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OT- SCF- Game #6 ..... Pens vs Nashville ......

Does anyone have any thoughts on how the Pens should focus their offseason? I think you pretty clearly bring back your RFAs: Sheary, Archibald, Sundqvist, Schultz, and Dumoulin. That probably eats up most of the money ($12.9M) currently available with maybe just $2-3M left in a best case scenario. Assuming they can get rid of Fleury and Hagelin without taking back salary, that should leave them with about $9.2M to fill in holes.

I would see them being left with needing 1 C, 1-2 W, 2D, and 1 backup G.

I think Shattenkirk is the only big time FA who would really fill a big area, but he will be offered a deal far too rich for Pittsburgh and his PP contributions would likely be redundant and reduce his value to Pittsburgh. I'd be really interested in the Martin Hanzal being signed as the Bonino/Cullen replacement and really going strong down the center of the ice. I think you could go after him and trust one of Sunqvist or Rowney can assume the 4th line role with Astin-Reese and Blueger possible impacts, as well. Next I would be interested in Michael Del Zotto and bringing back Ron Hainsey on a short term deal and then (again) seeing if Pouliot has anything. For backup G, I would love Nilsson, but would be happy with just bringing a guy like Mike Condon back and the fit is pretty natural. At W, I am pretty happy with our organizational options to fill the (maybe) 1 spot that should be available, but I would also be interested in a guy like Scottie Upshall for a safe 4th line option, outside of the unproven ranks.

I think we could get Hanzal, Del Zotto, Hainsey, Nilsson/Condon, and Upshall for around $9M and then have $1-2M left for flexibility at the deadline and depth signings, as needed.
 
the real MVP

matt murray

2 shut outs to clinch the cup, just imagine how many cups this team could've won if he was here back in 2010
 
Does anyone have any thoughts on how the Pens should focus their offseason? I think you pretty clearly bring back your RFAs: Sheary, Archibald, Sundqvist, Schultz, and Dumoulin. That probably eats up most of the money ($12.9M) currently available with maybe just $2-3M left in a best case scenario. Assuming they can get rid of Fleury and Hagelin without taking back salary, that should leave them with about $9.2M to fill in holes.

I would see them being left with needing 1 C, 1-2 W, 2D, and 1 backup G.

I think Shattenkirk is the only big time FA who would really fill a big area, but he will be offered a deal far too rich for Pittsburgh and his PP contributions would likely be redundant and reduce his value to Pittsburgh. I'd be really interested in the Martin Hanzal being signed as the Bonino/Cullen replacement and really going strong down the center of the ice. I think you could go after him and trust one of Sunqvist or Rowney can assume the 4th line role with Astin-Reese and Blueger possible impacts, as well. Next I would be interested in Michael Del Zotto and bringing back Ron Hainsey on a short term deal and then (again) seeing if Pouliot has anything. For backup G, I would love Nilsson, but would be happy with just bringing a guy like Mike Condon back and the fit is pretty natural. At W, I am pretty happy with our organizational options to fill the (maybe) 1 spot that should be available, but I would also be interested in a guy like Scottie Upshall for a safe 4th line option, outside of the unproven ranks.

I think we could get Hanzal, Del Zotto, Hainsey, Nilsson/Condon, and Upshall for around $9M and then have $1-2M left for flexibility at the deadline and depth signings, as needed.
Rip...my thoughts...

Fleury is gone. UFA's.........
Kunitz. Maybe a 1 year deal at $2 mill, he is a bottom 6 winger. Love him come playoff time. BUT....the key is, can Scott Wilson come in and be the next Chris Kunitz? Which I think he can and will be. But Kunitz has 4 rings now.....if some team comes in with a 2-3 year deal at $2.5-3 million per, you have to let him walk.
Bonino. Some team is going to come with a 3-4 year package at $3.5-4 million +. Trust me, I see what alot lesser players get, and this is a guy now with 2 rings and experience, that some lower level team will look for as a 2nd line Center. And he will disappoint in that role. He is a 3rd liner, but again it is a business and Bonino will get paid, and he no longer has to chase rings because he has two.
Cullen: Great story, great romance, possibly if he wants to come back at $1million or so, then yes. But he may not want to come back. He may just want to retire. He also may be back as Dickie Tocchet's replacement behind the bench.
Daley: He will be 34 years. He is going to likely get a 2-3 year deal at around $3 million. The Pens can easily afford that next year, but not in future years. He was a great soldier but this relationship is likely to end.
Ron Hainsey, Mark Streit, thank you for your service.
Chad Ruwhedel. He is a depth guy. If you can sign him for a 2way contract, likely to return.

Of the RFA's, Schultz, Dumolin and Sheary are the likely must signs. Sundquist will be also but he should be cheap and he is needed to step into a 4th line role. You need cheap bottom 6 players.

The Free Agent class is weak (and it seems to be getting weaker each year as teams are getting smarter and preventing players in their primes from getting to free agency.

I can see the Pens making a run a Martin Hanzal, a big, strong Center faceoff guy, who can score 20 goals.
The Pens also could be looking for a big, "tough" winger to have on the roster to help patrol the ice for Sid, Letang and Geno. I can see the Pens making a run at Cody Franson, Roman Polak, Brendan Smith, Jared Cowan, Karl Alzner. Teams can and likely will offer more, the Pens have what few can offer, a legit, LEGIT chance at a ring. Or two.

I can see the Pens also moving a Hagelin, I like him, but he has 2 years left at $4 million per. A 2 time Cup Winner is always attractive for teams. He could be moved for a Dman.

The Pens have the following guys who will make under a million next year. Guentzel, Rust, Kuhnackl, Wilson, Rowney, Sundquist, in fact most of them will be under $750,000. That gives you alot of flexibility. This is what Chicago has been doing, except Chicago really started getting themselves in a bind for getting too many high priced players they needed to purge guys like Saad, Bolland, etc...

Oh in goal, I know they like Jarry, but I would expect the Pens to sign a Mike Condon like backup, so Jarry can play and be the guy in the AHL instead of sitting behind Murray. I think Daniel Sprong will start the season in the AHL, seeing how he does against men, learning other parts of the game. He no doubt looks like the role of a goal scorer. Oh and Guentzel is the real deal. He has "it". He has speed, one helluva shot, willingness to go to the net, and really high hockey IQ. I think Sheary is great too, I just think that having both he and Guentzel on Sid's line really gives them a lack of size and physical presence that can allow teams to take runs at Sid and Guentzel.

Amazing. After the 2015 season, this team looked dead. Their run over. Too cap strung. A curious trade for Phil Kessel. Their farms system prospects were rated amongst the worst in the NHL. Looked like the Sid/Geno run was over and a disappointment. Bloated. Tired. Then they fired Johnston, all of a sudden these middling prospects started to trickle in one by one and be real, legit players, Rust, Sheary, Kuhnackl, Guentzel. And Matt Murray happened. All of a sudden the Pens had the best young goalie in the world. Just an amazing transformation as they have won back to back cups, still have their core under contract and are favorites for next year. The NHL hasn't see a franchise like this since the Pre Cap era Red Wings.
 
the real MVP

matt murray

2 shut outs to clinch the cup, just imagine how many cups this team could've won if he was here back in 2010

Just imagine how many they would have won if Rutherford and Sullivan were here. I think that maybe more fair. Murray in 2010 would have been 16 years old.
 
He is pretty damn clutch ain't he?
He is.
Remember game 7 against the caps, though.

Sullivan went with Murray after 2 back to back bad games after yanking Fleury when the whole team stunk.

It was the right call.
But let's pretend nothing other than truth... no Fleury... no cup. He beat the #4 and #1 seeds.

Murray did his job against double digit seeds and is the new franchise.
 
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He is.
Remember game 7 against the caps, though.

Sullivan went with Murray after 2 back to back bad games after yanking Fleury when the whole team stunk.

It was the right call.
But let's pretend nothing other than truth... no Fleury... no cup. He beat the #4 and #2 seeds.

Murray did his job against double digit seeds and is the new franchise.

Oh no doubt. Fleury gets props here too.
 
Interesting what Calgary just gave up to get Mike Smith from the Coyotes. I guess the Pens must be very, very confident Vegas will take MAF or MAF said no to going to Calgary. Coyotes (in exchange for a 35 year old G who is, at best, slightly below MAF and makes the same salary) got a 2/3rd rounder (conditional), a decent and cheap backup G, and a solid D prospect.

I would have been happy with this for Fleury.
 
Interesting what Calgary just gave up to get Mike Smith from the Coyotes. I guess the Pens must be very, very confident Vegas will take MAF or MAF said no to going to Calgary. Coyotes (in exchange for a 35 year old G who is, at best, slightly below MAF and makes the same salary) got a 2/3rd rounder (conditional), a decent and cheap backup G, and a solid D prospect.

I would have been happy with this for Fleury.

Yeah, I am somewhat confused by this. Unless they made the deal before MAF really regenerated his worth with his playoff performance and now probably could have gotten more for Fleury than they thought when they initially agreed to this with Vegas. But if you look at this way, it is MAF's salary AND the Pens get to keep Dumoulin and Cole.
 
Yeah, I am somewhat confused by this. Unless they made the deal before MAF really regenerated his worth with his playoff performance and now probably could have gotten more for Fleury than they thought when they initially agreed to this with Vegas. But if you look at this way, it is MAF's salary AND the Pens get to keep Dumoulin and Cole.
Good point and that is the other wrinkle to this whole thing. Although, wouldn't the Pens still be able to match on Dumoulin as a RFA? They don't get compensation for him, if he signs with them and they don't match, but I thought they still had the right to match.
 
Yeah, I am somewhat confused by this. Unless they made the deal before MAF really regenerated his worth with his playoff performance and now probably could have gotten more for Fleury than they thought when they initially agreed to this with Vegas. But if you look at this way, it is MAF's salary AND the Pens get to keep Dumoulin and Cole.
Perhaps it's simply about doing right by a good player and human by only shipping him to a location he agreed to??
 
So, now we wait a few days and hope Vegas takes MAF and not Cole or Rust.

It is going to be interesting to see how active the Pens are in the trade market and what they would be willing to part with, since the FA market is so weak.
 
Coyotes (in exchange for a 35 year old G who is, at best, slightly below MAF and makes the same salary) got a 2/3rd rounder (conditional), a decent and cheap backup G, and a solid D prospect.


The backup goalie they got in the deal is an unrestricted free agent in 13 days. All they really got there was an exclusive negotiating window for a guy that they could have signed anyway in two weeks.
 
The Pens protected Dumoulin. They opted to protect four defensemen and only four forwards rather than seven forwards but only three defensemen.

Pens protected list: Crosby, Malkin, Kessel, Hornqvist, Dumoulin, Letang, Matta, Schultz and Murray.

Again, if it as they say, that the deal has been made in some fashion and Vegas is selecting Fleury, the unprotected/protected list for the Pens is meaningless.
 
Again, if it as they say, that the deal has been made in some fashion and Vegas is selecting Fleury, the unprotected/protected list for the Pens is meaningless.


Absolutely. And even if some deal hasn't been made it's pretty likely that Vegas is picking Fluery anyway. But the fact that the Pens protected four and four rather than seven and three is interesting. It means that at least theoretically the Pens think that their fourth best defenseman is worth as much or more than their fifth, sixth and seventh best forwards.
 
Whoever LV picks from the list is meaningless for the team. With Sprong and Reese likely to have a shot to make the team next year. Losing a forward won't hurt a bit..
Definitely not true, but it be would be worse to lose one of the defensemen. Hopefully they won't have to worry about it anyway.
 
Rip...my thoughts...

Fleury is gone. UFA's.........
Kunitz. Maybe a 1 year deal at $2 mill, he is a bottom 6 winger. Love him come playoff time. BUT....the key is, can Scott Wilson come in and be the next Chris Kunitz? Which I think he can and will be. But Kunitz has 4 rings now.....if some team comes in with a 2-3 year deal at $2.5-3 million per, you have to let him walk.
Bonino. Some team is going to come with a 3-4 year package at $3.5-4 million +. Trust me, I see what alot lesser players get, and this is a guy now with 2 rings and experience, that some lower level team will look for as a 2nd line Center. And he will disappoint in that role. He is a 3rd liner, but again it is a business and Bonino will get paid, and he no longer has to chase rings because he has two.
Cullen: Great story, great romance, possibly if he wants to come back at $1million or so, then yes. But he may not want to come back. He may just want to retire. He also may be back as Dickie Tocchet's replacement behind the bench.
Daley: He will be 34 years. He is going to likely get a 2-3 year deal at around $3 million. The Pens can easily afford that next year, but not in future years. He was a great soldier but this relationship is likely to end.
Ron Hainsey, Mark Streit, thank you for your service.
Chad Ruwhedel. He is a depth guy. If you can sign him for a 2way contract, likely to return.

Of the RFA's, Schultz, Dumolin and Sheary are the likely must signs. Sundquist will be also but he should be cheap and he is needed to step into a 4th line role. You need cheap bottom 6 players.

The Free Agent class is weak (and it seems to be getting weaker each year as teams are getting smarter and preventing players in their primes from getting to free agency.

I can see the Pens making a run a Martin Hanzal, a big, strong Center faceoff guy, who can score 20 goals.
The Pens also could be looking for a big, "tough" winger to have on the roster to help patrol the ice for Sid, Letang and Geno. I can see the Pens making a run at Cody Franson, Roman Polak, Brendan Smith, Jared Cowan, Karl Alzner. Teams can and likely will offer more, the Pens have what few can offer, a legit, LEGIT chance at a ring. Or two.

I can see the Pens also moving a Hagelin, I like him, but he has 2 years left at $4 million per. A 2 time Cup Winner is always attractive for teams. He could be moved for a Dman.

The Pens have the following guys who will make under a million next year. Guentzel, Rust, Kuhnackl, Wilson, Rowney, Sundquist, in fact most of them will be under $750,000. That gives you alot of flexibility. This is what Chicago has been doing, except Chicago really started getting themselves in a bind for getting too many high priced players they needed to purge guys like Saad, Bolland, etc...

Oh in goal, I know they like Jarry, but I would expect the Pens to sign a Mike Condon like backup, so Jarry can play and be the guy in the AHL instead of sitting behind Murray. I think Daniel Sprong will start the season in the AHL, seeing how he does against men, learning other parts of the game. He no doubt looks like the role of a goal scorer. Oh and Guentzel is the real deal. He has "it". He has speed, one helluva shot, willingness to go to the net, and really high hockey IQ. I think Sheary is great too, I just think that having both he and Guentzel on Sid's line really gives them a lack of size and physical presence that can allow teams to take runs at Sid and Guentzel.

Amazing. After the 2015 season, this team looked dead. Their run over. Too cap strung. A curious trade for Phil Kessel. Their farms system prospects were rated amongst the worst in the NHL. Looked like the Sid/Geno run was over and a disappointment. Bloated. Tired. Then they fired Johnston, all of a sudden these middling prospects started to trickle in one by one and be real, legit players, Rust, Sheary, Kuhnackl, Guentzel. And Matt Murray happened. All of a sudden the Pens had the best young goalie in the world. Just an amazing transformation as they have won back to back cups, still have their core under contract and are favorites for next year. The NHL hasn't see a franchise like this since the Pre Cap era Red Wings.

-If it was me, I would try to resign EVERYONE. And I mean EVERYONE. We just won back to back cups without Letang. No one in the last 2 years has proven to be able to stop us and this unit of players, try to keep the same exact core until someone proves they can stop us.

-Fleury is probably gone, find a backup goalie that is respectable. I would not screw around with players asking for a little more money while winning back to back without Letang. No way I want Bonino gone. He fits our team to a T and is a good faceoff player and shot blocker. The little things that do not show up on the stat sheet are important. Get the whole roster back minus Fleury, I dont care about age at this moment, we could win 2 more in a row right now with this unit and should run the east over next year with Letang and a healthy roster.

-We are talking about potentially making history and a dynasty here. Some players will sacrifice money to be part of a potential Penguin dynasty. The team rapport is strong with the current unit and the entire core are winners. Re-Sign all of them.
 
-If it was me, I would try to resign EVERYONE. And I mean EVERYONE. We just won back to back cups without Letang. No one in the last 2 years has proven to be able to stop us and this unit of players, try to keep the same exact core until someone proves they can stop us.

-Fleury is probably gone, find a backup goalie that is respectable. I would not screw around with players asking for a little more money while winning back to back without Letang. No way I want Bonino gone. He fits our team to a T and is a good faceoff player and shot blocker. The little things that do not show up on the stat sheet are important. Get the whole roster back minus Fleury, I dont care about age at this moment, we could win 2 more in a row right now with this unit and should run the east over next year with Letang and a healthy roster.

-We are talking about potentially making history and a dynasty here. Some players will sacrifice money to be part of a potential Penguin dynasty. The team rapport is strong with the current unit and the entire core are winners. Re-Sign all of them.


You realize there is a salary cap in the NHL, right? And that because there is one there is absolutely no chance at all that the Penguins can bring everyone back, right? Even if they wanted to, which they probably don't.
 
You realize there is a salary cap in the NHL, right? And that because there is one there is absolutely no chance at all that the Penguins can bring everyone back, right? Even if they wanted to, which they probably don't.

-The cap got raised and Fleury is probably headed to Vegas. We have a ton to work with. The only player Im not crazy about is Olli Maata injury or no injury this year, we can trade him away.

-Resign Cullen and Hainsey on the the cheap. Kunitz takes a paycut. Sheary, Dumo, Bonino, and Shultz get raises. Daley stays about the same as he is aging. That's the bulk of the lineup already done and try to make each contract 1 or 2 years max.

-Should be an easy off-season unless we are adding more, not less. I dont see the difficulty in this at all.
 
I dont see the difficulty in this at all.


It's no surprise that you don't. It's obvious by his words that Jim Rutherford does. I wonder which of the two of you has a better idea about what is going on? Hmmmmm.

By the way, Matta is on the Pens protected list. It's obvious that the Penguins hold him in much higher regard than you do.
 
It's no surprise that you don't. It's obvious by his words that Jim Rutherford does. I wonder which of the two of you has a better idea about what is going on? Hmmmmm.

By the way, Matta is on the Pens protected list. It's obvious that the Penguins hold him in much higher regard than you do.

-He only said that about the unrestricted free agents. And guess what, he did it for a reason. Cullen and Hainsey will probably either resign cheap with Pittsburgh or retire.

-The only other players that are unrestricted that really matter are Kunitz (37), Daley ( 34 in October ), and the big one, Bonino. Kunitz wont sniff 4 million anywhere and Daley may or may not break 3.3 mil so we get the upper hand by letting both of them talk to anyone they want before we negotiate. Bonino is the only one worth talking about since he is getting a raise with a possible bidding war. The others not mentioned under unrestricted are severe role players, mean little.

-As for the protected list, its irrelevant with Fleury since he dropped the no movement clause. It means nothing since Vegas is going to take him. We can trade Matta if we choose to try and get a better defensmen and a better power play if we choose. He's overrated and overpaid at this point, albeit, only 22 years old so he does have upside and maybe he likes his upside.
 
-He only said that about the unrestricted free agents. And guess what, he did it for a reason. Cullen and Hainsey will probably either resign cheap with Pittsburgh or retire.

-The only other players that are unrestricted that really matter are Kunitz (37), Daley ( 34 in October ), and the big one, Bonino. Kunitz wont sniff 4 million anywhere and Daley may or may not break 3.3 mil so we get the upper hand by letting both of them talk to anyone they want before we negotiate. Bonino is the only one worth talking about since he is getting a raise with a possible bidding war. The others not mentioned under unrestricted are severe role players, mean little.

-As for the protected list, its irrelevant with Fleury since he dropped the no movement clause. It means nothing since Vegas is going to take him. We can trade Matta if we choose to try and get a better defensmen and a better power play if we choose. He's overrated and overpaid at this point, albeit, only 22 years old so he does have upside and maybe he likes his upside.


If it only it was as easy as you are making it sound......simply put it's not.

The Pens are up against the Salary Cap every year and this year will be no different. Players such as Doumilon, Schultz, Rust, Sheary and others who are RFA's are due raises. That eats up most of the cap space they had.

Players such as Bonino who I am sure the Pens would love to have back are UFA's. All it takes is one team to offer a big money deal that doesn't make sense or makes it impossible for the Pens to resign.

Kunitz won't get 4 million but he is not going to get league minimum either.

Obviously if you could bring back the whole team you probably do so for the most part, but that is not realistic and
 
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I suggested what Calgary gave up wasn't relevant as Fleury has vegas as his agreed to destination.

You seemed to want to argue that point, so I further clarified Fleury is in control of his destination- not the pens

Technically you are incorrect but overall your point is valid. Fleury has a limited no trade clause so the Pens could have in theory traded him to other teams besides going to Vegas.

However, the Pens worked out a deal with Fleury in Feb instead of trading him then, he was willing to waive his NTC in order to go to Vegas in the expansion draft. He did the Pens a favor by doing that and the Pens will honor that unless Vegas picks a different player off the Pens roster.

If I was Vegas, I would draft Rust and then trade for Fleury. Vegas will have tons of draft picks after this draft so they could easily get Fleury from the Pens for something and then still get a good forward in Rust.
 
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I suggested what Calgary gave up wasn't relevant as Fleury has vegas as his agreed to destination.

You seemed to want to argue that point, so I further clarified Fleury is in control of his destination- not the pens

Not totally. And what is your infatuation with the guy? Good guy. Good goalie. And that's that.
 
It's not as easy as keeping the same roster. These players have played A LOT of games over the last two years. They are going to want to get fresh bodies in around the core players. Rutherford has straight up said he wants to add some beef to to protect his players.

These are humans, not video game players. Winning this much takes a toll.

On top of that, we don't know what the UFAs are going to want. Unlike last year, there will be more movement this year, which may or may not be a bad thing.
 
Oh sorry, I thought the discussion was about SCF Game 6, and the Pens winning the Cup.
Hasn't been about that since post 25 or so. In fact, check out post # 30 by none other than YOU, talking about Fleury's smile! I think that YOU are the one infatuated with MAF!
 
Oh sorry, I thought the discussion was about SCF Game 6, and the Pens winning the Cup.
Not since Saturday, then it was expansion draft
Hasn't been about that since post 25 or so. In fact, check out post # 30 by none other than YOU, talking about Fleury's smile! I think that YOU are the one infatuated with MAF!
oops
 
It's not as easy as keeping the same roster. These players have played A LOT of games over the last two years. They are going to want to get fresh bodies in around the core players. Rutherford has straight up said he wants to add some beef to to protect his players.

These are humans, not video game players. Winning this much takes a toll.

On top of that, we don't know what the UFAs are going to want. Unlike last year, there will be more movement this year, which may or may not be a bad thing.

-This point would have more merit if we were actually healthy this year. We had a total of 10 players ONLY play more than 62 games in the regular season. Letang played 41, Guentzel 40, etc... So people from other teams can say all they want about the Pens being tired winning back to back. We won back to back with a depleted unhealthy roster the entire season with a lot guys missing a ton of games this season and no one could stop us. We wont be tired next year.
 
-This point would have more merit if we were actually healthy this year. We had a total of 10 players ONLY play more than 62 games in the regular season. Letang played 41, Guentzel 40, etc... So people from other teams can say all they want about the Pens being tired winning back to back. We won back to back with a depleted unhealthy roster the entire season with a lot guys missing a ton of games this season and no one could stop us. We wont be tired next year.

Well, Rutherord thinks otherwise, as do many others close to the game.

You have a video game mind.
 
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Well, Rutherord thinks otherwise, as do many others close to the game.

You have a video game mind.

-You really think a Coach, a GM, an Owner, is going to speak the truth to the media 100% of the time and just tell the world what is he is openly going to do? Common guys.
 
Assuming they don't have a trade in place my preference for who NOT to lose in order would be:
Cole - playoff has shown that they need depth on blue line
Wilson - Showed his worth in the playoffs, tough & can score, Kunitz lite
Sundqvist - A low cost alternative if Bonino can't be signed
Rust - Nice player but hasn't produced in regular season and they have depth up front
Fleury - Not about his play, just a chance for him to be #1, cap flexibility
Hagelin - Love his speed on the fore-check, but hasn't produced for salary

Anyone else unprotected
 
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