ADVERTISEMENT

I will leave this here....

Doesn’t seem to me that the ownership and staff are content with it. That's why they drafted Kenny Pickett. That’s also why they dumped Kenny Pickett and brought in Russell Wilson and Justin Fields. Why they finally dumped Canada and brought in Smith. Why they brought in the guy from Philly to serve as assistant GM (or whatever title he has) and to spearhead their draft strategy to build offensive and defensive lines like in Philly, etc.

Again, a lot of things to complain about with the Steelers, the moves they’ve made with staff hires and player acquisitions haven’t elevated them from a little better than average to elite. But it is inaccurate to say they haven’t tried and are satisfied with mediocre.
Content and satisfied with mediocrity is the epitome of what the Steelers have become. The fact that they even "promoted" Canada without a legitimate search was the laziest thing an NFL team could do. Dumping Kenny Pickett wasn't any sort of genius move. They dumped a young QB that they buried on the depth chart from the day they started drills and replaced him with an aging QB that was run out of town in Denver and a young QB that was run out of Chicago. Add in Rudolph's exploits and you had four guys that have pretty much all performed the same because the offensive philosophy is archaic and there is almost no talent around them. The best receiver is a TE who can't block, the OL has somehow regressed, and the RB you didn't need (but I guess they are brilliantly moving on from) never amounted to anything. Oh, and the one guy that can run the ball and inject a little bit of playmaking into the offense regularly gets benched in pivotal situations. It's tired and the whole thing only works well enough to be just okay enough that they can scapegoat their way out of a fan uprising every year. Will be Pickens this year. Kenny last year. Was the Center the year before that. Juju before that. Claypool. So on and so forth. All we get is gibberish and nonsense and the local media gushes over the ringleader without any critical evaluation of what's actually wrong. So yeah, content is probably pretty accurate because they just keep doing the same thing and seem genuinely surprised it isn't working.
 
I would like to see the Steelers trade Watt and commit to a 3-year rebuild. Ain't happening under Tomlin, though.

But if you trade/get rid of Watt, Minkah, Pickens, Heyward, etc. you're setting yourself up to have a bad team (i.e. a couple high draft picks), BUT you're also building a solid foundation in that you're letting Jones, Frazier, Fautanu, Benton, etc. gain valuable experience.

It's all about the lines, man. Then you can add your QB - preferably via the draft - in 2026 or 2027, plug in a few other positions (WR, CB, edge, etc.), and you're ready to go.
Yep. You have to start rebuilding at some point. Your best defensive players are older. They have begun rebuilding the O-line. They have drafted 2 left tackles in the 1st round the last 2 years and yet amazingly this staff refuses to play them there. Instead, they stick with an unimpressive Dan Moore. I mean, this staff is just an enigma. I can't figure out what they are trying to do.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: pittbb80
I would like to see the Steelers trade Watt and commit to a 3-year rebuild. Ain't happening under Tomlin, though.

But if you trade/get rid of Watt, Minkah, Pickens, Heyward, etc. you're setting yourself up to have a bad team (i.e. a couple high draft picks), BUT you're also building a solid foundation in that you're letting Jones, Frazier, Fautanu, Benton, etc. gain valuable experience.

It's all about the lines, man. Then you can add your QB - preferably via the draft - in 2026 or 2027, plug in a few other positions (WR, CB, edge, etc.), and you're ready to go.
I would trade Watt in a heartbeat. I know it's a capital crime to say in Pittsburgh but the better teams have figured out how to neutralize him enough that he's not an overwhelming factor in big games. Should have been evident when Cleveland figured out how to slow him down a few years ago. He'll still look dominate enough in a dozen games every year to get the accolades. Other than one big play in last year's game against the Bills, hasn't exactly taken over any playoff games either. You'd get good value from a team looking to make a splash but he's a luxury they can't afford with so many other holes that need filled.
 
Content and satisfied with mediocrity is the epitome of what the Steelers have become. The fact that they even "promoted" Canada without a legitimate search was the laziest thing an NFL team could do. Dumping Kenny Pickett wasn't any sort of genius move. They dumped a young QB that they buried on the depth chart from the day they started drills and replaced him with an aging QB that was run out of town in Denver and a young QB that was run out of Chicago. Add in Rudolph's exploits and you had four guys that have pretty much all performed the same because the offensive philosophy is archaic and there is almost no talent around them. The best receiver is a TE who can't block, the OL has somehow regressed, and the RB you didn't need (but I guess they are brilliantly moving on from) never amounted to anything. Oh, and the one guy that can run the ball and inject a little bit of playmaking into the offense regularly gets benched in pivotal situations. It's tired and the whole thing only works well enough to be just okay enough that they can scapegoat their way out of a fan uprising every year. Will be Pickens this year. Kenny last year. Was the Center the year before that. Juju before that. Claypool. So on and so forth. All we get is gibberish and nonsense and the local media gushes over the ringleader without any critical evaluation of what's actually wrong. So yeah, content is probably pretty accurate because they just keep doing the same thing and seem genuinely surprised it isn't working.
Speaking of the RB that regularly gets benched in pivotal situations, was he hurt or banged up at the end of the Bengals game? I never heard that he was and if he wasn’t, then it was inexcusable that they had Patterson in instead of him on that last offensive series.

And of course, our great OC had to throw in the obligatory handoff to Patterson for no gain that contributed to that failed series.
 
Yep. You have to start rebuilding at some point. Your best defensive players are older. They have begun rebuilding the O-line. They have drafted 2 left tackles in the 1st round the last 2 years and yet amazingly this staff refuses to play them there. Instead, they stick with an unimpressive Dan Moore. I mean, this staff is just is just an enigma. I can't figure out what they are trying to do.
Dan Moore would have obviously played a lot less this year if their 1st round draft choice wouldn’t have got lost for the full year. He would still have played some though because the prior year’s 1st round draft choice hasn't exactly been setting the world afire with his play.
 
Speaking of the RB that regularly gets benched in pivotal situations, was he hurt or banged up at the end of the Bengals game? I never heard that he was and if he wasn’t, then it was inexcusable that they had Patterson in instead of him on that last offensive series.

And of course, our great OC had to throw in the obligatory handoff to Patterson for no gain that contributed to that failed series.
I believe Harris was being evaluated for a concussion.
 
Maybe they have. The point is, they have been making mistake after mistake in the draft, and the Minkah trade was also a mistake. They are making these mistakes because of their philosophy. They want defense and a running game. This staff is stubborn as hell, they don't want to change. How about hiring an OC who doesn't want to play 1970's football and then draft accordingly. If Tomlin doesn't want to do that, he needs to go.
There’s one thing we can agree on, their OC hire was definitely underwhelming.

Can’t agree with you so much on the ‘mistake after mistake in the draft’. I think their last few drafts have been pretty good for where they’ve been drafting.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Fk_Pitt and Burgh15
There’s one thing we can agree on, their OC hire was definitely underwhelming.

Can’t agree with you so much on the ‘mistake after mistake in the draft’. I think their last few drafts have been pretty good for where they’ve been drafting.
Their drafts have been uninspiring. I know it takes time, but, I'd like to see some improvement. Broderick Jones hasn't been great, but OK of late. Joey Porter, has been decent when not being called for a penalty. Keannu Benton has been solid. Mount Washington is a good blocker. Herbig has made some nice plays and looks solid. That is 2023. Fautanu missed the season. Zach Frazier looks solid at center. Roman Wilson we hardly know ya. Peyton Wilson looks OK. Mccormick played decent. That is 2024. It may not have been fair to call most of these guys mistakes, but, are they difference makers?? Maybe on a team with a good staff they might look better. I'll give you that the offensive line could be good in 2 or 3 years. As I have said in a previous post, where are the offensive game changers?? What is the qb plan?? Drafts such as these set you up for more mediocrity.

Please find a receiver with a brain who can be coached and put the team first. Guys like Chase, Jefferson, and St. Brown are all team first guys who run their routes hard even when they know the ball isn't coming their way. Somehow Tomlin drafts these headless idiots year after year. Ofcourse, drafting 20th or worse, would not allow one to draft players like I listed above.
 
I would trade Watt in a heartbeat. I know it's a capital crime to say in Pittsburgh but the better teams have figured out how to neutralize him enough that he's not an overwhelming factor in big games. Should have been evident when Cleveland figured out how to slow him down a few years ago. He'll still look dominate enough in a dozen games every year to get the accolades. Other than one big play in last year's game against the Bills, hasn't exactly taken over any playoff games either. You'd get good value from a team looking to make a splash but he's a luxury they can't afford with so many other holes that need filled.
Plus he is going to start breaking down. Man if you can get a 1st and 2nd or 1st and 3rd, I would trade him like tomorrow.
 
I would like to see the Steelers trade Watt and commit to a 3-year rebuild. Ain't happening under Tomlin, though.

But if you trade/get rid of Watt, Minkah, Pickens, Heyward, etc. you're setting yourself up to have a bad team (i.e. a couple high draft picks), BUT you're also building a solid foundation in that you're letting Jones, Frazier, Fautanu, Benton, etc. gain valuable experience.

It's all about the lines, man. Then you can add your QB - preferably via the draft - in 2026 or 2027, plug in a few other positions (WR, CB, edge, etc.), and you're ready to go.
Are you Ben Cherington? What NFL team has ever traded its better players to start a rebuild? Can you cite any successful examples of this ever happening?
 
  • Haha
Reactions: FireballZ
Plus he is going to start breaking down. Man if you can get a 1st and 2nd or 1st and 3rd, I would trade him like tomorrow.

Are you Ben Cherington? What NFL team has ever traded its better players to start a rebuild? Can you cite any successful examples of this ever happening?
Cowher used to let guys go all the time that hit their pinnacle but still had mileage left in the tank - Rod Woodson, Chad Brown, Carlos Emmons, Mike Vrabel, Joey Porter, Levon Kirkland, Eric Green, Leon Searcy, Kevin Greene, Carnell Lake, Brenston Buckner, Yancey Thigpen, etc.. I'm not sure they were ever in "rebuild" mode but that's probably because Cowher/Donahoe/Colbert did a good job of stockpiling depth.
 
The staff's vision is still to run the ball and play good defense. It is an outdated philosophy. The teams that are challenging for the superbowl all can score. Look at Jamyrr Gibbs vs. Najee Harris. This is the most obvious example of where the Steelers are making a mistake. Harris was a 1st round pick who is a strong back but also a plodder who can't break off a big run. Gibbs, on the other hand, is a good runner, great pass catcher and a threat to take it to the house any time he touches it. Gibbs gives you explosive plays. Najee gives you 2 and 3 yard gains. If the Steelers want to compete with the big boys, their philosophy must change. You only get one 1st round pick a year, you have to get great players.
Remember that when David Montgomery is healthy as he was until last week, Gibbs splits equally with him. And Monty is a hammer.

The Lions got this party started by trading Stafford and a draft picks for Goff and a couple of Rams 1st round picks. When Brad Holmes came in as GM in 2021 he had one first round pick-and it round wasn’t sexy-he took the best tackle prospect in the draft, now one of the best if not the best OTs in the NFL. He went to work immediately to build both lines, and it all starts wit that. Holmes has been masterful in trades, accumulating draft picks and maximizing the players he gets with those picks, and free agency. He traded DeAndre Swift, talented the soft and always injured, for Monty who is one of the best between the tackles, downhill leverage runners in the league. It took a guy with a clear vision to turn around the saddest sack franchise in pro sports, and that’s what Holmes did.
 
  • Like
Reactions: lilspainishflea
Cowher used to let guys go all the time that hit their pinnacle but still had mileage left in the tank - Rod Woodson, Chad Brown, Carlos Emmons, Mike Vrabel, Joey Porter, Levon Kirkland, Eric Green, Leon Searcy, Kevin Greene, Carnell Lake, Brenston Buckner, Yancey Thigpen, etc.. I'm not sure they were ever in "rebuild" mode but that's probably because Cowher/Donahoe/Colbert did a good job of stockpiling depth.
There is a big difference between trading these players as everyone is campaigning for as opposed to letting them walk in free agency which I think is every example you listed.
 
Are you Ben Cherington? What NFL team has ever traded its better players to start a rebuild? Can you cite any successful examples of this ever happening?

Uh, are you kidding me? It literally happens every season in every sport. Khalil Mack, a decent comp point for TJ Watt, was traded from the Raiders to the Bears for two first-round picks. Then he was traded from the Bears to the Chargers a few seasons later.
 
  • Like
Reactions: pittdan77
Uh, are you kidding me? It literally happens every season in every sport.
It happens all the time in MLB, how often does it happen in the NFL? The few tines I can think of it happening, it wasn’t because of a team wanting to go into rebuild mode. Best example offf the top of my head is Tyreek Hill from Chiefs to Dolphins.
 
My problem is that the way the NFL is structured is you need to take your lumps to get better. You can't finish in the middle of the pack every year and get difference makers with late 1st round picks. We had to suck to get big Ben all those years ago. Mediocrity in the NFL breeds more mediocrity. Watching the lions tonight, they have 7 1st round picks on their offense. That is why they are almost unstoppable. The Lions sucked forever, but got the right coach and made some great picks.
What we have going on in Pittsburgh needs to be ended now! This will soon be a decade of underperforming antiquated football philosophy with absolutely no signs of any improvement. Just run the ball and play great D. It can work with elite coaches and players. We have neither. Time to hit the reset button.
It’s also noteworthy that of that former 7 first rounders on the Lions O, 4 of them are OLs and 3 of those were originally Lions draft picks. The best WR, St Brown was a Lions 4th rounder, star TE LaPorta was a Lions 3rd rounder, starting G Glasgow was a Lions 3rd rounder. Montgomery was a brilliant pickup from the Bears, Goff was a castoff from the Rams. One team’s trash is another team’s treasure.

It has been a clinic in roster building, and Ben Johnson is the best OC in the NFL.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Pittisit4me
It’s also noteworthy that of that former 7 first rounders on the Lions O, 4 of them are OLs and 3 of those were originally Lions draft picks. The best WR, St Brown was a Lions 4th rounder, star TE LaPorta was a Lions 3rd rounder, starting G Glasgow was a Lions 3rd rounder. Montgomery was a brilliant pickup from the Bears, Goff was a castoff from the Rams. One team’s trash is another team’s treasure.

It has been a clinic in roster building, and Ben Johnson is the best OC in the NFL.

It's clear as day that sinking a ton of resources into your offensive line is the best investment a team can make. That's why I think the Steelers are finally doing it right (but they'd still need Jones and Fautanu to pan out). Good QBs look bad behind bad offensive lines. Mid QBs look good behind great offensive lines. Obviously ones like Allen defy any of that and will succeed in spite of a bad line, but if you put Goff, Hurts, Darnold on the Steelers next season... good luck.

Still don't think Watt fits this timeline, though, so they can win a few more games with him and not be a serious championship contender or expedite the modest rebuild by turning him into a few draft picks.

I've posted on here the amount of top 3 round draft picks the Steelers devoted to their o-line from '92 to '12 vs '13 to '21, and it jives quite well with this logic.
 
It happens all the time in MLB, how often does it happen in the NFL? The few tines I can think of it happening, it wasn’t because of a team wanting to go into rebuild mode. Best example offf the top of my head is Tyreek Hill from Chiefs to Dolphins.

I mean, Joe Montana was traded for a 1st round pick. Randy Moss was traded to the Patriots. Marshall Faulk. Bettis. Eric Dickerson. Even at the deadlines you see some pretty decent names move, such as Lattimore (can't tell me the Saints aren't rebuilding). Hopkins (maybe not great anymore, but one of Tennessee's better players), Cooper, Adams, etc.
 
  • Like
Reactions: pittdan77
It happens all the time in MLB, how often does it happen in the NFL? The few tines I can think of it happening, it wasn’t because of a team wanting to go into rebuild mode. Best example offf the top of my head is Tyreek Hill from Chiefs to Dolphins.
Stafford to Rams for Goff and draft picks. Rams got an immediate Super Bowl out of it and Lions drafted 3 young superstars, and gave Goff a chance to be reborn as a player. And all it really took was a coach who expressed unwavering belief in him. Confidence was the missing ingredient.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JohnnyGossamer
Their drafts have been uninspiring. I know it takes time, but, I'd like to see some improvement. Broderick Jones hasn't been great, but OK of late. Joey Porter, has been decent when not being called for a penalty. Keannu Benton has been solid. Mount Washington is a good blocker. Herbig has made some nice plays and looks solid. That is 2023. Fautanu missed the season. Zach Frazier looks solid at center. Roman Wilson we hardly know ya. Peyton Wilson looks OK. Mccormick played decent. That is 2024. It may not have been fair to call most of these guys mistakes, but, are they difference makers?? Maybe on a team with a good staff they might look better. I'll give you that the offensive line could be good in 2 or 3 years. As I have said in a previous post, where are the offensive game changers?? What is the qb plan?? Drafts such as these set you up for more mediocrity.

Please find a receiver with a brain who can be coached and put the team first. Guys like Chase, Jefferson, and St. Brown are all team first guys who run their routes hard even when they know the ball isn't coming their way. Somehow Tomlin drafts these headless idiots year after year. Ofcourse, drafting 20th or worse, would not allow one to draft players like I listed above.
Seriously. Pickens is closer to a #3 than a #1. He’s the Farmer Ted of the receiver room. That WR room is just as responsible for the lack of offense as the OL, OC’s and QBs.

sixteen candles GIF
 
Uh, are you kidding me? It literally happens every season in every sport. Khalil Mack, a decent comp point for TJ Watt, was traded from the Raiders to the Bears for two first-round picks. Then he was traded from the Bears to the Chargers a few seasons later.
how did those raider and Bear rebuilds work out?
 
Are you Ben Cherington? What NFL team has ever traded its better players to start a rebuild? Can you cite any successful examples of this ever happening?
Aging stars get traded all the time. This team isn’t close. Getting beat by 35 in every playoff game is an indicator of such. We are 5 years down the road of when the last rebuild should have happened. And we are further away than ever.
 
  • Like
Reactions: lilspainishflea
I mean, Joe Montana was traded for a 1st round pick. Randy Moss was traded to the Patriots. Marshall Faulk. Bettis. Eric Dickerson. Even at the deadlines you see some pretty decent names move, such as Lattimore (can't tell me the Saints aren't rebuilding). Hopkins (maybe not great anymore, but one of Tennessee's better players), Cooper, Adams, etc.
The patriots were notorious for moving on from star vets before their marketability dropped.
 
He’s definitely trade bait with 1 more year on his deal .
I’d love to move him (highsmith , Herbig , and the GB guy are plenty good enough )
Minkah the season after .
Love your thought process. But why not Minkah now? What’s his cap hit next year ?
 
Drafting matters. Getting the right free agents matters. Tomlin’s drafting has been anywhere from mediocre to terrible. It can’t be excused by drafting low in the first round either. The Ravens have 9 players in the Pro Bowl and most of them were not first round draft choices. Jackson was the last pick in the first round.

The Ravens got Henry in free agency. The Steelers got Queen, who has vacillated between average and terrible when not injured. Broderick Jones is still a below average OT. I don’t think there is an OL on the roster who will ever be an All Pro Frazier might be pretty good but the Ravens drafted an all-pro C with the 25th pick. Joey Porter is decent but with two years in the league is nowhere near outstanding. We won’t even talk about Tomlin’s WR drafting. The Steelers’ WR corps has to be the worst in the league. I don’t think any of them would start at Ohio State.

Tomlin is an above average game coach but a significantly below average talent evaluator. His selection of assistants is also below average. The Steelers are limited to seasons like these past 8 as long as he remains.
 
Drafting matters. Getting the right free agents matters. Tomlin’s drafting has been anywhere from mediocre to terrible. It can’t be excused by drafting low in the first round either. The Ravens have 9 players in the Pro Bowl and most of them were not first round draft choices. Jackson was the last pick in the first round.

The Ravens got Henry in free agency. The Steelers got Queen, who has vacillated between average and terrible when not injured. Broderick Jones is still a below average OT. I don’t think there is an OL on the roster who will ever be an All Pro Frazier might be pretty good but the Ravens drafted an all-pro C with the 25th pick. Joey Porter is decent but with two years in the league is nowhere near outstanding. We won’t even talk about Tomlin’s WR drafting. The Steelers’ WR corps has to be the worst in the league. I don’t think any of them would start at Ohio State.

Tomlin is an above average game coach but a significantly below average talent evaluator. His selection of assistants is also below average. The Steelers are limited to seasons like these past 8 as long as he remains.
Good post Mike. I pretty much agree with it. Lots of food nuggets. But I don’t see how Tomlin is a pretty good game coach. He and Narduzzi are pretty similar in that regard.
 
Drafting matters. Getting the right free agents matters. Tomlin’s drafting has been anywhere from mediocre to terrible. It can’t be excused by drafting low in the first round either. The Ravens have 9 players in the Pro Bowl and most of them were not first round draft choices. Jackson was the last pick in the first round.

The Ravens got Henry in free agency. The Steelers got Queen, who has vacillated between average and terrible when not injured. Broderick Jones is still a below average OT. I don’t think there is an OL on the roster who will ever be an All Pro Frazier might be pretty good but the Ravens drafted an all-pro C with the 25th pick. Joey Porter is decent but with two years in the league is nowhere near outstanding. We won’t even talk about Tomlin’s WR drafting. The Steelers’ WR corps has to be the worst in the league. I don’t think any of them would start at Ohio State.

Tomlin is an above average game coach but a significantly below average talent evaluator. His selection of assistants is also below average. The Steelers are limited to seasons like these past 8 as long as he remains.
And to add to your post Mike - Tomlin is almost void of player development.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mike412
Good post Mike. I pretty much agree with it. Lots of food nuggets. But I don’t see how Tomlin is a pretty good game coach. He and Narduzzi are pretty similar in that regard.
In the current NFL being a better than average game day coach is a pretty low bar. There are about 10 good ones, a few in a second category where I would put Tomlin, and about 8-10 really bad ones.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Fk_Pitt
In the current NFL being a better than average game day coach is a pretty low bar. There are about 10 good ones, a few in a second category where I would put Tomlin, and about 8-10 really bad ones.
I remember about a year ago I saw some statistics regarding all NFL coaches and how they rank and compare on challenges and time management. And Mike was in the bottom half of the league in both categories.

But…

They’re all worse than one would think and the difference between Tomlin and a top half of the league guys looked to be negligible to me.

So I think because we watch him every week, we see all of his blunders and they stay in the forefront of our minds. He’s not as bad as he appears.

But compared to his peers, he still is bottom half FWIW.

And worth noting that I believe that just about every other team has a specialist designated in the booth that’s supposed to help their HCs with such decisions. And Rooney doesn’t employee one. Whether that’s Fredo’s decision or Tomlin’s decision, who knows. But Fredo is the boss so…
 
The decade of 2010-19 the Steelers drafted the 6th most (different) players to make a Pro Bowl and had the 7th highest success rate.

I don't know if that's the best barometer, though. Najee has made a Pro Bowl, and that pick still sucked. Then you have some weird ones like Miles Killebrew, Rosie Nix, etc. Not saying they were drafted or fit the criteria of what you were talking about; just saying there are weird Pro Bowl choices at times. Especially now that a bunch of people opt out.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 303vND and Fk_Pitt
ADVERTISEMENT

Latest posts

ADVERTISEMENT