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Clemson Game & Other Dribbles ...

I wish I could find the published study I used to use that analyzed the probabilities in an NBA game of every single spot on the half court. The mid range probabilities from about 5-7 feet contested in the NBA actually are the same as about a 24 ft 3 pointer from the top of the key.
 
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whirlybird optio said:
I know there was one set yesterday, I think out of a timeout, where Nate ran the baseline got the pass, immediately went up. Looked like a set play to me, I don’t know.
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Well of course it was a set play. We run set plays off baseline inbounds passes every single time. But those plays are designed for options. For instance, if the guy cutting to the basket is open get him the ball. If he's not but the guy flashing to the corner is then get him the ball. If all else fails lob the ball high and deep to the center moving away from the hoop. That isn't a set play to get one particular guy a shot, that's a play that could get a couple different guys a shot, depending on what the defense does. If they leave Santos open at the three point line and we pass it to him, he shoots the ball.
 
PittMan 72 said:
@DT_PITT, a question I wondered about on the 3 point play Tyson made in the 1H where he drove the baseline from the left corner, dunked and was fouled? It looked like he pulled the rim down before he dunked the ball.

Was the basket allowed even though he pulled the rim down because he was fouled? Because otherwise wouldn’t that have been offensive basket interference? It looked like at first the officials were not going to rule the basket good. But then they did and Tyson made the FT for a 3 point play.
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When it happened in real time, I thought we may have done something for basket interference, but we didn't.

Tyson drove and sort of just lost the ball as he was going to dunk and as he was fouled by Diaz. As the he was pulling down the rim, the ball just went in. I'm not the super rules guru as to why this was good.

I can say that in other situations in games I've watched, I think I've seen players sort of lose the ball as they go for the dunk and they grab the rim, but it still goes in and it counts.

Pitt didn't complain too much at the time so maybe there's a reason this is good.
 
I regret that my original post devolved into a a threadful of bickering.

But allow me to offer the following parallel as a reason for hope, if not just perspective.

In 2001-2002, the Panthers were starting to look pretty good around the Holidays. They went on the road and defeated a tournament team in Ohio State. But earlier, we had kind of a meh loss to the Seth Greenburg led South Florida team up at the Sewall Center.

Still, the Panthers started off the Big East season 3-0, including a road win against the previous year's Big East Champ Boston College. We had just cracked the Top 25.

Then they came home to play a decent, but not Elite ND team. I recall Zavackas hitting a three to put the Panthers up five with around 2:30 minutes to go. But ND scored the last 8 points of the game to sink the Panthers.

Our loss to Clemson yesterday reminds me a great deal of the ND loss. After the game, there was still a great deal of doubt as to whether the team was actually for real. It didn't help that we lost our next game at Miami in OT. We also got pretty well pummeled during our return trip to ND. Our record slid to 6-3 in the Big East and while we knew our team was decent, we still didn't know exactly what we had.

The true greatness of that team really started to show through a couple weeks later when we went up to the Dome were we faced a 14 point deficit several minutes into the 2nd half. But we snapped out of it was ended up blowing them out. This win catapulted us well back into the top 25 and we all know where it went from there, including a 13-3 Big East record.

Personally, I think we have a pretty good Pitt team this year, and I think Clemson was a pretty good opponent. It's easy to see why many are saying this was not a bad loss by any means. And along the same lines, I can also see why it would concern some folks a little.

This team, just like the 2001-2002, must face the skepticism of it's recent past. And it wasn't until later in the year we knew for sure. Maybe this team can finish the year 15-5 in the ACC. Maybe they will be 10-10. Neither would surprise me. I guess whatever comes to pass, I'm going to try to enjoy it the best I can, just like we all enjoyed that very special 2001-2002 season.
 
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hilltoppanther said:
When Clemson went to the match up zone in the final minutes of the second half, it stymied Pitt a bit. Burton could no longer back his man down into the post.
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I looked at the last few possessions and I tend to think they got pretty good looks against the zone. Burton's easy layup was against the zone. Then Nelly and Greg got inside the zone nicely but missed the short runners. That was followed by Nelly missing a wide open three that was opened by a nice perimeter zone screen from Fede. This was followed by Burton's charge, where he actually could have tried to back down his man, but instead tried to go to fast with the spin move. But Burton followed up on the next possession by pretty easily getting into the lane for a 10 footer.

Clemson did defend us pretty well on the final possession when we were left to the poor lob to Fede from Nelly.

If anything, the guy who was really taken out to the game by Clemson's zone was Burton. He barely touchefd the ball in the last five-six minutes.
 
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DT_PITT said:
I regret that my original post devolved into a a threadful of bickering.

But allow me to offer the following parallel as a reason for hope, if not just perspective.

In 2001-2002, the Panthers were starting to look pretty good around the Holidays. They went on the road and defeated a tournament team in Ohio State. But earlier, we had kind of a meh loss to the Seth Greenburg led South Florida team up at the Sewall Center.

Still, the Panthers started off the Big East season 3-0, including a road win against the previous year's Big East Champ Boston College. We had just cracked the Top 25.

Then they came home to play a decent, but not Elite ND team. I recall Zavackas hitting a three to put the Panthers up five with around 2:30 minutes to go. But ND scored the last 8 points of the game to sink the Panthers.

Our loss to Clemson yesterday reminds me a great deal of the ND loss. After the game, there was still a great deal of doubt as to whether the team was actually for real. It didn't help that we lost our next game at Miami in OT. We also got pretty well pummeled during our return trip to ND. Our record slid to 6-3 in the Big East and while we knew our team was decent, we still didn't know exactly what we had.

The true greatness of that team really started to show through a couple weeks later when we went up to the Dome were we faced a 14 point deficit several minutes into the 2nd half. But we snapped out of it was ended up blowing them out. This win catapulted us well back into the top and we all know where it went from there, including a 13-3 Big East recent.

Personally, I think we have a pretty good Pitt team this year, and I think Clemson was a pretty good opponent. It's easy to see why many are saying this was not a bad loss by any means. And along the same lines, I can also see why it would concern some folks a little.

This team, just like the 2001-2002, must face the skepticism of it's recent past. And it wasn't until later in the year we knew for sure. Maybe this team can finish the year 15-5 in the ACC. Maybe they will be 10-10. Neither would surprise me. I guess whatever comes to pass, I'm going to try to enjoy it the best I can, just like we all enjoyed that very special 2001-2002 season.
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I see where you are going with this but there is was one HUGE difference. Back then we had BK leading the team instead of Nelly. And we had a much better coaching staff. But I think your post brings up some interesting thoughts.
 
One other noticeable thing to me in this game, and this isn’t a negative for the Panthers, was there were two, maybe three, loose balls that we came up with. 50/50 type balls. And it was late in the shot clock both times and both times we grabbed it but because of the nature of these loose balls clemson had leaked out and we wound up with wide open 3’s. One for Elliott and one for someone else. Might’ve been both Elliott. Can’t remember.

My point in saying this is that there was luck in creating those wide open opportunities and yes we created our own luck in that. But without those 2 50/50 wins and subsequent 3 pointers we are talking about a 7 point or possibly more had Clemson converted the leak outs on the other end.

And the larger point of saying THAT is that the past 4 teams wouldn’t have won those 50/50 balls and had they they wouldn’t have converted.

So while they didn’t win, and I’m certainly not a silver lining guy in a loss, I appreciate the efforts and think those plays are winning plays moving forward.
 
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DT_PITT said:
I regret that my original post devolved into a a threadful of bickering.

But allow me to offer the following parallel as a reason for hope, if not just perspective.

In 2001-2002, the Panthers were starting to look pretty good around the Holidays. They went on the road and defeated a tournament team in Ohio State. But earlier, we had kind of a meh loss to the Seth Greenburg led South Florida team up at the Sewall Center.

Still, the Panthers started off the Big East season 3-0, including a road win against the previous year's Big East Champ Boston College. We had just cracked the Top 25.

Then they came home to play a decent, but not Elite ND team. I recall Zavackas hitting a three to put the Panthers up five with around 2:30 minutes to go. But ND scored the last 8 points of the game to sink the Panthers.

Our loss to Clemson yesterday reminds me a great deal of the ND loss. After the game, there was still a great deal of doubt as to whether the team was actually for real. It didn't help that we lost our next game at Miami in OT. We also got pretty well pummeled during our return trip to ND. Our record slid to 6-3 in the Big East and while we knew our team was decent, we still didn't know exactly what we had.

The true greatness of that team really started to show through a couple weeks later when we went up to the Dome were we faced a 14 point deficit several minutes into the 2nd half. But we snapped out of it was ended up blowing them out. This win catapulted us well back into the top 25 and we all know where it went from there, including a 13-3 Big East record.

Personally, I think we have a pretty good Pitt team this year, and I think Clemson was a pretty good opponent. It's easy to see why many are saying this was not a bad loss by any means. And along the same lines, I can also see why it would concern some folks a little.

This team, just like the 2001-2002, must face the skepticism of it's recent past. And it wasn't until later in the year we knew for sure. Maybe this team can finish the year 15-5 in the ACC. Maybe they will be 10-10. Neither would surprise me. I guess whatever comes to pass, I'm going to try to enjoy it the best I can, just like we all enjoyed that very special 2001-2002 season.
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How do remember this stuff !
 
rockypanther said:
I see where you are going with this but there is was one HUGE difference. Back then we had BK leading the team instead of Nelly. And we had a much better coaching staff. But I think your post brings up some interesting thoughts.
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There were LOTS of differences indeed. Nor am I saying that I think we will be a top 10 team this year at all. But I should also add that it wasn't until late in 2001-2002 the season that I was finally convinced that was a legit 3 seed type of team.
 
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DT_PITT said:
There were LOTS of differences indeed. Nor am I saying that I think we will be a top 10 team this year at all. But I should also add that it wasn't until late in 2001-2002 the season that I was finally convinced that was a legit 3 seed type of team.
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Gotcha. I loved that team and season. Even more than the 88-89 team.
 
Duneaux Harm said:
Good God. Please stop the nonsense. We are now in the phase of extolling the virtues of the opponent we just lost to so that we can feel better about who we are and still firmly hang on to the beliefs we had last week. I tell you what. I will bet you a thousand dollars. You get Clemson to win the ACC and I get the rest of the ACC field. How about it?
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DT_PITT said:
I regret that my original post devolved into a a threadful of bickering.

But allow me to offer the following parallel as a reason for hope, if not just perspective.

In 2001-2002, the Panthers were starting to look pretty good around the Holidays. They went on the road and defeated a tournament team in Ohio State. But earlier, we had kind of a meh loss to the Seth Greenburg led South Florida team up at the Sewall Center.

Still, the Panthers started off the Big East season 3-0, including a road win against the previous year's Big East Champ Boston College. We had just cracked the Top 25.

Then they came home to play a decent, but not Elite ND team. I recall Zavackas hitting a three to put the Panthers up five with around 2:30 minutes to go. But ND scored the last 8 points of the game to sink the Panthers.

Our loss to Clemson yesterday reminds me a great deal of the ND loss. After the game, there was still a great deal of doubt as to whether the team was actually for real. It didn't help that we lost our next game at Miami in OT. We also got pretty well pummeled during our return trip to ND. Our record slid to 6-3 in the Big East and while we knew our team was decent, we still didn't know exactly what we had.

The true greatness of that team really started to show through a couple weeks later when we went up to the Dome were we faced a 14 point deficit several minutes into the 2nd half. But we snapped out of it was ended up blowing them out. This win catapulted us well back into the top 25 and we all know where it went from there, including a 13-3 Big East record.

Personally, I think we have a pretty good Pitt team this year, and I think Clemson was a pretty good opponent. It's easy to see why many are saying this was not a bad loss by any means. And along the same lines, I can also see why it would concern some folks a little.

This team, just like the 2001-2002, must face the skepticism of it's recent past. And it wasn't until later in the year we knew for sure. Maybe this team can finish the year 15-5 in the ACC. Maybe they will be 10-10. Neither would surprise me. I guess whatever comes to pass, I'm going to try to enjoy it the best I can, just like we all enjoyed that very special 2001-2002 season.
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DT. Thank you. I remember listening to Zavackas on the post game after the Ohio State game thinking we had something. I was shocked we beat them at their place. The rest is history. This team reminds me a lot of that team grittiness wise. Let's get back to our winning ways Wednesday. I'm heading over to my buddy's house to watch the Duke game. Haven't done that in nearly a decade. Hail to Pitt. Go Panthers.
 
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Duneaux Harm said:
Don’t be a dick. Either the loss to clemson was an amazing effort by Pitt since Clemson is clearly winning National Championship or us losing to Duke was a huge costly performance. You can’t have it both ways youngster.
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Actually, both were unacceptable. Anything less than going 40-0 with this group by Capel and he should be fired.

You are the one who ridiculously posted Clemson wasn’t good enough to win the ACC, not me ya dingus.
 
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BballinsiderfromPitt said:
Actually, both were unacceptable. Anything less than going 40-0 with this group by Capel and he should be fired.

You are the one who ridiculously posted Clemson wasn’t good enough to win the ACC, not me ya dingus.
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They won’t win it. Still haven’t take me up on my thousand dollar bet.
 
pittjas said:
They are 7-0. Why is that crazy?
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Lots of games to go against lots of good to great teams. Can they win? Maybe. Are they likely to? I do not believe so and will gloat appropriately when they are out of the race.
 
Duneaux Harm said:
They won’t win the conference. Jesus. Please just stop.
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It's as if you don't understand that even if they don't win the conference they could still be pretty good.

I think this is the appropriate place, or, well, that probably would have been at least a couple days ago, but it still applies. Stop digging! You aren't making the hole smaller!
 
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Why don't they just throw out the NET garbage along with all of the metrics they used to seed this tournament? Boy, did they get this wrong! I could see an FAU or Princeton winning the whole thing. But more probable is a Miami. That's why the NCAA Tournament, at least for now, is the best sporting event in sports.
 
HailToPitt1985 said:
Why don't they just throw out the NET garbage along with all of the metrics they used to seed this tournament? Boy, did they get this wrong! I could see an FAU or Princeton winning the whole thing. But more probable is a Miami. That's why the NCAA Tournament, at least for now, is the best sporting event in sports.
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Isn’t it amazing Princeton, a school where all the players are actual students competed so well .

I‘m 10 minutes away from FAU , next yr I guess I should take in a few games ! Wonder where their coach ends up going .
 
Fsgolfdr said:
Isn’t it amazing Princeton, a school where all the players are actual students competed so well .

I‘m 10 minutes away from FAU , next yr I guess I should take in a few games ! Wonder where their coach ends up going .
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It can be done. It takes some effort and smarts. And coaching. But now everyone wants to take the easy way and short cuts.

It would be interesting to know how many of the Princeton kids are from the portal. I would say with almost 100% certainty that none of them are. I don't know though because I didn't look it up.

I'm rooting for FAU now. I hope they win it all. If I were you, I'd try to watch some of their games in person, if you're that close. Very entertaining.
 
HailToPitt1985 said:
It can be done. It takes some effort and smarts. And coaching. But now everyone wants to take the easy way and short cuts.

It would be interesting to know how many of the Princeton kids are from the portal. I would say with almost 100% certainty that none of them are. I don't know though because I didn't look it up.

I'm rooting for FAU now. I hope they win it all. If I were you, I'd try to watch some of their games in person, if you're that close. Very entertaining.
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I’ve really only rooted for Pitt , but I think I’m going to adopt FAU . Go Owls !
 
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