NOT the same old Pitt – Long - Read and learn.

[ncyajleel]

There are so many facets to this. The last couple of years we have seen something that we haven't seen in many years that shows the brilliance of Narduzzi and the commitment of the administration, but then there are glimpses of "same old Pitt."

Whether people like it or not there is a losing culture at Pitt. Some like to blame one area such as the fans or administration, but it is a combination of many things that has brought this culture to Pitt and will take time to get sorted out. I believe Pitt is headed in the right direction, the only question is will people have patience to give them time to turn it all around. It isn't going to happen overnight. It's not easy changing a culture that has been around for years, look at Penn State.

You are going to have those who can see the changes and those who cannot yet. There is no reason for one side to bash the other because people can see the same thing in many different ways. Everyone is in this together. People have different backgrounds and some are going to have to see more proof than others. It doesn't mean that one side is smarter than the other, it just means those that have been around longer has seen more, whether they have been fans since they won their last title or those that have been fans since the lowest times in the 1990's and have never really seen Pitt success.

Vol,

Well said......

I would just add a couple of thoughts....

1) while we did lose three games by 11 points (an argument I dont like to lean on)....we did pull one out against GA Tech. Pitt teams from the past few regimes NEVER.......found a way to win.

I think it provides a glimmer of hope that our days of 'Pitting" are winding down.

2) I agree that results do matter...and I truly believe this coming year is the breakout year. I think Max Browne is going to have a season that gets him drafted....our defense will finally be filled with Narduzzi recruits...

and.....it is likely Ok State will be the best team we play next year. This team is going to be good enough to knock off the Pokes....and set up for a nice year.

 

[Piranha]

There are so many facets to this. The last couple of years we have seen something that we haven't seen in many years that shows the brilliance of Narduzzi and the commitment of the administration, but then there are glimpses of "same old Pitt."

Whether people like it or not there is a losing culture at Pitt. Some like to blame one area such as the fans or administration, but it is a combination of many things that has brought this culture to Pitt and will take time to get sorted out. I believe Pitt is headed in the right direction, the only question is will people have patience to give them time to turn it all around. It isn't going to happen overnight. It's not easy changing a culture that has been around for years, look at Penn State.

You are going to have those who can see the changes and those who cannot yet. There is no reason for one side to bash the other because people can see the same thing in many different ways. Everyone is in this together. People have different backgrounds and some are going to have to see more proof than others. It doesn't mean that one side is smarter than the other, it just means those that have been around longer has seen more, whether they have been fans since they won their last title or those that have been fans since the lowest times in the 1990's and have never really seen Pitt success.

People are either part of the problem or the solution. People that attend the games and financially support the program are part of the solution. People that sit on the couch and do not support the program, but then tear apart the program in the media or public forums are part of the problem. This last group is doing the work for PS or WV fans.

 

[ncyajleel]

I agree, but there are so many different types. You have the fans, but you also have administration, coaches, media, other fan bases, etc. We as fans can control what we do, but others have to do their part too.

I come to every game and give money, but I can't control what administration does, what the team does, what the media says or the national perception of Pitt.

People are either part of the problem or the solution. People that attend the games and financially support the program are part of the solution. People that sit on the couch and do not support the program, but then tear apart the program in the media or public forums are part of the problem. This last group is doing the work for PS or WV fans.

 

[Saboteur]

Oh you're so cool. You're also a tool. Taking the high ground is a military tactic, this isn't a battle. Any time someone acts like a douche, I just like to let them know that they are one.

Hook, line and sinker.

 

[Nittany1997]

Vol,

Well said......

I would just add a couple of thoughts....

1) while we did lose three games by 11 points (an argument I dont like to lean on)....we did pull one out against GA Tech. Pitt teams from the past few regimes NEVER.......found a way to win.

I think it provides a glimmer of hope that our days of 'Pitting" are winding down.

2) I agree that results do matter...and I truly believe this coming year is the breakout year. I think Max Browne is going to have a season that gets him drafted....our defense will finally be filled with Narduzzi recruits...

and.....it is likely Ok State will be the best team we play next year. This team is going to be good enough to knock off the Pokes....and set up for a nice year.

Are you crazy? The pokes will be the best team you play? How about the PSU team that is sitting at #5 returning everybody at home. Did you even look at the schedule or are you in da' Nile??? The pokes are the least of your worries. Christ all mighty!

 

[Las Panteras]

Are you crazy? The pokes will be the best team you play? How about the PSU team that is sitting at #5 returning everybody at home. Did you even look at the schedule or are you in da' Nile??? The pokes are the least of your worries. Christ all mighty!

Nope,

OK state is legit. your'e third in your division.

 

[Nittany1997]

Nope,

OK state is legit. your'e third in your division.

Haha. Oklahoma state will be a wet dream compared to PSU. You will wake up someday.

 

[CaptainSidneyReilly]

Haha. Oklahoma state will be a wet dream compared to PSU. You will wake up someday.

I can wait for the Iowa-Florida, USC-PSU, Wisky-WMU games and Oklahoma-Auburn to determine Conference 2016 Evaluation and especially Bama-Clemson?

Talking about it until all those 5 games play out is not scientific logic until those games are played. Sure there is a Trend right now but Big Ten has 3 more Games, SEC 3, Big-12, MAC, and ACC 1?

There is no question that SEC's Bama and ACC's Clemson earned and deserved to be in the CFB Playoffs, this is accepted reality based on GridIron Results. No one can argue otherwise now.

However, whether Penn State should have been there over Ohio State until we see Penn State wins or loses to USC that cannot be determine either, to be fair.

USC played far better CFB after game 4 and beat Washington or Colorado. Both won each Division and USC beat both.

As Penn State beat Ohio State and Wisconsin. Both USC & PSU won there last 8 and 9 Games unlike Washington and Ohio State and not by much?

Yet, the Big-12 in my opinion was the weakest of all Conferences for sure. WVU went 10-3 but blown away in all 3 losses. OKSU was 10-3 too but was only beaten badly by OU, robbed by Refs in CMU, and lost to Baylor but OKSU barely beat Pitt, Texas Tech, Iowa State, and KSU? OU lost to Houston and Ohio State and got Hot the last 7 games?

Yet, the Big-12 only had 4 Teams with Winning records, it is by far the weakest of all Conferences, in my opinion in 2016!

Lets see how these last 5 games turn out before ordaining the Best Conference in 2016?

 

[Nittany1997]

I did not have time to read your verbose post Sid, but whatever happens this week has little bearing on next year. Spring game is probably a better barometer.

 

[CaptainSidneyReilly]

I did not have time to read your verbose post Sid, but whatever happens this week has little bearing on next year. Spring game is probably a better barometer.

Well...if you can't read a Post you really can't comment on it? So, why post what you lack time to evaluate with another post a what child can say, and still wrong in facts and content on your own, I might add?

Spring practice and games are not a Better Barometer at all, many times the Starters and Stars are left out of them to prevent injuries, Dorsett was kept out of Spring Ball every year as just one example.

It is the Summer Camps with New Recruits showing up that is the "Better Barometer" and to be even more accurate, "After The First Game" is played is even a "Better Barometer" and some Better Experts say after 3 Games even Best Barometer!

So, your post in not "Probably" but actually more Bable and I did have the time to easily read it and point it out?

You can now agree to admit you were wrong if you have the Balls not the Bable to say it! We Share to Learn on the Lair unlike on the Board Without Integrity!

If you can't read or lack the time to read, you should stay on BWI where ignorance is only exceeded by an arrogance of pride not based in reality.

I say this not to offend you, but to demand you become a better Poster on the Lair as I have seen in the past, and due to the above Post you failed to comprehend and probably should have admitted it!

 

[pittmeister]

Sorry you can't say same results but not same old Pitt results do matter. Two years in a row we have looked woefully unprepared to play in a bowl game against not what I would call traditional powerhouses. You can't argue there are good things going on but at the same time you have to have a breakout season where you go 10-2 or 11-1 for me to say this is not the same old Pitt. We lost at least 3 games we should have won especially the UNC game. We were in every game except the Miami game late in the second half but you have to win those close games and not find a way to lose them then and only then will it not be the same old Pitt.

This year was one of the most exciting I can remember in the last 25 years but in the end we lost 5 games and it doesn't matter we lost 3 of them a total of 11 points we lost plain and simple. I think we do have the right person to lead us to our first 11 win season soon but at the end of the day results matter. That's not being negative it's just the truth and it doesn't make me any less of a Pitt fan than any of you who disagree.


The whole criticism of any of us who don't just sing Pitt's praises every post as not being real fans is such a joke it gets really old. I haven't missed a Pitt football game either in person on TV or radio in 25 years but I have missed plenty of weddings picnics and whatever else on Saturdays so to say I'm not a true fan just because you may not agree with me on a post on a damn message board is one of the weakest and dumbest responses ever. The inability of people to debate differences but rather just start name calling has gotten really bad on here. I respect your opinion if it differs from mine but it would be nice if others could do that without just name calling or funnier yet calling them a Nitter troll.

I don't have a major problem with Vol's post. Even if I don't agree with everything. Vol's post was thought out and he made good points.

What I can't stand and what pisses me off more than anything is when you get a simpleton giving us a post with no explanation, no thought, just estrogen:

"We lose, same old Pitt" It's too simplistic. Usually that drivel comes from an idiot that brings nothing to the board except foolishness and negativity.

The results on the field may look familiar, but what's going on with Pitt is not the same.

Winning on the field and developing a winning culture starts at the top. Make no mistake about it.

If you don't have it there, you will not win for very long. Once the coach is gone the whole thing crumbles. Example: Jackie Sherrill. Once he left, it was all over because there was no commitment from the administration. No budget for recruiting, no money for upgrades, no money for coaches, no academic support for the athletes. The success of the football program fell solely on the back of the head coach. That will not sustain.

I won't rehash the administration's commitment from the original post. But if you want to know how, reread it again.

Because of our current commitment by the administration I an confident that we will win on a high level very soon. If it wasn't for that, then I would also be saying, "Same old Pitt".

 

[ncyajleel]

Serious question, are you mentally challenged? You sound like a moron.

"Duh...hook line and sinker." Do you think that makes you smart or something?

Hook, line and sinker.

 

[Nittany1997]

I read your post in its entirety and still fell that a better barometer is closer to next season than these bowl games. Next season

Well...if you can't read a Post you really can't comment on it? So, why post what you lack time to evaluate with another post a what child can say, and still wrong in facts and content on your own, I might add?

Spring practice and games are not a Better Barometer at all, many times the Starters and Stars are left out of them to prevent injuries, Dorsett was kept out of Spring Ball every year as just one example.

It is the Summer Camps with New Recruits showing up that is the "Better Barometer" and to be even more accurate, "After The First Game" is played is even a "Better Barometer" and some Better Experts say after 3 Games even Best Barometer!

So, your post in not "Probably" but actually more Bable and I did have the time to easily read it and point it out?

You can now agree to admit you were wrong if you have the Balls not the Bable to say it! We Share to Learn on the Lair unlike on the Board Without Integrity!

If you can't read or lack the time to read, you should stay on BWI where ignorance is only exceeded by an arrogance of pride not based in reality.

I say this not to offend you, but to demand you become a better Poster on the Lair as I have seen in the past, and due to the above Post you failed to comprehend and probably should have admitted it!

You are right. Fall practice is a much better predictor of how a season will Go than this week.

 

[sherepower]

Wrong. Same results, but not the same old Pitt. When Pitt puts themselves in a position to fail, that's the same old Pitt.

The new Pitt is doing things to try and succeed for a change. That is a positive step. Eventually they will succeed in the near future.

I really hope your right. But to say you know exactly how committed Pitt's higher ups are to winning championships is false. None of us know.

If your looking without blue and gold glasses. You will see Pitt has lost 2 offensive coordinators in 2 years. As soon as our coaches have any success. We lose them to so called better programs.

Well, if Pitt was fully committed to play at the highest level. They need to keep their good coaches.

Pitt fans will know for a fact how committed we are once Nards wins 10 or 11 games.

If he does you know other programs will come calling. Pitt must step up and keep him here. No matter who is after him. We are no longer hand cuffed playing in the big east. We are a P5 school.

If we keep Nards once he has this program rolling. Then we can say its not the same old Pitt

 

[CaptainSidneyReilly]

I read your post in its entirety and still fell that a better barometer is closer to next season than these bowl games. Next season
You are right. Fall practice is a much better predictor of how a season will Go than this week.

Thank you, I welcome challenges on my Posts anytime and I either defend them, admit I was wrong, or agree to disagree. It is all about FB Content sharing to learn together whether in unison or learning new things.

I respect Penn State Alumni & Posters, University and Program and we have the Best PSU Posters that come on the Lair and give their own knowledge, opinions, and facts welcomed anytime. Judging PSU how it is today with the Reforms is my aim and Friendly Banter is expected and accepted by me and can give it back sometimes since it is on the Lair.

However, I try and avoid the Scandal and still believe Paterno was a Great Coach that was lied to by Sandusky (As JS Did To Many At PSU Including Family) and simply did not believe it until much later than but many others disagree with me, and i won't fault them since that is their opinions are just as valid, I just disagree!

Joe like all Great Coaches & Men or Women had flaws too and admitted he was No Saint and he made mistakes too, but his Coaching was terrific and he built a solid strong Program but stayed too long, in my view and contributed to his Legacy Downfall much as Art Briles today, but separate that from their superb Coaching even if all rules were not follow. I blame that on Spanier & Starr whom are responsible directly under NCAA, AIA-Big Ten, & Education Department.

Judging PSU as it is today under all the 2012 Reforms and admiring it is no vice in my view and see Pitt-WVU-Penn State together is better, and respect others that disagree, but that is what I believe.

At the same time, I also feel it is more than appropriate to judge and criticize Corbett & his Deputy Fina PAOAG sloppy Investigations, and giving The Second Mile a pass. Just me and my view.

Still, it is totally a PSU Scandal by Penn State Employees, at Penn State and of or by Penn State Higher Ups and that can't be denied or blame upon anyone else either. Yet, O'Brien, Franklin, Barron, and Barbour were brought in Reform President Erickson & AD Joyner with the Trustees and corrected

These are my thoughts until the Criminal & Civil Court cases are resolved, settled, or turn up different information, but should have no reflection on Today's University, Program, Coach since Compliance is now in place since 2012 and just want to Post FB.

 

[Piranha]

I really hope your right. But to say you know exactly how committed Pitt's higher ups are to winning championships is false. None of us know.

If your looking without blue and gold glasses. You will see Pitt has lost 2 offensive coordinators in 2 years. As soon as our coaches have any success. We lose them to so called better programs.

Well, if Pitt was fully committed to play at the highest level. They need to keep their good coaches.

Pitt fans will know for a fact how committed we are once Nards wins 10 or 11 games.

If he does you know other programs will come calling. Pitt must step up and keep him here. No matter who is after him. We are no longer hand cuffed playing in the big east. We are a P5 school.

If we keep Nards once he has this program rolling. Then we can say its not the same old Pitt

Pitt fans need to support the program if u want to keep good coaches. Coaches want support from the fans and the administration.

 

[sherepower]

Pitt fans need to support the program if u want to keep good coaches. Coaches want support from the fans and the administration.

This subject i disagree with you. If Pitt wants the causal fans to start showing up for games. They must start competing for ACC titles. Or show they are all in to make this program a top flight one. Just like the fans who are Penguins fans, or Pirates fans. Once those teams started to win. Fans started showing up. Its no different for Pitt

The majority of the guys who are on this board and on the pay board. Are part of the 30 000 die hards who do show up.

 

[Piranha]

This subject i disagree with you. If Pitt wants the causal fans to start showing up for games. They must start competing for ACC titles. Or show they are all in to make this program a top flight one. Just like the fans who are Penguins fans, or Pirates fans. Once those teams started to win. Fans started showing up. Its no different for Pitt

The majority of the guys who are on this board and on the pay board. Are part of the 30 000 die hards who do show up.

How many schools that receive the amount of support that Pitt does from its fan base are a Top 15 program and keep their coaching staff? If you want a big time program, then you need all hands on deck - administration, fans, coaches, and players.

 

[Saboteur]

Serious question, are you mentally challenged? You sound like a moron.

"Duh...hook line and sinker." Do you think that makes you smart or something?

Words rarely make anyone appear to be smart. Quite the contrary. Your prose is a classic example of that being the case.

 

[VolPanther]

I don't have a major problem with Vol's post. Even if I don't agree with everything. Vol's post was thought out and he made good points.

What I can't stand and what pisses me off more than anything is when you get a simpleton giving us a post with no explanation, no thought, just estrogen:

"We lose, same old Pitt" It's too simplistic. Usually that drivel comes from an idiot that brings nothing to the board except foolishness and negativity.

The results on the field may look familiar, but what's going on with Pitt is not the same.

Winning on the field and developing a winning culture starts at the top. Make no mistake about it.

If you don't have it there, you will not win for very long. Once the coach is gone the whole thing crumbles. Example: Jackie Sherrill. Once he left, it was all over because there was no commitment from the administration. No budget for recruiting, no money for upgrades, no money for coaches, no academic support for the athletes. The success of the football program fell solely on the back of the head coach. That will not sustain.

I won't rehash the administration's commitment from the original post. But if you want to know how, reread it again.

Because of our current commitment by the administration I an confident that we will win on a high level very soon. If it wasn't for that, then I would also be saying, "Same old Pitt".

Thank you I appreciate someone who doesnt agree with me on every single item but at least can be gracious and respectful in disagreeing. You sir are someone I could debate with in a meaningful and respectful manner unlike these clowns who just hurl insult after insult at each other.