Maybe It's Time Reform University Basketball & Football

[Pitt79]

When I went to college, I went to Edinboro because they had DI wrestling and I thought I could start there better than I could at a big school, I wanted to wrestle the best. I never started a match and got my ass handed to me every day at practice, but at least I was with the best.

WOW! I played high school football for a AAAA Championship team, mostly rode the bench and finally lettered my senior year, I still REGRET GREATLY that I didn't live 2 blocks to the west, and could have went to a crappy, losing Class A high school and probably started for 3 years! I would of rather played a lot.

 

[Pitt79]

It is your personal choice that you like lower level, anonymous, no name sporting events which is fine. That's okay, it is your right. But I want to watch the best. I don't like Duke, but I love watching a talent like Marvin Bagley. Much moreso than I do watching Peace Ilegomah. I much rather watch the Pittsburgh Penguins play hockey than Robert Morris. I loved watching Larry Fitzgerald here or Darrelle Revis over say Joe DelSardo or Dennis Briggs.

That is the way 90% of the people are. You are one of the 10 percenters who feel otherwise.

To me it's all about having fun. I'd rather attend the minor league soccer game, and be out in the open air, enjoying the day, socializing, than go to a bar at 7am to watch Manchester United on TV, just because the skill is better.

 

[Jpripper88]

WOW! I played high school football for a AAAA Championship team, mostly rode the bench and finally lettered my senior year, I still REGRET GREATLY that I didn't live 2 blocks to the west, and could have went to a crappy, losing Class A high school and probably started for 3 years! I would of rather played a lot.

That is not a shock to hear.

 

[Pitt79]

Very, very nice of you to say 10%.

The funny thing is, in Pitt79's scenario you wouldn't even be able to watch Pitt on TV. That could mean attendance would skyrocket!!! Oh. Wait. He doesn't go to the games, either.

I'd stream the games and then attend as many games as I do now, 1-2 per year, nothing would change. I'd probably prefer if they had a 20000 stadium because you'd likely get better seats because all the D1 snobs would be home watching Bama on TV instead. LOL, It would be just as much FUN for me.

 

[Pitt79]

That is not a shock to hear.

What? That I'd prefer to play at a lower level, than ride the bench for several years at a higher level before getting a chance to play? Is there something wrong with preferring to play? Rudy was an idiot killing himself to get a few plays at ND, he should of gone to some D3 school elsewhere in Indiana if he wanted to play college football so bad, he would of had more fun.

 

[Jpripper88]

I'd stream the games and then attend as many games as I do now, 1-2 per year, nothing would change. I'd probably prefer if they had a 20000 stadium because you'd likely get better seats because all the D1 snobs would be home watching Bama on TV instead. LOL, It would be just as much FUN for me.

How would you stream it? Who would be producing it? Pitt on their own for $0?

 

[Pitt79]

That is not a shock to hear.

Where you a great athlete? Anyways, where I went to high school, 120 kids went out for football every year, around 60 made it, the whole roster probably would have started at smaller high schools.

 

[Pitt79]

How would you stream it? Who would be producing it? Pitt on their own for $0?

You're wrong, you can stream games of a lot of smaller schools, teams like Towson and Morgan St. in my area are televised all the time, and streamed. Indoor soccer is streamed, it's not that hard or expensive Pitt would do it.

 

[ncyajleel]

Maybe you should have worked to get better. I still wrestled in practice every single day three times a day. I wrestled with national champions, world champions and olympic champions. We wrestled Iowa, Penn State, Oklahoma State, all the great schools and I traveled with the team. One year we went against the returning national champions and almost beat them. Just because I never got to start doesn't make me any less because I was in the wrestling room with them busting my ass trying to get better. I wouldn't trade that for trips to Wartburg, Augsburg, and Stevens Institue for Technolongy or even a D3 national title. Who in the wrestling world even cares about those schools? It is the same in football, do you think anyone even cares who won the 1AA, D2 or D3 national title? Do you think anyone even knows who won without looking it up?

The fun is taking on a challenge of being with, working with and trying to beat the best. Its the challenge that is the fun part and just because you don't quite beat that challenge doesn't make you any less. What makes you less is settling.

WOW! I played high school football for a AAAA Championship team, mostly rode the bench and finally lettered my senior year, I still REGRET GREATLY that I didn't live 2 blocks to the west, and could have went to a crappy, losing Class A high school and probably started for 3 years! I would of rather played a lot.

 

[Pitt79]

Maybe you should have worked to get better.

I did, eventually I played a good amount and started games at the AAAA level and I'm proud of sticking with it, still I would have rather played significantly for 3-4 years, given the choice, since I was never going pro anyways, I competed with the best, 2 of my teammates played NFL, one USFL. Something to talk about, but playing for the crappier team would have been more fun IMO.

 

[Pitt79]

I wouldn't trade that for trips to Wartburg, Augsburg, and Stevens Institue for Technolongy or even a D3 national title. Who in the wrestling world even cares about those schools? It is the same in football, do you think anyone even cares who won the 1AA, D2 or D3 national title? Do you think anyone even knows who won without looking it up?

I don't really care if anyone "cares" or "remembers" if I lived the experience and had fun, I care and I remember. I still have great memories of winning a summer basketball league championship series, lol.

 

[ncyajleel]

But wouldn't you rather say you worked hard and played your senior year on a Central Catholic or Pine Richland state champion team than was handed a starting job at Avella or West Greene all four years just because there were only 14 players and a couple of them were girls they got to come out just so they can have a team?

I did, eventually I played a good amount and started games at the AAAA level, still I would have rather played significantly for 3-4 years, given the choice, since I was never going pro anyways, I competed with the best, 2 of my teammates played NFL, one USFL. Something to talk about, but playing for the crappier team would have been more fun IMO.

 

[Pitt79]

But wouldn't you rather say you worked hard and played your senior year on a Central Catholic or Pine Richland state champion team than was handed a starting job at Avella or West Greene all four years just because there were only 14 players and a couple of them were girls they got to come out just so they can have a team?

No, I'd would rather have played the whole time. I hated the years riding the bench hoping to play a few minutes.

 

[ncyajleel]

I didn't mean "anyone cares" as in who was watching, I mean anyone as in yourself. I don't care what D2 and D3 does, I only care what the best does. So if I don't watch D2 or D3 sports, then why on earth would I even want to play on one?

I don't really care if anyone "cares" or "remembers" if I lived the experience and had fun, I care and I remember. I still have great memories of winning a summer basketball league championship series, lol.

 

[ncyajleel]

You did play the entire time. You did practice, didn't you? I would rather work for something than have it handed to me. Again, just difference in opinion. Its how I was raised.

No, I'd would rather have played the whole time. I hated the years riding the bench hoping to play a few minutes.

 

[Pitt79]

I didn't mean "anyone cares" as in who was watching, I mean anyone as in yourself. I don't care what D2 and D3 does, I only care what the best does. So if I don't watch D2 or D3 sports, then why on earth would I even want to play on one?

Because when I'm a member of a team, that's my major league. My daughter plays on a bad Class C girls high school soccer team, lowest classification in the state. She starts and is a team captain, that's the #1 girls soccer team and league to me at the moment, I follow it intensely, watch every game, I don't care who the best players are or who the Class AAAA champ is. She is probably the best female player in her small school, and I'd rather watch her play every minute on this mediocre low level team, than attend a big time AAAA game and hope she gets a few minutes.

 

[Pitt79]

You did play the entire time. You did practice, didn't you? I would rather work for something than have it handed to me. Again, just difference in opinion. Its how I was raised.

Practice is not the same, and playing for a lower classification team is not having anything "handed" to you. The players on those teams deserve their positions as much as anyone else, they are the best at that school.

 

[ncyajleel]

It depends on the team. I coached and played for a single A team where we had just enough players to compete. Believe me, some of those kids had the attitude that they didn't have to work to get better because they knew there was no one else to take their place. They didn't do the extra work to get better and the whole team suffered. We had the athletes many years to be good, but it was that attitude that made them lose. Some would skip practice because they knew that. What were we going to do? Bench them? You can't bench someone if you have just enough players. That would work until someone had to come out or got hurt.

The more people and better people you have, the better the competition and the better you and your team will become. If you are going to do it half-assed, then why even bother?

Practice is not the same, and playing for a lower classification team is not having anything "handed" to you. The players on those teams deserve their positions as much as anyone else, they are the best at that school.

 

[Jpripper88]

Where you a great athlete? Anyways, where I went to high school, 120 kids went out for football every year, around 60 made it, the whole roster probably would have started at smaller high schools.

Great? Nah. But I played at a 7A school with about 1700 in enrollment and in one of the hardest districts in the country. We competed against teams from across the region and in 7 on 7s vs teams around the country. We lost to the State Champs in the quarter finals SR and runner ups JR year, but had 9 future FBS (Alabama, Auburn, Auburn, Clemson, Florida, Duke, UAB, UAB, and MTSU) scholarship players and another 7 or 8 FCS/JUCO scholarship players. I'm sure I could have been much more impactful at a smaller HS on a shitty team. I could have played at a smaller college, but I had absolutely no desire to trade that for a real large school college experience. Our DB coach for that team is now an SEC Defensive Coordinator and the OC is an FBS OC.

My HS competition was easily better than D2 and probably most of 1-AA at the starter level. It was essentially run as a college program.

You're wrong, you can stream games of a lot of smaller schools, teams like Towson and Morgan St. in my area are televised all the time, and streamed. Indoor soccer is streamed, it's not that hard or expensive Pitt would do it.

What was I wrong about? I asked you if that is what you would "stream". Pitt streaming would be your option. The product would be terrible. You are in just an unbelievable minority and Pitt would never voluntarily give up their position for that environment.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Great? Nah. But I played at a 7A school with about 1700 in enrollment and in one of the hardest districts in the country. We competed against teams from across the region and in 7 on 7s vs teams around the country. We lost to the State Champs in the quarter finals SR and runner ups JR year, but had 9 future FBS (Alabama, Auburn, Auburn, Clemson, Florida, Duke, UAB, UAB, and MTSU) scholarship players and another 7 or 8 FCS/JUCO scholarship players. I'm sure I could have been much more impactful at a smaller HS on a shitty team. I could have played at a smaller college, but I had absolutely no desire to trade that for a real large school college experience. Our DB coach for that team is now an SEC Defensive Coordinator and the OC is an FBS OC.

My HS competition was easily better than D2 and probably most of 1-AA at the starter level. It was essentially run as a college program.


What was I wrong about? I asked you if that is what you would "stream". Pitt streaming would be your option. The product would be terrible. You are in just an unbelievable minority and Pitt would never voluntarily give up their position for that environment.

Hoover?? Just a guess.

 

[Jpripper88]

Hoover?? Just a guess.

That was our rival and who we lost to. They were better. Chad Jackson (went to UF and 2nd round pick of the Patriots) of Hoover was the best player I ever played against. Guy was electric. Absolutely smoked us one year.

 

[topdecktiger]

But again, what is that? There are always "special dispensation" met in admitting students for diversity and other reasons. I am not saying that is a bad thing, and not dare wanting to get into the politics of it, just merely stating that colleges don't always take the most qualified of applicants. So why would you want to extend this to football? And more to the point, how would this help the seedy undercurrent of cheating, because the big time programs will still get the best players.

It's actually fairly straightforward, although it involved eligibility rather than admissions. You take the average GPA and SAT of all incoming freshmen in the United States (you could recalculate this every 4/5 years or so). A perspective athlete has to meet this level to be eligible to participate in intercollegiate athletics, no exceptions. Even if you are short by just one point, you can't participate. Of course, you would either need an independent governing agency, or you would need to get the schools to agree to NCAA legislation. However, just the framework itself is straightforward.

 

[Pitt79]

Great? Nah. But I played at a 7A school with about 1700 in enrollment and in one of the hardest districts in the country. We competed against teams from across the region and in 7 on 7s vs teams around the country. We lost to the State Champs in the quarter finals SR and runner ups JR year, but had 9 future FBS (Alabama, Auburn, Auburn, Clemson, Florida, Duke, UAB, UAB, and MTSU) scholarship players and another 7 or 8 FCS/JUCO scholarship players. I'm sure I could have been much more impactful at a smaller HS on a shitty team. I could have played at a smaller college, but I had absolutely no desire to trade that for a real large school college experience. Our DB coach for that team is now an SEC Defensive Coordinator and the OC is an FBS OC.

My HS competition was easily better than D2 and probably most of 1-AA at the starter level. It was essentially run as a college program.


What was I wrong about? I asked you if that is what you would "stream". Pitt streaming would be your option. The product would be terrible. You are in just an unbelievable minority and Pitt would never voluntarily give up their position for that environment.

You must be way younger than me, 7on7? Yeah, I can say that I'm proud to say I played with future NFL players, or tell a story about how I tacked one of them in practice or something, but I still would of preferred playing all the time. It's only natural.

"The product would be terrible"- Again, I watch MASL soccer on YouTube because I have "rooting interest" in the Baltimore Blast, some of the teams' "product" is pretty bad technically, but I watch that, because I don't care who wins Liverpool vs. Man U.

 

[Pitt79]

It depends on the team. I coached and played for a single A team where we had just enough players to compete. Believe me, some of those kids had the attitude that they didn't have to work to get better because they knew there was no one else to take their place. They didn't do the extra work to get better and the whole team suffered. We had the athletes many years to be good, but it was that attitude that made them lose. Some would skip practice because they knew that. What were we going to do? Bench them? You can't bench someone if you have just enough players. That would work until someone had to come out or got hurt.

The more people and better people you have, the better the competition and the better you and your team will become. If you are going to do it half-assed, then why even bother?

I'd still rather play most of every game for 3-4 years given a choice. I knew pretty much in 9th grade that I wasn't going pro, I just wanted to play.

 

[Jpripper88]

You must be way younger than me, 7on7? Yeah, I can say that I'm proud to say I played with future NFL players, or tell a story about how I tacked one of them in practice or something, but I still would of preferred playing all the time. It's only natural.

"The product would be terrible"- Again, I watch MASL soccer on YouTube because I have "rooting interest" in the Baltimore Blast, some of the teams' "product" is pretty bad technically, but I watch that, because I don't care who wins Liverpool vs. Man U.

I'd rather be part of a winning team and compete at the highest level I can. We certainly must come from different backgrounds and philosophies. To each their own.

Obviously Pitt would never willingly do that to themselves and their entire Athletic Department.

 

[Pitt79]

I'd rather be part of a winning team and compete at the highest level I can.

I've experienced playing at the very highest level and with a championship team-mostly as a role player, it was great, I don't regret it, in fact very proud of it. But I've also experienced playing at a lower level, worse team, and playing every minute, I honestly enjoyed that more. I JUST WANT TO PLAY/DON'T WANT TO SIT.

 

[BuffetParrothead]

I agree. If Pitt were 1AA, I would probably never go to another game. In fact, I don't like going when they play 1AA teams because it doesn't seem real to me for some reason. I don't go to minor league baseball or hockey games and I don't root for Division II or III teams and I work at a Division III school.

When I went to college, I went to Edinboro because they had DI wrestling and I thought I could start there better than I could at a big school, I wanted to wrestle the best. I never started a match and got my ass handed to me every day at practice, but at least I was with the best. Its just difference in opinion. I would rather say I was with the best and was average than say I was a champion at a lower level. Not that I would have been, turns out I wasn't very good at wrestling.

That's commendable,

I did the opposite since I wanted to focus on academics ( accounting/finance/MBA) in college which I did so I went to a school to wrestle the worst so I thought.

I was a really good HS wrestler, wrestled alot of AAU bouts outside of HS, but in the early 70's I thought choose an average college wrestling program.

I was amazed to find out how many really good wrestlers choose less than D1 schools so they can wrestle early or it was easier to get in one school over another.

In some cases I met up with some of the same talent I wrestled in HS?

 

[pittiswhereiamfrom2]

But again, what is that? There are always "special dispensation" met in admitting students for diversity and other reasons. I am not saying that is a bad thing, and not dare wanting to get into the politics of it, just merely stating that colleges don't always take the most qualified of applicants. So why would you want to extend this to football? And more to the point, how would this help the seedy undercurrent of cheating, because the big time programs will still get the best players.

“Diversity” hasn’t been an “always” thing.