Right, but they stuck with the two LA teams and not Oregon. That tells me that the market matters. So if they want the south, then the first viable team they will go after is Miami.
FSU Fires warning shot to ACC
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Right, but they stuck with the two LA teams and not Oregon. That tells me that the market matters. So if they want the south, then the first viable team they will go after is Miami.
That still leaves those two west coast teams stuck on an island. At some point will they look to dump teams like Rutgers and Maryland in favor of teams like Miami, FSU, Oregon, and Washington? A deep talented league with must-watch games every week would be more valuable league half full of cupcakes or overrated name brands.
"It's not that hard to predict what will happen."
You are correct again! Lots of time and moving parts. There are a lot of other considerations as well. A new conference could form to create another super conference. A partnership could form between existing conferences. There's lots of TV streaming that need sports in order to sell subscription's. New Streaming pops up all the time. Time goes on....things change... ND could decide it's in their best interest to join the ACC instead of joining the Big Ten and becoming a middle of the pack program.
There are lots of scenarios... None of us need to speculate. I will say this, the ACC and the powers to be are VERY pleased with Pitt's progress on in all sports and are thrilled that they're part of the conference. As I have said before, Heather Lyke is an asset to the school. She is well liked by her peers, including those in the Big Ten. The hiring of the next chancellor will be the key to Pitt's future.
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THEY DON'T!!! This FSU is a brand is akin to saying Sony Betamax is a brand.
Add what type of value? Enough value to not eat away at the pie? A few. Probably the ones you listed at least.
Did I state otherwise? The claim I responded to was a “larger share than anyone else”. There was no payment being made to a conference to be divvied up equally or unequally.
Stating an agreement on how much of a school’s own revenues they should keep and how much should be handed over to others is a different subject.
If using absolute terms like exactly, then no, because quite simply, that was impossible, see above
As for its validity of this separate idea, if it has been reported by numerous people, it would be rather easy to provide some type of evidence of these numerous reports.
It’s so much easier to disparage someone and make a claim rather than provide support of a claim.
The amusing part is that I haven’t seen posters who make this type of complaint write one word about their team having belonged to a conference where certain schools were treated differently.
In fact, it would be pretty easy for someone who actually wanted to be educated to find out things like this on their own. You are venturing into SMF territory, making claims against the facts and then telling others that they should do the work to educate you, and if they won't then it must not be true.
On the other hand, I don't need to look for the facts, because I already know them. Take off the blue and white glasses, educate yourself, and then come on back and talk about it.
I accepted your challenge because I don't know one way or the other what happened. I found several articles, even 2 from 1981, and none of them mentioned anything like what you said. I did see that Pitt got a big payday from the Big East for basketball. I also saw that Pitt and Penn State would need to share their revenue with the other proposed schools since they were the big names. Not saying you're wrong, but if you have some link to share, it would be helpful, and it would shut up the person you're arguing with. Plus, I don't really know how you expect him to prove his point if his point is that something didn't exist.
Realistically, FSU is probably number 3 in Florida. UF is popular state wide, and Miami at least has the Miami market which is gigantic. Outside of the panhandle, FSU is 3rd (sometimes 4th) fiddle. Plus they obviously aren't going anywhere right now as they would basically bankrupt themselves.
FSU is easily #2. Miami's local fanbase is relatively small.
Clemson will once again be irrelevant once Dabo bolts to A&M or Texas in a few years.
WAKE me up when one of your conference teams wins sh*t.
Maybe physically at games Florida State, but otherwise Miami is way more popular. Miami area has over 6 million people that are mostly Cane fans. If you look at all the maps made of things like streams, Google interactions, etc, you won't see FSU leading anywhere but Tallahassee and Tallahassee is smaller than Akron Ohio. UF has Jacksonville and Tampa, and UCF leads in Orlando.
And then there’s this, which seems a lot closer to how things really are:
No, FSU has a lot more in reality. I'm not talking about vanilla ice wannabe t-shirt fans across the country; Miami has more of those for sure. But for most Floridians, Miami might as well be another state. In fact, in my experience of attending the U during the Larry Coker era, Miami has less of a built in fan base than Pitt. It is a medium sized private school. Once you get outside of Miami proper, even starting in Broward, but certainly by Palm Beach County, you start seeing a lot of FSU and UF. And if Miami isn't winning, big, forget about it.
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I don’t doubt FSU is the top tv draw, but had anyone checked his numbers from his rant? I’m guessing he did a lot of cherry picking data.
If what you just described mattered, then Pitt wouldn't be in the ACC.
Tallahassee is the #163 media market. Miami is Top 20 and growing.
I think we're looking at different data sets. Yes, Miami doesn't have a huge following outside of the Miami CSA, but it's the 9th largest area in the US. I've never seen any study that shows any substantial interest in FSU outside of the panhandle. If you want to argue that Miami only has Miami, I totally agree. But mostly everywhere else is dominated by UF, not FSU. And now UCF has come in and taken over the Orlando area. So if I'm the SEC/Big 10 would I rather have Miami or Tallahassee? Doesn't really matter as nobody is leaving for at least 10 years IMO and who knows what college football will even look like by then.
Yes, on another board they looked into it and they apparently are all cherry picked #s.
Can someone explain why there is no discussion of Ga tech to the Big 10?
They are an excellent school academics wise. So is USC
They are in a huge TV market . So is USC and UCLA
They are in the sweet spot of fan interest in CFB.
The recruiting base in ATL would benefit every Big 10 team already members.
And bear in mind, the Big 10 is a kingmaker. The money received and the recruiting base in their backyard could get them to unprecedented levels for football.
They are an excellent school academics wise. So is USC
They are in a huge TV market . So is USC and UCLA
They are in the sweet spot of fan interest in CFB.
The recruiting base in ATL would benefit every Big 10 team already members.
And bear in mind, the Big 10 is a kingmaker. The money received and the recruiting base in their backyard could get them to unprecedented levels for football.
I lived there for 5+ years and am a graduate of the U. My personal experience is what I'm using. Miami does not have much following in Florida outside Miami-Dade, and inside Miami-Dade it is weaker than Pitt's following in Allegheny County. Give the two programs equal records, and Pitt is outdrawing Miami fairly easily. And I make that assessment based on what I saw, and I was there when they won their last national championship when they were giving out tickets for free to fill to try to fill the Orange Bowl.
If I am the SEC, which seems most interested in large brands that can fill large stadiums, I'm taking FSU over Miami every time. Miami is not like an SEC school at all, where FSU is. In fact, I can see UCF surpassing the U in Florida, if they haven't already. Here's the reality. In South Florida, particularly in Miami, no one cares about college sports. Heck, they barely care about sports at all. It is a very transient area where athletics is not really on the forefront of what people are engaging in. It flat out is a terrible sports town. The sports fans there are people from the northeast or elsewhere, and they largely keep their loyalties from whence they came.
What the U is living off of its glory days and has is a national brand for people that get caught up in the swag image, and it draws national eyeballs on tv, but within Florida, the U pales in comparison to UF and FSU as far as fanbase. The Big Ten is more about markets so the U would be more likely a school that the Big Ten could be interested in for the media market, although it doesn't really go for smallish private schools.
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I'd suggest looking at things like Google Trends rather than old anecdotal observations. That data would indicate a much stronger interest in the U in South Florida than you are suggesting. FSU, on the other hand, doesn't even command all of northern Florida. The west is more dominated by Alabama interest and Georgia is more popular in the East. In fact, there isn't a single section outside Tallahassee where FSU has the most interactions online. You may be right about who the Big Ten would want vs the SEC,who really knows. What I do know is you'll be waiting a long time to find out, if you ever do.
Glory days? Miami had a top 10 recruiting class this year. They are going to build a new stadium. Nobody cares that their don't have great attendance. It literally won't make a difference for conference invites. Absolutely nobody will be surprised when the program is playing for the national title (once they get a better coach).
Why be disrespectful? Statistics obviously outweigh your personal perception from God only knows when. I'm sure in your 5 years in Miami you had your finger more on the pulse of 6 million plus people than what they are actually doing every single day on their phones, tablets, and computers. And for the record, I've lived in South Florida 4 months a year for 20+ years. Whatever you want to think is fine with me. You were probably super confused when the Big Ten took Rutgers, Maryland, USC, and UCLA.
Being a snow bird in South Florida, you'd think you would know better.
Do you know how bad internet impressions are as a guide to which you are speaking. Talk about confirmation bias.
Miami is maybe 1/5 as popular as FSU in Florida. You could maybe, maybe argue they are more popular than FSU outside of Florida but in Florida, its not even close. FSU is even more popular in Miami than Miami. Please stop it.
And you have what now? I see nothing. No stats. No information on how the stats were collected or what it means about actual engagement. No one is arguing Miami would have more "internet impressions" in South Florida. What that actually means is completely unknown in comparison to the interest of FSU vs Miami in the entire state of Florida or anywhere else; for instance it doesn't speak to how South Florida numbers compare to the rest of the state, how impressions are actually being generated or what individuals are actually seeking, marketing differences, how usage of internet enable devices varies across the state, how long interactions last or how those impressions actually lead to engagement or consumption of media.
You may want to look at things that are actual directly comparable: metered tv ratings (greater for FSU even when both equally suck), alumni base size (FSU more than double), attendance (FSU by about 20K more over 5 years avg and that is with Miami greatly exaggerating its numbers), greater donor numbers for FSU by a lot, merchandise sales (CLC lincensee rank much higher for FSU), the markets that their radio network bigger and more geographically diverse for FSU as Miami has almost none outside South Florida. Heck, FSU football's twitter account has has over 160K more followers than Miami. You know, pretty much anything that measures actual, direct fan engagement of the program will tell you what someone who lived any length of time in Florida would already know.
Here's one of about a zillion of these:
Again, you'd be totally right if UF, UCF, Bama, and Georgia didn't exist, but they do. What's left are the scraps, and I'll take a conference footprint in Miami over Tallahassee every time. If you're somehow trying to claim any market outside of Tallahassee for FSU, you're clueless.
Dude, I don’t have a dog in this fight, but I’d suggest you quit while you’re behind.
That link you posted by “Harry” is embarrassing.
I'm not sure what the argument here is about. Nobody is arguing that Miami has more fans or better attendance than FSU. In fact, those things would be barely relevant for a conference's decision. Miami's value is not measured with those metrics, much like Pitt. Miami's value is measured in them being Miami, asshole fanbase and all.
You can go pay for the Orlando paper or Washington Post if you like. The data is publicly available and doesn't change. You take Tallahassee and I'll take Miami. Sounds like we're both good with that.
If you think the fanbase of each school is limited to the City the school is located in, and the fanbase is comprised of the entire population, I don’t know what to say, other than carry on.
Another:
Edit: apparently I cant post a link to BleacherReport. Here's NYT: http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/10/03/upshot/ncaa-football-fan-map.html?abt=0002&abg=1
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When did I say that? We're talking about who is attractive to a conference based on the market/regional area that that Team brings with them. Miami has South Florida, FSU has Tallahassee, and UF is everywhere else. Nobody is attracted to PSU for the Pittsburgh market because they're second in popularity there.
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