The standard is the standard,’ it feels like a saying now

[pittbb80]

. It’s not something you actually see.”

Harrison also dismissed the usual national media narrative that Tomlin has actually been overachieving the last eight years with underwhelming talent.

“If I’m the head coach of a football team and I’ve been the head coach of this football team for (18 years), and now the team’s not doing well — that all has to fall on my shoulders. Because I’ve been here long enough to be able to draft who I want and put the guys in the positions that I need,” Harrison said. “For me to be like, ‘I haven’t been (able to) get this or get that.’ Well, I’m the guy who’s supposed to be getting that. And I’ve been here long enough to get it.”

Looks like Harrison disagrees with the MM apologists on the board

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

 

[Fk_Pitt]

. It’s not something you actually see.”

Harrison also dismissed the usual national media narrative that Tomlin has actually been overachieving the last eight years with underwhelming talent.

“If I’m the head coach of a football team and I’ve been the head coach of this football team for (18 years), and now the team’s not doing well — that all has to fall on my shoulders. Because I’ve been here long enough to be able to draft who I want and put the guys in the positions that I need,” Harrison said. “For me to be like, ‘I haven’t been (able to) get this or get that.’ Well, I’m the guy who’s supposed to be getting that. And I’ve been here long enough to get it.”

Looks like Harrison disagrees with the MM apologists on the board

I love the steeler talk. I wonder if @Chris Peak could have a forum added to the site specific for OT sports? I know some members here are offended by all the steeler talk, but most of us are pittsburghers. Then again, there are a very few vocal minority who are offended at any negative talk regarding their dear Steelers and the first holy Rooney family and the man tasked to coach the team.

Instead of Father, Son, Holy Ghost, amen…it’s Rooney, Tomlin, we’re better than the mean, the standard is the standard.

 

[pittbb80]

View embedded media

If they don’t hire a new aggressive DC (what ever happened to Bliztburg). And a legit OL coach it’s all window dressing and just more minor tweaks to a failed approach

I think they even need to upgrade from Smith as well but I’m not sure any OC can put enough lipstick on that pig. They are just devoid of talent at the skill positions

 

[steelcurtain55.]

James is just angry and biased because he was never invited to Mike's hotbox like other players have lol...

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

If they don’t hire a new aggressive DC (what ever happened to Bliztburg). And a legit OL coach it’s all window dressing and just more minor tweaks to a failed approach

I think they even need to upgrade from Smith as well but I’m not sure any OC can put enough lipstick on that pig. They are just devoid of talent at the skill positions

spoiler alert. even if they hire a new DC, it will still be the same defensive philosophy under Tomlin's control.

 

[FreeportPanther]

. It’s not something you actually see.”

Harrison also dismissed the usual national media narrative that Tomlin has actually been overachieving the last eight years with underwhelming talent.

“If I’m the head coach of a football team and I’ve been the head coach of this football team for (18 years), and now the team’s not doing well — that all has to fall on my shoulders. Because I’ve been here long enough to be able to draft who I want and put the guys in the positions that I need,” Harrison said. “For me to be like, ‘I haven’t been (able to) get this or get that.’ Well, I’m the guy who’s supposed to be getting that. And I’ve been here long enough to get it.”

Looks like Harrison disagrees with the MM apologists on the board

Funny, I've never heard Tomlin say anything like that.
Heard him address the playoff win drought, and personally take ownership of that.

 

[303vND]

Funny, I've never heard Tomlin say anything like that.
Heard him address the playoff win drought, and personally take ownership of that.

Empty calories when there isn't any consequences. I can take responsibility and ownership of a lot of things if it comes with no consequences.

 

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

Funny, I've never heard Tomlin say anything like that.
Heard him address the playoff win drought, and personally take ownership of that.

But he does not do anything different. It is empty and hollow as Ben Cherrington and Travis Williams saying "Bob Nutting wants to win and takes responsibility". And then they do things exactly the same, year after year.

 

[FreeportPanther]

Empty calories when there isn't any consequences. I can take responsibility and ownership of a lot of things if it comes with no consequences.

LOL, what do you want? Him to fire himself???

 

[pittbb80]

Funny, I've never heard Tomlin say anything like that.
Heard him address the playoff win drought, and personally take ownership of that.

And what has he done ? Actions speak louder than words

 

[pittbb80]

But he does not do anything different. It is empty and hollow as Ben Cherrington and Travis Williams saying "Bob Nutting wants to win and takes responsibility". And then they do things exactly the same, year after year.

Winner winner chicken dinner

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

Definitely needed a new Tomlin thread

 

[303vND]

LOL, what do you want? Him to fire himself???

Be forced to resign!

 

[FreeportPanther]

But he does not do anything different. It is empty and hollow as Ben Cherrington and Travis Williams saying "Bob Nutting wants to win and takes responsibility". And then they do things exactly the same, year after year.

He is what he is. He can't completely reinvent himself.
He makes changes but reluctantly. He got rid of Canada, brought in Wilson and Fields.
They tried like hell to sign a #2 WR but struck out on every top guy they tried to get for various reasons.

Not sure what you guys expect from him. He's dancing with the one who got him here.
Big changes in philosophy would require a new HC, and seems Rooney isn't going that direction.

 

[pittbb80]

Be forced to resign!

Well he is right. But the first thing he could do is hire a legit DC and OL coach and expand his staff. His coaching hires have been awful.

 

[FreeportPanther]

Be forced to resign!

Then tell Rooney! Despite all the grousing, the stadium is still full, Steeler fans take over opposing stadiums, there is a waiting list for season tickets, and the $$ is rolling in.

Much like the PIrates, most of this is out of everyone's hands.

 

[pittbb80]

He is what he is. He can't completely reinvent himself.
He makes changes but reluctantly. He got rid of Canada, brought in Wilson and Fields.
They tried like hell to sign a #2 WR but struck out on every top guy they tried to get for various reasons.

Not sure what you guys expect from him. He's dancing with the one who got him here.
Big changes in philosophy would require a new HC, and seems Rooney isn't going that direction.

You pretty much pointed out the problem and that is Tomlin himself. And you’re right it’s clear the Roomeys are content to stay with the same approach that has lead up to this point. Ultra conservative football on both sides of the ball combine with awful personnel decisions

It’s a sound approach for maintaining the status quo but will not get the franchise back to the elite status it says it wants to be at

 

[FreeportPanther]

Well he is right. But the first thing he could do is hire a legit DC and OL coach and expand his staff. His coaching hires have been awful.

They have been underwhelming. Smith seems decent.
The defense needs an overhaul, but is it Tomlin or Austin, or is it just the personnel??

 

[pittbb80]

Then tell Rooney! Despite all the grousing, the stadium is still full, Steeler fans take over opposing stadiums, there is a waiting list for season tickets, and the $$ is rolling in.

Much like the PIrates, most of this is out of everyone's hands.

For sure much like Nutting why would you make changes to a process that is taking in cash. From a business perspective it makes perfect sense. The reality is there is not a great difference between the Rooneys and Nuttings business model and I can’t blame them

 

[ChiefJusticeMarshall]

Then tell Rooney! Despite all the grousing, the stadium is still full, Steeler fans take over opposing stadiums, there is a waiting list for season tickets, and the $$ is rolling in.

Much like the PIrates, most of this is out of everyone's hands.

Yep

 

[FreeportPanther]

You pretty much pointed out the problem and that is Tomlin himself. And you’re right it’s clear the Roomeys are content to stay with the same approach that has lead up to this point. Ultra conservative football on both sides of the ball combine with awful personnel decisions

It’s a sound approach for maintaining the status quo but will not get the franchise back to the elite status it says it wants to be at

But a huge step forward is to find a solid franchise quarterback. It all starts there.
Every franchise goes through this moving on from a long term QB.
The Steelers themselves did when Bradshaw retired suddenly.

They have to figure out a way to get that guy. Then a lot of things upgrade immediately.

 

[pittbb80]

They have been underwhelming. Smith seems decent.
The defense needs an overhaul, but is it Tomlin or Austin, or is it just the personnel??

Smith is meh. He’s not going good and he’s no where near as bad as Canada or Firtchner

But smith is NOT what they need.

 

[pittbb80]

But a huge step forward is to find a solid franchise quarterback. It all starts there.
Every franchise goes through this moving on from a long term QB.
The Steelers themselves did when Bradshaw retired suddenly.

They have to figure out a way to get that guy. Then a lot of things upgrade immediately.

I kind of disagree. I think you have to start with a really good OL and then adesss the skilll positions. Finding a franchise Qb is like winning a lottery ticket. You can win with a guy like Goff who I don’t think any would say is a franchise Qb

 

[FreeportPanther]

Smith is meh. He’s not going good and he’s no where near as bad as Canada or Firtchner

But smith is NOT what they need.

He's fine as long as they don't have the top gunslinger at QB they sorely need.
He can scheme a run centric attack just fine.
They'll fortify the RB position and seems like Fields gives them this dimension at QB.

Get a few solid possession WR's and teach the TE how to catch a ball, and they can make the playoffs.

 

[FreeportPanther]

I kind of disagree. I think you have to start with a really good OL and then adesss the skilll positions. Finding a franchise Qb is like winning a lottery ticket. You can win with a guy like Goff who I don’t think any would say is a franchise Qb

Well, with a solid O line, you can win with Wilson!
But if you want to be a SB contender, then team a solid O line with a guy like Allen or Daniels, or Stroud, or Burrows. Then you're talking!

 

[Las Panteras]

I would like to see an insider write a book....talking about the decision making, personnel, scouting decisions, all which have led to a once storied franchise now reduced to pedestrian level (s)

the title of the book?

"The Standard No More"

 

[pittbb80]

Well, with a solid O line, you can win with Wilson!
But if you want to be a SB contender, then team a solid O line with a guy like Allen or Daniels, or Stroud, or Burrows. Then you're talking!

We’ll agree to disagree. I don’t think you need an Allen type player. Goff is more than good enough to win a Super Bowl

For sure the better the Qb the greater the margin for error is with the rest of the team.

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

The problem with Tomlin right now is that he's backed into a corner. This team should have started the rebuilding process years ago, instead of milking what little was left in Ben and drafting pieces they thought could help him the most in the immediate future.

So, because the organization elected to kick the can down the road, it remains in limbo with a discontent fan base. The smart thing to do would be to realize this isn't a championship-caliber team and move guys like Watt, Minkah, etc. to acquire what draft capital you can.

However, with fans already bitter toward Tomlin, they're simply not going to wait out a soft rebuild under his leadership. The second they go 7-10, the pitchforks will be out in full force and the narrative will be, "See, he's even lost the one magic trick he had left - not having a losing season." I'm pretty sure Tomlin knows this. So what's he going to do, other than keep up the patchwork effort?

A trade and a fresh start would have benefitted both parties, in my opinion.

 

[FreeportPanther]

We’ll agree to disagree. I don’t think you need an Allen type player. Goff is more than good enough to win a Super Bowl

For sure the better the Qb the greater the margin for error is with the rest of the team.

Is Goff that far removed from that top tier of QB?
If those guys are #1, a QB like Goff is #1A?

Stafford and Noles won SB's lately, but it's mostly been Mahomes and Brady over the past 10 years.

 

[Fk_Pitt]

Rooney is the most complicit. He’s the boss. But Tomlin is the steward of the franchise and his way isn’t working anymore.

But ever notice that an overwhelming majority of people and fans in and around football are critical of Tomlin. The tipping point was reached. With that kind of majority, it takes people from every single circle to form such a strong majority. But the people who defend Tomlin only come from one particular circle, even though there are plenty others within that circle who are “Tomlin out”. But some people just can’t help themselves.

Weird.

 

[FreeportPanther]

The problem with Tomlin right now is that he's backed into a corner. This team should have started the rebuilding process years ago, instead of milking what little was left in Ben and drafting pieces they thought could help him the most in the immediate future.

So, because the organization elected to kick the can down the road, it remains in limbo with a discontent fan base. The smart thing to do would be to realize this isn't a championship-caliber team and move guys like Watt, Minkah, etc. to acquire what draft capital you can.

However, with fans already bitter toward Tomlin, they're simply not going to wait out a soft rebuild under his leadership. The second they go 7-10, the pitchforks will be out in full force and the narrative will be, "See, he's even lost the one magic trick he had left - not having a losing season." I'm pretty sure Tomlin knows this. So what's he going to do, other than keep up the patchwork effort?

A trade and a fresh start would have benefitted both parties, in my opinion.

Probably correct, but every franchise makes the same mistakes with an aging franchise QB.

The soft rebuild you mention is well underway. If they would happen to go 7-10 it might be exactly what the doctor ordered to get up in the draft order and get the QB they need.

 

[FreeportPanther]

Rooney is the most complicit. He’s the boss. But Tomlin is the steward of the franchise and his way isn’t working anymore.

But ever notice that an overwhelming majority of people and fans in and around football are critical of Tomlin. The tipping point was reached. With that kind of majority, it takes people from every single circle to form such a strong majority. But the people who defend Tomlin only come from one particular circle, even though there are plenty others within that circle who are “Tomlin out”. But some people just can’t help themselves.

Weird.

You say that, but it hasn't shown up at the ticket office yet.
Just grumbling about making the playoffs and not advancing.

Rest is just hot air until Rooney is convinced. This team was far from the train wreck some imply it was.

 

[pittdan77]

He's fine as long as they don't have the top gunslinger at QB they sorely need.
He can scheme a run centric attack just fine.
They'll fortify the RB position and seems like Fields gives them this dimension at QB.

Get a few solid possession WR's and teach the TE how to catch a ball, and they can make the playoffs.

Isn't that the same conversation fans have been having for a decade now? They never seem to pull it off.

There was a moment back when the Steelers had Ben and were actually a contender. Not whatever this is, now. 2018 draft and the Steelers used an extra 3rd round pick to take Mason Rudolph. Remember how much Ben hated the pick because he felt there were other needs that were more pressing because he thought they needed to try to win while they still had a solid core? Not plan for the future. The locals trashed him for being selfish because the thought was that the franchise was looking towards his replacement or at least needed a suitable backup but I think it's obvious now that Ben was right. They were living in their fears then and they're still doing it.

 

[Fk_Pitt]

You say that, but it hasn't shown up at the ticket office yet.
Just grumbling about making the playoffs and not advancing.

Rest is just hot air until Rooney is convinced. This team was far from the train wreck some imply it was.

I think it’s coming. I remember games of the past with 10,000+ no shows.

Rooney has to be proactive. And he’s not.

 

[FreeportPanther]

Isn't that the same conversation fans have been having for a decade now? They never seem to pull it off.

There was a moment back when the Steelers had Ben and were actually a contender. Not whatever this is, now. 2018 draft and the Steelers used an extra 3rd round pick to take Mason Rudolph. Remember how much Ben hated the pick because he felt there were other needs that were more pressing because he thought they needed to try to win while they still had a solid core? Not plan for the future. The locals trashed him for being selfish because the thought was that the franchise was looking towards his replacement or at least needed a suitable backup but I think it's obvious now that Ben was right. They were living in their fears then and they're still doing it.

Funny, this is exactly the opposite of fkPitt's take. Both critics but coming from opposite places.
Interesting.

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

Probably correct, but every franchise makes the same mistakes with an aging franchise QB.

The soft rebuild you mention is well underway. If they would happen to go 7-10 it might be exactly what the doctor ordered to get up in the draft order and get the QB they need.

They're finally drafting some offensive linemen, but what have they done that would actually signify a rebuild is taking place? It's not like they've moved any vets. It's not like they have a young QB they're developing. I wouldn't call it a rebuild as much as I would call it finally having some common sense and realizing it starts up front. But they're still letting Watt, Heyward, Minkah, etc. expire - or do something close to it - on this roster.

As far as aging quarterbacks go, I don't know. The Packers let Favre and Rodgers go when both were evidently still very valued on the open market. Colts and Patriots let Manning and Brady walk when both were evidently still good enough to win another Super Bowl. Seattle let Russ go pretty early. I don't see too many teams trotting guys they drafted out there who can barely move.

 

[FreeportPanther]

I think it’s coming. I remember games of the past with 10,000+ no shows.

Rooney has to be proactive. And he’s not.

Then he'll go broke. No skin off my teeth! One less 1%'er would be fine with me!!

 

[pittdan77]

Funny, this is exactly the opposite of fkPitt's take. Both critics but coming from opposite places.
Interesting.

How is it opposite? You're not suggesting that Tomlin has zero input on the draft or player evaluation, are you?

 

[pittdan77]

I think it’s coming. I remember games of the past with 10,000+ no shows.

Eh, tickets are sold. Biggest hit is concessions when people don't show. TV pays regardless.