OT: FGs to end football games

[Fk_Pitt]

Perfectly acceptable to every NFL fan that a 61 yard field goal wins a game. But there was all kinds of outrage from Americans that the World Cup was decided by penalties (PKs).

Let’s face it…our opinions are based on years and years of conditioning.

Why should a walk off field goal decide who wins and loses?

 

[Chairman Moe]

Totally different situations. Maybe, to your point, an ending to a soccer match (after OT) should be penalty kicks from a further distance from the goal

 

[HailToPitt725]

I was one of those Americans against the World Cup ending in a shootout. I think you’re making a false equivalent because you’re comparing apples to oranges. Unlike a penalty kick, where it’s just the shooter and the goalie, field goals and special teams are a fundamental aspect of the game that involve all 22 players on the field. There’s also events that can spiral from the kick itself, such as a block or a kick return.

A better comparison would be Winter Olympic hockey games (or NHL regular season games) ending in a shout-out.

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

Perfectly acceptable to every NFL fan that a 61 yard field goal wins a game. But there was all kinds of outrage from Americans that the World Cup was decided by penalties (PKs).

Let’s face it…our opinions are based on years and years of conditioning.

Why should a walk off field goal decide who wins and loses?

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Because a field goal is an integral part of the game from beginning to end.

If there weren’t field goals during the game and this was how the game was decided if tied at the end of regulation then we have that discussion. Otherwise it’s not apples to apples and not even close.

And even then it wouldn’t be the same since different guys take PKs.

 

[Fk_Pitt]

I was one of those Americans against the World Cup ending in a shootout. I think you’re making a false equivalent because you’re comparing apples to oranges. Unlike a penalty kick, where it’s just the shooter and the goalie, field goals and special teams are a fundamental aspect of the game that involve all 22 players on the field. There’s also events that can spiral from the kick itself, such as a block or a kick return.

A better comparison would be Winter Olympic hockey games (or NHL regular season games) ending in a shout-out.

I honestly think it’s a false equivalency because American football really isn’t football because hands are used on every pkay. Kicking is completely random when considering every other part of the game they use their hands. Seriously, would anyone care if kicking was eliminated from the game? Most people don’t even consider kickers and punters football players.

 

[Fk_Pitt]

Totally different situations. Maybe, to your point, an ending to a soccer match (after OT) should be penalty kicks from a further distance from the goal

I would be fine with that for sure. Even if they backed up the spot a foot, it would make a difference.

 

[Burgh15]

I honestly think it’s a false equivalency because American football really isn’t football because hands are used on every pkay. Kicking is completely random when considering every other part of the game they use their hands. Seriously, would anyone care if kicking was eliminated from the game? Most people don’t even consider kickers and punters football players.

I would because kicking helps keep games competitive. If a team has 4th and 20 from their own 5-yard line, I want them to punt. Also, when the ball is actually returned, it's one of the more exciting plays in football.

The World Cup shootout is deciding a game in essentially amounts to a skills competition.

 

[HailtoPitt]

I was one of those Americans against the World Cup ending in a shootout. I think you’re making a false equivalent because you’re comparing apples to oranges. Unlike a penalty kick, where it’s just the shooter and the goalie, field goals and special teams are a fundamental aspect of the game that involve all 22 players on the field. There’s also events that can spiral from the kick itself, such as a block or a kick return.

A better comparison would be Winter Olympic hockey games (or NHL regular season games) ending in a shout-out.

Lol. No.

 

[NCanton Panther]

Perfectly acceptable to every NFL fan that a 61 yard field goal wins a game. But there was all kinds of outrage from Americans that the World Cup was decided by penalties (PKs).

Let’s face it…our opinions are based on years and years of conditioning.

Why should a walk off field goal decide who wins and loses?

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Now if you had a tie football game at he end of regulation and then decided the winner based on who made the most out of 5 FG attempts, you might have a apples to apples comparison.

I’ll give you credit though, you are persistent in your defense of soccer.

 

[Pittnerski]

The more comparable answer is the new 2 point conversion off in college OT

Absolutely brutal way to decide a hard fought 60+ mins of football

 

[HailToPitt725]

I honestly think it’s a false equivalency because American football really isn’t football because hands are used on every pkay. Kicking is completely random when considering every other part of the game they use their hands. Seriously, would anyone care if kicking was eliminated from the game? Most people don’t even consider kickers and punters football players.

Taking all forms of kicking out of American football would cause a huge change in the game, large enough that people definitely would care. For example, think about flipping the field with punts and what that does to an opposing offense. Or how about the fact that eliminating field goals and extra points? Both would create fundamental differences in game strategy.

 

[HailToPitt725]

Lol. No.

Care to elaborate?

 

[Fk_Pitt]

Now if you had a tie football game at he end of regulation and then decided the winner based on who made the most out of 5 FG attempts, you might have a apples to apples comparison.

I’ll give you credit though, you are persistent in your defense of soccer.

Dude soccer doesn’t need defending. Not one bit. And not from provincial people.

 

[Burgh15]

The more comparable answer is the new 2 point conversion off in college OT

Absolutely brutal way to decide a hard fought 60+ mins of football

Quite possibly the world tiebreaker in all of sports. Not only is it a weird tiebreaking system, but it's also incredibly boring to watch. It doesn't eliminate much contact either as there's often more physical collisions in short-yardage situations.

 

[Fk_Pitt]

The more comparable answer is the new 2 point conversion off in college OT

Absolutely brutal way to decide a hard fought 60+ mins of football

As far as I’m concerned the NFL is the best sport in the world. But at least they stopped letting coin flips decide an overwhelming majority of their games that ended in a tie. That went on for decades and no one cared until Payton Manning didn’t touch the ball in an OT game once.

My overriding point remains. Field goals winning football games are fine because that’s how we are conditioned. 150 million people agree. PKs winning cup competitions in soccer is fine too. 4 billion people agree.

 

[kma0043]

Maybe soccer should do like the nhl does and play playoff ot til a winner, but it’d probably still be being played.

 

[NCanton Panther]

Dude soccer doesn’t need defending. Not one bit. And not from provincial people.

Then why do you do backflips on here continuously trying to prop it up, or in other words defend it. You have a funny way of showing it doesn’t need defended.

 

[Pitt8189]

You actually have to move the ball against the defense to get into field goal range. Now with the kickers we have today anything from 60 yards in has a good chance but that is far different from an asinine penalty kicks shootout to determine the best team in the world

 

[Fk_Pitt]

Then why do you do backflips on here continuously trying to prop it up, or in other words defend it. You have a funny way of showing it doesn’t need defended.

700 million people watched the UEFA champions league final (soccers closest thing to the super bowl) last year.

By comparison, 150 million people in a good year watch the super bowl.

I saw some some estimates that 4 billion watched the World Cup final this year.

These stats show a couple things. 1) The Super Bowl is massive and 2) Soccer doesn’t need defended.

The OP was less about soccer and more about people’s weird flexes about one sport when their own sport has some oddities that are easily accepted and not thought about, because it’s our sport, we’ve spent our whole lives watching it, and we like it how it is.

 

[Chaos]

I'm one of those people, but like has already been said in this thread, a 61 yard contested fg with 22 players isn't comparable to PKs to me. Maybe if they kicked extra points with no defense, or 1 defender, maybe? I like the idea of moving back the PK to give the goalie a bit of a chance at least. But as it is now, I think it's a disappointing way to end the world championship.

 

[Fk_Pitt]

I'm one of those people, but like has already been said in this thread, a 61 yard contested fg with 22 players isn't comparable to PKs to me. Maybe if they kicked extra points with no defense, or 1 defender, maybe? I like the idea of moving back the PK to give the goalie a bit of a chance at least. But as it is now, I think it's a disappointing way to end the world championship.

I think at some point we will see a narrowing of the goalposts or raising of the crossbar in our lifetime. I don’t think we are quite there yet where the 60 yarder is the new 50 yarder, but it’s getting close.

Saw the old curmudgeon Steigerwald make the point on twitter last week that soccer has ruined football because the soccer style kicker has made FG kicking too easy. He’s an example of old guy stuck in his ways and just likes to complain.

 

[upj87]

Perfectly acceptable to every NFL fan that a 61 yard field goal wins a game. But there was all kinds of outrage from Americans that the World Cup was decided by penalties (PKs).

Let’s face it…our opinions are based on years and years of conditioning.

Why should a walk off field goal decide who wins and loses?

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SMF-like post...time to maybe limit your in defense of soccer posts to only 50 or 60 a week now that the big kickball tourney is over.

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

Seriously, would anyone care if kicking was eliminated from the game? Most people don’t even consider kickers and punters football players.

talk about a move that would drastically change the game. hmm, i dont know FK, im no fan of endless field goals and playing the "field position" game with punting being such a big part of american football but to get rid of all punts and kicks? That might be even too drastic for me..

Would be interesting though.. How about something like, "if you are inside the 20 (Red zone), you have to go for it. Or something like, You can only punt if you are within your own 30..

 

[Fk_Pitt]

SMF-like post...time to maybe limit your in defense of soccer posts to only 50 or 60 a week now that the big kickball tourney is over.

Ok Steigy.

 

[Fk_Pitt]

talk about a move that would drastically change the game. hmm, i dont know FK, im no fan of endless field goals and playing the "field position" game with punting being such a big part of american football but to get rid of all punts and kicks? That might be even too drastic for me..

Would be interesting though.. How about something like, "if you are inside the 20 (Red zone), you have to go for it. Or something like, You can only punt if you are within your own 30..

Kicking field goals from the 50 yard line isn’t what the founding fathers had in mind. Lol.

Then again, neither is todays NFL.

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

Kicking field goals from the 50 yard line isn’t what the founding fathers had in mind. Lol.

Then again, neither is todays NFL.

yeah, i dont know, im throwing out SMF like ideas. honestly, i dont think too many football fans complain about FGs and punts, do they? on the list of things to fix in the nfl, i dont think either are on the David Letterman top 10 list.

while speaking of kickers, as a steeler fan, hopefully Boswell can get another groin pull so we can bring back that other kicker who is 2 Xs better for a 1/4 of the price...

 

[Gep Dawg]

I'm a huge soccer fan. Everything I read and experienced abroad is that hardcore fans agree that a penalty shootout is a completely unsatisfactory way to decide an important match. Most fans also accept the fact there isn't really a satisfactory alternative. In the old days they just had a replay in a few days. Can't do that with TV these days. I would argue for an important final (World Cup, Champions League, FA Cup) they should go sudden death after 120 minutes. Only because its a unique special thing. Rest of knockout stage should be penalties.

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

I'm a huge soccer fan. Everything I read and experienced abroad is that hardcore fans agree that a penalty shootout is a completely unsatisfactory way to decide an important match. Most fans also accept the fact there isn't really a satisfactory alternative. In the old days they just had a replay in a few days. Can't do that with TV these days. I would argue for an important final (World Cup, Champions League, FA Cup) they should go sudden death after 120 minutes. Only because its a unique special thing. Rest of knockout stage should be penalties.

not a soccer fan but i was shocked that they'd let a championship game of this caliber to be decided by a shoot out?

I'd compare it to an NHL game 7 Stanley cup game be decided by a penalty shot competition. Just dont see it happening..

a "Sudden Death" overtime would be pretty cool for soccer world cup. I know fatigue would be a factor but that would make it even better. The last man standing kind of thing when soccer players are dropping dead would be cool (Figuratively speaking of course).

 

[pittiswhereiamfrom2]

Perfectly acceptable to every NFL fan that a 61 yard field goal wins a game. But there was all kinds of outrage from Americans that the World Cup was decided by penalties (PKs).

Let’s face it…our opinions are based on years and years of conditioning.

Why should a walk off field goal decide who wins and loses?

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You will conjure up anything to create a post.

 

[Fk_Pitt]

You will conjure up anything to create a post.

Nah. I saw it trending on social media by a talking head. An annoying talking head for that matter. So yeah maybe I should have refrained.

But no, I’m right. We will bitch about things we don’t fully understand, when at the same time we have our own oddities inside own own sport that we we completely accept because it’s what we are used to.

 

[Jakey_John]

The defense had every opportunity to stop the kicker and he is good enough to make it from that far then so be it.

Similarly, when extra points become so automatic they were backed up. Penalty kicks and shootouts happen in a bubble. That’s why they are removed from playoff OT in the NHL.

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

700 million people watched the UEFA champions league final (soccers closest thing to the super bowl) last year.

By comparison, 150 million people in a good year watch the super bowl.

I saw some some estimates that 4 billion watched the World Cup final this year.

These stats show a couple things. 1) The Super Bowl is massive and 2) Soccer doesn’t need defended.

The OP was less about soccer and more about people’s weird flexes about one sport when their own sport has some oddities that are easily accepted and not thought about, because it’s our sport, we’ve spent our whole lives watching it, and we like it how it is.

I don't think there's 4 billion people with access to TVs in the world, so whomever threw that number out there is totally full of it.

 

[BFo8]

FG kicking has changed as much or more than anything in the sport since I started watching in the 1970’s. Roy Gerela was considered a decent kicker and he made about 60% over his career, including a grand total of one 50+ yarder. Jan Stenerud is a HOF’er that only made 66% of his attempts and was only slightly over 50% from 40 yards or more. Neither of those guys would even be able to make a college team today.

With the 50 yard FG becoming almost a chip shot and accuracy levels where they are isn’t it almost a given that we will be seeing 70 yard field goals a generation from now? I’m not sure that at some point it doesn’t change the fabric of the game too much when all it will take is getting to midfield to have close to an automatic 3 points.

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

I don't think there's 4 billion people with access to TVs in the world, so whomever threw that number out there is totally full of it.

i actually looked this up..


Globally, more than 1.4 billion households now own at least one TV set, representing 79 percent of total households; the report notes that “virtually all” households in the developed world now own a TV set while 69 percent own at least one set in developing countries.

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

FG kicking has changed as much or more than anything in the sport since I started watching in the 1970’s. Roy Gerela was considered a decent kicker and he made about 60% over his career, including a grand total of one 50+ yarder. Jan Stenerud is a HOF’er that only made 66% of his attempts and was only slightly over 50% from 40 yards or more. Neither of those guys would even be able to make a college team today.

With the 50 yard FG becoming almost a chip shot and accuracy levels where they are isn’t it almost a given that we will be seeing 70 yard field goals a generation from now? I’m not sure that at some point it doesn’t change the fabric of the game too much when all it will take is getting to midfield to have close to an automatic 3 points.

It will make TDs more important each possession.

 

[TheSpecialSauce]

I was one of those Americans against the World Cup ending in a shootout. I think you’re making a false equivalent because you’re comparing apples to oranges. Unlike a penalty kick, where it’s just the shooter and the goalie, field goals and special teams are a fundamental aspect of the game that involve all 22 players on the field. There’s also events that can spiral from the kick itself, such as a block or a kick return.

A better comparison would be Winter Olympic hockey games (or NHL regular season games) ending in a shout-out.

Bingo!

A simple change would be to narrow the goal posts. Make a field goal more challenging.

 

[Burgh15]

Nah. I saw it trending on social media by a talking head. An annoying talking head for that matter. So yeah maybe I should have refrained.

But no, I’m right. We will bitch about things we don’t fully understand, when at the same time we have our own oddities inside own own sport that we we completely accept because it’s what we are used to.

Here is a comment from someone who doesn’t fully understand the game:

"When it comes to the World Cup final it is passion and when it goes to extra time it is a drama", he said. "But when it comes to penalty kicks it is a tragedy. Football is a team sport and penalties is not a team, it is the individual.” - Sepp Blatter, FIFA president from 2006.

 

[YourPittDanceTeam]

Perfectly acceptable to every NFL fan that a 61 yard field goal wins a game. But there was all kinds of outrage from Americans that the World Cup was decided by penalties (PKs).

Let’s face it…our opinions are based on years and years of conditioning.

Why should a walk off field goal decide who wins and loses?

View embedded media

Perhaps a better comparison would be, in OT, having each team's place kicker line up to kick a 20 yard FG until one of those kickers misses it.

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

i actually looked this up..


Globally, more than 1.4 billion households now own at least one TV set, representing 79 percent of total households; the report notes that “virtually all” households in the developed world now own a TV set while 69 percent own at least one set in developing countries.

Well, I know 10% of the world doesn't have access to electricity, so makes sense.

 

[Fk_Pitt]

Here is a comment from someone who doesn’t fully understand the game:

"When it comes to the World Cup final it is passion and when it goes to extra time it is a drama", he said. "But when it comes to penalty kicks it is a tragedy. Football is a team sport and penalties is not a team, it is the individual.” - Sepp Blatter, FIFA president from 2006.

Is this the guy who awarded the World Cup to Qatar? Lol. Talk about tragedy.

In all honesty if the guy wants to grow the game, the biggest upside is the USA. So opinions of sporting fans in this country is something he probably listens to. But I don’t think penalties deciding games will move the needle much. Americans are just looking for reasons to complain. If it wasn’t penalties deciding games, they’d just find something else.