Miami Game & Other Dribbles ...

[mo cheeks]

Glad to see we have some depth and choices.

I thought tonight was Femi's worst game. Jeffress too.

Collier again played more than Brown. Says more about Brown than it does about Collier. Collier has not shown anything yet, not even glimpses.

Hate it when refs don't call fouls on teams that play few or have few players. Happens with Syracuse all the time.

Collier has shown he knows what the coach wants him to do and he does it. He is not being asked to do more than play defense, rebound and not make mistakes. He has good bball IQ. that makes him valuable this year. He looks athletic. Femi struggled against a team playing pressure defense. He is not ready to excel against that kind of pressure yet. they got in his face. He did ok, but we clearly missed X when he was out.

Collier. 12 minutes. 4 rebounds. 0 turnovers. 1 assist. I am guessing Capel loves that stat line. Did not take a shot.

 

[mo cheeks]

I’ll admit that I’m also a little bit cautious because of the slide the team took after getting to 6-7 in the ACC last year.

I am also cautious, but this team is so much better than last years team. night and day. our key players are older and more mature and they have a lot more help. no way we tail off like last year unless injuries or illness. We have a chance to be in the middle of the ACC pack, which is light years ahead of where we have been, and the arrow is pointing up!

 

[mo cheeks]

Coulibaly is also night and day from last year. so much better, more mature, confident. like a QB from the center position at times. right place, right time, right decisions, intensity at all times.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

I am also cautious, but this team is so much better than last years team. night and day. our key players are older and more mature and they have a lot more help. no way we tail off like last year unless injuries or illness. We have a chance to be in the middle of the ACC pack, which is light years ahead of where we have been, and the arrow is pointing up!

If Horton is hitting, we are better. If he's not, he's a net negative and we are worse.

 

[KennyTheKangaroo]

Miami had just 6 ORB’s tonight. Maybe the low ORB numbers are an anomaly this early?

But Pitt does appear to be doing a better job on the D glass. More aggressive. Some better positioning. Stronger hands. We’ll find out. Louisville & @ Duke are the next 2 games. So the competition ramps up quite a bit.

I agree with this sentiment. There was a lot of effort on the glass last night. Champaganie had one rebound in particular in the second that really stood out. It wasn't a sexy play but it was definitely one that showed effort. That is encouraging.

 

[KennyTheKangaroo]

If Horton is hitting, we are better. If he's not, he's a net negative and we are worse.

Good take.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Good take.

The team DESPERATELY needs a shooter. If Johnson can play smarter and limit the fouls, and TOs and Horton can hit consistently, this team has a chance because Toney and Champagnie have been pretty consistent.

Johnson and Horton are the wildcards, not to mention Sibande. You never know what they'll bring.

 

[Duneaux Harm]

I don’t ever care how we win, just that we WIN. My sad, sad life always feels way better when football and basketball win. Hell, I even have one of the Pitt Panther logos tattooed on my right arm. Being a Pitt fan keeps one humble.

 

[DT_PITT]

I am also cautious, but this team is so much better than last years team. night and day. our key players are older and more mature and they have a lot more help. no way we tail off like last year unless injuries or illness. We have a chance to be in the middle of the ACC pack, which is light years ahead of where we have been, and the arrow is pointing up!

I agree with all of this but I also can't completely forget what happened against St. Francis. But I'm still on board for an 8-12 ACC record is what I predicted even before the St. Francis game.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

Any ACC win is a good win for this team , but just like the loss to St Francis let’s not over react to a win over a depleted Miami team .

Wasn’t able to watch the game , but listened to it on Radio. com and Billy H told the story that last yr according to Curtis Aiken his son told him that Horton was far and away the best player on the team in practice last season .

The biggest positive to come out of this game has to be Horton coming alive , someone being a legitimate 3 pt shooter will make everyone better .

Next has to be the improved play of Coulibaly and Big John .

The player who should benefit the most from better post play and a consistent shooter from 3 is X . Having him realize he doesn’t need to force the action should cut down on his turnovers ...we’ll see !

The loss to St Francis was a kick in the gut , but this is a young team with a lot of new players playing key roles ( even Billy H referred to these Panthers as the young Panthers I guess BBI and Ski will disagree with him also ! ) The key for this season is improvement and so far so good . There will be setbacks, but they’re trending in the right direction .

 

[TIGER-PAUL]

• still undersized at 4 and 5 but but big men improving which is promising. Who coaches them?
• Sibande looks like he can create on his own which helps
• There's depth at wings but key is somebody, anybody has to hit some outside shots every game
• seem to be contesting more overall since game 1
• still in disarray at times hopefully due to still figuring out the rotation

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Winning is better than losing. The team does look much better than opening night but that doesn't say much. Basically we improved from an 0-20 looking team to a 6-14 type team. The 7 players Miami had on the floor tonight was easily the worst team in the ACC. Northwestern is easily the worst team in the Big Ten. Its nice to beat them but we shouldn't have struggled as much as we did. Nice to see Horton come alive at the end and put it out of reach though. If he can start hitting, everything changes.

I wouldn't say "worst", definitely thin right now. But the guys they put out there, Wong, Walker, were 4 star types that we were very much after and they beat us out for.

 

[pittchagg]

• still undersized at 4 and 5 but but big men improving which is promising. Who coaches them?
• Sibande looks like he can create on his own which helps
• There's depth at wings but key is somebody, anybody has to hit some outside shots every game
• seem to be contesting more overall since game 1
• still in disarray at times hopefully due to still figuring out the rotation

Tim O’Toole coaches the bigs. He’s been very good over the past few years IMO - Coulibaly looks much better than last year, Hugley is getting more comfortable, and I think it’s fair to say that Brown is pretty close to playing at his full potential.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Owt takes:

1) Two wins in a week over P5 competition on the road. It has been awhile since we were able to say this.
2) I have accepted X is going to win you some games, but he also going to have his down days.
3) A big positive is Okudale has not looked overmatched at all against P5 level competition and should only get more comfortable. He's going to be that 2000's Pitt player that just keeps on getting better.
4) Speaking of comfort levels, you can tell AKC and Big John are starting to get comfortable in their roles as Centers at this level. Neither has plus athleticism, but both have big bodies, soft hands and seemingly decent IQ for the game.
5) Fouls. Yes, we have to play better defense and especially stop with the gratuitous reaching (Hi Xavier looking at you) but at some point I thought the refs were going to make sure the bench numbers were going to even out. I mean, that foul at the end of the half, when Sibande and I think Cross were going for a loose ball with less than 1 second to play, no closer that 40 feet to either hoop. That's a no call, you don't call a foul there, you let it play out and go to the half.
6) FINALLY!! We saw the Ithiel Horton obviously Capel and the rest of the team sees in practice. Hopefully it translates, but he does have a sweet stroke.
7) Toney is that 2000's Pitt player who just gets better. I compare him with Jaron Brown except maybe not as good defensively but better offensively.
8) Nike's game was incomplete, but good to have some depth at the guard position now.
9) We attacked a zone, we played a zone, we are evolving.
10) Justin got in early foul trouble, but it is good to know we don't need 20/20 from him to win games.

 

[gary2]

Collier has shown he knows what the coach wants him to do and he does it. He is not being asked to do more than play defense, rebound and not make mistakes. He has good bball IQ. that makes him valuable this year. He looks athletic. Femi struggled against a team playing pressure defense. He is not ready to excel against that kind of pressure yet. they got in his face. He did ok, but we clearly missed X when he was out.

Collier. 12 minutes. 4 rebounds. 0 turnovers. 1 assist. I am guessing Capel loves that stat line. Did not take a shot.

It worked out. when we got in trouble I would have expected more Jeffress than Collier and more Nike than Fermi.

All is well that ends well.

 

[PITT_PANTHER17]

Good performance last night. We'll take an ACC road win anyway we can get one. Last year we played Miami I believe on Super Bowl Sunday, and they were also missing Chris Lykes that day as well. We did get the win, but really had to grind one out until the end and almost blew it. Last night we were able to go on that run the last 10 minutes and really put the game out of reach. I'm starting to really see growth from the team as a whole from the past 2 years. I realize Miami was missing way more than just Lykes last night, but I think the past two years this would have been a game that would have came down to the last minute.

Diese has showed major improvements in his game from just last season alone. He's becoming a player I never imagined he could be. He's so calm and just creates his own shots that this team desperately needs.

In my opinion, the thing holding us back now is turnovers coming from the PG position. X has been better this year, but he still has these games where he's out of control at times and just needs to slow it. Femi shows potential when he's out there, but he's still learning and hurts us with some really bad turnovers at times. The main thing to fix this is going to be slowing X down and having him just let the game come to him instead of forcing stuff that isn't there. Also, keeping X out of foul trouble is right there in terms of importance. All of a sudden we're a really good rebounding team and playing some nice defense to go along with that. If we can just cut down on turning the ball over which shouldn't be that difficult of a fix , I then think we can take this to another level.

 

[pittchagg]

It worked out. when we got in trouble I would have expected more Jeffress than Collier and more Nike than Fermi.

All is well that ends well.

I just don’t think that the staff trusts Nike to be the primary ballhandler over Femi. Femi’s gotta take better care of the ball, for sure, but I think his overall comfort of facilitating what we’re trying to do on offense is better than Nike’s. So it’s a situation where if X is on the bench, then Femi’s playing the point. Maybe that will change going as Nike gets acclimated to game speed, but I don’t think he was recruited to run point in any meaningful way.

And I think they see Jeffress as more comfortable playing on the perimeter than inside right now, especially defensively. So when Champagnie was out of the game, Collier filled in at that 4 spot. Toney stayed out of foul trouble, so we didn’t see Jeffress come in for him.

 

[gary2]

I just don’t think that the staff trusts Nike to be the primary ballhandler over Femi. Femi’s gotta take better care of the ball, for sure, but I think his overall comfort of facilitating what we’re trying to do on offense is better than Nike’s. So it’s a situation where if X is on the bench, then Femi’s playing the point. Maybe that will change going as Nike gets acclimated to game speed, but I don’t think he was recruited to run point in any meaningful way.

And I think they see Jeffress as more comfortable playing on the perimeter than inside right now, especially defensively. So when Champagnie was out of the game, Collier filled in at that 4 spot. Toney stayed out of foul trouble, so we didn’t see Jeffress come in for him.

Agree Nike is not a point.

I think at times we had a very inexperienced bunch of non scorers on the court. I would have expected Nike to play and dominate the ball, point or not. If he had been playing all along, I think that would be the case.

 

[Chescat]

It worked out. when we got in trouble I would have expected more Jeffress than Collier and more Nike than Fermi.

All is well that ends well.

I would like to see more Jeffress also. However it's
pretty clear that Capel trusts Femi at the point.
In fact he doesn't just put him there when X gets
in foul trouble. He sometimes plays him at the
point and moves X out to the wing.

It'll be interesting to see how he uses Sibande.
My guess he will give both him and Horton
minutes at the off guard position. Femi IMO will
remain as X's backup. We'll see

 

[PittMan 72]

Xavier had 5 in 21 minutes so that's not so great either. Both need to be more careful, plain an simple. I don't think Femi played well, but he hung in there for 19 minutes and looks capable in the ACC.

Femi had 1 really bad stretch there late in the 1H. Turned it over a few times pretty quickly. The size, speed and quickness of defenders at this level is still an adjustment for him. He’ll learn. He has the talent and skills. Really like his length and athleticism.

X needs to settle down and really make an effort to play with more self control. Quit playing D with his hands instead of his feet - too much reaching. With the ball, he has to really try to put into practice the famous words of John Wooden: “Be quick, but don’t hurry.”

But absolutely everyone handling the ball for Pitt needs to work on ball security. Live ball turnovers especially are killers.

 

[PittMan 72]

I'm seeing guys boxing out more and more - getting in the way of the enemy, to give their comrades space to rebound.

That’s such a BIG part of defensive rebounding: establishing inside position by boxing out. So much tougher for an opponent to get an ORB if he has to go over or around someone who has inside position.

So maybe some of the emphasis on defensive rebounding is starting to pay off? Plus Pitt seems to have a few more guys getting more minutes who look to have more of a fervor for hitting the boards. Guys like AKC, Hugley, Collier. And of course Champ and Toney. I think Jeffress can help out some on the glass, too.

 

[Cavalier Panther]

Femi had 1 really bad stretch there late in the 1H. Turned it over a few times pretty quickly. The size, speed and quickness of defenders at this level is still an adjustment for him. He’ll learn. He has the talent and skills. Really like his length and athleticism.

I noticed that too. Femi passed from the top of the 3 point line over to the sideline and it was was batted away by the defender. In AAU ball or prep ball there are probably a couple guards on each team fast enough to make a play on the ball there. But in the ACC all of the guards and many of the forwards can react and disrupt that pass.

Still, the freshman looked pretty good last night. These are guys who can contribute now, and start for a 12-8 ACC team in a couple years. And I think that's what we're looking for.

 

[PittMan 72]

I noticed that too. Femi passed from the top of the 3 point line over to the sideline that was batted away by the defender. In AAU ball or prep ball there are probably a couple guards on each team fast enough to make a play on the ball there. But in the ACC all of the guards and many of the forwards can react and disrupt that pass.

Still, the freshman looked pretty good last night. These are guys who can contribute now, and start for a 12-8 ACC team in a couple years. And I think that's what we're looking for.

Less time and space to make the plays for him now. The good news is he looks to have the talent and skills to be able to make the necessary adjustments.

 

[mo cheeks]

I agree with all of this but I also can't completely forget what happened against St. Francis. But I'm still on board for an 8-12 ACC record is what I predicted even before the St. Francis game.

agree it is hard to make sense of the St. Francis game, but based on the play since then, have to attribute it to COVID. there were a lot of upsets in college hoops at the beginning.

 

[mo cheeks]

If Horton is hitting, we are better. If he's not, he's a net negative and we are worse.

I don't see us being worse, because we had no better shooters last year and the team, ex that, is much better. How are we worse ? Horton being on like he was last night makes us a completely different team, that is for sure.

 

[Chescat]

2

I don't see us being worse, because we had no better shooters last year and the team, ex that, is much better. How are we worse ? Horton being on like he was last night makes us a completely different team, that is for sure.

First of all I'm going to call STFU (I love that abbreviation LOL),
an exception due to COVID, nervousness, etc.
We definitely are playing better since that game. We are far from
a finished product but we clearly have numbers which of course
equals depth. As far as shooters, I do think we're somewhat
better due to Toney alone. He's hitting his mid range J better
than ever, and he's ok on his threes....FG's 52%, 3 pt'rs 40%.
Those are VERY good numbers. His FT's 62% needs to improve.

Aside from Toney, we now have Sibande along with Horton who
has shown us he can hit the three. We need them both to be
consistent in their shooting. If they can, we're gonna be a better
shooting team than we were last year. We'll see.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

My only concern with that metric is that off the top of my head I read NW only had 1 offensive rebound the entire game. That's nuts.

I believe it was one in the first half, four for the entire game.

 

[Bethlehemjohn]

** It’s kind of tough to know exactly what to think or how to feel about this Pitt win. So to start, let’s get to the facts.

** This 15 point win marks the largest margin of victory in an ACC game in Coach Capel’s tenure. Actually, it’s the largest margin of victory for Pitt in an ACC game since Dixon’s days.

** Let’s add that the Panthers also handily beat the point spread. I add this point as something of a rebuttal against the idea that we “should” have beaten shorthanded Miami by more than we did.

** Here’s some other facts … 7-17 from three along with 26-54 overall from the floor is much better than what we usually shoot. I’ll go out on a limb and suggest that it is a fact that if you shoot the ball better than you usually do, it increases your chances to win. Yep ... I’m pretty sure that’s true.

** I’ll also offer that when your starting “shooting guard” shoots 4-6 from three, that’s also going to increase your chances to win.

** Those facts should be making me feel better about this game. And I certainly don’t feel bad about it. Any win on the road in the ACC is a very good thing.

** But I hope it’s also a fact that we can play better than this. I believe that we were more careless with the basketball than we should be. A combined 9 turnovers from your point guard spot is probably going to cause more losses than wins.

** We’ve also got to do a better job of defending without fouling. 15 first half fouls is too many even if a couple of those can be chalked up to poor officiating. Nonetheless, this game could have been something of a dogfight had Miami cashed in at a higher rate from the line (although they came into the game shooting worse from the line than we were).

** My next point isn’t a fact at all, but instead a question. Do we value Au’Diese Toney as much as we should? It seemed to me that he was perfectly steady tonight, and the biggest reason that this moved from the close game to a double digit lead.

** We’ve talked a lot about our “big three” this year, and it’s also noteworthy that we won a game with two of our big three playing just a few ticks over 20 minutes.

** It’s also a fact that Big John scored a career high in points, but my opinion is that he looked head and shoulders better than at any other time we’ve seen him this year. That is up until he shot an ill advised and untimely three pointer and Coach Capel decided John didn’t get to go back on the court.

** One more fact. We outrebounded the Canes by 14. We did this with Justin “only” getting 9 rebounds.

** We came into the game as the #2 rebounding team statistically in the ACC. Is it truly possible the we have turned one of last year’s larger weaknesses into a clear strength? Time will tell.

** So let’s close with one certain fact – maybe the only fact that really matters after 40 minutes in Miami. That is … we are 1-0 in the ACC.

-Miami was missing some solid guys, but still had some really good players on the court and they are still a good defensive team. And, other than too many TO's, we played pretty well against their defense.
-We do need to foul less and that gave Miami a fighting chance in the first half. Some of those fouls were bullshit though.
-Au'Diese was the rock that held us together last night and helped extend the lead to close to double digits and then Horton put the game away.
-Not sure of rebounding is a strength yet, but I don't think it is a weakness any more.
-Overall, I can't be happier with the direction we are heading. Are we perfect, no, but we are much improved.

 

[pelfrey]

Coulibaly is also night and day from last year. so much better, more mature, confident. like a QB from the center position at times. right place, right time, right decisions, intensity at all times.

Hat trick @mo cheeks...great posts!

 

[Tonyt66]

** It’s kind of tough to know exactly what to think or how to feel about this Pitt win. So to start, let’s get to the facts.

** This 15 point win marks the largest margin of victory in an ACC game in Coach Capel’s tenure. Actually, it’s the largest margin of victory for Pitt in an ACC game since Dixon’s days.

** Let’s add that the Panthers also handily beat the point spread. I add this point as something of a rebuttal against the idea that we “should” have beaten shorthanded Miami by more than we did.

** Here’s some other facts … 7-17 from three along with 26-54 overall from the floor is much better than what we usually shoot. I’ll go out on a limb and suggest that it is a fact that if you shoot the ball better than you usually do, it increases your chances to win. Yep ... I’m pretty sure that’s true.

** I’ll also offer that when your starting “shooting guard” shoots 4-6 from three, that’s also going to increase your chances to win.

** Those facts should be making me feel better about this game. And I certainly don’t feel bad about it. Any win on the road in the ACC is a very good thing.

** But I hope it’s also a fact that we can play better than this. I believe that we were more careless with the basketball than we should be. A combined 9 turnovers from your point guard spot is probably going to cause more losses than wins.

** We’ve also got to do a better job of defending without fouling. 15 first half fouls is too many even if a couple of those can be chalked up to poor officiating. Nonetheless, this game could have been something of a dogfight had Miami cashed in at a higher rate from the line (although they came into the game shooting worse from the line than we were).

** My next point isn’t a fact at all, but instead a question. Do we value Au’Diese Toney as much as we should? It seemed to me that he was perfectly steady tonight, and the biggest reason that this moved from the close game to a double digit lead.

** We’ve talked a lot about our “big three” this year, and it’s also noteworthy that we won a game with two of our big three playing just a few ticks over 20 minutes.

** It’s also a fact that Big John scored a career high in points, but my opinion is that he looked head and shoulders better than at any other time we’ve seen him this year. That is up until he shot an ill advised and untimely three pointer and Coach Capel decided John didn’t get to go back on the court.

** One more fact. We outrebounded the Canes by 14. We did this with Justin “only” getting 9 rebounds.

** We came into the game as the #2 rebounding team statistically in the ACC. Is it truly possible the we have turned one of last year’s larger weaknesses into a clear strength? Time will tell.

** So let’s close with one certain fact – maybe the only fact that really matters after 40 minutes in Miami. That is … we are 1-0 in the ACC.

Toney has put in the the work in the off season and has really surprised me how good he has become. The only thing he has to work on now is using his right hand because he's so left hand dominant that he's missed some shots that he would have made if he would have went to the right hand but that's just being alittle picky but it definitely will help him later.

 

[NTOP]

we are winning a lot more of the 50/50 ball. is it just that our team is a year older ? don't know. i just know I now expect Pitt to win most of the 50/50's. we are a lot more scrappy.

Rebounding is mostly attitude. Maybe they got the "Toney Bug"?

 

[NTOP]

I am also cautious, but this team is so much better than last years team. night and day. our key players are older and more mature and they have a lot more help. no way we tail off like last year unless injuries or illness. We have a chance to be in the middle of the ACC pack, which is light years ahead of where we have been, and the arrow is pointing up!

Did we improve some by subtraction?

 

[pittchagg]

Did we improve some by subtraction?

The ball certainly seems less “sticky” on offense this year.

 

[DT_PITT]

The ball certainly seems less “sticky” on offense this year.

So far, yes for sure -- if you compare it to the latter end of the ACC season last year.

And I hate to be "that guy," but in December in games against Rutgers and others and even into parts of the ACC season, the ball wasn't really all that "sticky." But as the year went on, it became more so.

 

[Millerton24]

Miami had just 6 ORB’s tonight. Maybe the low ORB numbers are an anomaly this early?

But Pitt does appear to be doing a better job on the D glass. More aggressive. Some better positioning. Stronger hands. We’ll find out. Louisville & @ Duke are the next 2 games. So the competition ramps up quite a bit.

They are actually boxing out. Pretty much always Brown was in bad position. Couldably is noticeably better at boxing out then anyone in last couple years.