Pitt/Penn State a fun exercise.

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

I saw David Jones in the Patriot News today posted an all time PSU position team. Which got me thinking, who would win an All Time Pitt vs All Time Penn State team. I am posting it here because obviously want PSU fans input too. But this would be one helluva game. I am not sure totally who would be on the teams but definitely guesses on my part. I do know this, I personally think Pitt has the better all time team. It is obviously close. But let me put my rosters out there.

QB. Pitt Dan Marino/Matt Cavanaugh
PSU: Kerry Collins/Todd Blackledge
Advantage Pitt. By a wide margin. Dan Marino is considered one of the greatest QB's of all time.

RB: Pitt: Tony Dorsett/Curtis Martin/Lesean McCoy/Ironhead Heywood
PSU: Curt Warner/Saiquon Barkley/Franco Harris/Kijana Carter
An embarrassment of riches on both sides. There are guys not on this list who would be "all timers" for other schools like Dion Lewis, Lydell Mitchell, Curvin Richards, John Cappeletti, Marshall Goldburg, Lenny Moore. etc...
Advantage. Wow. Maybe a slight edge to Pitt. Two NFL Hall of Famers vs one. But Nitters, you can argue a draw here and I couldn't argue.

WR: Pitt: Larry Fitzgerald/Antonio Bryant/Jon Baldwin/Gordon Jones/Eric Crabtree
PSU: Kenny Jackson/Bryant Johnson/ExCon McDuffie/Bobby Engram/Allen Robinson
Advantage? Pitt. What I see in alot of this, if you go top 4 or top 5 Pitt has an advantage but top 10 PSU has advantage. Pitt has more high end talent, PSU more depth of talent.

TE: Pitt: Ditka. (all you need to say) Jim Corbett/Joe Walton
PSU: Ted Kwalick/Kyle Brady/Mickey Shuler
Advantage? Ditka. But PSU's threesome here are pretty good. Maybe draw. But Ditka. Come on.

OL: Starting Pitt Fralic OT/MayOG/Stepnoski C/ Rueben Brown OG/ Jimbo Covert OT. Backups: Otah/Brzoza/Dixon/Dorian Johnson
Starting PSU: Dorney OT/MunchakOG/WisniewskiC/FarrellOG/Need some help here Nitters. Backups. AQ Shipley/Glenn Ressler/Help???

Advantage: Pitt.

Will get into defense into the next post. Again, Pitt seems to have the higher end starters, but PSU has the greater depth (except at OL).

 

[ratking17]

Just leave coaches out of this post

 

[Jpripper88]

Pitt seems to have the higher end starters, but PSU has the greater depth.

This.

 

[anon_vmuicqnzlyp3u]

Oh this should bring out the Nitter trolls and get them all fired up. Can't wait to peek at BWI when this is all said and done

 

[NittanySteel]

Great post. I agree that PSU has better depth but Pitt has the edge with the #1 player at more positions on offense. I don't expect that to be the case on defense, where the only position where I'd put Pitt as the clear leader is at corner with Revis. PSU will have an overwhelming edge at LB, and a pretty strong advantage at DT. I'd say it's a wash at DE and Safety. Regardless, I look forward to your post for D.

A couple other things:

- Obviously Marino is #1 on the list and gives Pitt the QB edge. But it's hardly a distinguished list for either school. And Marino also lost his only game as a starter vs. PSU, so there's that...

- Agree that it's pretty much a coin flip at RB, but I'd give PSU the edge here if we're talking a typical 4 or 5-man depth chart at RB. Also, both teams have 2 HOFers at the position (Lenny Moore and Franco for PSU).

- WR - Oof. Larry Fitz is second only to Jerry Rice in my eyes as the greatest WR of all time. He's certainly the best I watched in college. He alone gives Pitt the edge here. However, if I'm matching up the rest of the list (assuming Bobby Engram vs. Larry Fitz at #1), I'd take PSU's next 4 over Pitt's. But Larry was just that good, so Pitt takes WR for me.

TE - Ditka was great, and an NFL HOFer. But Kwalick's also in the CFB HOF. Edge to Pitt for Ditka.

OL - Both programs have produced fantastic OL. This one's a draw for me. Some more PSU OL greats not on your list: Jeff Hartings, Marco Rivera, Levi Brown, Stefen Wisniewski (assuming you're referring to his dad).

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Great post. I agree that PSU has better depth but Pitt has the edge with the #1 player at more positions on offense. I don't expect that to be the case on defense, where the only position where I'd put Pitt as the clear leader is at corner with Revis. PSU will have an overwhelming edge at LB, and a pretty strong advantage at DT. I'd say it's a wash at DE and Safety. Regardless, I look forward to your post for D.

A couple other things:

- Obviously Marino is #1 on the list and gives Pitt the QB edge. But it's hardly a distinguished list for either school. And Marino also lost his only game as a starter vs. PSU, so there's that...

- Agree that it's pretty much a coin flip at RB, but I'd give PSU the edge here if we're talking a typical 4 or 5-man depth chart at RB. Also, both teams have 2 HOFers at the position (Lenny Moore and Franco for PSU).

- WR - Oof. Larry Fitz is second only to Jerry Rice in my eyes as the greatest WR of all time. He's certainly the best I watched in college. He alone gives Pitt the edge here. However, if I'm matching up the rest of the list (assuming Bobby Engram vs. Larry Fitz at #1), I'd take PSU's next 4 over Pitt's. But Larry was just that good, so Pitt takes WR for me.

TE - Ditka was great, and an NFL HOFer. But Kwalick's also in the CFB HOF. Edge to Pitt for Ditka.

OL - Both programs have produced fantastic OL. This one's a draw for me. Some more PSU OL greats not on your list: Jeff Hartings, Marco Rivera, Levi Brown, Stefen Wisniewski (assuming you're referring to his dad).

Aha. Hartings, I was drawing a brain cramp. Yeah, that is who I was thinking of. And yes, definitely meant Stefen Wisniewski. Rivera and Brown are also two names I struggled with. Both program could field solid to great OL's for sure.

PSU's depth at RB is incredible. But Pitt's high end RB's are amazing. So that was tough.

On defense definitely LB to PSU, but remember I am putting Hugh Green and Rickey Jackson at OLB in this endeavour for a typical 4-3 scheme. So closes some of the gap. I think DL wow, we had some great ones, but PSU had alot of great ones. Pitt likely wins at CB, Safety goes to PSU. Kicker goes to Penn State (Matt Bahr) Punter goes to Pitt (Andy Lee).

 

[VAPITTALUM]

Great post. I agree that PSU has better depth but Pitt has the edge with the #1 player at more positions on offense. I don't expect that to be the case on defense, where the only position where I'd put Pitt as the clear leader is at corner with Revis. PSU will have an overwhelming edge at LB, and a pretty strong advantage at DT. I'd say it's a wash at DE and Safety. Regardless, I look forward to your post for D.

A couple other things:

- Obviously Marino is #1 on the list and gives Pitt the QB edge. But it's hardly a distinguished list for either school. And Marino also lost his only game as a starter vs. PSU, so there's that...

- Agree that it's pretty much a coin flip at RB, but I'd give PSU the edge here if we're talking a typical 4 or 5-man depth chart at RB. Also, both teams have 2 HOFers at the position (Lenny Moore and Franco for PSU).

- WR - Oof. Larry Fitz is second only to Jerry Rice in my eyes as the greatest WR of all time. He's certainly the best I watched in college. He alone gives Pitt the edge here. However, if I'm matching up the rest of the list (assuming Bobby Engram vs. Larry Fitz at #1), I'd take PSU's next 4 over Pitt's. But Larry was just that good, so Pitt takes WR for me.

TE - Ditka was great, and an NFL HOFer. But Kwalick's also in the CFB HOF. Edge to Pitt for Ditka.

OL - Both programs have produced fantastic OL. This one's a draw for me. Some more PSU OL greats not on your list: Jeff Hartings, Marco Rivera, Levi Brown, Stefen Wisniewski (assuming you're referring to his dad).

Defense will be interesting to see. At DT, Aaron Donald won just about every award imaginable in college, and is absolutely dominating at the NFL level. Don't discount the abilities of Hugh Green and Rickey Jackson at the DE position.

There are many other examples, but wanted to throw in my quick 2 cents.

 

[Parkview57]

Just leave coaches out of this post

Sorry Rat just can't help myself.

After an All-American college career playing on Pop Warner's 1915, 1916 NC teams at Pitt....
"...Sutherland replaced "Pop" Warner, his former coach and mentor, as head coach at Pitt. Sutherland, who was described as "a national hero" in a Saturday Evening Post article,[13] became a highly admired and influential coach at the University while compiling a record of 111–20–12.

During his tenure, Sutherland's teams were named Eastern football champions seven times including 1925, 1927, 1929, 1931, 1934, 1936, and 1937 During this time, Pitt appeared in four Rose Bowl games (1928, 1930, 1933, and 1937) and turned down a bid for the 1938 Rose Bowl.[14] Sutherland's teams were named "National Champions" by various selectors for nine different seasons including 1925, 1927, 1929, 1931, 1933, 1934, 1936, 1937, and 1938. Of these, the University of Pittsburgh officially recognizes five of those years as national championship seasons (1929, 1931, 1934, 1936, and 1937), while one of them, 1937, includes the Associated Press national championship designation which, at the time, was only the third instance in which the AP poll had been published. Sutherland coached the famed "Dream Backfield" of John Chickerneo, Dick Cassiano, Harold Stebbins, and Marshall Goldberg, which at the time was considered to be the best backfield in history by some, including Don Miller, a member of The Four Horsemen of Notre Dame" Wikipedia

In 1941 at age 52 Jock Sutherland joined the Navy and rose to the rank of Lt. Commander during WWII.

 

[bjcst27]

A couple of years ago Pitt was said to have the second best all time team only behind USC in an espn series that they ran in their website. So I'll take Pitt.

 

[phxpanther]

- Obviously Marino is #1 on the list and gives Pitt the QB edge. But it's hardly a distinguished list for either school. And Marino also lost his only game as a starter vs. PSU, so there's that

Lol. So there's what????? Marino started three times vs PSU, including as a freshman when he carved up psu in Beaver Stadium. The only game he didnt start was Pitt's 1980 win. Obviously jr and sr years didnt go nearly as well

 

[HailtoPitt]

Did someone say PSU has the edge at RB? Hahahahahahahaha!

Good one!

 

[HailtoPitt]

Great post. I agree that PSU has better depth but Pitt has the edge with the #1 player at more positions on offense. I don't expect that to be the case on defense, where the only position where I'd put Pitt as the clear leader is at corner with Revis. PSU will have an overwhelming edge at LB, and a pretty strong advantage at DT. I'd say it's a wash at DE and Safety. Regardless, I look forward to your post for D.

A couple other things:

- Obviously Marino is #1 on the list and gives Pitt the QB edge. But it's hardly a distinguished list for either school. And Marino also lost his only game as a starter vs. PSU, so there's that...

- Agree that it's pretty much a coin flip at RB, but I'd give PSU the edge here if we're talking a typical 4 or 5-man depth chart at RB. Also, both teams have 2 HOFers at the position (Lenny Moore and Franco for PSU).

- WR - Oof. Larry Fitz is second only to Jerry Rice in my eyes as the greatest WR of all time. He's certainly the best I watched in college. He alone gives Pitt the edge here. However, if I'm matching up the rest of the list (assuming Bobby Engram vs. Larry Fitz at #1), I'd take PSU's next 4 over Pitt's. But Larry was just that good, so Pitt takes WR for me.

TE - Ditka was great, and an NFL HOFer. But Kwalick's also in the CFB HOF. Edge to Pitt for Ditka.

OL - Both programs have produced fantastic OL. This one's a draw for me. Some more PSU OL greats not on your list: Jeff Hartings, Marco Rivera, Levi Brown, Stefen Wisniewski (assuming you're referring to his dad).

A wash at defensive end? Nope.

 

[Gunga_Galunga]

Defense will be interesting to see. At DT, Aaron Donald won just about every award imaginable in college, and is absolutely dominating at the NFL level. Don't discount the abilities of Hugh Green and Rickey Jackson at the DE position.

There are many other examples, but wanted to throw in my quick 2 cents.

Don't forget Doleman or even Maas. That's a damn good top 5.

 

[HailToPitt725]

Sorry Rat just can't help myself.

After an All-American college career playing on Pop Warner's 1915, 1916 NC teams at Pitt....
"...Sutherland replaced "Pop" Warner, his former coach and mentor, as head coach at Pitt. Sutherland, who was described as "a national hero" in a Saturday Evening Post article,[13] became a highly admired and influential coach at the University while compiling a record of 111–20–12.

During his tenure, Sutherland's teams were named Eastern football champions seven times including 1925, 1927, 1929, 1931, 1934, 1936, and 1937 During this time, Pitt appeared in four Rose Bowl games (1928, 1930, 1933, and 1937) and turned down a bid for the 1938 Rose Bowl.[14] Sutherland's teams were named "National Champions" by various selectors for nine different seasons including 1925, 1927, 1929, 1931, 1933, 1934, 1936, 1937, and 1938. Of these, the University of Pittsburgh officially recognizes five of those years as national championship seasons (1929, 1931, 1934, 1936, and 1937), while one of them, 1937, includes the Associated Press national championship designation which, at the time, was only the third instance in which the AP poll had been published. Sutherland coached the famed "Dream Backfield" of John Chickerneo, Dick Cassiano, Harold Stebbins, and Marshall Goldberg, which at the time was considered to be the best backfield in history by some, including Don Miller, a member of The Four Horsemen of Notre Dame" Wikipedia

In 1941 at age 52 Jock Sutherland joined the Navy and rose to the rank of Lt. Commander during WWII.

Yep. If we're doing coaches, we have the advantage in that as well. I would take our all-time team up against any other school's all-time roster. Only team we may have a struggle against is USC. It's awesome when people share posts like this because it makes you proud of how great of a history we have.

 

[Barkley26]

You have to ask yourself several questions before you undertake an exercise like this. First, is what you did in college more important or is what you did in the NFL more important. Or, do you weigh them equally? A lot of players played different positions in college versus what they played in the NFL. Fralic was a OT in college but a guard in the NFL. Millen was a DT at PSU but a LB in the NFL. Etc. Etc. Etc.

QB- Marino certainly had the better career in the NFL but I would put Kerry Collins ahead of Marino in college.

Here are the stats from Marino's best year at Pitt:
2876 yards 59.6% 37 TDs 23 INTs Team record 11-1

Here is Collins 1994 stats:
2679 yards 66.7% 21 TDs 7 INts team record 12-0

Marino threw more INTs in one season than Collins did in his entire career at PSU. I would take what Collins did in 1994 over anything Marino ever did in college.

RB- This depends on 2 things. Where do you put Lenny Moore and do you consider college production more important than NFL production(or vice versa). I believe PSU has the advantage when you just consider college production- just look at how many of their running backs went in the first round. Pitt has a slight edge when you consider NFL production but, again, if you consider Lenny Moore a running back, that would give PSU two NFL HOF backs just like Pitt.

WR- like a lot of positions, Pitt may have the single "best" player but PSU has better depth. In terms of NFL success, Pitt doesn't have much other than Fitz and Bryant while PSU has had 5-6 WRs that had a decent amount of success in the NFL

TE- see WR; Pitt doesn't have much at TE other than Ditka while PSU has had several TEs enjoy successful NFL careers

OL- I think PSU has the advantage at guard, Pitt has the advantage at tackle and it is a wash at Center(I'm considering Hartings and Stepnowski as centers even though each played guard in college).

 

[cbpitt2]

Here you can compare both schools. As someone stated above, first-teamers advantage Pitt. Depth advantage PSU. Are you comparing the players when they played in college or pro or both? That would be three different discussions. I always think of this discussion based solely on their college playing days.

Marino was a much better pro qb than in college. Franco, Lenny Moore and Jack Ham were better pros. Hugh Green was one of the all-time greatest defensive ends in college football history his pro career doesn't equal that. Bill Fralic was one of the greatest offensive linemen in college football history, his pro career wasn't going to equal that.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/789636-announcing-the-pittsburgh-panthers-all-time-football-team

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...nn-state-nittany-lions-all-time-football-team

 

[upj87]

I saw David Jones in the Patriot News today posted an all time PSU position team. Which got me thinking, who would win an All Time Pitt vs All Time Penn State team. I am posting it here because obviously want PSU fans input too. But this would be one helluva game. I am not sure totally who would be on the teams but definitely guesses on my part. I do know this, I personally think Pitt has the better all time team. It is obviously close. But let me put my rosters out there.

QB. Pitt Dan Marino/Matt Cavanaugh
PSU: Kerry Collins/Todd Blackledge
Advantage Pitt. By a wide margin. Dan Marino is considered one of the greatest QB's of all time.

RB: Pitt: Tony Dorsett/Curtis Martin/Lesean McCoy/Ironhead Heywood
PSU: Curt Warner/Saiquon Barkley/Franco Harris/Kijana Carter
An embarrassment of riches on both sides. There are guys not on this list who would be "all timers" for other schools like Dion Lewis, Lydell Mitchell, Curvin Richards, John Cappeletti, Marshall Goldburg, Lenny Moore. etc...
Advantage. Wow. Maybe a slight edge to Pitt. Two NFL Hall of Famers vs one. But Nitters, you can argue a draw here and I couldn't argue.

WR: Pitt: Larry Fitzgerald/Antonio Bryant/Jon Baldwin/Gordon Jones/Eric Crabtree
PSU: Kenny Jackson/Bryant Johnson/ExCon McDuffie/Bobby Engram/Allen Robinson
Advantage? Pitt. What I see in alot of this, if you go top 4 or top 5 Pitt has an advantage but top 10 PSU has advantage. Pitt has more high end talent, PSU more depth of talent.

TE: Pitt: Ditka. (all you need to say) Jim Corbett/Joe Walton
PSU: Ted Kwalick/Kyle Brady/Mickey Shuler
Advantage? Ditka. But PSU's threesome here are pretty good. Maybe draw. But Ditka. Come on.

OL: Starting Pitt Fralic OT/MayOG/Stepnoski C/ Rueben Brown OG/ Jimbo Covert OT. Backups: Otah/Brzoza/Dixon/Dorian Johnson
Starting PSU: Dorney OT/MunchakOG/WisniewskiC/FarrellOG/Need some help here Nitters. Backups. AQ Shipley/Glenn Ressler/Help???

Advantage: Pitt.

Will get into defense into the next post. Again, Pitt seems to have the higher end starters, but PSU has the greater depth (except at OL).

Maybe a slight edge to Pitt. Running backs? Your joking right...sort of like saying the In'juns had a slight edge over Custer...;

 

[Barkley26]

Maybe a slight edge to Pitt. Running backs? Your joking right...sort of like saying the In'juns had a slight edge over Custer...;

Franco Harris- HOF
Lenny Moore- Hof
Curt Warner- 3 times Pro Bowl
Larry Johnson- 2 times pro bowl
Lydell Mitchell- 3 times pro bowl

Penn State has 4 of the top 80 in the NFL's career rushing yardage while Pitt only has 3 players. I would say PSU has had a strong history of putting good running backs into the NFL despite a couple of busts.

 

[upj87]

Franco Harris- HOF
Lenny Moore- Hof
Curt Warner- 3 times Pro Bowl
Larry Johnson- 2 times pro bowl
Lydell Mitchell- 3 times pro bowl

Penn State has 4 of the top 80 in the NFL's career rushing yardage while Pitt only has 3 players. I would say PSU has had a strong history of putting good running backs into the NFL despite a couple of busts.

Pitt will have 3 (Shady gonna pass Franco) above any Penn State player you have listed (4 of the top 80 ...had to go to 80 eh? hahaha) and all in the pro hof. In the next couple of years 3 of the top 12 or so nfl rushers will have been panthers while no nits in sight in that group. ...next.

 

[Cathedral Lawn Frisbee]

Yep, quality over quantity.

Pitt will have 3 above any Penn State player you have listed (4 of the top 80 ...had to go to 80 eh? hahaha) and all in the pro hof ...next.

 

[bayardstreet]

Good stuff. You could pick first, second and third team offensive line for both schools and it would still be as good as any other school in division 1. Pitt and PSU cranked out plenty of NFL stars on the offensive line.

 

[Barkley26]

Pitt will have 3 (Shady gonna pass Franco) above any Penn State player you have listed (4 of the top 80 ...had to go to 80 eh? hahaha) and all in the pro hof. In the next couple of years 3 of the top 12 or so nfl rushers will have been panthers while no nits in sight in that group. ...next.

I could go to 125 and there wouldn't be any more Panthers in the list. Pitt's entire "running back U" mantra is built on 3 guys. I doubt McCoy surpasses Franco Harris's career rushing yards but even if he did, Harris played the first half of his career back when they only had 14 game regular seasons so his career yardage would be much higher of he got to play 16 games per season like McCoy.

The problem with your logic is you think if player A rushes for more yards than player B, then player A is the better player. Curtis Martin has more career rushing yards than Jim Brown but you won't find one person alive that would rate Martin a better player than Brown.

 

[Barkley26]

Yep, quality over quantity.

Penn State has both quality and quantity.

 

[Swervin27]

that's the problem with this "fun exercise," No chance you get any objectivity from either side... Our pitt guys kill those psu guys and well if you ask a Sandusky U fan, they'll say the opposite. My man here is talking about curt freakin warner for Christ sakes.. I mean if anything, go with DJ Dozier or Enis, who gives a crap about curt warner... This leads to another question, do you take into consideration NFL career.

 

[Cathedral Lawn Frisbee]

You have no one comparable to Hawk, no one

Penn State has both quality and quantity.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

You have to ask yourself several questions before you undertake an exercise like this. First, is what you did in college more important or is what you did in the NFL more important. Or, do you weigh them equally? A lot of players played different positions in college versus what they played in the NFL. Fralic was a OT in college but a guard in the NFL. Millen was a DT at PSU but a LB in the NFL. Etc. Etc. Etc.

QB- Marino certainly had the better career in the NFL but I would put Kerry Collins ahead of Marino in college.

Here are the stats from Marino's best year at Pitt:
2876 yards 59.6% 37 TDs 23 INTs Team record 11-1

Here is Collins 1994 stats:
2679 yards 66.7% 21 TDs 7 INts team record 12-0

Marino threw more INTs in one season than Collins did in his entire career at PSU. I would take what Collins did in 1994 over anything Marino ever did in college.

RB- This depends on 2 things. Where do you put Lenny Moore and do you consider college production more important than NFL production(or vice versa). I believe PSU has the advantage when you just consider college production- just look at how many of their running backs went in the first round. Pitt has a slight edge when you consider NFL production but, again, if you consider Lenny Moore a running back, that would give PSU two NFL HOF backs just like Pitt.

WR- like a lot of positions, Pitt may have the single "best" player but PSU has better depth. In terms of NFL success, Pitt doesn't have much other than Fitz and Bryant while PSU has had 5-6 WRs that had a decent amount of success in the NFL

TE- see WR; Pitt doesn't have much at TE other than Ditka while PSU has had several TEs enjoy successful NFL careers

OL- I think PSU has the advantage at guard, Pitt has the advantage at tackle and it is a wash at Center(I'm considering Hartings and Stepnowski as centers even though each played guard in college).

Only the most ardent homer would consider Kerry Collins over Dan Marino. Come on man. And you talk out both sides of your face, when you discount Marino's pro career and then you count Hartings.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Penn State has both quality and quantity.

But so does Pitt. I mean are you forgetting about Dorsett? Ironhead? McCoy? I think RB is such a deep position for both programs, PSU might be better 6 thru 10, but Pitt might be better 1 thru 5.

 

[Swervin27]

Only the most ardent homer would consider Kerry Collins over Dan Marino. Come on man. And you talk out both sides of your face, when you discount Marino's pro career and then you count Hartings.

my point exactly. psu fans will seriously put Kerry Collins in the same sentence as dan marino. how do you take someone like that serious?

 

[upj87]

Penn State has both quality and quantity.

dude, you listed three guys with a total of 6 pro bowls to make up your silly "quantity" point. Shady McCoy has 5 himself........Now, hows about I give you the edge in foot fairys that can put it through the uprights and you take your 4 posts and go away....

 

[Barkley26]

Only the most ardent homer would consider Kerry Collins over Dan Marino. Come on man. And you talk out both sides of your face, when you discount Marino's pro career and then you count Hartings.

I said I would take Collins COLLEGE career and I backed it up with facts. I think Collins's best season in college is better than Marino's and Collins led his team to a 12-0 record which again trumps the best Marino ever did in college. I never said Collins had a better NFL career.

 

[pittmeister]

Franco Harris- HOF
Lenny Moore- Hof
Curt Warner- 3 times Pro Bowl
Larry Johnson- 2 times pro bowl
Lydell Mitchell- 3 times pro bowl

Penn State has 4 of the top 80 in the NFL's career rushing yardage while Pitt only has 3 players. I would say PSU has had a strong history of putting good running backs into the NFL despite a couple of busts.

Typical nitter logic... on a previous post you said that Marino was a better NFL player, but you would take Collins over Marino in college, yet you list PSU RB's and what they did in the NFL... Then you don't even list Cappelletti as one of the all-time great PSU running backs...

You are confused.... No surprise...

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

that's the problem with this "fun exercise," No chance you get any objectivity from either side... Our pitt guys kill those psu guys and well if you ask a Sandusky U fan, they'll say the opposite. My man here is talking about curt freakin warner for Christ sakes.. I mean if anything, go with DJ Dozier or Enis, who gives a crap about curt warner... This leads to another question, do you take into consideration NFL career.

I think I was being objective. I mean a guy obviously shows his biasness when he even suggests Collins over Marino. I am talking body of work. You have to take pro careers along with college, because that is an obvious metric of how great a player was.

 

[Swervin27]

I think I was being objective. I mean a guy obviously shows his biasness when he even suggests Collins over Marino. I am talking body of work. You have to take pro careers along with college, because that is an obvious metric of how great a player was.

tough to include both. I mean if you do that, Hugh Green gets knocked down a few pegs. Guy was one of the best collegiate de linemen ever but throw in his nfl career, well Im not even sure he played in the nfl. I recall seeing him in a dolphin jersey but can honestly say I cant recall one video, highlight clip of him ever in the nfl.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

I said I would take Collins COLLEGE career and I backed it up with facts. I think Collins's best season in college is better than Marino's and Collins led his team to a 12-0 record which again trumps the best Marino ever did in college. I never said Collins had a better NFL career.

Buck Belue led his team to a National title. Does that make his college career better than Marino and Collins? So that means you would take him over those guys? Or how about John Schaefer? Both were lousy QB's on great teams. Plus again, this is about the totality of a player's career, the only way you can measure how truly great a guy was marrying the college with the pros. For example, Michigan...Tom Brady. He wasn't a star with Michigan, but he is the greatest QB to play the game. That goes in the Michigan column, even though you would argue that drunk Collins is ahead of him because of one college season. See how it goes? Do you understand??

 

[Barkley26]

dude, you listed three guys with a total of 6 pro bowls to make up your silly "quantity" point. Shady McCoy has 5 himself........Now, hows about I give you the edge in foot fairys that can put it through the uprights and you take your 4 posts and go away....

If you are using Pro Bowls as your basis for determining who is better, than Franco has 9 PBs to Dorsett's 4 so I guess that makes Harris better right?

Curt Warner, Lydell Mitchell, and Larry Johnson were all very good running backs in the NFLCurt Warner, in particular, could have been a borderline HOF at a minimum had he not torn his ACL in 1984.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

tough to include both. I mean if you do that, Hugh Green gets knocked down a few pegs. Guy was one of the best collegiate de linemen ever but throw in his nfl career, well Im not even sure he played in the nfl. I recall seeing him in a dolphin jersey but can honestly say I cant recall one video, highlight clip of him ever in the nfl.

But you have to. Again, I use the Tom Brady example for Michigan. Hugh Green's greatness was cut short by a knee injury in the pros. And so be it.

 

[Panther Holla]

Great post. I agree that PSU has better depth but Pitt has the edge with the #1 player at more positions on offense. I don't expect that to be the case on defense, where the only position where I'd put Pitt as the clear leader is at corner with Revis. PSU will have an overwhelming edge at LB, and a pretty strong advantage at DT. I'd say it's a wash at DE and Safety. Regardless, I look forward to your post for D.

A couple other things:

- Obviously Marino is #1 on the list and gives Pitt the QB edge. But it's hardly a distinguished list for either school. And Marino also lost his only game as a starter vs. PSU, so there's that...

- Agree that it's pretty much a coin flip at RB, but I'd give PSU the edge here if we're talking a typical 4 or 5-man depth chart at RB. Also, both teams have 2 HOFers at the position (Lenny Moore and Franco for PSU).

- WR - Oof. Larry Fitz is second only to Jerry Rice in my eyes as the greatest WR of all time. He's certainly the best I watched in college. He alone gives Pitt the edge here. However, if I'm matching up the rest of the list (assuming Bobby Engram vs. Larry Fitz at #1), I'd take PSU's next 4 over Pitt's. But Larry was just that good, so Pitt takes WR for me.

TE - Ditka was great, and an NFL HOFer. But Kwalick's also in the CFB HOF. Edge to Pitt for Ditka.

OL - Both programs have produced fantastic OL. This one's a draw for me. Some more PSU OL greats not on your list: Jeff Hartings, Marco Rivera, Levi Brown, Stefen Wisniewski (assuming you're referring to his dad).

Dan Marino was 1-1 as a starter vs the Lions. He started and won in 1979, lost in 81.

 

[Barkley26]

Buck Belue led his team to a National title. Does that make his college career better than Marino and Collins? So that means you would take him over those guys? Or how about John Schaefer? Both were lousy QB's on great teams. Plus again, this is about the totality of a player's career, the only way you can measure how truly great a guy was marrying the college with the pros. For example, Michigan...Tom Brady. He wasn't a star with Michigan, but he is the greatest QB to play the game. That goes in the Michigan column, even though you would argue that drunk Collins is ahead of him because of one college season. See how it goes? Do you understand??

Did Buck Belue win the Maxwell Award and finish 4th in the Heisman? Didn't think so. Was Belue a top 5 pick in the NFL draft? Didn't think so.

 

[recruitsreadtheseboards]

Did Buck Belue win the Maxwell Award and finish 4th in the Heisman? Didn't think so. Was Belue a top 5 pick in the NFL draft? Didn't think so.

Was Tom Brady? Didn't think so.

 

[anon_vmuicqnzlyp3u]

Why are you guys even arguing with a Nitter. Don't you know that everything at Pedo U is far Superior to anything thing else in this world. They think and believe the world stop and ends with Pedo U. This Barcley26 guy is proof in point