I'm surprised by the apparent lack of 'BB' fans on here??

[NCanton Panther]

Very long thread on the board currently debating our OOC schedule not unlike many others over the years. While it is a given that everyone on here is a diehard Pitt BB fan, I'm surprised from reading all of the posts that it is literally 'Pitt BB' where the interest may be and not a general or pure interest in BB, even from a number of posters that I generally inferred from their postings were not just Pitt BB fans but pure fans of BB or college BB.

We have many defending our traditionally weak OOC scheduling as a positive or good thing to get us an NCAA tourney bid. Yeah that may be a good thing although it definitely depends on the year as to whether it would help us into the field or put us on the outside looking in. And I'm with the group that feel we don't really deserve to be in the tourney or won't last long if we need to pile up a number of W's against cupcakes to make it.

What gets me the most though is all the claims of someone not being a true Pitt fan if they only show up for the marquee games or Pittsburgh not being a 'hoops' town because people will only come out for the marquee games. Maybe some people don't come out because they're fans of the competitive nature of the sport and many of these games just don't have it.

From my perspective, I go to Pitt FB and/or BB games first and foremost because I am a Pitt fan. But I'm also a pure fan of the sport and the competition that goes with it. For me, it doesn't need to be a 'marquee' team for me to have an interest in going to the game. But as a pure fan of the sport, I definitely have more interest in a going to a game that has a good chance of being a competitive contest. You can keep the long line of cupcake teams usually on the BB OOC home schedule. Nothing wrong with having a few, but being a fan of the sport, it sure would be nice having a few games against higher level competition to be able to enjoy the competitive nature of the sport.

 

[KiwiJeff]

I think you misunderstand the argument on OOC. We play a very competitive conference schedule. Our OOC is probably only 1 game, maybe 2, worse than most teams at our level. People keep comparing us to teams that I would not compare Pitt to, like UNC. We play UNC, Duke, SU and UL twice next year. To what end would it be necessary to add 3-4 difficult OOC games over the ones we already play? It's risky and self-defeating for no apparent purpose than to make it more fun for fans to go 1 or 2 more games OOC (unless it's opposite a Penguins game or if it's a road game). That's a pretty dull argument.

 

[Pittbaseball11]

Pitt needs to win and do what is best for Pitt. I literally do not care about entertainment value with Pitt, nor will Pitt adding a solid away game do anything for attendance.

Pitt's home schedule is similar to most P5 schools. It's not changing.

 

[Zaratoughda]

I think a few cupcake games at the beginning of the year is a good thing as it gives the players time to come together as a team.

But, the problem is, TEN of them is way too many.... and for those that go to the games (which I do not as it would be a 6-8 hour drive).. as well as those that watch the team on the tube (which I am one)... IMO we deserve better.

We aren't the only ones to have schedules like this... beating up on cupcakes... but the better programs all have much more demanding OOC schedules.

The good news.... is I expect this to change come next year.... this from Barnes' and Dixon's comments.

When Dixon was asked about it... he talked about the Gonzaga game and that was a major trip so his comment was that he felt we didn't need any home and homes because we had that. So, he was defending the schedule for THIS year.... but was leaving the door open for future years.

Barnes.... seems to have indicated he wants home and homes but that was a while ago and I am a bit foggy on that.

My expectation is come next year we will have two home and homes... one home and one away... then swapping the following year. I would like to see UConn and Temple... to bolster our visibility in the east... which USED TO BE where we got most of our players from.... but I would guess we would probably be seeing something like Cincinnatti and... who know who. Hopefully the games will be in December.

But, whatever. Time will tell.

Yeah, a home game against UConn in early December while the students are still around.... would really bring out the fans... because of the past rivalry.. and would be a great kickoff to the non-cupcake season.

 

[UPitt '89]

I think a few cupcake games at the beginning of the year is a good thing as it gives the players time to come together as a team.

But, the problem is, TEN of them is way too many.... and for those that go to the games (which I do not as it would be a 6-8 hour drive).. as well as those that watch the team on the tube (which I am one)... IMO we deserve better.

We aren't the only ones to have schedules like this... beating up on cupcakes... but the better programs all have much more demanding OOC schedules.

The good news.... is I expect this to change come next year.... this from Barnes' and Dixon's comments.

When Dixon was asked about it... he talked about the Gonzaga game and that was a major trip so his comment was that he felt we didn't need any home and homes because we had that. So, he was defending the schedule for THIS year.... but was leaving the door open for future years.

Barnes.... seems to have indicated he wants home and homes but that was a while ago and I am a bit foggy on that.

My expectation is come next year we will have two home and homes... one home and one away... then swapping the following year. I would like to see UConn and Temple... to bolster our visibility in the east... which USED TO BE where we got most of our players from.... but I would guess we would probably be seeing something like Cincinnatti and... who know who. Hopefully the games will be in December.

But, whatever. Time will tell.

Yeah, a home game against UConn in early December while the students are still around.... would really bring out the fans... because of the past rivalry.. and would be a great kickoff to the non-cupcake season.

The addition to the schedule will be a perpetual home-and-home with WVU. Both schools have already indicated that they want that. Barnes will work it so that the years we get the ACC-B1G challenge game at home, we'll play at WVU... and vice versa.

That will be the only major change to the OOC schedule... and that's fine.

 

[Pittbaseball11]

Based on what Dixon told Andy Katz a couple days ago, my guess is Pitt adds one home-and-home which will alternate with the B1G-ACC Challenge (i.e. Pitt is home in years where the B1G-ACC Challenge is the away). He said he would have added a road game this year at the expense of a home game if he could do it over again.

That would pretty much be on par with all but the most elite schools, who often get invited to play each other as part of events and showcases.

The alternative is that we put the home-and-home following the same pattern as the ACC-B1G Challenge game, which will lead to alternating years of "these guys suck!" and "OH MY GOD THESE GUYS GET IT!".

 

[Zaratoughda]

Pitt needs to win and do what is best for Pitt. I literally do not care about entertainment value with Pitt, nor will Pitt adding a solid away game do anything for attendance.

Pitt's home schedule is similar to most P5 schools. It's not changing.

If things turn out to be different... or even quite the opposite to what you are emphatically stating... I bet you won't be around wiping the egg off your face.

 

[Pittbaseball11]

If things turn out to be different... or even quite the opposite to what you are emphatically stating... I bet you won't be around wiping the egg off your face.

Fans are complaining about the home slate of OOC games. Pitt is saying they're happy playing their Tournament/Event games at neutral site, their assigned ACC-B1G game, their usual home slate, and really would only like to add a road game in a year like this.

So, Pitt will be upgrading the OOC slate but will not be addressing the core complaint. So, why would attendance increase? You're losing a home game, keeping a slate primarily of cupcakes aside from either your home-and-home or ACC-B1G game, and then you're in to ACC play.

What's different?

 

[Zaratoughda]

The addition to the schedule will be a perpetual home-and-home with WVU. Both schools have already indicated that they want that. Barnes will work it so that the years we get the ACC-B1G challenge game at home, we'll play at WVU... and vice versa.

That will be the only major change to the OOC schedule... and that's fine.

You may well be right but I don't see that buying us anything, while it buys WVU a lot. Right now our program is struggling while WVU is top 20... and they will probably lay it on us.... and we would be much better off playing UConn or Temple which would be more national (or regional) opponents.

But, again, you may well be right on this one.

Yeah... watch out for the flying garbage and coin throwing.

 

[KiwiJeff]

Funny how people count Oakland for MSU as an OK game, but count Kent St, Morehead St, Detroit and Duquesne as cupcakes. What's really the difference?

I guess the question is, who is a cupcake, and how many are ok? Also, is playing DePaul better than playing Morehead St? People are being very fast and loose with the term cupcake, without actually defining anything. Maybe we'd all agree if saw actual teams besides WVU, and how many cupcakes are "too many".

 

[Delpanther]

Fans are complaining about the home slate of OOC games. Pitt is saying they're happy playing their Tournament/Event games at neutral site, their assigned ACC-B1G game, their usual home slate, and really would only like to add a road game in a year like this.

So, Pitt will be upgrading the OOC slate but will not be addressing the core complaint. So, why would attendance increase? You're losing a home game, keeping a slate primarily of cupcakes aside from either your home-and-home or ACC-B1G game, and then you're in to ACC play.

What's different?

Dixon is saying that. Barnes isn't.

 

[NCanton Panther]

I think you misunderstand the argument on OOC. We play a very competitive conference schedule. Our OOC is probably only 1 game, maybe 2, worse than most teams at our level. People keep comparing us to teams that I would not compare Pitt to, like UNC. We play UNC, Duke, SU and UL twice next year. To what end would it be necessary to add 3-4 difficult OOC games over the ones we already play? It's risky and self-defeating for no apparent purpose than to make it more fun for fans to go 1 or 2 more games OOC (unless it's opposite a Penguins game or if it's a road game). That's a pretty dull argument.

Definitely not misunderstanding the argument at all. Your comment that we play a very competitive conference schedule is insignificant, so doe just about everyone else that is in a P5 conference. You can micro-analyze it from one year to another based on whichever conference is strong in a given year, but in the long run, there isn't much difference playing an ACC conference schedule vs a Big12 conference schedule vs a B10 conference schedule, etc etc. And I would disagree that our OOC schedule is very close to everyone else's. The fact that our OOC schedule seems to get spotlighted by the National talking heads every year says that isn't the case. And frankly, I don't really care what anyone else's OOC scheduling practice is. It doesn't have to be a major change in scheduling practice for 4 games, changing it for at least a couple games goes a long way to closing the gap between us and many others. As a few other replies have noted, adding WVU as a home n home opponent would go a long way in helping. Absolutely no reason why they shouldn't be on the schedule every year going forward.

I also don't agree with the argument that our OOC schedule this year is helping to get us into the tourney because of the W's. What is helping us into the tourney this year is our ACC conference performance. It's a good thing we beat Duke and beat Syracuse twice instead of splitting with them. Without those 2 W's we would likely be on or very close to the bubble and our OOC schedule would be doing nothing to swing the in/out vote in our direction.

 

[Piranha]

Minnesota, Oklahoma St, St Johns, Missouri, TCU, Rutgers, and DePaul all have a higher RPI than Kent St, Moorehead St, and Duquesne. Just because someone does not have a big name does not mean they are not a good team. If you are a fan of basketball and Pitt, then I do not understand why you would not attend the games.

 

[pittbb80]

There definitely is a delicate balance to scheduling the OOC in terms of getting wins, generating fan excitement to come out and support the team, and ensuring the schedule is strong enough to help the teams positioning come March. When the Team is near the top of the NCAA rankings like it was a few years back, the OOC isn't as big of a deal because demand to see the team play is high and fans will go to less attractive games just to see the product. However when the team is average to mediocre like its been, the Pete is going to be a ghost town like it has been for many of the games this year. People who poo poo the OOC schedule seem to forget that PItt is in the entertainment business and they are competing for a share of the entertainment dollar in the area. Better OOC games make the product more attractive.

I think most would agree that Pitt has erred on the side of scheduling less competitive teams. I don't think the OOC needs to be overhauled but adding a WVU and possibly a Georgetown, or a mid level SEC would be great.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

Pitt needs to win and do what is best for Pitt. I literally do not care about entertainment value with Pitt, nor will Pitt adding a solid away game do anything for attendance.

Pitt's home schedule is similar to most P5 schools. It's not changing.

Wrong again. Pitt, ND, and Duke are the only ACC schools who have not played a home and home series the last 2 seasons. 12 of the 15 did.

 

[Pittbaseball11]

Wrong again. Pitt, ND, and Duke are the only ACC schools who have not played a home and home series the last 2 seasons. 12 of the 15 did.

I said I would expect them to add a home and home to alternate with the B1G-ACC. The home slate portion of this year's schedule is comparable, though. If they add a home-and-home, it will be the same type of schedule going forward, just with one less home game. The lack of an away game is the odd part, not the home part.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

I said I would expect them to add a home and home to alternate with the B1G-ACC. The home slate portion of this year's schedule is comparable, though. If they add a home-and-home, it will be the same type of schedule going forward, just with one less home game. The lack of an away game is the odd part, not the home part.

OK but that road game turns into a marquee home game every other year. Dont play it at 9PM or during a Steeler or Penguin game and people will come.

 

[Pittbaseball11]

OK but that road game turns into a marquee home game every other year. Dont play it at 9PM or during a Steeler or Penguin game and people will come.

LOL, and we're right back to the qualifiers. Purdue is about as marquee as Pitt can hope to get for a home game in terms of opponent quality (Top 15ish) on a yearly basis and Pitt fans fell flat on their faces.

And yes, the home and home series turns into a home game, but the B1G-ACC Challenge turns into a road game. It's a net zero impact compared to what Pitt had as a home slate this year.

 

[DT_PITT]

The addition to the schedule will be a perpetual home-and-home with WVU. Both schools have already indicated that they want that. Barnes will work it so that the years we get the ACC-B1G challenge game at home, we'll play at WVU... and vice versa.

That will be the only major change to the OOC schedule... and that's fine.

Completely agree with all.

 

[DT_PITT]

I said I would expect them to add a home and home to alternate with the B1G-ACC. The home slate portion of this year's schedule is comparable, though. If they add a home-and-home, it will be the same type of schedule going forward, just with one less home game. The lack of an away game is the odd part, not the home part.

Completely agree.

 

[KiwiJeff]

Definitely not misunderstanding the argument at all. Your comment that we play a very competitive conference schedule is insignificant, so doe just about everyone else that is in a P5 conference. You can micro-analyze it from one year to another based on whichever conference is strong in a given year, but in the long run, there isn't much difference playing an ACC conference schedule vs a Big12 conference schedule vs a B10 conference schedule, etc etc. And I would disagree that our OOC schedule is very close to everyone else's. The fact that our OOC schedule seems to get spotlighted by the National talking heads every year says that isn't the case. And frankly, I don't really care what anyone else's OOC scheduling practice is. It doesn't have to be a major change in scheduling practice for 4 games, changing it for at least a couple games goes a long way to closing the gap between us and many others. As a few other replies have noted, adding WVU as a home n home opponent would go a long way in helping. Absolutely no reason why they shouldn't be on the schedule every year going forward.

I also don't agree with the argument that our OOC schedule this year is helping to get us into the tourney because of the W's. What is helping us into the tourney this year is our ACC conference performance. It's a good thing we beat Duke and beat Syracuse twice instead of splitting with them. Without those 2 W's we would likely be on or very close to the bubble and our OOC schedule would be doing nothing to swing the in/out vote in our direction.

How can you in the same paragraph say we don't need to make a major change, and that we are not close to everyone else? By definition, if it is only a minor change (like I have consistently said), doesn't that mean we are pretty close to everyone else?

Not sure I said OOC schedule is helping us get in. I am saying it isn't preventing us from getting in. Those are two different things.

 

[KiwiJeff]

LOL, and we're right back to the qualifiers. Purdue is about as marquee as Pitt can hope to get for a home game in terms of opponent quality (Top 15ish) on a yearly basis and Pitt fans fell flat on their faces.

And yes, the home and home series turns into a home game, but the B1G-ACC Challenge turns into a road game. It's a net zero impact compared to what Pitt had as a home slate this year.

Steak appetite on hamburger budget.

 

[Delpanther]

Minnesota, Oklahoma St, St Johns, Missouri, TCU, Rutgers, and DePaul all have a higher RPI than Kent St, Moorehead St, and Duquesne. Just because someone does not have a big name does not mean they are not a good team. If you are a fan of basketball and Pitt, then I do not understand why you would not attend the games.

You can be a fan and still want to see a competitive game. A little suspense as regards the outcome makes the event more enjoyable when your team prevails. Beating a noncompetitive team is a complete bore and proves nothing as regards the ability of your team. What's so hard to understand about that?

 

[Pittbaseball11]

Steak appetite on hamburger budget.

We're just fortunate to be fans of a program with the kind of pull that ESPN will move the ACC-B1G Challenge dates and shuffle around time slots to accommodate us so that we will not have conflicts with the Penguins and/or early bedtimes.

 

[KiwiJeff]

You can be a fan and still want to see a competitive game. A little suspense as regards the outcome makes the event more enjoyable when your team prevails. Beating a noncompetitive team is a complete bore and proves nothing as regards the ability of your team. What's so hard to understand about that?

I think that's the point. Kent State and Morehead State can be better than Missouri and Rutgers. The question is then, why do you prefer games against worse opponents?

 

[DC_Area_Panther]

I am fairly confidant that many Pitt basketball ticket holders would come out to see Pitt play a "FB Name" school from the very bottom of a P5 hoops conference rather than see Pitt play a stronger hoops opponent lacking FB name recognition.

 

[levance2]

Remember when Pitt was losing in the Sweet 16 every year and all Pitt fans wanted to talk about was how March was the "real season" and everything before that didn't matter? Now getting to March doesn't matter, and only who you play in November means anything.

 

[Sean Miller Fan]

LOL, and we're right back to the qualifiers. Purdue is about as marquee as Pitt can hope to get for a home game in terms of opponent quality (Top 15ish) on a yearly basis and Pitt fans fell flat on their faces.

And yes, the home and home series turns into a home game, but the B1G-ACC Challenge turns into a road game. It's a net zero impact compared to what Pitt had as a home slate this year.

Its not a net zero impact because you get a marquee home game every year instead of every other like the current setup is. As for the qualifiers, if the goal is to increase attendance, 9PM wont sell any tickets. If the goal is to improve resume/reputation/throw loyal season ticket holders a bone, start time doesnt matter much. Personally, I'd rather Pitt play VCU at 3AM than EWU at 7PM but I'm sure the 7PM EWU game would be much bettet attended. Then you'd say, "see, we scheduled VCU and only 400 people came, there's no point to this." Start times matter a lot.

 

[levance2]

We have many defending our traditionally weak OOC scheduling as a positive or good thing to get us an NCAA tourney bid. Yeah that may be a good thing although it definitely depends on the year as to whether it would help us into the field or put us on the outside looking in. And I'm with the group that feel we don't really deserve to be in the tourney or won't last long if we need to pile up a number of W's against cupcakes to make it.

This season, there will be teams that are in the NIT and better than teams that get at-large NCAA bids. They will be there because they couldn't win enough games, or couldn't win big enough games. As a huge CBB fan, March is the most exciting time of the year. The idea that Pitt would miss out on that, like they did last year, just because someone wants to watch 1-2 marginally more entertaining games in November astounds me.

 

[Swervin27]

Remember when Pitt was losing in the Sweet 16 every year and all Pitt fans wanted to talk about was how March was the "real season" and everything before that didn't matter? Now getting to March doesn't matter, and only who you play in November means anything.

you completely fail to either comprehend or listen to the opposing viewpoint.. It's not just about getting a number of wins to get into tourney, if it was, I'd be with you on scheduling these joke programs.. ONce again, for the 45th time, selection committee gives no credibility or merit to these wins.. Please understand this.. Going 1 and 1 against two good teams is better than going 2-0 against bad teams.. This isn't opinion, this is fact.. We all want to go to the tournament, that is everyone's goal.

 

[Pittbaseball11]

Its not a net zero impact because you get a marquee home game every year instead of every other like the current setup is. As for the qualifiers, if the goal is to increase attendance, 9PM wont sell any tickets. If the goal is to improve resume/reputation/throw loyal season ticket holders a bone, start time doesnt matter much. Personally, I'd rather Pitt play VCU at 3AM than EWU at 7PM but I'm sure the 7PM EWU game would be much bettet attended. Then you'd say, "see, we scheduled VCU and only 400 people came, there's no point to this." Start times matter a lot.

My entire argument here has been that using attendance as some sort of talking point when it comes to the OOC is abjectly stupid. Pitt fans aren't coming out unless conditions align.

Pitt can upgrade the OOC by adding the alternating home and home game with the ACC-B1G challenge (which I expect them to do), but that will do absolutely nothing for attendance because you'll just wind up with a slate of games identical to this one, minus a home game or 2 (depending on Tournament/Event).

Attendance is an irrelevant factor when discussing the OOC, just like the OOC is an irrelevant factor when discussing attendance.

Pitt's home schedule for the OOC this year wasn't different from the home portion of any other team's OOC, and it won't likely be different going forward. The difference between Pitt's OOC and other teams' OOC is the lack of a road game and whatever variations occur due to Tournament invites and Event participation.

 

[levance2]

ONce again, for the 45th time, selection committee gives no credibility or merit to these wins.. Please understand this.. Going 1 and 1 against two good teams is better than going 2-0 against bad teams.. This isn't opinion, this is fact..

I'm going to be really surprised next week when Pitt misses the tournament with their 10-9 record

Otherwise, the fact, not opinion, will be that the committee evaluates every game and considers us worthy of a bid.

 

[NTOP]

Definitely not misunderstanding the argument at all. Your comment that we play a very competitive conference schedule is insignificant, so doe just about everyone else that is in a P5 conference. You can micro-analyze it from one year to another based on whichever conference is strong in a given year, but in the long run, there isn't much difference playing an ACC conference schedule vs a Big12 conference schedule vs a B10 conference schedule, etc etc. And I would disagree that our OOC schedule is very close to everyone else's. The fact that our OOC schedule seems to get spotlighted by the National talking heads every year says that isn't the case. And frankly, I don't really care what anyone else's OOC scheduling practice is. It doesn't have to be a major change in scheduling practice for 4 games, changing it for at least a couple games goes a long way to closing the gap between us and many others. As a few other replies have noted, adding WVU as a home n home opponent would go a long way in helping. Absolutely no reason why they shouldn't be on the schedule every year going forward.

I also don't agree with the argument that our OOC schedule this year is helping to get us into the tourney because of the W's. What is helping us into the tourney this year is our ACC conference performance. It's a good thing we beat Duke and beat Syracuse twice instead of splitting with them. Without those 2 W's we would likely be on or very close to the bubble and our OOC schedule would be doing nothing to swing the in/out vote in our direction.

So, the fact that TV goofballs deride our schedule is because they THINK it's significantly worse than others, yet you dismiss the comparatives. I guess Doug Gottlieb gets it right. Was dropkicked when we joined the ACC. SP & Ollie wanted no parts of each other. The kind of treatment Pitt gets in Morgantown tells me to look elsewhere. Schedule a short-term series with them....and bail out if their thugs act up.

 

[Swervin27]

I'm going to be really surprised next week when Pitt misses the tournament with their 10-9 record

Otherwise, the fact, not opinion, will be that the committee evaluates every game and considers us worthy of a bid.

so you think that the committee will put us in the tourney because of our win against southern Arkansas and northern Washington?? You think this is what gets us in? 10-9 record? I don't even know what that means.. Do you mean our acc record? we are 9-7 with 2 games left, we play 18 conference games.. What does our conference record have to do with our argument about out of conference scheduling.. I am literally arguing with someone from a different planet who has never spent 1 day on earth..

 

[levance2]

I am literally arguing with someone from a different planet who has never spent 1 day on earth..

I'm beginning to think you don't know what the word "literally" means.

so you think that the committee will put us in the tourney because of our win against southern Arkansas and northern Washington?? You think this is what gets us in? 10-9 record? I don't even know what that means..

You said our OOC wins receive no consideration, which means Pitt's record is only 10-9. Most tournament teams have roughly 20 wins. It will be really hard to make it with only 10.

 

[NCanton Panther]

How can you in the same paragraph say we don't need to make a major change, and that we are not close to everyone else? By definition, if it is only a minor change (like I have consistently said), doesn't that mean we are pretty close to everyone else?

Not sure I said OOC schedule is helping us get in. I am saying it isn't preventing us from getting in. Those are two different things.

You and I are just disagreeing based on terminology. I think changing 2 games on the OOC schedule would have a big impact on the perception and the actual quality of the schedule while at the same time making it more appealing to someone that actually enjoys watching BB for the competitive nature of it and not just because it is Pitt.

My other comment regarding the cupcake wins allowing us to be able to make to tourney really wasn't directed to you, it is others that are claiming that is the case.

 

[KiwiJeff]

you completely fail to either comprehend or listen to the opposing viewpoint.. It's not just about getting a number of wins to get into tourney, if it was, I'd be with you on scheduling these joke programs.. ONce again, for the 45th time, selection committee gives no credibility or merit to these wins.. Please understand this.. Going 1 and 1 against two good teams is better than going 2-0 against bad teams.. This isn't opinion, this is fact.. We all want to go to the tournament, that is everyone's goal.

Apparently they do, you know, because we make the tourney and don't lose seed lines. Your argument is all wet.

 

[KiwiJeff]

You and I are just disagreeing based on terminology. I think changing 2 games on the OOC schedule would have a big impact on the perception and the actual quality of the schedule while at the same time making it more appealing to someone that actually enjoys watching BB for the competitive nature of it and not just because it is Pitt.

My other comment regarding the cupcake wins allowing us to be able to make to tourney really wasn't directed to you, it is others that are claiming that is the case.

Agreed, we are generally on the same page.

 

[KiwiJeff]

Remember when Pitt was losing in the Sweet 16 every year and all Pitt fans wanted to talk about was how March was the "real season" and everything before that didn't matter? Now getting to March doesn't matter, and only who you play in November means anything.

This is absolutely the post of the year so far.

 

[Swervin27]

This is absolutely the post of the year so far.

post of the year?? it's a straw man, not even top 5 in this thread.. he is saying people don't care about making tournament, something that has been said by no one.. ever..