All projected as Top 10 in different mocks. Would any of you take any of them over Pickett straight up? I wouldnt. The OSU dude has no chance. Their QBs suck. Young's success was due to elite talent around him. And Levis and Richardson arent good. The Steelers are lucky they got their QB last year.
Pickett vs Young, Stroud, Levis, Richardson
- Thread starter Sean Miller Fan
- Start date
Dang, for once I agree with you. And I’ll add that they didn’t have to give up anything to get him beyond the first round pick they used to draft him. As long as they get him the weapons and protection necessary for him to succeed, well done by the Steelers.
Young is a very good college QB who played in a great program. Will his game translate over if he was drafted by the Browns, or Lions? I don't think so, mainly his size has to be a concern.
I'm not sure how well Young's game translates to the pros, but he is immensely gifted.
Before he ever got to college I saw him play vs. Saint Francis in Baltimore where he singlehandedly beat one of the most talented defenses ever assembled at the High School level. SFA's entire front 7 was power 5 and if I'm not mistaken so were the backups.
He pretty much did the same in the toughest conference in football.
But, he is not just small for that position, he's really small.
Yeah. Major questions. I would say maybe Stroud but tOSU's QB's have not fared will in the NFL. Some of these programs just have so much talent that they get good QB's who dominate. But it is like alot of the Oklahoma QB's, you get all of that talent and in that system, when you get to the NFL and struggle, you just don't know how to react.
Agree with this. Young seems capable, but his size will get him beat down fairly quickly.
Stroud has the far better physique to last longer in the league. But he is stiff and indecisive. Kind of moves on tiptoes.
I haven’t seen enough of the other two to judge.
Bad take on Young; he has the ability to be extremely special in the league. Size is a concern, and it's no guarantee that he will be special, but he has some Mahomes to him. I would absolutely take a gamble on him over Pickett. The others? Not so sure about Stroud. I haven't seen a ton of him, and he's been throwing to Harrison Jr., Smith-Njigba, Wilson, and Olave the last two seasons. Definitely not Levis or Richardson.
I wouldn't be shocked if at least Richardson slips out of the first round. A gifted Malik Willis was thought to be a first round pick/top ten at this time time year. There is a lot of change to come. Have to say, though: This seems like a pretty weak first round in general.
I wouldn't be shocked if at least Richardson slips out of the first round. A gifted Malik Willis was thought to be a first round pick/top ten at this time time year. There is a lot of change to come. Have to say, though: This seems like a pretty weak first round in general.
A rare SMF post I agree with. As a rule I’m not taking an Alabama or OSU QB. The talent advantage is so great in college that I don’t think it translates to the pros.
And before you cite Tua, I’d say his season was more due to Waddle and Hill than his own talents.
Give KP8 those two WRs and he’s winning the North with multiple games to spare.
And before you cite Tua, I’d say his season was more due to Waddle and Hill than his own talents.
Give KP8 those two WRs and he’s winning the North with multiple games to spare.
See, I can't subscribe to that "this school produces busts" theory, because it's such a chicken or egg thing. Most quarterbacks are going to be busts, statistically. There might be 10-15 good ones in the world at any one time, and most of them are fixtures in the league for over a decade. So it stands to reason that most high picks will be busts. Therefore, the schools that produce most of those picks are going to look like they produce the most busts. And most of the premier high school talent is going to end up at these schools. So there is a lot of margin for error when it comes to cause and effect.
Pick a school to follow and look at their last few highly drafted QBs. Going off the top of my head here (so I may be missing quite a few):
Florida - Danny Wuerffel, Rex Grossman, Tim Tebow, Kyle Trask. Still early on Trask, but mostly seems like a list of busts.
Florida State - Jameis Winston, EJ Manuel, Christian Ponder, Chris Weinke.
Texas - Colt McCoy, Vince Young, Chris Simms.
Notre Dame - Jimmy Clausen, Brady Quinn, Deshon Kizer.
And the lists just go on and on... until they don't.
LSU quarterbacks sucked... then came Burrow. Big 12 quarterbacks sucked... then came Mahomes.
Most quarterbacks just end up sucking. You can't penalize Ohio State and Alabama for attracting more talented quarterbacks.
Pick a school to follow and look at their last few highly drafted QBs. Going off the top of my head here (so I may be missing quite a few):
Florida - Danny Wuerffel, Rex Grossman, Tim Tebow, Kyle Trask. Still early on Trask, but mostly seems like a list of busts.
Florida State - Jameis Winston, EJ Manuel, Christian Ponder, Chris Weinke.
Texas - Colt McCoy, Vince Young, Chris Simms.
Notre Dame - Jimmy Clausen, Brady Quinn, Deshon Kizer.
And the lists just go on and on... until they don't.
LSU quarterbacks sucked... then came Burrow. Big 12 quarterbacks sucked... then came Mahomes.
Most quarterbacks just end up sucking. You can't penalize Ohio State and Alabama for attracting more talented quarterbacks.
There's teams who are taking these guys at 2, 3, etc and if I'm a Steelers fan, I would be pissed if they traded Pickett for the #2 pick to take the Young or Stroud. Bama and OSU QB's would scare the crap out of me as a GM. When you look at successful QBs, they seem to come from lesser programs
Mahomes
Allen
Lamar Jackson
Purdy
Jimmy G
Even guys like Brady and Burrow who were from blue bloods, were very late bloomers.
Young is easily the best in this class IMO. As noted his size is the only knock, but that’s a tough one. Will be important that he lands with a coach that knows how to use his strengths, a la Murray with Kingsbury. He looks slighter than Murray and don’t think he’s as athletic, but Young is a better QB. That said Canada ain’t that coach to do it.
Picking at #20, I’d have to consider Richardson, who has big time upside.
Picking at #20, I’d have to consider Richardson, who has big time upside.
You really do post some absurd stuff.
If you knew anything about the game, you’d understand that Young is an absolutely outstanding QB by any measure. He has elite arm talent, probably more so than any QB to come out in years. His only flaw as an NFL prospect is his size. I also think Stroud has a lot of talent. Would I take him over Pickett if they both came out at the same time with the same numbers? Probably not but that’s not some no brainer. To say he “has no chance” because “OSU QBs suck” is just stupid.
I wouldn’t touch Levis or Richardson in the first round, maybe not even the second
I'd take Levis- he gives you the best chance of sucking enough to get Maye or Williams next year.
Agreed, the OSU QB thing is beyond silly. Discounting a QB because previous players from that school failed is lazy. How many years was that said about Tedford QBs, even up to the year Rodgers came out.
Especially when two of the top quarterbacks in the league this past season started their college careers at Alabama and Ohio State. Are we going to move the goalposts to, "Okay, I would only take an OSU or Alabama quarterback IF the coaches thought someone else should start over him!"... ?
So when if a team wants to trade their pick (when Young is available) for Pickett, you accept the deal and essentially trade Pickett for Young?
And LET HIM PLAY, stop babying him now, put him in position next year to throw 20-25 TDs and 3500-4000 yards, numbers matter, his have to be bigger, this year, 2023.
He’s more likely to be similar to the last Richardson we picked in the 1st round from FL than a starter in the NFL.
Young is closer to Flutie height than Murray height. And he has a slight build unlike Murray. Name the last small QB to really be a difference maker in the NFL? Drew Brees?
I would take that bet with you any day of the week, twice on Sundays.
I don't think Young is big enough to take the pounding in the league
I'd be too concerned about Young's size to draft him or trade for him. From a talent standpoint, he's way ahead of Pickett and anybody else I can think of that came out the last 2 years. But he's just too small
I don't love any of these top QB prospects as a first round pick. I had the same thought last year, when I posted in the months before the draft in the Pickett/Howell/Ridder/Willis debates that Pickett was the only QB I thought was worthy of a first round pick. Ridder would have been my second choice. The others I wouldn't touch.
If Young was 6'2 or taller, he'd be the best pro QB prospect since T Lawrence.
pittdan77
Athletic Director
It takes a bit more than size or arm strength to be a good QB. Let's face it, plenty of those guys have failed. How well does the guy make decisions under pressure? Can he make a throw knowing he's going to get blown up? Is he a guy that can take command of a huddle? Does he know how to read a defense? Is he driven to win? Sometimes that last one will propel a guy to success that doesn't really have all the measurables. Sure, a big arm is nice but it's pretty useless if he's going to throw it away instead of taking a shot at a big moment when the game is on the line.
The other problem you see all the time is that NFL teams don't necessarily adjust to what a guy is capable of. If someone expects Young to come in and be a true pocket passer they're going to get him killed. He needs to be able to run if he's going to survive and make plays. Stroud is a better choice if that's the kind of passer you want.
The other problem you see all the time is that NFL teams don't necessarily adjust to what a guy is capable of. If someone expects Young to come in and be a true pocket passer they're going to get him killed. He needs to be able to run if he's going to survive and make plays. Stroud is a better choice if that's the kind of passer you want.
Oh you could be absolutely correct. In no way do I mean to sound like I know Young will be a slam dunk. It's just a gamble I'd take, as I don't think it would be THAT tough finding a suitable replacement who is at least around Pickett's level if Young didn't work out. I just don't see Pickett as an upper-echelon quarterback, but I think Young at least has the tools to possibly be that. It's a gamble, but it's one I would take.
That;s a great pic. Young looks like a child next to Pickett who has pretty close to optimal NFL QB size.I don't think Young is big enough to take the pounding in the league
Stroud is bigger than I thought. Young will be an assistant at Alabama in 5 years, yet some idiot GM will take him in the Top 5
pittdan77
Athletic Director
Given where they got him in the draft, Pickett is absolutely worth the gamble. Especially when you consider that they still probably wouldn't have gotten the pick of the litter and may have had to give up something to move into a better draft slot. End up with about the same gamble but you also have probably failed badly and given away much more to get there.
I agree with your analysis. If I had the choice of Young or Pickett last year, I would have chose Young because of the higher ceiling. But having Pickett already, I wouldn't take another QB this year - at least not from this batch - as I think you have to give Pickett the chance to grow and justify the pick.
Pickett at #20 looks like a good pick considering what will likely be available this year at #17. But I'd still trade him in a heartbeat to have Young. Although small, the dude is super talented. He might end up being a top 5 quarterback - something I don't think Pickett will ever be. And if it doesn't work out, well, you just go back to the drawing board.
If the Colts or Texans had the #1 pick, for instance, I don't think either would trade it in exchange for Kenny Pickett.
Yeah, I agree with that. Like if we had a top 5 pick I wouldn't want a quarterback. I'm just saying if it's an even swap - Pickett for Young - I'd do it.
1. Young - best pure prospect of the bunch, but it's hard to ignore his lack of size.
2. Stroud - he answered some questions in the bowl game about playing out of structure. My questions would be how he does minus all the talent around him and does he have the "it" factor.
3. Pickett - he does have the "it" factor and terrible coaching around him. Year 2 will be interesting.
4. Richardson - his physical traits are off the charts.
5. Levis - big arm, but what else?
2. Stroud - he answered some questions in the bowl game about playing out of structure. My questions would be how he does minus all the talent around him and does he have the "it" factor.
3. Pickett - he does have the "it" factor and terrible coaching around him. Year 2 will be interesting.
4. Richardson - his physical traits are off the charts.
5. Levis - big arm, but what else?
Ok. Fair enough. I'd just be shocked if he's good NFL QB. His build is that of rec flag football QB. I wouldn’t trade Pickett for him. We'll see.
If, hypothetically, a 2nd-year Pickett could enter this draft, which QBs do you think would go before him? I would probably guess Young and Stroud and that's it.
What matters most is can a QB drive the team down the field and score to win the game at the end of the 4th quarter. There are QBs with all the talent in the world who can't do that, and their teammates know they can't do it, and so the team doesn't win big games like the Chiefs did a few Sundays ago. That's hard to predict when drafting, but Pickett has already done it twice in his abbreviated rookie season.
Young and Stroud based on potential but the fact they played on super-teams would scare me as a GM. And Young's size, I just cant see him being any good.
Maybe, maybe not. But you just replace him if he isn't. I'm way more concerned about Pickett becoming Daltonesque.
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The problem with drafting a Young or Stroud (or most QBs) in the Top 5 is you are giving up a sure-fire Pro Bowl, possible HOFer at other positions. The bust rate for other Top 5/10 picks is very low compared to QBs.
