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OT - PENS/RANGERS series tied 1-1 .......

goalieman

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Rangers outplayed the Pens in Game 2 ..... there was a 5-6 minute stretch in the 2nd period where the Pens went to sleep and the Rangers scored 3 goals ..... and I thought the Rangers outplayed the Pens a lot of the game.

A few thoughts ........

The Rangers were outhitting us, winning the battles on the boards, and had much better puck possession then the Pens.

The Pens turned the puck over way too many times leading to Ranger scoring chances.

The Pens seemed not to use their speed as much and couldn't get a forechecking game going.

Pens breakouts were subpar.

Maatta and Daley had bad games ..... Maatta was playing to get more defense into the game for the Pens and yet he gave up 3 breakaways and generally was poor in his own end as was Daley.

Malkin played for the 1st time in awhile and played well on the power play and looked ok playing with Rust and Sheery as well as taking some shifts with Crosby ..... I personally think we'll need Geno to play well to make a deep run in the playoffs.

Lundqvist stopping Rust on the breakaway was big for the Rangers.

Zatkoff played great in game 1 but Lundqvist was the somewhat better goalie in game 2 ...... Zatkoff did make some excellent saves in game 2 and the Pens hung him out to dry a number of times. If you analyze the Rangers four goals in game 2 from the standpoint of could Zatkoff have played them somewhat better .... the answer is yes on a couple of them but overall he played well as all the Ranger scores were on good scoring chances.

However, we are going to need a healthy Fleury back soon IMO.

I'd like to see Schultz back in the lineup ..... if Sullivan wants to dress Maatta then maybe we should dress 7 defensemen (to get Schultz in the lineup) as we did in game 1.... I generally don't like to do this though.

Let's get back to using our speed going north and south and get in the Rangers zone and into their faces.

Regarding assessing Zatkoff on the Rangers goals in game 2 (and I'm in no way saying Zatkoff cost us the game as he played overall well !!! .... just analyzing the goals from a goalie standpoint) .......

Goal #1 - A Ranger had the puck near the goal line to the left of Zatkoff .... Zatkoff went down in a butterfly position on the post directly facing the puck carrier (90 degree angle to the post) so that when the puck was passed through the low slot to a NYR in the low far circle, Zatkoff could not directly power push out and across as he had to turn, get his left skate away from the post and angled so he could push across .... this took too much time and he did not get across in time .... if he was paddle down on the post with his left skate on the post and right leg at a 45 degree or less angle to the goal line, he would have been in perfect position to immediately power push out and across off the post and I think he gets there in time to have a good chance of making the save ...... a technique and positioning mistake.

Goal #2 - Maatta lets the puck get by him in the neutral zone and a NYR gets an off angle/off center breakaway (which technically are played differently by the goalie then a straight on/down the center breakaway) ..... the puck carrier comes to the top of the right circle and angles toward the hash marks ultimately taking the shot from just inside the circle and just below the hash mark in the low slot...... Zatkoff was in good position until the shooter angled in just before the shot ..... Zatkoff needed to shuffle 6-8"s to his right and out to be at the best angle and position to make the save ..... he didn't and when the shooter took the shot, Zatkoff was a little off angle (the puck was on an angle that went through his right pad instead of between his legs) and the shooter had some open net to Zatkoff's right side ..... he shot and the puck was a few inches outside his blocker ..... if Zatkoff shuffles as I said, he is in perfect position and the shot hits his blocker and is the difference between a save and a goal ...... it may sound over critical but that is what was needed to make the save and could have been done ..... in these high scoring chances, if you aren't precise in your angles and positioning these guys put it in the net..... obviously Maatta was the bigger problem on the play and made it a high scoring chance for the Rangers and a tough play for Zatkoff.

Goal #3 - The puck is in the Pens end and the Rangers are making a change but one Ranger gets the puck against 3 Pens and ultimately there is a pass across ice through the slot to a Ranger in the low, inner circle..... there is a screener in front of Zatkoff and he didn't see the pass across very well, reacted just a little late and didn't get a real good push off to try and get across ...... I doubt Zatkoff makes the save even if he reacts a little earlier and gets a better push off as the shot was perfect .... high and just inside the near post..... I don't think anyone makes that save..... good goal IMO.

Goal #4 - Daley tried to clear a puck just outside the Pens crease and hits a Ranger in the circle who recovers the puck and takes a quick shot from the hash mark ..... Zatkoff is behind the play and off angle but trying to recover ..... the shot deflects off Daley changes direction and Zatkoff has no real chance for the save .... good goal.
 
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Playoff hockey is great. I cannot believe all the people around here thinking after Game 1 that the series is over. This is what makes it fun. Stress. Angst. Seeing the adjustments and how teams respond. What thought was working for the Pens actually worked against them between Game's 1 and 2 and that was the extra day. If Game 2 was Friday, not sure if Lundquist plays.

Lundquist is Lundquist. The Pens are going to have to get traffic and get him uncomfortable. The Rangers are doing a great job clogging the middle of the ice, the Pens need to carry the puck more, and use the center drive to carry the Ranger defense (traffic) to Lundquist, and then shoot and crash the net. Don't even think of making the beautiful play. The first Kessel goal is a prime example, beautiful goal. Tic. Tac. Toe. But............those aren't going to work right now. So north/south, keep it simple styles is what the need to do.

The Rangers are a good team, deep up front so the Pens are going to be in a long series, especially with Lundquist. It worries me that MAF if/when he returns may need one game to shake off the rust and right now the Pens can't afford this.

Still.......Pens need to go 1-1 in these next two games. This is fun. All of my life watching Penguins playoff games, and trust me no other sports team gets me as emotionally involved, but you remember the struggles, those long series much more so than you do the easy ones. I know 3 cups have been won by this franchise and the first rounds have been 7, 7 and 6 games. So in those easy years, they didn't end up as well as we hoped. But the early struggles when overcome, often has led to the holy grail.
 
I agree with much of what was written so I'm not going to say much.

The Rangers are a very good team and anyone who thought we were just going to stomp all over them from the word go is crazy. I still think the Penguins are going to win the series but I have always expected this to go six or seven games.

In yesterday's game Pittsburgh's defense really struggled. They were getting a lot of pressure from New York's hard charging forwards and it forced them into a number of turnovers. Also, the team did a terrible job of managing the puck in the neutral zone – way too many turnovers. Those two things were probably related.

Also, these guys aren't robots and of course there's a natural tendency to play a little too conservatively whenever you're trying to protect your third string goalie. I still can't believe they risked Murray at Philadelphia in a meaningless game!

Incredibly dumb!

As for the D, Olli Maatta has really struggled all season long. He's been hurt for much of the season and when he has played he has often looked terrible. Speed was never his strength but this entire season he has looked flat out slow - like AHL slow.

Pittsburgh may have to make a tough decision regarding him going forward. As things stand he is simply not fast enough to play at this level.

Personally, I still like him. He has excellent instincts and he's the smartest defenseman on the team. For example, his plus/minus rating is still very good. However, if you actually watch him play you know that he has not played up to his previously established standards.

What good does it do you to always know where the play should go if you can never get there to make it?

In the off-season, Maatta has to improve his skating - period. As far as this playoff run goes, I think they need to ease him into the lineup and take their time with him while he shakes off some of the rust. He can't play on the top pairing. That is just too much ice time for a guy who is clearly not ready for it.
 
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Playoff hockey is great. I cannot believe all the people around here thinking after Game 1 that the series is over. This is what makes it fun. Stress. Angst. Seeing the adjustments and how teams respond. What thought was working for the Pens actually worked against them between Game's 1 and 2 and that was the extra day. If Game 2 was Friday, not sure if Lundquist plays.

Lundquist is Lundquist. The Pens are going to have to get traffic and get him uncomfortable. The Rangers are doing a great job clogging the middle of the ice, the Pens need to carry the puck more, and use the center drive to carry the Ranger defense (traffic) to Lundquist, and then shoot and crash the net. Don't even think of making the beautiful play. The first Kessel goal is a prime example, beautiful goal. Tic. Tac. Toe. But............those aren't going to work right now. So north/south, keep it simple styles is what the need to do.

The Rangers are a good team, deep up front so the Pens are going to be in a long series, especially with Lundquist. It worries me that MAF if/when he returns may need one game to shake off the rust and right now the Pens can't afford this.

Still.......Pens need to go 1-1 in these next two games. This is fun. All of my life watching Penguins playoff games, and trust me no other sports team gets me as emotionally involved, but you remember the struggles, those long series much more so than you do the easy ones. I know 3 cups have been won by this franchise and the first rounds have been 7, 7 and 6 games. So in those easy years, they didn't end up as well as we hoped. But the early struggles when overcome, often has led to the holy grail.

Playoff hockey is great ..... every game becomes a war ..... adjustments between games become important ..... playing the same team 4 to 7 games in a row can build up some tremendous emotions..... unexpected heroes can emerge ...... there is nothing like a game 7 ..... then a genuine handshake at the end ..... and that is just one series ..... if you are lucky enough you get four of those series .......great stuff !
 
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I agree with much of what was written so I'm not going to say much.

The Rangers are a very good team and anyone who thought we were just going to stomp all over them from the word go is crazy. I still think the Penguins are going to win the series but I have always expected this to go six or seven games.

In yesterday's game Pittsburgh's defense really struggled. They were getting a lot of pressure from New York's hard charging forwards and it forced them into a number of turnovers. Also, the team did a terrible job of managing the puck in the neutral zone – way too many turnovers. Those two things were probably related.

Also, these guys aren't robots and of course there's a natural tendency to play a little too conservatively whenever you're trying to protect your third string goalie. I still can't believe they risked Murray at Philadelphia in a meaningless game!

Incredibly dumb!

As for the D, Olli Maatta has really struggled all season long. He's been hurt for much of the season and when he has played he has often looked terrible. Speed was never his strength but this entire season he has looked flat out slow - like AHL slow.

Pittsburgh may have to make a tough decision regarding him going forward. As things stand he is simply not fast enough to play at this level.

Personally, I still like him. He has excellent instincts and he's the smartest defenseman on the team. For example, his plus/minus rating is still very good. However, if you actually watch him play you know that he has not played up to his previously established standards.

What good does it do you to always know where the play should go if you can never get there to make it?

In the off-season, Maatta has to improve his skating - period. As far as this playoff run goes, I think they need to ease him into the lineup and take their time with him while he shakes off some of the rust. He can't play on the top pairing. That is just too much ice time for a guy who is clearly not ready for it.

There is definitely something wrong with Maatta's skating ...... it seems significantly worse right now .... he was never a speedster but he is much slower at present and you are correct to say his skating is not at an NHL level at this time ...... I'm wondering if he had a lower body injury that has slowed him down ..... he was a liability yesterday.

The Rangers are a very good team and a tough 1st round match up for the Pens ...... If Ryan McDonagh comes back soon for them, their defense and team is going to be that much tougher.
 
I'm still extremely confident the Pens win this series and would not be suprised if they rip off the next 3 wins....assuming Fleury comes back. I feel we would be up 2-0 right now with Murray/Fleury between the pipes. They come out way too tight because they know what they have behind them....just unmagine how bad it will be if Zatkoff is still in net IN NY!

Out of curiosity, Schultz played 5 minutes in game 1. He was obviously a big defensive liability in the eyes if the coaching staff and had Lovejoy/Cole eat his minutes. I would not want to bench any of Sheary, Rust, Fehr, Kuhnhackl in favor of playing a 7th defenseman that will play between 5-7min. If youbwant Schultz, whi you benching?
 
I'm still extremely confident the Pens win this series and would not be suprised if they rip off the next 3 wins....assuming Fleury comes back. I feel we would be up 2-0 right now with Murray/Fleury between the pipes. They come out way too tight because they know what they have behind them....just unmagine how bad it will be if Zatkoff is still in net IN NY!

Out of curiosity, Schultz played 5 minutes in game 1. He was obviously a big defensive liability in the eyes if the coaching staff and had Lovejoy/Cole eat his minutes. I would not want to bench any of Sheary, Rust, Fehr, Kuhnhackl in favor of playing a 7th defenseman that will play between 5-7min. If youbwant Schultz, whi you benching?

If Maatta plays like he did in game 2, you have to make some adjustment ..... what the coach decides is what makes playoff hockey interesting ...... the Pens game is based on speed ...... Maatta just is playing slow, there is something wrong with his skating and it is making him a liability at present ..... maybe he will play better as the series goes on but one thing that the coaches could consider (and I don't know if they trust him enough) is playing Derrick Pouliot who gives more defense then Schultz and more offense/speed then Maatta..... one thing is for sure, the coaches will play whoever they feel gives them the best chance to win ...... will be interesting to see what they decide.
 
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The Rangers are literally standing at the blue line with at least 3 defenders, sometimes 4 just laughing at the pens trying to skate into the zone. Dump and chase. Dump and chase. Pens will be fine. I like malkin getting the rust off in game 2. I bet he explodes Tuesday
 
One thing........that entry (or more apropos "attempt of an entry") the Pens do on the PP needs to be shelved. The Rangers are just sitting one guy high in the middle of the neutral zone waiting for a cross ice pass. It is not working. They need to attack as a unit with speed.

And again, if they are clogging the middle then have your guys drive to the net down the middle and attack from the wings.
 
wonder what it is gonna take for this staff and this city's love affair with Matta to end.. I know, it was a great story and all but it shouldn't over shadow actual on ice failures..
 
wonder what it is gonna take for this staff and this city's love affair with Matta to end.. I know, it was a great story and all but it shouldn't over shadow actual on ice failures..

Are you implying that maatta is the new Craig adams?
 
Are you implying that maatta is the new Craig adams?
not sure, if Craig Adams defense resembled a turnstile, then yes.. I think pens fans either like the cancer story or just like saying his name, it is kind of fun.
 
There is nothing wrong with Maatta that a solid offseason of conditioning cannot fix, I wouldn't play him right now in the playoffs, but this guy has missed two offseasons of normal conditioning,.....

He is simply out of gas......
 
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Do you think it would be smart not to play Malkin this series with the Rangers since things have worked out well without him since his injury.
Get thru this one with a series win and work Malkin in next playoff round!
It doesn't matter how good someone is, the PENS had incredible chemistry since early early /mid March so don't try to fix whats not broken.
Seems like they played different in game # 2/slower!
 
Do you think it would be smart not to play Malkin this series with the Rangers since things have worked out well without him since his injury.
Get thru this one with a series win and work Malkin in next playoff round!
It doesn't matter how good someone is, the PENS had incredible chemistry since early early /mid March so don't try to fix whats not broken.
Seems like they played different in game # 2/slower!
He already played on Saturday. He is playing.
 
He already played on Saturday. He is playing.
I know I watched the 4-2 loss and that's why I asked the question.
The team looked out of synch compared to the games over the last month so I thought just leave things as they were - don't try to fix something that's not broken.
Just my opinion!
 
Do you think it would be smart not to play Malkin this series with the Rangers since things have worked out well without him since his injury.
Get thru this one with a series win and work Malkin in next playoff round!
It doesn't matter how good someone is, the PENS had incredible chemistry since early early /mid March so don't try to fix whats not broken.
Seems like they played different in game # 2/slower!

If the Pens were 15-1 with Malkin while Crosby was hurt and Crosby then cones back, would you say the same thing?
 
There is nothing wrong with Maatta that a solid offseason of conditioning cannot fix, I wouldn't play him right now in the playoffs, but this guy has missed two offseasons of normal conditioning,.....

He is simply out of gas......

That's probably true (hopefully).
 
Do you think it would be smart not to play Malkin this series with the Rangers since things have worked out well without him since his injury.
Get thru this one with a series win and work Malkin in next playoff round!
It doesn't matter how good someone is, the PENS had incredible chemistry since early early /mid March so don't try to fix whats not broken.
Seems like they played different in game # 2/slower!

I think that if Malkin is healthy, you have to play him ..... he is an elite player ...... the Rangers are very good and we will need to play our best to beat them ..... there are some rumors that Malkin's "upper body injury" which looked like a hand or arm injury to me still is hindering his ability to shoot .... I don't know if that is true or not but if Malkin is healthy, the Pens are obviously a much better team with Malkin then without him ..... I think he'll get better over the next game or two after he gets back into the flow of things ..... remember also that other then a few shifts with Crosby, Malkin was playing with some new line mates in the last game and the more they play together, the better they will get.... if Malkin is healthy, he has to play in my opinion.
 
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Speaking of Strawman arguments. What the hell does that have to do with what the guy said?

He said it doesn't matter how good a player is, if chemistry isn't broken, don't try and fix it.....in reference to his belief that Malkin should not be put back into the lineup. I was simply asking if the roles were reversed and the other world class hockey talent was out, would he still think Crosby should not be put back into the lineup when healthy. Relax man, its a message board.
 
This shouldn't be a shocker to anybody, but Malkin is not 100%. In fact, he really can't take faceoffs from the left side right now due to pain, which is why Fehr and others have taken the draws. He'll get more healthy over the next couple games and honestly, with all this heat, I expect a multi point game out of him tomorrow. I'll take a 70% Malkin over a 100% Sundqvist or 6 minutes of Schultz as a 7th dman.
 
He said it doesn't matter how good a player is, if chemistry isn't broken, don't try and fix it.....in reference to his belief that Malkin should not be put back into the lineup. I was simply asking if the roles were reversed and the other world class hockey talent was out, would he still think Crosby should not be put back into the lineup when healthy. Relax man, its a message board.
To answer your question if the PENS made the same run with Crosby out ( like 9th or10th to 2nd something like that) and he Crosby came back the 2nd game of the first Stanley Cup series I wouldn't want to upset positive momentum.I would delay Crosby's entry into the lineup until I as the HC was sure he was 100% and fit into the new lineup.
Remember Malkin was out for an extended time and others stepped up helping the PENS move to second place in the conference.
I guess we'll see how things work out!
Sometimes when a "superstar" reenters the line-up others who were productive players defer to the "superstar." If he the "superstar" doesn't produce things go downhill!
Don't try to fix things that aren't broken!
 
Come on guys, let's not be silly here. If Malkin can play, of course you play him. That's not even worth debating.

The question is how do you use him?

I think Pittsburgh used Geno pretty well in game two. They mixed and matched him all over the ice and were really trying to confuse New York's defense pairings. Honestly, it mostly worked. The Pens had lots of room out there to make plays, they just didn't execute.

I would prefer to see them try Crosby between Sheary and Rust but the idea of putting Geno between them - and then spotting him on Crosby's line from time to time - certainly has its merits too.

I need to see Geno shoot more to make a decision on his game readiness. He passed up a lot of shot opportunities last night. We need that howitzer back there – especially on the power play. If we don't get anything going on the power play in this series, we are going to have a tough time winning it.
 
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