I work in research admin at a Big 10 school and focus on the expenditures numbers so I probably think too much in terms of research, in which Pitt is very much like the other Big 10 schools.
Jeff Goodman aka The Coach Whisperer says
- Thread starter WillFerrell
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So pay up for Hurley and then campaign for donations.
If you build it, they will come. Show the fan base you're serious and then ask for their support.
There us no other way to do it. All other pathways lead to failure at Pitt. You can be damn near sure of it.
All the mopey folks saying otherwise are part of the problem
Thank you for this post, even though you probably realize TD was trolling.
In any case, this is exactly why Hurley is the best option and should lead Lyke's list.
It's worth a bidding war with UConn to het him because there is no other candidate (ex Matta) better able to supply what we need right this very moment: cache.
FB doesn't define all of us. Pgh is decidedly NOT like Boston/NYC/Jersey/Philly/Baltimore/DC. It is much like Cleveland/C-Bus/Naptown/KC/Milwaukee/STL....and even Chicago.
I agree that Pitt is a bad fit for the B1G......but it is NOT eastern. It's like so much of what coastal elites call "flyover" land.
I don't think it is Midwestern or Eastern. It has qualities of both. It is its own thing, and that isn't a bad thing.
I love the place. Posting this from Dunedin, FL. Temps in the 50's most days. But we get to see my grandsons. Nutso group.
I may be wrong but I've heard it's not sbout money. Supposedly, Mrs Hurley prefers UConn and UConn would provide an easier path to the NCAAT. Hurley might want a bridge job between URI and a true elite job at the top of the ACC.
Not so.....he was Majors' top asst., recruited a skinny RB from Hopewell, and ran the defense. He was VERY much a known quantity. That year at Wazzou was meaningless...he was the easy, correct pick. Idiots like Madden or the FAN morons might whine, but they don't count.
Agree with most of this, but one of the biggest misconceptions out there is that coaches look for the “easiest path”. The guys at the top level are all alpha males, they want to compete against the best and think that they can do better.
That easiest path thing is just message board fodder, nothing more.
Maybe he proves me wrong with a tournament run, but I think he did a bad job managing his talent this year.
IMO they underachieved.
I agree with that I don’t necessarily follow them that closely but he will have three straight Tournament appearance at a school that haven’t been there since 05.
It’ll be interesting to see what happens with him when his core of Rodriguez, Delgado and Carrington graduates after this season.
No. I wasn't trolling at all.
Seriously, There are very few coaches that I would consider slam dunk hires, and Danny Hurley is FAR from being a slam dunk hire. Just stay with the Hurley name for example and look what Bobby did at Buffalo and how its translated to ASU. His first three years in Tempe have been very Sendek-esque.
Remember how big Shaka Smart to Texas was a few years ago? How is that working out?
I actually think Hurley is a better hire and more of a slam dunk hire for either UConn or Pitt than Smart was. In fact, I think Hurley's much, much better. Smart is a good coach, but what worked for him at VCU was "Havoc." It was a particular style of play that worked in the CAA, then the A10, that made it possible for VCU to compete with almost anyone. It didn't require elite shooters or dominant big men. It just required great athletes and a commitment.
At Texas, he's recruiting Top 100, 5-star players and has gone away from the coaching approach and system that provided him so much success at VCU. Not surprisingly, he's no longer getting the results.
As far as the Hurley name, I'm not suggesting Danny Hurley will win because of his last name. I'm suggesting he'll have recruiting inroads because of his name, which carries weight throughout the Mid-Atlantic, New England, and NY/NJ. All regions of consequence for Pitt basketball.
In short, Danny Hurley is a better fit for EITHER UConn or Pitt than Shaka Smart ever was (or ever will be) for Texas. Smart may yet win in Austin, but I never considered him a slam dunk.
Yes, Hurley is a slam dunk. If both Matta and Hurley wanted the job, I'd take Hurley EVERY time. He's a better fit for Pitt in almost every way imaginable.
He's going to win big at his next job. I'd bet on it. In fact, if he comes to Pitt, I'll go on record now and say he'll win at least 20 games by the 2020-2021 season.
P.S. Oh, re-read your post. Buffalo isn't even in the conversation with Rhode Island. That was part of my point. A10 isn't really mid-major. Apples to oranges. The idea that what Hurley's doing at RI wouldn't translate to Pitt is ridiculous. Hell, Hurley has a better recruiting class next year, including a top 50 player, than Pitt does. We could have kept Stallings and just switched recruiting classes with Hurley and been better off.
Even during the best of times, Pitt lags way behind other schools. The schools to the east and west of us put us to shame.
Not sure I agree. UConn as it is currently configured is a challenge enough to rebuild. But it's doable. And, with success, may parlay to a better job. Pitt is on the gurney with the sheet about to be drawn over its head. The risk of success versus failure is much greater. Which kills the chance for the next big gig and the fat payday forthcoming. These guys are competitive, but they are also wise, and have lawyers and business advisors. If it was post Dixon, at least we still had a pulse. Now, we are closer to calling it, find the widow.
As he was for the open Ohio State job last year. At least he was interviewed. He does have some street cred. I would think his future is nba, however. Otherwise why wouldn't he have sought out a small school to coach at and work his way through the ranks rather than heading back to the nba? And he probably told her as much.
Not sure how I would feel about him other than he is defintiely a better option than Jent.
Agree.... And another thing I can't overlook when looking at his resume, he literally changes job almost every year. If he is this great coach, why are teams not holding onto him more?
Sorry this guy might be the next Coach K but on paper Jent is a total dud.
That's the thing I think a lot of people don't get IMO. It's hard to get the right coach. Far more fail than succeed, and it's not just a Pitt thing.
That's why a few years ago when I read these boards, listened to the radio, and even talked to my friends and people wanted Dixon gone so we can "go to the next level" I thought they were nuts. We had an excellent coach. You had an EXTREMELY small chance to get something better, but people minds don't think realistically like that.
Now we have to hope we get lucky again. We did with Howland, then Dixon, both of whom probably would be blasted when hired from many Pitt fans.
I think we can do better than some of the candidates mentioned, but I also laugh at what some of the expectations of the list are from some on here.
After thinking about things it might have been smart if PITT kept the KS firing and the coach search quiet until they made some headway with various candidates.
It would have been possible to work a deal out with KS regarding the end of his employment at PITT which could have coincided with the hiring of a new coach.
It would have been possible to work a deal out with KS regarding the end of his employment at PITT which could have coincided with the hiring of a new coach.
That's what Pitt fans do. They think they "deserve" something better than they have and then whine and complain when they don't get it. Dixon was the best coach we had or could hope to have, but he was run out of town. There is little chance we'll get someone now that approaches his level. We might get a good coach or a coach that can occasionally get us to 20 wins and an NIT bid or an NCAA bid every 5 or so years, but not every year like we did before. I don't care if it's Hurley or Matta or whoever. It's not going to happen now. All we can hope for now is an improvement over Stallings, which should be extremely easy.
We looked that gift horse in the mouth and he's gone.
Eh... I partially agree on your comments. I agree on comments around Dixon but I think you are selling the potential of the program short by saying occasionally getting to 20 wins and an NIT bid or an NCAA bid every 5 years. They can and should do better than that and if it is Matta or Hurley I suspect they will. It all depends on getting a good coach. Good coaches can win almost anywhere.
Now, I will agree that it will be extremely difficult to replicate what Howland and then Dixon did with the program where we were an automatic NCAA tourney team year in and year out. That kind of success will be hard to get back to. But it is not impossible either.
Ha, good luck with that. KS side would have leaked something quicker than you would know after he was fired.
-It we are offering over 3 million and can't cherry pick a quality coach something is seriously wrong with people trying to sell the job and school. We are close to Top 10 money in the entire country. Rewind to 2 years ago. Keatts was making 350k. I mean -Asu and Vanderbilt got it right,. And we are still offering far more. If those schools can land 5 stars,. so should we with the right coach. Georgia's leaking big names like Pitino and Matta drawing hype. Heck bait and switch to your advantage. Make the school look desirable. Call coaches to interview and get them here,. Decline or never offer the job. This game of silence with crickets doesn't work. The job has to look appealing after the damage that was done. 3+ million is a good start. But you still have to draw some excitement. I don't even know why they announced the search firm. That was the one piece of information that should of remained silent after the disaster 2 years ago
I agree....we SHOULD expect to get to 20+ wins every year and NCAA bids most year. I do agree and I would never sell the Pitt program short. We proved we are better than that. I'm just saying the coaching pool out there that is available and realistic for Pitt may not be able to duplicate what Howland and Dixon did here. It won't be that easy.
I read it. Pretty thorough analysis. Hurley has accomplished some good things. I knew all of that already. None of that makes him a "slam dunk" hire to make this program what it was in its best days, but I honestly can't think of any realistic option who would be. he is pretty clearly our #1 priority and I won't be sorry if we get him. Likewise, I won't be jumping for joy and convinced that he's the savior.
if the poster i was responding to (can't remember if it was you) had used the term "no-brainer" instead of "slam dunk", I never would have engaged on this topic. I think Hurley would be close to a no--brainer hire given what's available. I am not confident that he ends up at Pitt. It will probably take more money than Pitt is willing to pony up to beat out UCONN.
The league Pitt is in now has made what Howland and Dixon did in the old BE a lot less likely, as evidenced by Dixon's last 3 years at Pitt.
Dixon was/is a very good coach. But he was flat out sucking wind in his last 3 years at Pitt, he couldn't get players to come to Pitt, the team never got above the middle of the pack in the ACC, and he didn't seem to be in any hurry to fix it. I mean, seriously, look at the players he brought to Pitt in those last 3 classes. You couldn't win in the MAC with those guys. I honestly didn't want to see Dixon go and it took me by surprise when he did, but anyone who is denying the direction the program was in, and the problems Dixon was having with recruiting, and the fact that to the outside eye it appeared that nothing was being done to fix them, is in serious denial.
Fair enough. No-brainer probably would have been a better choice of phrase. Although I would be genuinely shocked if Hurley doesn't win big at Pitt or UConn. Absolutely confident he will. If he comes to Pitt, will he win ACC and get 1 seeds? Harder to say (which is why I think UConn is better job; he will win AAC and be in occasional running for 1 seed there). Certainly, as long as K, Williams, Bennett, and company are around, it will be very, very tough. But top 5 in conference and a 3 to 6 seed in the next five years? Doable.
Hurley had built or rebuilt two programs already. He has experience doing it. Not every coach does. Thernis nowhere to go by up at Pitt. He said no two years ago...he would have followed Dixon, where he was criticized for not making the Final Four. Now he would follow Stallings, where he didn't win a confernce game. He would follow an unpopular coach who had no success.
That's a very good point. I'd rather face the worst coach in team history than best.
Pitt is a large research school like Michigan, Wisconsin, and Minnesota. So are Duke, UNC, and Georgia Tech.
But the Big 10 and ACC are athletic conferences.
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Hurley has a relationship of some sorts with Jim Calhoun too, who I believe lives in Rhode Island, or at least has a house up there near Narragansett, which is right next to Kingston. I think Calhoun was brought in to speak to Hurley's team a couple times.
I believe they're big on family and family is in the NJ/NY area.
For the love of God, when will this administration learn to not fire a coach until you have a replacement lined up and ready to go. Incompetence run amok!
Wanny, Dixon, Stallings. etc, etc, etc. .
Wanny, Dixon, Stallings. etc, etc, etc. .
Most places fire their coaches prior to having another lined up.
I would guess that very few schools actually have someone lined up and ready to go. Sounded like Texas A&M did with their football situation, but that's a rarity.
By all accounts, Hurley's "people" had expressed interest to Pitt weeks ago. How deeply a school can ethically negotiate with a sitting coach with a probable NCAAT team is the question. Few coaches are likely to want the distraction. We saw how our team lost a possible Final Four run when word leaked out before Howland left for UCLA.
If Hurley is the number one target, we have little choice but to wait it out.,
Actually the Big 10 is more than that. Admin and Exec staff meet on and discuss many non-athletic issues. But I do realize joining a conference is for athletic reasons and the other stuff is a bonus.
Sure, and going even more base than the Big 10 research alliance, the Ivy League is only an athletic conference too -- but we live in a bizarre country where somehow people assume that means something specific about their academics.
My brother in law dated a woman who's parents were from China and didn't think his very impressive Duke law + Cal-Berkeley business education was adequate for their daughter's life, because it wasn't "Ivy League."
My brother in law dated a woman who's parents were from China and didn't think his very impressive Duke law + Cal-Berkeley business education was adequate for their daughter's life, because it wasn't "Ivy League."
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