Unusual evening

[Pete108K11]

No Roc the Panther (at the soccer game I guess ), no Hillgrove and on the Game Program UAPB had 22 players listed. UAPB played an unusual zone with four guys at or above the foul line. This allowed Pitt to get lob passes into the blocks as well as some good big to big passing.

No way we attack Syracuse or any other zone teams this way, I guess beating any zone without Murphy and Trey will be an impossible task.

Capel played some with two bigs and ran some double teams in the corners, something to look for in future games. Hamilton played well, even though his game is all below the rim.Ezakudo played well in spot duty.

 

[Chanceman]

Hamilton being strong below the rim is all that is expected of him. I wonder if the actual attendance at the soccer game exceeded the basketball game. That game was the first NCAA win for men's soccer. This game was an expected easy one.

 

[Chescat]

"Unusual Zone?... I already read on a game report that it was a
2-3...WRONG!
It really was a 1-3-1....actually an extended 1-3-1, and that's why it
looked "unusual." You mentioned "four guys at or above the foul
line." Good observation...but that's why it's an "extended" 1-3-1.

I wasn't going to post about how we approach zones, because it
truly frustrates me. Now that you brought it up LOL. I really like Capel,
but this is the one area I've been critical of him.
We basically run three guys out front against a zone. One in the
middle out and ahead of the top of the circle, and two wings on
either side. The ball swings back and forth with these three.
Some of the basic approaches; taking it to the side, overload,
triangle, cutter through to the weakside are seemingly never even
tried. Occasionally we get it to the high post and then hit the player
down low. We never get it to the high post and hit the weak side wing.
That's basic stuff.
What I just mentioned is as basic to zone offense as
the basketball is round. We simply don't make the zone work
or adjust, and consequently gaps don't open up in the zone.
I'm not talking anything sophisticated here, this stuff is taught
at the jr. high or middle school level.
We won tonight because of superior talent and depth.
Anyone who has ever played this game or coached it knows
exactly what I'm talking about here. It's as basic as A-B-C.

 

[TIGER-PAUL]

Soccer had 1321

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

"Unusual Zone?... I already read on a game report that it was a
2-3...WRONG!
It really was a 1-3-1....actually an extended 1-3-1, and that's why it
looked "unusual." You mentioned "four guys at or above the foul
line." Good observation...but that's why it's an "extended" 1-3-1.

I wasn't going to post about how we approach zones, because it
truly frustrates me. Now that you brought it up LOL. I really like Capel,
but this is the one area I've been critical of him.
We basically run three guys out front against a zone. One in the
middle out and ahead of the top of the circle, and two wings on
either side. The ball swings back and forth with these three.
Some of the basic approaches; taking it to the side, overload,
triangle, cutter through to the weakside are seemingly never even
tried. Occasionally we get it the high post and then hit the player down
low. We never get it to the high post and hit the weak side wing. That's
basic stuff.
What I just mentioned is as basic to zone offense as
the basketball is round. We simply don't make the zone work
or adjust, and consequently gaps don't open up in the zone.
I'm not talking anything sophisticated here, this stuff is taught
at the jr. high or middle school level.
We won tonight because of superior talent and depth.
Anyone who has ever played this game or coached it knows
exactly what I'm talking about here. It's as basic as A-B-C.

I share your concerns. I am expecting we will see lots of 1-3-1 zones going forward and I don’t like the limited way we are attacking it. Perhaps that will change? We can hope.

 

[Chescat]

No way we attack Syracuse or any other zone teams this way, I guess beating any zone without Murphy and Trey will be an impossible task.

Very true, but not because of Murphy or Trey. I'ts the offensive scheme.
Trey did poorly against zones last year. Tonight was a replay of
that. He's not going to score when he's on the wing just passing it
back and forth with the point.
We do nothing to make the zone adjust, and we don't create the gaps
that a player like Trey needs to score.

 

[Chescat]

I share your concerns. I am expecting we will see lots of 1-3-1 zones going forward and I don’t like the limited way we are attacking it. Perhaps that will change? We can hope.

Yeah we agree on this obviously. However it's not the 1-3-1 that concerns
me. As long as we attack zone the way we saw tonight (and all last year),
it's not gonna make any difference what zone we face. A 2-3 zone
is what is usually seen at the college level, but it won't make any difference.
It's our approach that's the problem. I know you get it.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

Soccer had 1321

Well Pitt said there were 7068 at the basketball game, so obviously there were way more at the basketball game.

No, really, stop laughing. Pitt announced 7068 at the basketball game. In reality, if there were 1321 at the soccer game (and you'd think that was probably a real number since it was an NCAA tournament game) then there were more people at the soccer game than at the basketball game. While it was probably close, I think there were more people at Monday's basketball game than were there tonight. And Monday was probably around 1200.

 

[Chanceman]

I was at the basketball game which looked very sparsely attended. Even in the Zoo. I don't know what the capacity is at the soccer game but I heard it was packed.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Well Pitt said there were 7068 at the basketball game, so obviously there were way more at the basketball game.

No, really, stop laughing. Pitt announced 7068 at the basketball game. In reality, if there were 1321 at the soccer game (and you'd think that was probably a real number since it was an NCAA tournament game) then there were more people at the soccer game than at the basketball game. While it was probably close, I think there were more people at Monday's basketball game than were there tonight. And Monday was probably around 1200.

Man, Pitt has to stop exaggerating attendance to these extents. Even Barnes only listed 3000 some when we had nights like this when there were only 1000 or so people there. I skipped hoops tonight, sold my tickets on Stubhub for the StubHub minimum of $6 (cant believe they actually sold) and went to the soccer game. It was a no-brainer, really. Pitt's 1st NCAAT game in my lifetime vs a scrimmage over at The Pete.

I was surprised the announced attendance was only 1321 for soccer. It seemed much more than that. People had to sit in the last row of the baseball stadium to get a view. From what Zeise was saying though, its hard to imagine there were more than 1000-1500 people at the basketball game. I realize we have a long way to go but Pitt has to do something to get more people to these games. They are being outdrawn by soccer, volleyball, and soon to be WPIAL basketball games. It doesn't help that they didn't sell many season tickets as they kept prices near the top of college basketball in terms of cost. If it were me, I woulda said "eff it, slash the prices to ridiculously low levels foe a year or 2 and lets build back the fanbase."

Here's some photos from the soccer game. 1300 looks much better in 1000 seat stadium than it does in a 12,500 seat arena. Did you hear that Pitt football? Playing in smaller venues helps create a better atmosphere.

 

[levance2]

Well Pitt said there were 7068 at the basketball game, so obviously there were way more at the basketball game.

No, really, stop laughing. Pitt announced 7068 at the basketball game. In reality, if there were 1321 at the soccer game (and you'd think that was probably a real number since it was an NCAA tournament game) then there were more people at the soccer game than at the basketball game. While it was probably close, I think there were more people at Monday's basketball game than were there tonight. And Monday was probably around 1200.

Curtis Aiken said on the radio postgame that he was sure the volleyball game would be sold out tomorrow, so maybe he does the attendance counts for all sports.

 

[Black Panther]

No Roc the Panther (at the soccer game I guess ), no Hillgrove and on the Game Program UAPB had 22 players listed. UAPB played an unusual zone with four guys at or above the foul line. This allowed Pitt to get lob passes into the blocks as well as some good big to big passing.

No way we attack Syracuse or any other zone teams this way, I guess beating any zone without Murphy and Trey will be an impossible task.

Capel played some with two bigs and ran some double teams in the corners, something to look for in future games. Hamilton played well, even though his game is all below the rim.Ezakudo played well in spot duty.

Did BIll already leave for the football game? Need another roc suit I guess.

 

[Joe the Panther Fan]

Did BIll already leave for the football game? Need another roc suit I guess.

The football team hasn't even left for the football game yet.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

Yeah we agree on this obviously. However it's not the 1-3-1 that concerns
me. As long as we attack zone the way we saw tonight (and all last year),
it's not gonna make any difference what zone we face. A 2-3 zone
is what is usually seen at the college level, but it won't make any difference.
It's our approach that's the problem. I know you get it.

Well, only to quibble just a tiny bit--having Coulibaly in the middle as was done some last should help when we do see zones--especially if/when Coulibaly's game matures and he doesn't force things with bad shots like he did a number of times last night.

What was troubling vs the 1-3-1 was failure to attack it effectively where it is most vulnerable--from the corners. Of course, our weak 3-ball shooting from the corners doesn't help since other attacking opportunities out of the corner don't open up if a defender doesn't get pulled out strongly to the offensive player with the ball in the corner. Has anyone made that shot in the six games we have played so far except Champagnie a couple of times in one game?

 

[Panther Holla]

The Pete was pretty dead last night. The game was a snooze and I found myself alternating between the action on the court, napping and reading CNN on my phone. Best part of the evening was my turkey sub from the place in the food court. But... there will be nights like that. Pitt was able to keep UAPB at bay despite a couple of our guys having off nights.

 

[Chescat]

Well, only to quibble just a tiny bit--having Coulibaly in the middle as was done some last should help when we do see zones--especially if/when Coulibaly's game matures and he doesn't force things with bad shots like he did a number of times last night.

What was troubling vs the 1-3-1 was failure to attack it effectively where it is most vulnerable--from the corners. Of course, our weak 3-ball shooting from the corners doesn't help since other attacking opportunities out of the corner don't open up if a defender doesn't get pulled out strongly to the offensive player with the ball in the corner. Has anyone made that shot in the six games we have played so far except Champagnie a couple of times in one game?

I hear what you're saying about Coulibaly in the middle. For now he's a work
in progress, but in time I agree that he can handle this. Right now the best
player there is Champagnie IMO. He knows what to do with the ball when
he gets it in the high post. On the other hand, he also appears to be our
best option in the low post. Did you see the dunks and layups he was
getting down there? That's the one thing we did fairly well against the
zone last night. It takes more than a scheme for him to do that. He has
to have a sense or a feel for where the gap is, and he has to time it
right. He seems to know how to do that.
As far as the "corners" that you mentioned, we mostly play catch out front
and don't attack it from the side. If we did, that would make it easier to get
the ball to where you're suggesting (corners).

 

[Fsgolfdr]

I hear what you're saying about Coulibaly in the middle. For now he's a work
in progress, but in time I agree that he can handle this. Right now the best
player there is Champagnie IMO. He knows what to do with the ball when
he gets it in the high post. On the other hand, he also appears to be our
best option in the low post. Did you see the dunks and layups he was
getting down there? That's the one thing we did fairly well against the
zone last night. It takes more than a scheme for him to do that. He has
to have a sense or a feel for where the gap is, and he has to time it
right. He seems to know how to do that.
As far as the "corners" that you mentioned, we mostly play catch out front
and don't attack it from the side. If we did, that would make it easier to get
the ball to where you're suggesting (corners).

What I found interesting was JC saying that when communicating with Coulibaly gets better ....If he’s having trouble with bb terminology how does he understand what his instructors in his classes are saying !

 

[Chescat]

What I found interesting was JC saying that when communicating with Coulibaly gets better ....If he’s having trouble with bb terminology how does he understand what his instructors in his classes are saying !

HA! Good point.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

HA! Good point.

No worry , college athletics is all about the free education !

 

[pittchagg]

What I found interesting was JC saying that when communicating with Coulibaly gets better ....If he’s having trouble with bb terminology how does he understand what his instructors in his classes are saying !

I think listening to a professor on a Tuesday morning in some freshman social studies class in Posvar is a little different than trying to listen to a coach or a teammate in real time in the middle of a basketball game, especially while you're still adjusting to the jump in quality that is D1 basketball.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

I hear what you're saying about Coulibaly in the middle. For now he's a work
in progress, but in time I agree that he can handle this. Right now the best
player there is Champagnie IMO. He knows what to do with the ball when
he gets it in the high post. On the other hand, he also appears to be our
best option in the low post. Did you see the dunks and layups he was
getting down there? That's the one thing we did fairly well against the
zone last night. It takes more than a scheme for him to do that. He has
to have a sense or a feel for where the gap is, and he has to time it
right. He seems to know how to do that.
As far as the "corners" that you mentioned, we mostly play catch out front
and don't attack it from the side. If we did, that would make it easier to get
the ball to where you're suggesting (corners).

Absolutely re the corners. If you google attacking the 1-3-1 there is a nice video of a Michigan State game where they are doing an excellent job of breaking it down by attacking from the corners. They execute it very well.

 

[Chescat]

Absolutely re the corners. If you google attacking the 1-3-1 there is a nice video of a Michigan State game where they are doing an excellent job of breaking it down by attacking from the corners. They execute it very well.

I just finished googling it. Classic Stuff!! Thanks DC.
First of all did you see the front against that 1-3-1? It was a two man front,
exactly what some of us have been posting.
Also, the use of the post was really good, he didn't just stay on the free
throw line. When the ball went to the wing he sometimes came to the top
of the circle, received the pass and reversed it to the other wing for an
open jumper. Ball reversal against a zone is very important. Using the
post to throw the kick out is effective. That film is very instructive.
Something else...Michigan State with Green in the post makes
a difference LOL..he became a star in the NBA. Also notice the
ball movement, and how they get into the gaps with penetration
AFTER forcing the zone to adjust. That is something we've been
strongly suggesting on here. That film made my day...LOL

 

[Chescat]

Absolutely re the corners. If you google attacking the 1-3-1 there is a nice video of a Michigan State game where they are doing an excellent job of breaking it down by attacking from the corners. They execute it very well.

DC, I tried to link it here but couldn't. If you could get that Mich. ST film
on here I believe our posters would enjoy it and see what we've all
been talking about. Thanks.

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

DC, I tried to link it here but couldn't. If you could get that Mich. ST film
on here I believe our posters would enjoy it and see what we've all
been talking about. Thanks.

I believe this is it.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

I think listening to a professor on a Tuesday morning in some freshman social studies class in Posvar is a little different than trying to listen to a coach or a teammate in real time in the middle of a basketball game, especially while you're still adjusting to the jump in quality that is D1 basketball.

This was JC talking about practice . Plus there’s 7 coaches 8 counting strength and conditioning coach and 15 players counting walk ons . Think your getting far more personal attention in practice than in your freshman social studies class !

 

[brdst11]

Not sure why Roc didn't make it to the game. I saw him heading from the soccer game at half and heading towards the Pete. I guess this confirms that there's only one Roc costume

No Roc the Panther (at the soccer game I guess ), no Hillgrove and on the Game Program UAPB had 22 players listed. UAPB played an unusual zone with four guys at or above the foul line. This allowed Pitt to get lob passes into the blocks as well as some good big to big passing.

No way we attack Syracuse or any other zone teams this way, I guess beating any zone without Murphy and Trey will be an impossible task.

Capel played some with two bigs and ran some double teams in the corners, something to look for in future games. Hamilton played well, even though his game is all below the rim.Ezakudo played well in spot duty.

 

[Chescat]

I believe this is it.

View embedded media

Yup, that's it. Everything we've been talking about is apparent in
this film.
Of course it also is Michigan ST. with superior talent compared
to the opposition (Northwestern), but still...that's how you
attack a zone.

 

[Pete108K11]

Yup, that's it. Everything we've been talking about is apparent in
this film.
Of course it also is Michigan ST. with superior talent compared
to the opposition (Northwestern), but still...that's how you
attack a zone.

The way UAPB played the zone was not the classic style instead of having their big man in the center and a quick guy on the baseline to run corner to corner UAPB had their big on the baseline, Should have made the corners more vulnerable.

 

[joeydavid]

I believe this is it.

View embedded media

The 1-3-1 easy to attack. You overload either side of the zone with 4 players and someone is going to be open.

That first clip is exactly what MSU did the caveat is needing 2 good shooters and a post to take advantage of it.

 

[Fsgolfdr]

Thinking that the coaching staff doesn’t know how to exploit every zone defense ever concocted is being a little naive . Having the players capable of exploiting those weaknesses is Pitts problem right now !

 

[Chescat]

The 1-3-1 easy to attack. You overload either side of the zone with 4 players and someone is going to be open.

That first clip is exactly what MSU did the caveat is needing 2 good shooters and a post to take advantage of it.

yup. Also run one of those four through as a cutter to the other side and
reverse the ball. there will be at least a few options off of that.