FSU Fires warning shot to ACC

[ThePanthers]

FSU fires warning shot to ACC: ‘Something has to change’

A trustee asked whether a buyout to leave the ACC was feasible. The answer wasn’t “no.”

www.tampabay.com

Not surprising as FSU has always seemed to have one foot out the door. But the FSU AD met with the FSU BOT today and claimed that something has to change in the ACC in order for FSU to be able to compete nationally with the other big boys.

One FSU BOT asked how much it would cost for FSU to leave the ACC, and the legal counsel said the exit fee is 3 times the ACC operating budget, which would be about $120M. But that does not answer how to get out of the GOR to get their media content back, which I'm guessing would be significantly more expensive.

But at the end of the day, to me, FSU is going to be looking at every avenue to get out of the ACC (along with probably others, but lead by FSU), and even if they are stuck with the conference until the mid 2030s, unless something signficantly changes, the ACC as constituted will only be around for another decade.

Just hoping Pitt can be in the "best of the rest" conference outside of the BIG/SEC.n

 

[lilspainishflea]

Lmao Florida State has 1 double-digit win season in the last 6 years. They should worry about winning games in the ACC before dreaming about an SEC title. They'd be a bottom half SEC team and more money wouldn't change that.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

This is nothing.

Every ACC team (including Pitt) would accept a Power 2 conference bid, even if these teams were making $60-$70 million per year in the ACC.

The ACC discussed unequal revenue sharing at its spring meetings as a way to close the gap for the schools serious about winning (ie not BC and GT). I have always been a fan of unequal revenue sharing and said way back the Big East should have offered it to keep Miami.

The ACC will begin sharing revenue unequally. But it will not keep any team in the ACC. Its the Power 2 and everyone else.

 

[HailtoPitt]

It's only a matter of time. Pitt should have moved heaven and earth to get into the Big 10 years ago. During the Penn State scandal would have been the perfect time, but instead we scheduled two additional games.

Pitt will have to do something, but they won't.

I'd aim for a football only conference, with programs likes Pitt, Miami, Clemson, Oregon, Stanford, and a few others securing a high value tv contract with a competitive amount per team. No bottom feeders.

Then move the other sports to more localized conference play. We would need to keep them because of Title IX, but they don't have to travel across the US to compete.

What will happen is that FSU and Clemson will go to the SEC. Miami will be in the Big 10. Pitt will be a B or C level program without much conference revenue funding the other sports.

 

[Upg bobcat]

Not surprising as FSU has always seemed to have one foot out the door. But the FSU AD met with the FSU BOT today and claimed that something has to change in the ACC in order for FSU to be able to compete nationally with the other big boys.

If they want to "compete nationally with the other big boys," I'd start by not hiring anyone that spends nearly a decade on Todd Graham's staff.

 

[ThePanthers]

Lmao Florida State has 1 double-digit win season in the last 6 years. They should worry about winning games in the ACC before dreaming about an SEC title. They'd be a bottom half SEC team and more money wouldn't change that.

To me, FSU is the Texas of the BIG XII and USC of the PAC12. Have strong resources, big brand name, but can't get out of their own way to win, so they blame everyone else.

They know they have the brand and strength to be able to be invited to the SEC or BIG, just like USC and Texas. They'll bring along their BFF that can get out of their own way and win, but don't want to be left behind just like Texas did with OU, and FSU will with Clemson.

Unfortunately, it's not about the winning for a lot of programs, it's about the $$.

 

[HailtoPitt]

To me, FSU is the Texas of the BIG XII and USC of the PAC12. Have strong resources, big brand name, but can't get out of their own way to win, so they blame everyone else.

They know they have the brand and strength to be able to be invited to the SEC or BIG, just like USC and Texas. They'll bring along their BFF that can get out of their own way and win, but don't want to be left behind just like Texas did with OU, and FSU will with Clemson.

Unfortunately, it's not about the winning for a lot of programs, it's about the $$.

Not sure the Big 10 would want FSU if they didn't want Oregon. They would probably take Miami because of the market.

 

[happjack]

Where do they think they'll go? They bring nothing to the SEC they don't already have and none of the SEC schools want to compete with another Florida school for recruits. The B1G isn't going to add them, any school they add will be from the west or Notre Dame.

 

[ThePanthers]

Where do they think they'll go? They bring nothing to the SEC they don't already have and none of the SEC schools want to compete with another Florida school for recruits. The B1G isn't going to add them, any school they add will be from the west or Notre Dame.

I don't believe this. Things have changed from even 5 years ago. I think both the big and sec would invite them today. Especially the big 10.

 

[HailtoPitt]

I don't believe this. Things have changed from even 5 years ago. I think both the big and sec would invite them today. Especially the big 10.

Clemson and FSU would likely be the top two targets for the SEC. I think the Big would grab Miami.

 

[happjack]

I don't believe this. Things have changed from even 5 years ago. I think both the big and sec would invite them today. Especially the big 10.

What has changed? For the SEC they'd be the second team in a state with a current member and a huge portion of the population is old farts from the Northeast and Midwest who don't care or watch the Florida schools on tv. If they B1G was going to expand in the south they would have raided the ACC at the same time they grabbed USC and UCLA.

 

[ThePanthers]

What has changed? For the SEC they'd be the second team in a state with a current member and a huge portion of the population is old farts from the Northeast and Midwest who don't care or watch the Florida schools on tv. If they B1G was going to expand in the south they would have raided the ACC at the same time they grabbed USC and UCLA.

SEC just took Texas even though A&M was already there. I mean people kept saying ou wouldn't leave osu, and they did.

I think until the gor is fought or until 2036, a conference isn't going after acc teams. They will wait for an acc team to work around that. That is why the big didn't go after any acc. Usc and ucla were at the end of their contract.

That's why at the latest it will be 2030s, but fsu and a few other acc teams will have a home in the p2.

To add to this. Just the cable model. Who is willing to pay. Consolidation of power programs instead of just shifting. It's about the brand now.

 

[TIGER-PAUL]

I see they're annual warning shot more pushing for more revenue shifting. If anything more than that, no one is really listening.

 

[Baddest Cat]

It's only a matter of time. Pitt should have moved heaven and earth to get into the Big 10 years ago. During the Penn State scandal would have been the perfect time, but instead we scheduled two additional games.

Pitt will have to do something, but they won't.

I'd aim for a football only conference, with programs likes Pitt, Miami, Clemson, Oregon, Stanford, and a few others securing a high value tv contract with a competitive amount per team. No bottom feeders.

Then move the other sports to more localized conference play. We would need to keep them because of Title IX, but they don't have to travel across the US to compete.

What will happen is that FSU and Clemson will go to the SEC. Miami will be in the Big 10. Pitt will be a B or C level program without much conference revenue funding the other sports.

You can't just squat in a conference that doesn't want you.

 

[Chem95]

The move will pay for itself in four years...LOL. I understand that an athletic department losing money hand over fist, like FSU, will jump at the chance for the P2 payday. But do they move the needle enough for those two conferences? I have no doubt that FSU would take a reduced payout. But I also have doubts if the SEC would want them. The Big certainly would but...my opinion is that they would be given the Rutgers treatment (reduced payouts for a number of years)

 

[ThePanthers]

'Something has to change' ... Florida State A.D. Michael Alford sounds off on ACC revenue disparity

Florida State athletics director Michael Alford tells Board of Trustees that 'something has to change' with ACC revenue disparity

www.on3.com

More quotes. Fsu is not happy.

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

Makes no sense for the Pitts of the world to agree to unequal revenue sharing unless it's accompanied by an extended GOR (and yes - I know it's already pretty lengthy). As it stands, it's really just a matter of time until the ACC implodes. It would be silly to forego any money in the meantime.

 

[The Ole Six-Fiver]

It's only a matter of time. Pitt should have moved heaven and earth to get into the Big 10 years ago. During the Penn State scandal would have been the perfect time, but instead we scheduled two additional games.

Pitt will have to do something, but they won't.

I'd aim for a football only conference, with programs likes Pitt, Miami, Clemson, Oregon, Stanford, and a few others securing a high value tv contract with a competitive amount per team. No bottom feeders.

Then move the other sports to more localized conference play. We would need to keep them because of Title IX, but they don't have to travel across the US to compete.

What will happen is that FSU and Clemson will go to the SEC. Miami will be in the Big 10. Pitt will be a B or C level program without much conference revenue funding the other sports.

Not that there is a move there for Pitt to make, but IMO, Pitt would never willingly make a move that would leave its non-revenue sports on a lower level than football and basketball. “Willingly” the key word there.

 

[HailtoPitt]

I'm all for unequal revenue sharing. Pitt has the 3rd most wins in the ACC over the last 10 seasons. So we should get the third highest revenue, right?

 

[HailtoPitt]

Not that there is a move there for Pitt to make, but IMO, Pitt would never willingly make a move that would leave its non-revenue sports on a lower level than football and basketball. “Willingly” the key word there.

The way I see it, they don't have a choice. Need to increase revenue for football without all of the bottom to mediocre programs dragging the average down.

And the other sports would still be at the same level, as I don't think Pitt would be allowed to demote or eliminate them. They just would be playing in a different conference then football.

 

[303vND]

Florida State's brand is not as attractive as they think. They need to win a few conference titles and appear in some playoff games.

 

[HailtoPitt]

You can't just squat in a conference that doesn't want you.

Sure, but they did add Rutgers and Maryland. Pitt should have twisted Penn State's arm when they wer elooking for some goodwill.

 

[HailtoPitt]

Florida State's brand is not as attractive as they think. They need to win a few conference titles and appear in some playoff games.

It's plenty attractive enough. There are one of like 5 programs that have a championships over the last decade.

 

[The Ole Six-Fiver]

The way I see it, they don't have a choice. Need to increase revenue for football without all of the bottom to mediocre programs dragging the average down.

And the other sports would still be at the same level, as I don't think Pitt would be allowed to demote or eliminate them. They just would be playing in a different conference then football.

Well that’s what I mean by “level”. Pitt admin thinks those non revenue sports are at least as important as football and men’s basketball and would commit to continuing their participation in a national, top level setup similar to what they have with the ACC now.

If you are suggesting they’d have to settle for playing the small local schools around WPA, I think you are underestimating how important the university thinks these sports are, and how important it is to them that women’s and Olympic sports are kept at least as equal as the two important sports. If it came to it I think Pitt would actually decline inclusion in the Big 2 for football if it meant the girls volleyball team would be reduced to playing in a league with Bethany and Grove City.

However, I think other universities in our plight would feel similar, so a semblance of the ACC would likely stay in existence to give the impression these sports are still big time. Pitt girls volleyball and dude soccer could still travel around to play Virginia and Duke and other “name” schools. That’ll be costly, likely would need federal subsidies, funded by special Title IX related taxes on the Big 2 and/or networks as punishment of sorts for the harm they’ll be causing to programs like ours left in the cold if the ACC, B12 etc got shuttered.

 

[TempleBAPittMPA]

I see they're annual warning shot more pushing for more revenue shifting. If anything more than that, no one is really listening.

Reminds me of why the eastern all-sports conference never came to be, because the Pennsylvania Snake University felt it should get a larger share than anyone else.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

'Something has to change' ... Florida State A.D. Michael Alford sounds off on ACC revenue disparity

Florida State athletics director Michael Alford tells Board of Trustees that 'something has to change' with ACC revenue disparity

www.on3.com

More quotes. Fsu is not happy.

Again. Nothing. He wants unequal revenue distribution and he will get it. Clemson, FSU, UNC, etc will get more than BC, GT, and Wake until the SEC or Big Ten offer them in 2036.

 

[cruzer]

I'm all for unequal revenue sharing. Pitt has the 3rd most wins in the ACC over the last 10 seasons. So we should get the third highest revenue, right?

Sorry, but wins is secondary.... viewers and fanbase is the key.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

'Something has to change' ... Florida State A.D. Michael Alford sounds off on ACC revenue disparity

Florida State athletics director Michael Alford tells Board of Trustees that 'something has to change' with ACC revenue disparity

www.on3.com

More quotes. Fsu is not happy.

"Repeatedly citing the strong “brand” of Florida State, Alford said the Seminoles generate about 15 percent of the revenue that comes into the ACC through media contracts.

“But we only get 7 percent of the distribution,” he said.

Alford said Florida State and Clemson combine to generate about 24 percent of the conference’s TV revenue."


I have no doubt he believes that.

I also have no doubt that it isn't even close to the truth. I mean he is tell everyone that Florida State is responsible for 67% more revenue to the ACC than Clemson. And yet the average number of viewers last season for Clemson was 2.59M, whereas for FSU it was 2.03M. In 2021 it was 1.74M for Clemson and 1.27M for FSU. From 2015 through 2019 it was Clemson 2.67M, FSU 2.23M.

In fact that's the real problem. If FSU wouldn't keep crapping the bed in football maybe the ACC could have gotten a better television deal. If FSU had had Clemson's success over the last decade maybe things are different, at least a little different. But the fact is that FSU hasn't been what the conference needs them to be, and then they bitch about everyone else instead of looking in the mirror.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

"Repeatedly citing the strong “brand” of Florida State, Alford said the Seminoles generate about 15 percent of the revenue that comes into the ACC through media contracts.

“But we only get 7 percent of the distribution,” he said.

Alford said Florida State and Clemson combine to generate about 24 percent of the conference’s TV revenue."


I have no doubt he believes that.

I also have no doubt that it isn't even close to the truth. I mean he is tell everyone that Florida State is responsible for 67% more revenue to the ACC than Clemson. And yet the average number of viewers last season for Clemson was 2.59M, whereas for FSU it was 2.03M. In 2021 it was 1.74M for Clemson and 1.27M for FSU. From 2015 through 2019 it was Clemson 2.67M, FSU 2.23M.

In fact that's the real problem. If FSU wouldn't keep crapping the bed in football maybe the ACC could have gotten a better television deal. If FSU had had Clemson's success over the last decade maybe things are different, at least a little different. But the fact is that FSU hasn't been what the conference needs them to be, and then they bitch about everyone else instead of looking in the mirror.

Its about cable/streaming households. FSU has a statewide following in a populated state. They are definitely more valuable than Clemson.

 

[Baddest Cat]

Sure, but they did add Rutgers and Maryland. Pitt should have twisted Penn State's arm when they wer elooking for some goodwill.

The key difference is that they wanted Rutgers and Maryland and they didn't want Pitt.

 

[ThePanthers]

"Repeatedly citing the strong “brand” of Florida State, Alford said the Seminoles generate about 15 percent of the revenue that comes into the ACC through media contracts.

“But we only get 7 percent of the distribution,” he said.

Alford said Florida State and Clemson combine to generate about 24 percent of the conference’s TV revenue."


I have no doubt he believes that.

I also have no doubt that it isn't even close to the truth. I mean he is tell everyone that Florida State is responsible for 67% more revenue to the ACC than Clemson. And yet the average number of viewers last season for Clemson was 2.59M, whereas for FSU it was 2.03M. In 2021 it was 1.74M for Clemson and 1.27M for FSU. From 2015 through 2019 it was Clemson 2.67M, FSU 2.23M.

In fact that's the real problem. If FSU wouldn't keep crapping the bed in football maybe the ACC could have gotten a better television deal. If FSU had had Clemson's success over the last decade maybe things are different, at least a little different. But the fact is that FSU hasn't been what the conference needs them to be, and then they bitch about everyone else instead of looking in the mirror.

Yep. Your last paragraph sums it up. Throw Miami in there too.

 

[pafootballguy]

Well that’s what I mean by “level”. Pitt admin thinks those non revenue sports are at least as important as football and men’s basketball and would commit to continuing their participation in a national, top level setup similar to what they have with the ACC now.

If you are suggesting they’d have to settle for playing the small local schools around WPA, I think you are underestimating how important the university thinks these sports are, and how important it is to them that women’s and Olympic sports are kept at least as equal as the two important sports. If it came to it I think Pitt would actually decline inclusion in the Big 2 for football if it meant the girls volleyball team would be reduced to playing in a league with Bethany and Grove City.

However, I think other universities in our plight would feel similar, so a semblance of the ACC would likely stay in existence to give the impression these sports are still big time. Pitt girls volleyball and dude soccer could still travel around to play Virginia and Duke and other “name” schools. That’ll be costly, likely would need federal subsidies, funded by special Title IX related taxes on the Big 2 and/or networks as punishment of sorts for the harm they’ll be causing to programs like ours left in the cold if the ACC, B12 etc got shuttered.

The current model for nonrevenue sports is broken across the country and IMO a nonrevenue sport should not have to get on a plane to go to a regular season game when there are plenty of other schools in a driveable area.

 

[BreakingPitt]

I remember when I thought these things mattered, they don't. Who cares who leaves, a new team will come in.

 

[thom67]

The key difference is that they wanted Rutgers and Maryland and they didn't want Pitt.

The Big 10 wanted Pitt, but Joe Paterno single handed kept Pitt out. This was told to me by the Iowa AD.

 

[HailtoPitt]

Well that’s what I mean by “level”. Pitt admin thinks those non revenue sports are at least as important as football and men’s basketball and would commit to continuing their participation in a national, top level setup similar to what they have with the ACC now.

If you are suggesting they’d have to settle for playing the small local schools around WPA, I think you are underestimating how important the university thinks these sports are, and how important it is to them that women’s and Olympic sports are kept at least as equal as the two important sports. If it came to it I think Pitt would actually decline inclusion in the Big 2 for football if it meant the girls volleyball team would be reduced to playing in a league with Bethany and Grove City.

However, I think other universities in our plight would feel similar, so a semblance of the ACC would likely stay in existence to give the impression these sports are still big time. Pitt girls volleyball and dude soccer could still travel around to play Virginia and Duke and other “name” schools. That’ll be costly, likely would need federal subsidies, funded by special Title IX related taxes on the Big 2 and/or networks as punishment of sorts for the harm they’ll be causing to programs like ours left in the cold if the ACC, B12 etc got shuttered.

If the folks at Pitt want those teams to keep up with the Joneses, then they are going to need conference revenue from football to be competitive. That isn't going to happen in the ACC. Teams there will soon be waaaay behind the Big Ten and SEC revenue, which is going to hurt Olympic sports greatly. This is why FSU is chirping. He sees the writing on the wall. Pitt doesn't. They probably are oblivious to it all.

But if Pitt wants to save their recently improving Olympic sports, they need to be dynamic and make some aggressive moves. Else they will simply die a slow death.

It should be a no brainier for schools like Oregon, Stanford, Washington, FSU, Miami, etc. Start an 8 team football conference consisting ONLY of teams that people want to watch on TV. That way the average TV revenue per school will be competitive.

The Coastal Alliance.
-Oregon
-Washington
-Stanford
-Miami
-FSU
-Pitt
-Notre Dame?
-Virginia Tech?

 

[cashisking884]

Where do they think they'll go? They bring nothing to the SEC they don't already have and none of the SEC schools want to compete with another Florida school for recruits. The B1G isn't going to add them, any school they add will be from the west or Notre Dame.

Eh.

The Big Ten really needs to move south. FSU would be a crown jewel for them if they can get FSU.

 

[cashisking884]

If the folks at Pitt want those teams to keep up with the Joneses, then they are going to need conference revenue from football to be competitive. That isn't going to happen in the ACC. Teams there will soon be waaaay behind the Big Ten and SEC revenue, which is going to hurt Olympic sports greatly. This is why FSU is chirping. He sees the writing in the wall. Pitt doesn't. They probably are oblivious to it all.

But if Pitt wants to save their recently improving Olympic sports, they need to be dynamic and make some aggressive moves. Else they will simply die a slow death.

It should be a no brainier for schools like Oregon, Stanford, Washington, FSU, Miami, etc. Start an 8 team football conference consisting ONLY of teams that people want to watch on TV. That way the average TV revenue per school will be competitive.

I doubt that’s the case. Every team in the ACC sees the writing on the wall.

The ones chirping the loudest are probably the ones that know they could be in the SEC/B1G tomorrow if they weren’t in the ACC.

The most silent are going to be teams like Wake, that know they have no option outside of the ACC.

 

[HOF Coach]

If the folks at Pitt want those teams to keep up with the Jones, then they are going to need conference revenue from football to be competitive. That isn't going to happen in the ACC. Teams there will soon be waaaay behind the Big Ten and SEC revenue, which is going to hurt Olympic sports greatly. This is why FSU is chirping. He sees the writing in the wall. Pitt doesn't. They probably are oblivious to it all.

But if Pitt wants to save their recently improving Olympic sports, they need to be dynamic and make so aggressive. Else they will simply die a slow death.

Pitt doesn't??

Even Stevie Wonder sees it...

 

[HailToPitt725]

If the folks at Pitt want those teams to keep up with the Joneses, then they are going to need conference revenue from football to be competitive. That isn't going to happen in the ACC. Teams there will soon be waaaay behind the Big Ten and SEC revenue, which is going to hurt Olympic sports greatly. This is why FSU is chirping. He sees the writing on the wall. Pitt doesn't. They probably are oblivious to it all.

But if Pitt wants to save their recently improving Olympic sports, they need to be dynamic and make some aggressive moves. Else they will simply die a slow death.

It should be a no brainier for schools like Oregon, Stanford, Washington, FSU, Miami, etc. Start an 8 team football conference consisting ONLY of teams that people want to watch on TV. That way the average TV revenue per school will be competitive.

The Coastal Alliance.
-Oregon
-Washington
-Stanford
-Miami
-FSU
-Pitt
-Notre Dame?
-Virginia Tech?

Is this assuming Clemson and UNC would be plucked up by someone else? I’d have them replace Virginia Tech (not in a good state right now) and Notre Dame (don’t think they’d agree to this). I’m with you on the football/Olympic sports split, though.

 

[Mufasa94]

Reminds me of why the eastern all-sports conference never came to be, because the Pennsylvania Snake University felt it should get a larger share than anyone else.

Curious about what specific form(s) of revenue this statement is referring to.