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OT - PENS ........

Sid was horrible again. Rust had a goal but otherwise has been completely ineffective. Geno has come back to earth. If these guys ain't going, this team ain't.

It's going to be a long couple of years as they all play out their contracts and keep Mike Sullivan around.
 
Sid was horrible again. Rust had a goal but otherwise has been completely ineffective. Geno has come back to earth. If these guys ain't going, this team ain't.

It's going to be a long couple of years as they all play out their contracts and keep Mike Sullivan around.
Sadly they’ve become a boring team to watch. Theres very little energy on this team

You would think with how poorly they’ve played the past few seasons that they’d be hungry But sadly this team is going through the motions just like they have the past few years.

Dubas is going to go down with sully sid geno and tanger He’s hitched his wagon to the wrong horses
 
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Sadly they’ve become a boring team to watch. Theres very little energy on this team

You would think with how poorly they’ve played the past few seasons that they’d be hungry But sadly this team is going through the motions just like they have the past few years.

Dubas is going to go down with sully sid geno and tanger He’s hitched his wagon to the wrong horses
I am not sure he has as much as ownership has.
 
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They are worse than a bad team. They are bad with no future, at least for the foreseeable future. It is the inevitable tradeoff for keeping the gang all together and trying to win today. Which it is now tomorrow and they didn't win anymore. So with the bloated contracts and no movement clauses, they are stuck. The only move of any significance is likely firing Sullivan because right now, night after night is the skating definition of insanity. Expecting things to change without changing anything.

So yeah. Here we are. I have proposed bringing in a defense minded coach, even to the point of it pisses off some of the veterans, so be it, maybe then they would be more amenable in waiving their no movement clauses. This year's draft is "okay", but no franchise player. Plus with the lottery there are no guarantees. Next year you have a superstar at the top of the draft in Gavin McKenna. So who knows.......but this has happened to Detroit from all of their years of contending, now have struggled to even get back to the playoffs, Chicago, the same and now the Kings appear to be on their way back. But the Pens haven't reached their bottom....yet.
 
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They are worse than a bad team. They are bad with no future, at least for the foreseeable future. It is the inevitable tradeoff for keeping the gang all together and trying to win today. Which it is now tomorrow and they didn't win anymore. So with the bloated contracts and no movement clauses, they are stuck. The only move of any significance is likely firing Sullivan because right now, night after night is the skating definition of insanity. Expecting things to change without changing anything.

So yeah. Here we are. I have proposed bringing in a defense minded coach, even to the point of it pisses off some of the veterans, so be it, maybe then they would be more amenable in waiving their no movement clauses. This year's draft is "okay", but no franchise player. Plus with the lottery there are no guarantees. Next year you have a superstar at the top of the draft in Gavin McKenna. So who knows.......but this has happened to Detroit from all of their years of contending, now have struggled to even get back to the playoffs, Chicago, the same and now the Kings appear to be on their way back. But the Pens haven't reached their bottom....yet.
Great post. Would
Be best to tank this year and next to start the rebuilding process. Piss of the vets and trade. Sid.
 
As I predicted, Karlsson was a bad idea. Perhaps he’ll waive his no trade to chase a cup and do both groups a favor. Rakell is having a good season and could fetch a return if he wants to move on. Petersson is in his last year. Is there a point to re-signing a defenseman going into his 30s and costing a pretty penny when rebuilding? Rust is off to a bad start and is getting injured a lot. Eller is moveable. Graves is most definitely not. It would Take a lot to move Jarry. You’ll have to pay someone to take him.

Any answers for this part of the season?
No.

But these aren’t the showtime lakers. Runnin and gunning isn’t working.

Karlsson plays good defense about as often as the pirates play playoff games. He’s been truly awful this season. I really hope they can get him out of here.

Sullivan isn’t going anywhere, Fenway loves him. I wish they’d move on from him. I don’t think he’s fitting a system to his players. I don’t think he’s been getting all he can from his players.


And there we are.
 
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They need to just suck it up and trade Jarry while eating some of the money. I think he is a guy who possibly could benefit from a change of scenery. I mean what a terrible contract. I know Dubas signed off on it, but all signs pointed to Sullivan having a big say in him coming back.

What a freefall the flightless are in right now.
 
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As I predicted, Karlsson was a bad idea. Perhaps he’ll waive his no trade to chase a cup and do both groups a favor. Rakell is having a good season and could fetch a return if he wants to move on. Petersson is in his last year. Is there a point to re-signing a defenseman going into his 30s and costing a pretty penny when rebuilding? Rust is off to a bad start and is getting injured a lot. Eller is moveable. Graves is most definitely not. It would Take a lot to move Jarry. You’ll have to pay someone to take him.

Any answers for this part of the season?
No.

But these aren’t the showtime lakers. Runnin and gunning isn’t working.

Karlsson plays good defense about as often as the pirates play playoff games. He’s been truly awful this season. I really hope they can get him out of here.

Sullivan isn’t going anywhere, Fenway loves him. I wish they’d move on from him. I don’t think he’s fitting a system to his players. I don’t think he’s been getting all he can from his players.


And there we are.
I don't think Sullivan lasts this season. I think as they go into the holidays if they are firmly at the bottom of the league, they will start moving guys like Eller, Petterson, Rackell, fire Sullivan and even go to the Big 4 and let them understand it is a complete rebuild and if they don't want to go through it then it might be best to move on.
 
I don't think Sullivan lasts this season. I think as they go into the holidays if they are firmly at the bottom of the league, they will start moving guys like Eller, Petterson, Rackell, fire Sullivan and even go to the Big 4 and let them understand it is a complete rebuild and if they don't want to go through it then it might be best to move on.
Id rather see them totally dismantle this train wreck and start the process over sooner than later. Its clear the BIg 4 are a shell of what they once were and cant carry this team. Maybe with a new coach and a different system they could at least be more competitive than they are now and sneak into the playoffs. But with Sully at the lead thats not going to happen.

SO the very first thing you do is fire Sully to see if you can light a fire under these guys. Then by January if they are still entrenched near the bottom of the league which I think they will be you start the sell off. Sully should get no longer than after Thanksgiving to right the ship.
 
Rob Lowe scored a penalty shot to win the game over the Hamilton Mustangs against this guy.

ChVBWWPW4AARgh2.jpg
 
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Too bad hockey doesn't have a Seniors Tour like professional golf does.
Yeah, if the NHL had a Seniors League, the present Penguins NHL team could play in it and maybe end up in 3rd or 4th place possibly making the Senior League playoffs ! ..... also, heard that the Pens were trying to trade Jarry to the New Zealand Beer League to be USN_Panther's backup, the Pens would get future considerations in return (maybe kiwifruit) !
 
Can't argue with much of anything posted the last couple days in this thread (I pretty much agree) ..... the Pens are TERRIBLE right now, probably one of the two worst teams in the league and hopes of making the playoffs are dimming rapidly at this point in time .....

To date, the Pens defense as a team is so bad ...... so many odd man breaks against, so many high danger shots from the slot against, so many Pens getting beat man on man, etc. has led to a league worst goals against per game average ....... so much pinching in the offensive zone on 50/50 pucks with no backup behind them, so many turnovers between the blue lines leading to odd man breaks against, just terrible puck management all over the ice, overall inadequate goaltending (Blomqvist playing above average, Ned playing somewhat below average, and Jarry playing awful) ...... top 6 forwards not scoring enough and giving up too many goals, bottom 6 scoring more than last year but giving up more goals as well ....... trying to play a speed game with a slower skating team just not working ......

To play better and win some games, IMO, the present Pens need to start playing a highly structured game leading to great positioning in all zones (everyone has to know and play their position and work as a 5 man unit in that regard and quit wondering around playing as individuals) ...... need much better puck management leading to fewer turnovers ...... they absolutely have to cut down on odd man breaks and high danger shots which a more structured game will help and that will also help the goalies a great deal but the goalies have to up their play for sure ( more trapping may help to be more structured) ...... Need to get Rust healthy and Sid playing better (Geno to his credit has played pretty well so far) ....... I just don't know how much of this the Pens can or will do, it may take another coaches voice/system to get through to them .....

Just as an anecdote, years ago I was at a pretty high level youth hockey camp run by a standing NHL head coach at the time who by the way as a player was a goalie himself ...... it was one of the best hockey camps I ever attended . I was fortunate enough to review a good deal of goalie tape personally with the head coach which was a joy for me ..... the camp lasted 5 days and each night he would show videos to the skaters about a different topic ..... one night he was showing video demonstrating how to create 2 on 1 breaks ...... he was the NHL coach with the best video system in the NHL at the time ....... he was just outstanding in teaching these kids and I clearly remember watching his video on creating the 2 on 1's ....... if he is still having youth camps and loses his video about creating 2 on 1's, all he would have to do is show tape of any Pens game, and it would be just as good at showing how 2 on 1's are created !
 
Yeah, if the NHL had a Seniors League, the present Penguins NHL team could play in it and maybe end up in 3rd or 4th place possibly making the Senior League playoffs ! ..... also, heard that the Pens were trying to trade Jarry to the New Zealand Beer League to be USN_Panther's backup, the Pens would get future considerations in return (maybe kiwifruit) !
I don't think my team would offer anything in return for Jarry. They would take him if the deal also included a 30 pack of Speights.

I was once traded for a 30 pack of Speights. It's actually considered an honour because every team needs a 30 pack of Speights.
 
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Can't argue with much of anything posted the last couple days in this thread (I pretty much agree) ..... the Pens are TERRIBLE right now, probably one of the two worst teams in the league and hopes of making the playoffs are dimming rapidly at this point in time .....

To date, the Pens defense as a team is so bad ...... so many odd man breaks against, so many high danger shots from the slot against, so many Pens getting beat man on man, etc. has led to a league worst goals against per game average ....... so much pinching in the offensive zone on 50/50 pucks with no backup behind them, so many turnovers between the blue lines leading to odd man breaks against, just terrible puck management all over the ice, overall inadequate goaltending (Blomqvist playing above average, Ned playing somewhat below average, and Jarry playing awful) ...... top 6 forwards not scoring enough and giving up too many goals, bottom 6 scoring more than last year but giving up more goals as well ....... trying to play a speed game with a slower skating team just not working ......

To play better and win some games, IMO, the present Pens need to start playing a highly structured game leading to great positioning in all zones (everyone has to know and play their position and work as a 5 man unit in that regard and quit wondering around playing as individuals) ...... need much better puck management leading to fewer turnovers ...... they absolutely have to cut down on odd man breaks and high danger shots which a more structured game will help and that will also help the goalies a great deal but the goalies have to up their play for sure ( more trapping may help to be more structured) ...... Need to get Rust healthy and Sid playing better (Geno to his credit has played pretty well so far) ....... I just don't know how much of this the Pens can or will do, it may take another coaches voice/system to get through to them .....

Just as an anecdote, years ago I was at a pretty high level youth hockey camp run by a standing NHL head coach at the time who by the way as a player was a goalie himself ...... it was one of the best hockey camps I ever attended . I was fortunate enough to review a good deal of goalie tape personally with the head coach which was a joy for me ..... the camp lasted 5 days and each night he would show videos to the skaters about a different topic ..... one night he was showing video demonstrating how to create 2 on 1 breaks ...... he was the NHL coach with the best video system in the NHL at the time ....... he was just outstanding in teaching these kids and I clearly remember watching his video on creating the 2 on 1's ....... if he is still having youth camps and loses his video about creating 2 on 1's, all he would have to do is show tape of any Pens game, and it would be just as good at showing how 2 on 1's are created !
The problem is gman is they just WONT play this structured system and Sullivan wont coach it. I mean they need a Mike Therrien right now. A Jacques Lemaire. But the star players don't want this and it sure seems like Sullivan won't coach this.

Tonight they are just dominating the Ducks but after 2 they are still down 1-0. They just don't have gamebreakers anymore. Sure the Ducks goalie is playing out of his mind, but usually in their primes these guys would just eventually wear out a goalie.

The sad thing is, I am not mad nor angry or even frustrated (more on that in a bit) because this day was always going to come if they were going to ride or die with the core. Now it is the dying part. The ride after the last two cups came up empty and now they are just backed into a corner and they won't do anything significant to change. Nothing changes with any significance until Sully is gone. Or someone like a Malkin is traded. Changing out bottom 6 forwards or even a winger for Sid or bottom pairing defensemen is nothing more than rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. The frustration part is the organization hasn't seemed to acknowledge this yet.
 
The problem is gman is they just WONT play this structured system and Sullivan wont coach it. I mean they need a Mike Therrien right now. A Jacques Lemaire. But the star players don't want this and it sure seems like Sullivan won't coach this.

Tonight they are just dominating the Ducks but after 2 they are still down 1-0. They just don't have gamebreakers anymore. Sure the Ducks goalie is playing out of his mind, but usually in their primes these guys would just eventually wear out a goalie.

The sad thing is, I am not mad nor angry or even frustrated (more on that in a bit) because this day was always going to come if they were going to ride or die with the core. Now it is the dying part. The ride after the last two cups came up empty and now they are just backed into a corner and they won't do anything significant to change. Nothing changes with any significance until Sully is gone. Or someone like a Malkin is traded. Changing out bottom 6 forwards or even a winger for Sid or bottom pairing defensemen is nothing more than rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. The frustration part is the organization hasn't seemed to acknowledge this yet.
Yeah, pretty much agree ....... if they are out of playoff contention around the trade deadline this season, I would expect them to go full rebuild and start the transition ......

Last nights game against the Ducks was interesting though in that the things in my previous post that I said that they needed to do to win more games is pretty much exactly what the Pens did ....... they were more structured and better positioned which led them to be more responsible defensively ....... they had fewer odd man breaks against (although they did have 3 in the last 4:30 of the 3rd period), fewer high danger shots against (6 as opposed to about double that amount per game prior in this season), much better puck management which led to fewer giveaways (the Pens had less than half of the giveaways the Ducks had), Sid started playing better and had both goals, and they got great goaltending by Ned ( he made 3 or 4 absolutely great saves in the last 4:30 of the 3rd period which kept the Pens in the game and gave them a chance to win) ....... still they barely beat a team that doesn't look that great so the questions are, can they play even more structured/better defensively or will they go back to their old ways after a few games, will they continue to manage the puck well, will the top 2 lines score and will they get some complimentary scoring from the bottom 6, will they stay healthy, will the goalies get better on a consistent basis, etc. ....... it's asking a lot and even if they do the things we said they need to do to win, I'm not sure how high their ceiling is and whether it is good enough to win enough games to make the playoffs ...... I think it will be difficult for them to make the playoffs and at this point would be pleasantly surprised if they did ...... more likely in for a full rebuild although let's see where they go from here.
 
Yeah, pretty much agree ....... if they are out of playoff contention around the trade deadline this season, I would expect them to go full rebuild and start the transition ......

Last nights game against the Ducks was interesting though in that the things in my previous post that I said that they needed to do to win more games is pretty much exactly what the Pens did ....... they were more structured and better positioned which led them to be more responsible defensively ....... they had fewer odd man breaks against (although they did have 3 in the last 4:30 of the 3rd period), fewer high danger shots against (6 as opposed to about double that amount per game prior in this season), much better puck management which led to fewer giveaways (the Pens had less than half of the giveaways the Ducks had), Sid started playing better and had both goals, and they got great goaltending by Ned ( he made 3 or 4 absolutely great saves in the last 4:30 of the 3rd period which kept the Pens in the game and gave them a chance to win) ....... still they barely beat a team that doesn't look that great so the questions are, can they play even more structured/better defensively or will they go back to their old ways after a few games, will they continue to manage the puck well, will the top 2 lines score and will they get some complimentary scoring from the bottom 6, will they stay healthy, will the goalies get better on a consistent basis, etc. ....... it's asking a lot and even if they do the things we said they need to do to win, I'm not sure how high their ceiling is and whether it is good enough to win enough games to make the playoffs ...... I think it will be difficult for them to make the playoffs and at this point would be pleasantly surprised if they did ...... more likely in for a full rebuild although let's see where they go from here.
Ned was fantastic as was the Ducks goalie. It took Sid being Sid to lift them to victory. We should note the Pens victories this year are against Anaheim and Buffalo in OT and Habs and Wings, not exactly the top of the league.

You are right, they played much better, generated chances, kept the puck and dammit if they didn't do their damndest to try and give away the game by giving up breaks and just great chances to the Ducks. That has become normal for this team the past year. They just can't and won't lock it down, or play more of a trapping type of game and pounce on counters to try and use some of their remaining skill while protecting their own net.
 
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As I predicted, Karlsson was a bad idea. Perhaps he’ll waive his no trade to chase a cup and do both groups a favor. Rakell is having a good season and could fetch a return if he wants to move on. Petersson is in his last year. Is there a point to re-signing a defenseman going into his 30s and costing a pretty penny when rebuilding? Rust is off to a bad start and is getting injured a lot. Eller is moveable. Graves is most definitely not. It would Take a lot to move Jarry. You’ll have to pay someone to take him.

Any answers for this part of the season?
No.

But these aren’t the showtime lakers. Runnin and gunning isn’t working.

Karlsson plays good defense about as often as the pirates play playoff games. He’s been truly awful this season. I really hope they can get him out of here.

Sullivan isn’t going anywhere, Fenway loves him. I wish they’d move on from him. I don’t think he’s fitting a system to his players. I don’t think he’s been getting all he can from his players.


And there we are.
And I haven’t seen 58 hit friendly tape with an outlet pass in two years or so.
 
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Boy, is 65 bad or what. Turrible.
Question for the board goalies, I played hockey in high school and college as a defenseman, my goalie knowledge involved not to screen him. Anyway are there any examples where a nhl goalie who has been dreadful goes to a new team is marketable better, kind of like our Bucco reject pitchers who go on to bigger and better things. Another question why does it seem there are so many good Russian goalies. Is it all due to the individual or their training regimen. On sad note we are probably saddled with 58 and 65 with their contracts on the books for at least 2 more years so to unload no doubt we would have to eat a lot of money.
 
FSG is so incompetent when it comes to this hockey organization. There is zero reason why Sullivan should not be sacked tonight.
 
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Question for the board goalies, I played hockey in high school and college as a defenseman, my goalie knowledge involved not to screen him. Anyway are there any examples where a nhl goalie who has been dreadful goes to a new team is marketable better, kind of like our Bucco reject pitchers who go on to bigger and better things. Another question why does it seem there are so many good Russian goalies. Is it all due to the individual or their training regimen. On sad note we are probably saddled with 58 and 65 with their contracts on the books for at least 2 more years so to unload no doubt we would have to eat a lot of money.
Goalies on better teams become better goalies.
It isn't always the number of shots, it is the quality of the scoring chance.
I didn't see the game tonight, but if reflective of recent games there will be goals off of odd man breaks and from undefended players in front of the net.
As an accomplished B grade beer league goalie, if you are in front of the shot, block it. Or get out of the line of the shot and let me see it off the stick. Preferably the defender challenges the shooter taking away the luxury of time and space.
My defenders like to continue to skate back towards me allowing the shooter to get closer and get better angles to shoot. This also creates a bigger screen so I can't see anything, like an eclipse.
The truly brilliant ones back up until they interfere with me. Since I'm not popular in my league, many forwards take the opportunity of a defender backed into me to take a run at either the defender or me. Then shit gets real as I kind of have to attack both the forward and my d man. Then the ref puts me in a headlock, some guys go the box and feel shame. Then they get free.
This happened once when I was filling in as goalie in a women's league. People got really upset about the blocker punched. They all have full cages so I don't get why all the fuss. I got suspended and had to write an apology letter to get reinstated.
Last year I hit a 13 year old in the face with my goalie stick. He tried a Michigan in me glove side so I just whacked his stick, the puck and his face with a big one handed golf swing. Actually hit the puck so I argued not a penalty. He has a full cage, but he did drop. No suspension or anything because it was in Gore. I'm sort of a legend there now. And nobody has tried a Michigan on me in Gore since. Although my son thought about it Tuesday and changed his mind. I'd have taken his teeth out.
 
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I don't know where this obsession with Penguins fans on the fate of the team comes down to the goaltender has come from. I mean we aren't Nashville or Vegas. We should be more sophisticated than this. It's not Jarry's fault!
 
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I don't know where this obsession with Penguins fans on the fate of the team comes down to the goaltender has come from. I mean we aren't Nashville or Vegas. We should be more sophisticated than this. It's not Jarry's fault!
I sort of just wrote that, but in a rambling buzzed at an airport diatribe way.
But he was terrible this year. He pretty much assisted on a goal against by misplaying a puck behind the net when he had plenty of time and got cute. Pens and Jarry were terrible. They both can be true. But also no goalie would be good playing behind 65 and 58.
 
FSG is so incompetent when it comes to this hockey organization. There is zero reason why Sullivan should not be sacked tonight.
They just don't care. Haven't cared since day 1.
Some of the personnel moves they have made the past couple seasons make that painfully clear.
No direction , no plan.
 
Goalies on better teams become better goalies.
It isn't always the number of shots, it is the quality of the scoring chance.
I didn't see the game tonight, but if reflective of recent games there will be goals off of odd man breaks and from undefended players in front of the net.
As an accomplished B grade beer league goalie, if you are in front of the shot, block it. Or get out of the line of the shot and let me see it off the stick. Preferably the defender challenges the shooter taking away the luxury of time and space.
My defenders like to continue to skate back towards me allowing the shooter to get closer and get better angles to shoot. This also creates a bigger screen so I can't see anything, like an eclipse.
The truly brilliant ones back up until they interfere with me. Since I'm not popular in my league, many forwards take the opportunity of a defender backed into me to take a run at either the defender or me. Then shit gets real as I kind of have to attack both the forward and my d man. Then the ref puts me in a headlock, some guys go the box and feel shame. Then they get free.
This happened once when I was filling in as goalie in a women's league. People got really upset about the blocker punched. They all have full cages so I don't get why all the fuss. I got suspended and had to write an apology letter to get reinstated.
Last year I hit a 13 year old in the face with my goalie stick. He tried a Michigan in me glove side so I just whacked his stick, the puck and his face with a big one handed golf swing. Actually hit the puck so I argued not a penalty. He has a full cage, but he did drop. No suspension or anything because it was in Gore. I'm sort of a legend there now. And nobody has tried a Michigan on me in Gore since. Although my son thought about it Tuesday and changed his mind. I'd have taken his teeth out.
I like how you offered a little @PGHShoeCobblerTheBEST with this post!!
 
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I sort of just wrote that, but in a rambling buzzed at an airport diatribe way.
But he was terrible this year. He pretty much assisted on a goal against by misplaying a puck behind the net when he had plenty of time and got cute. Pens and Jarry were terrible. They both can be true. But also no goalie would be good playing behind 65 and 58.
That wasn't aimed at you, but many people on facebook who post and blame the goalies even when the Pens lose 2-1.

The Pens are a bad team. Old. No hope, none until they move on from the current coach and core players.
 
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