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OT: Pittsburgh off of Amazon's list

Las Panteras

All American
May 11, 2014
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Public transit weakness is the "public" reason

Likely not enough tax breaks, relative to other competing cities is the real reason.

It looks more and more like Wash DC area
 
I fully expect public transit to be the main reason, but I'm not seeing this in the news anywhere.
 
Public transit weakness is the "public" reason

Likely not enough tax breaks, relative to other competing cities is the real reason.

It looks more and more like Wash DC area

Don't see that anywhere on Internet. However, if that is a listed reason there is nobody in this city that could even doubt that as a major issue. The Parkway East is listed as 5th worst traffic road in the country. How is that possible with a city this small? Tunnels for sure, but complete lack of anything representing public transportation is a huge reason.

If you were downtown yesterday for marathon you know exactly what I am talking about.
 
Public transit weakness is the "public" reason

Likely not enough tax breaks, relative to other competing cities is the real reason.

It looks more and more like Wash DC area
yep, if you have ever driven the DC beltway it is apparent that everyone down there uses public transit which allows you to blissfully cruise at 70 sans traffic or any trepidation or have the traffic nightmares that plague Pittsburgh...
 
Don't see that anywhere on Internet. However, if that is a listed reason there is nobody in this city that could even doubt that as a major issue. The Parkway East is listed as 5th worst traffic road in the country. How is that possible with a city this small? Tunnels for sure, but complete lack of anything representing public transportation is a huge reason.

If you were downtown yesterday for marathon you know exactly what I am talking about.

I don't live out East, I live in Collier but my son plays baseball tournaments out east almost every weekend at the All American fields in Trafford or fields in Monroeville or fields in Plum, etc.. I am out there probably 3 weekends out of 4 a month.

I simply don't know how anyone lives out that way if they work in Town. I could never deal with that commute every single day. That nightmare Parkway East is backed up on weekends on our way out to games leaving the city and also on our way back towards the city. It is absolutely unbearable even on weekends. You could pay my house off today and give me a totally debt free million dollar house and I would not live out there unless I was able to work out there and not have to come into the city for anything.

Absolutely hate the Parkway East.
 
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Public transit weakness is the "public" reason

Likely not enough tax breaks, relative to other competing cities is the real reason.

It looks more and more like Wash DC area

I am still not seeing this anywhere. Did you make it up?
 
wasn't it confirmed awhile ago it Alexandria, VA?

I love the argument some people have about how new businesses come in and rental prices go up, like it's a bad thing. Uh yeah, it's called "de-ghettoing" your neighborhood, it's a good thing. remember people in east liberty complaining about bakery square that their ghetto is going to become less ghetto, screaming racism.
 
Don't see that anywhere on Internet. However, if that is a listed reason there is nobody in this city that could even doubt that as a major issue. The Parkway East is listed as 5th worst traffic road in the country. How is that possible with a city this small? Tunnels for sure, but complete lack of anything representing public transportation is a huge reason.

If you were downtown yesterday for marathon you know exactly what I am talking about.
I used to live in south hills and work in Monroeville so I'd be "against" that parkway east traffic and shake my head seeing standstill traffic all the way back to monroeviille.. this would be at like 7:45am, people were about an hour from getting into the city.

It all stems from outdated and poor roads around the city. Blame it on hills, rivers or a road system build Pre WW2. In short, you need a beltway, to build that, you need money. Every major city has a beltway. If you live in the south hills (which I do) and you want to get to the east, you shouldn''t have to drive thru downtown to get there, that's not efficient to funnel your traffic into downtown.

I remember reading an article about proposed plans to build (or complete) this beltway but of course the hold up is funding. i'll see if I can find it. it was either a gazette or trib article about a year or two ago..
 
yep, if you have ever driven the DC beltway it is apparent that everyone down there uses public transit which allows you to blissfully cruise at 70 sans traffic or any trepidation or have the traffic nightmares that plague Pittsburgh...

I have and am blissfully thankful for the ease of use of the Metro. And seriously the population of the DC/Baltimore Megaplex is many orders higher than Pittsburgh.
 
I have and am blissfully thankful for the ease of use of the Metro. And seriously the population of the DC/Baltimore Megaplex is many orders higher than Pittsburgh.
how many people live in DC vs working in DC? It's probably a 1:10 ratio. Pittsburgh is nowhere near that.
 
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I used to live in south hills and work in Monroeville so I'd be "against" that parkway east traffic and shake my head seeing standstill traffic all the way back to monroeviille.. this would be at like 7:45am, people were about an hour from getting into the city.

It all stems from outdated and poor roads around the city. Blame it on hills, rivers or a road system build Pre WW2. In short, you need a beltway, to build that, you need money. Every major city has a beltway. If you live in the south hills (which I do) and you want to get to the east, you shouldn''t have to drive thru downtown to get there, that's not efficient to funnel your traffic into downtown.

I remember reading an article about proposed plans to build (or complete) this beltway but of course the hold up is funding. i'll see if I can find it. it was either a gazette or trib article about a year or two ago..
Building a big, expensive beltway is the exact kind of retrograde solution that we should be avoiding. They’re spending a billion dollars building a highway between the airport and southpointe that’s projected to serve fewer daily users than the BRT for 5x the cost.

If Amazon decides to go elsewhere, it won’t be because Pittsburgh doesn’t have enough highways that take people away from the areas in the city where it would want to build - it will be because the Pittsburgh region has made the choice over many years to not invest in its public transportation infrastructure, and has left the personal car as the most convenient form of daily transportation for many people who live outside of the city.
 
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Building a big, expensive beltway is the exact kind of retrograde solution that we should be avoiding. They’re spending a billion dollars building a highway between the airport and southpointe that’s projected to serve fewer daily users than the BRT for 5x the cost.

If Amazon decides to go elsewhere, it won’t be because Pittsburgh doesn’t have enough highways that take people away from the areas in the city where it would want to build - it will be because the Pittsburgh region has made the choice over many years to not invest in its public transportation infrastructure, and has left the personal car as the most convenient form of daily transportation for many people who live outside of the city.

And because the largest public transit investment Pittsburgh made was to build a tunnel connecting downtown to the Steelers and Succos, when the Downtown to Oakland connection was on the table.
 
And because the largest public transit investment Pittsburgh made was to build a tunnel connecting downtown to the Steelers and Succos, when the Downtown to Oakland connection was on the table.
Bingo. Conservative ridership projections for a T expansion to Oakland and Squirrel Hill in 1991 were at around 55,000 daily riders - that number would only be higher now as Pitt, CMU, the hospitals, and the surrounding residential neighborhoods have grown. The BRT will serve around 35,000 daily riders almost 30 years later - which is still a huge improvement over the optimistic projections for either the Southern Beltway or Mon-Fayette Expressway boondoggles.
 
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Bingo. Conservative ridership projections for a T expansion to Oakland and Squirrel Hill in 1991 were at around 55,000 daily riders - that number would only be higher now as Pitt, CMU, the hospitals, and the surrounding residential neighborhoods have grown. The BRT will serve around 35,000 daily riders almost 30 years later - which is still a huge improvement over the optimistic projections for either the Southern Beltway or Mon-Fayette Expressway boondoggles.
I used to work in Smithfield (just south of uniontown) for 3 years and would take the mon-Fayette expressway every day, to/from. I kid you not, I'd pass 2 maybe 3 cars tops in a 40mile drive. Every single day id be on that road, put cruise control on 70, stay in right lane and wouldn't see a car until I'd get close to uniontown.

Hey, I loved it (besides the tolls) but why in the world that road was build is beyond me. NO ONE uses that road..
 
Neither is good but Greentree hill is worse, imo. Parkway East can be easily avoided if you know the neighborhoods; if you don't, it's a tough drive.


I don't live out East, I live in Collier but my son plays baseball tournaments out east almost every weekend at the All American fields in Trafford or fields in Monroeville or fields in Plum, etc.. I am out there probably 3 weekends out of 4 a month.

I simply don't know how anyone lives out that way if they work in Town. I could never deal with that commute every single day. That nightmare Parkway East is backed up on weekends on our way out to games leaving the city and also on our way back towards the city. It is absolutely unbearable even on weekends. You could pay my house off today and give me a totally debt free million dollar house and I would not live out there unless I was able to work out there and not have to come into the city for anything.

Absolutely hate the Parkway East.
 
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If true then Pittsburgh/Allegheny County should be so appreciative of Pitt/UPMC combo in the city/county and be more willing to accommodate most requests made by the University.

Consider that UPMC is the LARGEST employer (80,000 workers) in Pennsylvania and they have made the LARGEST contribution to the Pittsburgh Promise of $100 million.

Pittsburgh/Allegheny County were going to give all kinds of enticements to Amazon and Pitt can't even get the city to close Bigelow Blvd. by Cathedral for the safety of students crossing.

HAIL TO PITT!!!!
 
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Neither is good but Greentree hill is worse, imo. Parkway East can be easily avoided if you know the neighborhoods; if you don't, it's a tough drive.
Greentree Hill Vs. Squirrel Hill tunnel-parkway east traffic? Hmmm, that's a good debate.. Man, im going to have to say going into city from east is worse but I've never had to do either.

I'd see those people backed up, still at least 2 miles from being at the squirrel hill tunnel every morning and wonder what time they have to be at work. It'd be 7:45am and there is no way, if they work in city, they are getting at their desk before 9:30am.
 
Neither is good but Greentree hill is worse, imo. Parkway East can be easily avoided if you know the neighborhoods; if you don't, it's a tough drive.

Parkway east can be avoided coming from Monroeville into town? How do you do that? I am interested so I can avoid it next time.

And Greentree HIll is certainly no picnic but that can be easily avoided coming from that way as well although other alternatives also back up depending on time. I commute into town and haven't taken Greentree Hill in over 10 years.
 
Parkway east can be avoided coming from Monroeville into town? How do you do that? I am interested so I can avoid it next time.

And Greentree HIll is certainly no picnic but that can be easily avoided coming from that way as well although other alternatives also back up depending on time. I commute into town and haven't taken Greentree Hill in over 10 years.
there is a road that actually can get you down on Allegheny river blvd from the parkway east, not sure the name of it but it goes past the old country club. Not sure what traffic is like coming in on Allegheny river blvd in the morning. Cant imagine being on a 2 lane rd thru Lawrenceville is a shortcut.

I guess you can dodge and weave your way on Penn thru Wilkinsburg and east liberty, again, not sure how that's a short cut. You either drive yourself mad driving thru congested areas or sit in traffic on parkway east, pick your poison.
 
Does the lack of a beltway hurt Pitt's recruiting? How does it affect the game day atmosphere at Heinz Field?
 
there is a road that actually can get you down on Allegheny river blvd from the parkway east, not sure the name of it but it goes past the old country club. Not sure what traffic is like coming in on Allegheny river blvd in the morning. Cant imagine being on a 2 lane rd thru Lawrenceville is a shortcut.

I guess you can dodge and weave your way on Penn thru Wilkinsburg and east liberty, again, not sure how that's a short cut. You either drive yourself mad driving thru congested areas or sit in traffic on parkway east, pick your poison.

Yeah I mean I know you go through Wilkinsburg to get to Squirrel HIll, etc.. and eventually into town. But I can't imagine those smaller neighborhood streets not being a parking lot during peak traffic times.
 
there is a road that actually can get you down on Allegheny river blvd from the parkway east, not sure the name of it but it goes past the old country club. Not sure what traffic is like coming in on Allegheny river blvd in the morning. Cant imagine being on a 2 lane rd thru Lawrenceville is a shortcut.

I guess you can dodge and weave your way on Penn thru Wilkinsburg and east liberty, again, not sure how that's a short cut. You either drive yourself mad driving thru congested areas or sit in traffic on parkway east, pick your poison.
Pa-130 from the Churchill exit, through Penn Hills to Allegheny River Blvd in Verona.
 
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Yeah I mean I know you go through Wilkinsburg to get to Squirrel HIll, etc.. and eventually into town. But I can't imagine those smaller neighborhood streets not being a parking lot during peak traffic times.
there are always alleged short cuts driving thru small neighborhood streets. when you stop to think about it objectively though, all you are doing is driving longer distances to give the perception of moving.

I used to do this coming from south hills into town. I'd go up thru beachview and dormont to avoid West liberty. 51 and banksville. Im zigging and zagging thru neighborhoods, stop signs, making lefts and rights and yeah, im not in traffic but im driving twice as far. At the end, I am in same place at same time. I was going twice as fast but travelling twice as far.
 
Yeah I mean I know you go through Wilkinsburg to get to Squirrel HIll, etc.. and eventually into town. But I can't imagine those smaller neighborhood streets not being a parking lot during peak traffic times.
I grew up in Swisshelm Park and it would get backed up not really a parking lot, that would start on Forward Ave in Squirrel Hill. It ends up being a huge mess when they shut down the tunnel and detour traffic that way though.
 
My prediction, based on hearsay rumors, is we get an Amazon distribution center by the airport; and a mix of more varied tech companies down to Hazelwood. No HQ2, which is fine by me.
 
My prediction, based on hearsay rumors, is we get an Amazon distribution center by the airport; and a mix of more varied tech companies down to Hazelwood. No HQ2, which is fine by me.
i think Uber is going to be ultimately leaving the area, so there should be a lot of room in that almono - hazelwood area. I always hear about commercial space available for light industrial and tech companies but never hear anything specific as far as companies committing to moving there.

I wonder if they are having a hard time getting tenants?
 
Biggest Pittsburgh/Allegheny County transportation mistakes:
  • Wasting endless years on the "Skybus" debate (or should I say debacle)
  • Not making the busways (particularly the MLK busway) light rail lines instead.
 
Biggest Pittsburgh/Allegheny County transportation mistakes:
  • Wasting endless years on the "Skybus" debate (or should I say debacle)
  • Not making the busways (particularly the MLK busway) light rail lines instead.
skybus was before my time but as a south park resident, I still hear about it. as someone that runs up and down Corrigan, there are a few times I'd have paid the .10cents for a ride back to my car to avoid running back.


A Skybus train makes its way along the rail network constructed in South Park, heading from the North Station towards Corrigan Drive and the return trip to the main terminal located at the Fairgrounds.

 
This city needs water taxis. Not just from ballgames to downtown but all over.

I would think a company based in Seattle would appreciate that form of transportation
 
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I don't live out East, I live in Collier but my son plays baseball tournaments out east almost every weekend at the All American fields in Trafford or fields in Monroeville or fields in Plum, etc.. I am out there probably 3 weekends out of 4 a month.

I simply don't know how anyone lives out that way if they work in Town. I could never deal with that commute every single day. That nightmare Parkway East is backed up on weekends on our way out to games leaving the city and also on our way back towards the city. It is absolutely unbearable even on weekends. You could pay my house off today and give me a totally debt free million dollar house and I would not live out there unless I was able to work out there and not have to come into the city for anything.

Absolutely hate the Parkway East.

It’s simple, I don’t come the parkway.
 
Zip lines from Mt. Washington and Spring Hill and the West End overlook to downtown. 60 seconds to the golden triangle.
you laugh, they proposed a zip line from mt Washington down to the north shore, not too long ago. more for entertainment purposes. not sure if it was close to happening or a pipe dream.

Regarding water taxis, years ago after a pitt game, I missed the usual boat from station square so I saw this little blue boat saying they'll take me over the river. so I pay 5 bucks, get in, they have a little bar so they make me a capt and coke, beautiful fall afternoon, im about 14 drinks in, feeling nice and then I realize they aren't taking me to station square, they are taking me up the Allegheny river by where the convention center is. I tell em I'm parked over by station square and they say they don't have the dock rights and this is the only place they can go. So of course I decide to have another capt and coke and I ultimately end up dropped off by the damn strip district.
 
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