Third place. Below 500. Another long losing streak. Season is over for those faint hopes of winning the weak division. I guess now its time to shift focus back tot the reality of watching player development the next few years and hoping we don't lose 90+ games again this year.
OT:Buccos
- Thread starter mike 301
- Start date
This was never going to be the year, so not much has changed. It's all about the players who will be here in two years.
I think I want Paul Skenes now, though. He's the kind of dude who doesn't let 6-game losing streaks happen, I think. I'm sure he'll require Tommy John at some point (unless he has already had it), but I'd still take him.
I think I want Paul Skenes now, though. He's the kind of dude who doesn't let 6-game losing streaks happen, I think. I'm sure he'll require Tommy John at some point (unless he has already had it), but I'd still take him.
So I heard a compelling case for drafting Skenes. He is never going to be here Post Arbitration years. Neither will be Crews. What chance do the Pirates have for a truly dominant #1 ace? Skenes is ready now. You get him for 6 1/2 years. If you think you are going to be a contender starting next year with a healthy Cruz, Henry Davis up, Skenes at the top of the rotation, moving Keller into a 2, that's pretty strong. Hopefully Ortiz, Bido, Ovieto or Roansy develop into 3-5. One of those you can turn into that 3 inning guy like Andrew Miller.
It is easier getting a bat than an ace. I might be convinced to take Skenes. If Skenes has arm problems 8 years down the road, he won't be with the Pirates anyway.
I could post a few paragraphs on my dumb philosophies about taking everyday players versus pitchers, but I think technology allows us to bypass a lot of the guesswork. Like, you can measure Skenes' velocity, spin rate, location, etc., etc. ,etc. right now and compare it to that of MLB pitchers right now. From the sounds of it, he would check out pretty well against even the best of the best. With Crews, there is always going to be some level of projection (okay - there will be projection in both cases, so let's call it more projection).
Skenes would be the best pitcher in the rotation. Now. He would be the #1 guy on many teams right now.
The problem is, the Pirates need bats too. But I think it is easier to find some of those. Plus, if you think you are getting ready for a 5 year window of contending, Skenes fits into that timeframe perfectly.
If you draft Skenes you sign him and pitch him right away. You can’t sign him and shut him down until 2024. You can’t sign him and send him to the minor leagues for two years of pampering. You sign him and play him. Every pitch he throws in the minor leagues is wasting his arm.
When I look at the small market teams who make these runs, it seems like it's usually on the backs of a high-level pitching staff. Bats go hot and cold, and we've seen some of our better ones all but disappear in the postseason. I totally agree that we need them, but if we're talking about someone who might hit .285 versus a veteran we could sign who could hit .265... well, that's a difference of 12 hits in a 600 at-bat season. And yes - batting average is obviously a reductive and antiquated statistic; OPS is what matters; blah blah. I'm just saying: We're talking about one of nine bats in the lineup every day versus a pitcher who affects the game on all 100ish of his pitches, albeit only every 5th game. But with the way position players get days off now, they might be appearing in 15-20 games less per season anyway.
There probably isn't a right or wrong answer to this, and some luck will probably be involved. But I'd be leaning toward Skenes right now. Reynolds and Suwinski are 2/3 of your outfield of the future, I would think. I don't know if I'm all in on Suwinski or not, but I guess we'll see. Outside of that, you should be able to sign a veteran, plug Davis in right, move Cruz to right... something.
I don't think that would happen in a million years. He's already 30 innings over what he's every pitched before and 16 innings above the MLB leader in innings pitched.
Between 1985 and 2013 a total of 13 teams had a batting average below .240. Total. Last year, 14 teams had a team batting average under .240.
The Angels have had Mike Trout all of his career, how has that helped? How has Machado, Tatis, Cruz, etc....their record is the same as the Pirates. Sure they won 89 games last year, but at that payroll it is underachieving.
My memory is just getting knocked out by true Aces in 2014 and 2015.
The Angels have had Mike Trout all of his career, how has that helped? How has Machado, Tatis, Cruz, etc....their record is the same as the Pirates. Sure they won 89 games last year, but at that payroll it is underachieving.
My memory is just getting knocked out by true Aces in 2014 and 2015.
Well this team kept things interesting until Fathers Day. That’s a bonus and frankly unexpected. Personally I was feeling greedy and hoping for relevancy on July 4th or my family vacation a couple weeks later. But it wasn’t meant to be. Maybe they can put a good week together and stay relevant a bit longer but it doesn’t appear likely right now. 90 losses is looking likely.
There isn't any team in baseball that would draft Skenes this year and put him straight into the majors.
Boy are Henry Davis’ parents a couple of peaches. Their in game interview was something else. Talking to them, their son is the greatest athlete ever and according to them he gets his greatness from them.
You’d think this was their son.
You’d think this was their son.
Bido good tonight after one shaky inning in the rain. No matter, Buccos choke twice with the bases juiced. This team just can't score. It's hard to watch. You would think that once in a while they could get an accidental hit with men on base, but no, just strikeouts and pop up are all you get. They kept my interest longer than I expected this season, but, the time has come for me to tune them out once again. Steelers training camp is close to only a month away now.
So you shut him down this year? Fine. But I guarantee on any franchise except a very few, he is in the rotation next year.
I don't know that I'd shut him down completely. But he's not going to pitch a lot, no matter who drafts him. He's already thrown 114-2/3 innings this season, and they aren't done yet. Just to put that into perspective, Quinn Preister leads Indianapolis in innings pitched so far this season. He's at 68-1/3. Altoona's leader is Aaron Shortridge at 54-2/3. Greensboro's leader is Anthony Solometo with 58-2/3, plus another 5 over the weekend after his promotion to Altoona for a total of 63-2/3. And Bradenton's leader is the aptly named Derek Diamond with 49-2/3.
Remember that the college season started six or seven weeks before the minor league season did, so he's at a place pitching-wise that a minor leaguer would be in early August. In early August, most minor leaguers are getting close to the end of their season.
My guess is that the team that drafts him, assuming that they sign him pretty quickly, is going to send him to their minor league complex and maybe (or maybe not) have him pitch at least a few pretty tightly controlled innings there before sending him out for a couple starts at the end of the year at either high A or AA.
Awe c'mon now . I saw the interview and I saw 2 proud parents who passed there good values onto there son . Nothing wrong with boasting a bit .
I and my son's mother offered nothing but that and complete encouragement to him and he earned a full college scholarship .
I'd like to think we were at least part of his achievements ... Just sayin' FK ...
But see there’s the difference. You just said that your kid earned a scholarship and left it at that. You’re a good man. But I know who your son is and he was a star athlete who you could brag plenty about but you choose not to because you have class.
I posted about it on the other board too and folks saw it the way I did. Certainly it’s a competitive family and that rubbed off on their son. So I’m with you there. But a little bit of humble pie goes a long way too. I mean, Mom said that he was the greatest at everything and better than all the other kids at everything he did. Sports, chess, Musical instruments, etc. After hearing that, I had to dig up an old WWF Mr Perfect vignette.
Mom needed to take it down a notch.
I gotcha ..
BTW . Loved the Kurt Hennig take ... Mr . Perfect .. Lol .. Classic ..
That Pirate ship is rapidly sinking . . . headed for the bottom of the ocean where the Titanic lies.
So the Pirate ship might find that missing tourist submarine.
Meanwhile the Reds have won 10 in a row. Pirates in 4th now, how soon before the Cards overtake them?
Sometime early next week.
I'm weaning myself off of professional sports and the Pirates were the first and easiest to jettison. Got better things to do.
Those still invested hang in there and keep buying those tickets. Nutting appreciates your support.
I agree with this. I think Skenes is more of a sure success than Cruz. I also think Skense produces at the major league level before Cruz does
Here a sincere question. I get the issue of innings hes pitched but does it make more sense to send him to the majors and use him selectively in the bullpen and maybe a spot start to give him major league experience prior to next season or to send him to the minors. The point is isnt it better to limit is innings at the major league level than to waste them in the minors (unless of course you shut him down completely).
Why is every new uniform regardless of design described as 🔥?
They're okay and feel like a safe design. Missed opportunity to incorporate the bridges, skyline, or rivers into the design. Most of the other city connect designs are awful, so the Pirates at least didn't get anything that bad.
That Damon Bruce in the comments must be an outsider, totally unaware that "Pgh" is the locally preferred abbreviation for the city's name. It's for that reason that I love the jersey and want one for myself. WTF does the airport code have to do with anything?
Perhaps that will help the rest of the country to realize that Pittsburgh is abbreviated "PGH", not "PIT".
Nike did a fantastic job months ago anticipating the Pirates would be in a 9-game losing streak when they decided the reveal date.
They aren't awful, but I'm not a big fan. I would have liked to have seen something that incorporated the pillbox hats. That is something unique to the Bucs that no other team has (at least no other team from the last 75 years).
I thought these were knockoff jerseys you buy in the strip district.
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