anything if you have to pay a lot to buy one coach out and then have to cut corners on the next hire and his NIL pot.
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We will never compete for a national championship in either sport.
But we're much farther away from being Duke/Auburn/etc. in basketball than we are from being Clemson/SMU/Indiana/Arizona State in football, and I think making the playoff in football would receive a reaction that only making the Final Four in basketball would compare to. Hell, Notre Dame just played for a national championship and they were not that good.
I get that there is more of an "anybody can beat anybody on a given day" vibe in basketball and that breeds hope. But there are also a hell of a lot more teams that applies to. And the Big Ten/SEC TV money disparity still holds true in basketball, as do the huge NIL differences (plus you have to add more non BIG/SEC players in basketball, such as the Big 12 teams, Duke, UNC, the Big East Teams, etc., etc., etc.).
Simple math
Can make a run in the Big Dance if you get in .
We are very unlikely to even make the CFP
We haven't made a Final Four since the World War II days, when there were like 25 teams in the tournament. It must not be as easy as people claim. One single Elite 8 appearance since it expanded to 64 teams, while we just finished in the top 12 in football a few years ago.
Neither a Final Four nor a CFP are likely to happen any time soon, and I don't know that one is easier to obtain than the other.
You’re so right and it’s scary to think that Pederson was the best AD since Cas. Hopefully it changes with Green.
Greene walked into an almost impossible situation. His only hope is to recruit a whale, or several baby whales that help get him out of the situation the athletic department is in. I seriously doubt Joan Gabel is going to divert more funds to athletics. They have a bid enough problem with Victory Heights.
It was higher than they wanted to pay for them, for whatever reason. We supposedly offered Hurley more money than any of these alternatives.
Again, the claim that Pitt is cheap isn't accurate at all. Pitt is getting very little value for what it is spending on coaching in both revenue sports and on basketball talent.
The argument for hiring Capel was that he would bring his top tier recruiting connections along with him here, before you could just pay players legally (though Capel had a reputation for being the bag man at Duke, which was arguably the source of those connections). I don't think anyone regarded Capel as a brilliant tactician or game day coach, but people (including myself) were excited about the hire given the smoking crater that had been left by Stallings.
No, there were eight teams in the tournament then.
A few years ago watching a game at the Pete, a friend saw the 1941 Final Four banner and asked about that. I told him how many teams made the tournament at that time, then watched his amused reaction as he did the math on how many games they won to reach that Final Four.
Well then that, along with the banners we have for NIT appearances, should be used as starter kindle at the next bonfire.
I mean, unless just getting to a tournament so small had some prestige to it. But, with it having happened in the middle of global warfare, something tells me there's an asterisk by it.
NC State made a final four in hoops just last year. Miami made it in the NIL era with a hoops budget almost identical to Pitt's. They didn't sustain success but that's partially my point: you can make a run that way.
Big East teams from small Catholic schools who focus their NIL since they don't have football (or in UConns case, who favor hoops over football) are absolutely competitive with the two richest conferences come March.
It's not remotely like what it takes to compete with Ohio State or Georgia football. Pitt will never do that, football is simply too much directly connected between spending and wins.
The idea that Notre Dame was "not that good" is so off. They were top 5 in the nation in snaps played by freshman and took that to a national championship game. They are loaded with expensive NFL level talent. They've had consistent top 12 recruiting classes. Pitt is not competing for those recruits.
Okay, and TCU just played for a national championship. Washington just played for a national championship. Arizona State, a bad Clemson team, SMU, Boise State, and Indiana were just in the playoff.
Notre Dame was loaded with explosive talent?!
Riley Leonard sucks.
Love is a decent back - no better than some of the Pitt backs Narduzzi has had.
Their leading receiver had 592 yards on the season. I knew Greathouse had a good game against Ohio State, but he really hasn't been that good.
Their d-line had two key injuries and they were playing with dudes who might not have started at Pitt. Hinish?! Lol, give me a break.
The fact that they advanced to the national championship was much more indicative on the state of college football this season. The fact that freshmen played so much is making the exact opposite point you think it's making. Those Clemson/Ohio State/Alabama juggernauts are a thing of the past. Teams don't have depth after the game of backup transferring musical chairs; that's why freshmen are being relied on.
