Notre Dame AD Squashes Rumors Of Moving Football To The ACC Full Time, LINK!

[topdecktiger]

they played in the NC game and in the fiesta bowl within the last 5 years. IF that's bad, sign me up for that. 43 wins and 21 losses in last 5 years with an NC appearance and fiesta bowl appearance, AND that includes a dreadful season last year. i'd take that 5 year run any day..

Listen, you hate ND and you think it's BS that they get to be an independent. i get it and to be honest, i feel similar. they can schedule who they want, they don't play these FCS scrimmage games that the P5 schools play, they don't have to share their tv money, they are on NBC every saturday.. it's horse puckey, im with you. but just admit it for what it is, don't invent a false narrative about their recruiting or their wins on the field.

You're missing the point. Notre Dame can't just be "pretty good." Notre Dame has a higher bar. They have much less margin of error than P5 teams. If you're Pitt, and you play in a P5 conference with a big TV contract, a conference network, major bowl tie ins, then yeah that's pretty good. If you are an independent Notre Dame, you have to make your living ENTIRELY off your reputation. You don't have a conference to bail you out if you have a rough patch. You simply have to be better than "pretty good."

What I'm telling you is, the framework of college football is changing, and being independent simply doesn't work the way it did 20+ years ago. You have a whole generation of kids who have grown up with Notre Dame being mediocre. You can't keep doing that and still get competitive TV contracts and recruits. At some point, living off the past doesn't work any more.

Just to illustrate the point, I was on YouTube the other day, and I found a video of college football highlights over the years. I was reading the comments, and a bunch of the kids were saying, "Wow, I didn't know Nebraska was so dominant in the 90s!" The point being, these young kids don't see the old blue bloods the same way older folks do. Now, you project that out over time, and Notre Dame's appeal becomes less and less.

You are dead wrong on your final analysis. I have no problem at all with Notre Dame being independent. It doesn't make me mad at all. What I have a problem with is you denying reality. Look at the facts. Notre Dame joined the ACC for all its other sports. They agreed to play almost half their schedule against ACC teams. They signed a GOR with the ACC. They signed a contract to only join the ACC until 2037. Those aren't the actions of a school confident in independence. That looks more like a school trying to hedge their bets and prepare a landing spot.

I'm also not inventing a false narrative. Notre Dame, from top to bottom, simply doesn't have the speed and athleticism of teams like Alabama, Ohio St, Florida St, Clemson, etc. I'm not making it up. I'm watching the games on TV, and they simply don't have the athletes from top to bottom. They have some good skill players, but you have to have more than just skill players to compete with the elite teams.

Wins and losses is also not a false narrative. I'm stating a fact that Notre Dame has only had 4 seasons of 10+ wins in 20 years. That's not going to keep you afloat as an independent forever. At some point, Notre Dame has to get back to elite status. You keep saying Notre Dame has an easier path to the playoffs, yet they can BARELY get to 10-2, and they are damn luck to do that. Two decades is more than enough of a sample size to indicate a trend.

 

[pittdan77]

So which one loss P5 member gets excluded to let a one loss ND team into the playoff?

Then again, ND has to be somewhat relevant again before it matters.

 

[topdecktiger]

Then again, ND has to be somewhat relevant again before it matters.

That's the entire point.

 

[Swervin27]

You're missing the point. Notre Dame can't just be "pretty good." Notre Dame has a higher bar. They have much less margin of error than P5 teams. If you're Pitt, and you play in a P5 conference with a big TV contract, a conference network, major bowl tie ins, then yeah that's pretty good. If you are an independent Notre Dame, you have to make your living ENTIRELY off your reputation. You don't have a conference to bail you out if you have a rough patch. You simply have to be better than "pretty good."

What I'm telling you is, the framework of college football is changing, and being independent simply doesn't work the way it did 20+ years ago. You have a whole generation of kids who have grown up with Notre Dame being mediocre. You can't keep doing that and still get competitive TV contracts and recruits. At some point, living off the past doesn't work any more.

Just to illustrate the point, I was on YouTube the other day, and I found a video of college football highlights over the years. I was reading the comments, and a bunch of the kids were saying, "Wow, I didn't know Nebraska was so dominant in the 90s!" The point being, these young kids don't see the old blue bloods the same way older folks do. Now, you project that out over time, and Notre Dame's appeal becomes less and less.

You are dead wrong on your final analysis. I have no problem at all with Notre Dame being independent. It doesn't make me mad at all. What I have a problem with is you denying reality. Look at the facts. Notre Dame joined the ACC for all its other sports. They agreed to play almost half their schedule against ACC teams. They signed a GOR with the ACC. They signed a contract to only join the ACC until 2037. Those aren't the actions of a school confident in independence. That looks more like a school trying to hedge their bets and prepare a landing spot.

I'm also not inventing a false narrative. Notre Dame, from top to bottom, simply doesn't have the speed and athleticism of teams like Alabama, Ohio St, Florida St, Clemson, etc. I'm not making it up. I'm watching the games on TV, and they simply don't have the athletes from top to bottom. They have some good skill players, but you have to have more than just skill players to compete with the elite teams.

Wins and losses is also not a false narrative. I'm stating a fact that Notre Dame has only had 4 seasons of 10+ wins in 20 years. That's not going to keep you afloat as an independent forever. At some point, Notre Dame has to get back to elite status. You keep saying Notre Dame has an easier path to the playoffs, yet they can BARELY get to 10-2, and they are damn luck to do that. Two decades is more than enough of a sample size to indicate a trend.

they are not elite like Alabama, Clemson, I agree, nor is anyone else. you keep bringing up how ND cant thrive as an independent but one little thing you are missing is, THEY ARE THRIVING AS AN INDEPENDENT. this is fact, they are. you say they will be forced to join a conference and I tell you, I've been hearing this since the late 90s. same thing, every year. But it never happens.. you are saying "it's fact" over and over but one fact you don't admit is that they are an independent and they are thriving.

ND wants no parts of a conference and I don't blame them. I'd LOVE if pitt could succeed as an independent, any college football fan would. Reality is, it's not realistic outside of ND, maybe Texas and that's' about it. You think if they join the ACC or Big 10, they'll beat out bama and Clemson for elite athletes? Really? You think 18 year old kids dream of ACC championship games in Charlotte in front of 25k, beating va tech or duke and getting that coveted ACC champs ring? You think there is 3 kids on this planet that ever had that wish?

 

[topdecktiger]

they are not elite like Alabama, Clemson, I agree, nor is anyone else. you keep bringing up how ND cant thrive as an independent but one little thing you are missing is, THEY ARE THRIVING AS AN INDEPENDENT. this is fact, they are. you say they will be forced to join a conference and I tell you, I've been hearing this since the late 90s. same thing, every year. But it never happens.. you are saying "it's fact" over and over but one fact you don't admit is that they are an independent and they are thriving.

ND wants no parts of a conference and I don't blame them. I'd LOVE if pitt could succeed as an independent, any college football fan would. Reality is, it's not realistic outside of ND, maybe Texas and that's' about it. You think if they join the ACC or Big 10, they'll beat out bama and Clemson for elite athletes? Really? You think 18 year old kids dream of ACC championship games in Charlotte in front of 25k, beating va tech or duke and getting that coveted ACC champs ring? You think there is 3 kids on this planet that ever had that wish?

No, Notre Dame is not "thriving" as in independent. I'll repeat it again. 4, count 'em 4, 10+ win season in 20 years. That is not "thriving." Notre Dame's NBC contract has been surpassed by the P5 conferences. That wasn't case in the 90s. That's what I'm telling you. Things have changed. They are changing. Notre Dame doesn't have the advantages they had in the past. That's why they aren't elite any more.

Your last point illustrates your unawareness. Yes, kids want to go home and brag about a championship. It's not because they beat Virginia Tech or Duke. They want to go home and say, "I won an ACC championsip," or "I won an SEC championship." That kind of stuff DOES matter to kids. Notre Dame offers them a chance to MAYBE get a decent bowl (which they will probably lose). If Notre Dame was consistently playing games in Florida, Georgia, etc, then yes, they would start getting better recruits.

 

[Swervin27]

No, Notre Dame is not "thriving" as in independent. I'll repeat it again. 4, count 'em 4, 10+ win season in 20 years. That is not "thriving." Notre Dame's NBC contract has been surpassed by the P5 conferences. That wasn't case in the 90s. That's what I'm telling you. Things have changed. They are changing. Notre Dame doesn't have the advantages they had in the past. That's why they aren't elite any more.

Your last point illustrates your unawareness. Yes, kids want to go home and brag about a championship. It's not because they beat Virginia Tech or Duke. They want to go home and say, "I won an ACC championsip," or "I won an SEC championship." That kind of stuff DOES matter to kids. Notre Dame offers them a chance to MAYBE get a decent bowl (which they will probably lose). If Notre Dame was consistently playing games in Florida, Georgia, etc, then yes, they would start getting better recruits.

we both understand ND's deficiencies and what is holding them back into being a top 5 program. I think what we disagree on is how they can get there. I don't see how in the world joining the ACC gets them there. the problems they have, the ones you listed, doesnt' get fixed by joining the acc. maybe joining the big 10 helps a bit but contractually, it's not happening.

in short, acc gives them more hindrances and negates their advantages and gives them very little in return. we are going to have to agree to disagree on this one. it has been a fun debate though.

 

[BFo8]

I think we can mostly agree that ND is thriving off the field, but not on it.

I don't think they have a clear path at all as a 1 loss team, would depend on who they beat and who they lost to.

They would have a tough time getting in over any 1 loss SEC team, or an Ohio St or Michigan type.

 

[Revenge Of The Noise]

Notre Dame probably underachieves slightly (especially now that they are scheduling a bit lighter) but come on. They are doing great.

 

[fedman]

I know a number of people who work in the ND athletic department. A couple of points:
(1) TV money: the $15 million NBC figure is wrong. That is the old number. I have been told that the new number is $22 million a year from NBC. ND also gets $5 million a year from the ACC, which brings the money they receive from TV to $27 million a year.

(2) TV money will not be a factor in ND joining a conference. If money was a factor they would have joined the Big10 a long time ago. It is alumni donations that is the big factor. In the late 1990s it was basically a done deal that ND was going to join the Big10. The deal was so close that ND and the Big10 were discussing when and where to hold the news conference. However the news was leaked to the Chicago Tribune and the ND administration was blindsided by the heated reaction from the long time big donors. They told the administration that they would withhold all donations if ND joined the Big10. ND backed out and did not sign the contracts with the Big10.

(3) One thing and one thing only will cause ND to join a conference (and it would be the ACC. Not only because ND is contractually obligated to do so , but also because ND prefers the ACC over the Big10). And that one thing would be access to the playoffs. If ever the playoff rules change to give so much weight to being a conference champion that ND is effectively eliminated from ever being chosen, they will immediately join the ACC.